Yes, it was a Trump question I saw him answer. Et tu Ed ? Oh dear.gilsey wrote:You missed the bit where he said he supported Corbyn's 3 line whip then?yahyah wrote:Have only seen a quick clip of the Ed M appearance on Newsnight but nice to see him on good form.
Hard not to think 'what if ?'.
Friday 27th January 2017
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Welcome to FTN. New posters are welcome to join the conversation. You can follow us on Twitter @FlythenestHaven You are responsible for the content you post. This is a public forum. Treat it as if you are speaking in a crowded room. Site admin and Moderators are volunteers who will respond as quickly as they are able to when made aware of any complaints. Please do not post copyrighted material without the original authors permission.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Ahem. Step forth Corbyn on the last leg. Roundly condemned afterwards for his 7 out of 10 comment,should've been 10/10.yahyah wrote:PaulfromYorkshire wrote:I agree with this.yahyah wrote:@willow
Good post. Your point about people like Abbott fetishing a referendum result, that's what worries. It leaves a huge opportunity for the right to exploit it. There may be pressure for other votes so we can let 'the people' speak on other issues. How could Labour argue against a government implementing awful policies if the people 'speak' and say they want them in a referendum vote ?
Abbott use of 'elites' grated with me too. She sounded patronising to voters in the Labour vulnerable areas.
Well done Tulip Siddiq.
But the root of the mess, as I see it, is the asking of a binary question on a subject that most (I'm guessing) folk feel massively ambivalent about.
There wasn't a place to say "I'm not entirely happy with how the EU is working, but I suspect leaving is a bad idea", or "I think we should leave the EU but consider what aspects of the EU we might be able to stay part of".
Too true Paul. That's why I feel Labour should be saying that, and saying it loud.
Am trying to remember the debates at that time. Who was standing up and shouting about the havoc the lack of nuance would wreak ?
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
The time for the whip is surely after the bill & amendments, not before. Corbyn jumped the gun and as with so much he does, he's shot it into his own foot.StephenDolan wrote:Would anyone have been supportive of a 3 line whip against at this stage of proceedings?
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Labour Leave filmed a video with this self-appointed common man.
https://twitter.com/PaulEmbery" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
He likes retweeting Spiked (how dare salt of the earth people be called racist etc?). He seems to like appearing in films. Here's somebody reacting to another of his appearances.
https://twitter.com/PaulEmbery" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
He likes retweeting Spiked (how dare salt of the earth people be called racist etc?). He seems to like appearing in films. Here's somebody reacting to another of his appearances.
C @gibtsdes Jan 24
@PaulEmbery So what are ordinary people? And: whom do you consider "non-ordinary" and what does it imply?
He got a bit of a bloody nose when the FBU backed Remain. Their "liberal elite" leader Matt Wrack was clever enough to spot the people actually calling the referendum and likely to profit from it.C @gibtsdes Jan 24
@PaulEmbery Ridiculous that @BrunoBrussels is making a living out of spreading lies about #EU & if I say he lied I'm looking down on "ordinary folk".
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
The case for membership was higher than that, even if you don't rate the organization itself. A question to avoid, I think.StephenDolan wrote:Ahem. Step forth Corbyn on the last leg. Roundly condemned afterwards for his 7 out of 10 comment,should've been 10/10.yahyah wrote:PaulfromYorkshire wrote: I agree with this.
But the root of the mess, as I see it, is the asking of a binary question on a subject that most (I'm guessing) folk feel massively ambivalent about.
There wasn't a place to say "I'm not entirely happy with how the EU is working, but I suspect leaving is a bad idea", or "I think we should leave the EU but consider what aspects of the EU we might be able to stay part of".
Too true Paul. That's why I feel Labour should be saying that, and saying it loud.
Am trying to remember the debates at that time. Who was standing up and shouting about the havoc the lack of nuance would wreak ?
- AngryAsWell
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
The Source of Donald Trump's '3 million illegal votes' figure
Actually oh my god
https://twitter.com/i/moments/824983715482853377" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Actually oh my god
https://twitter.com/i/moments/824983715482853377" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
With respect pk, that's not what I'm asking. There's been a lot of support for Labour to be against A50 being invoked, I wondered if any that had expressed this opinion would've been supportive of a TLW against invocation.pk1 wrote:The time for the whip is surely after the bill & amendments, not before. Corbyn jumped the gun and as with so much he does, he's shot it into his own foot.StephenDolan wrote:Would anyone have been supportive of a 3 line whip against at this stage of proceedings?
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
The case was higher? Okay, then 8 or 9/10.Tubby Isaacs wrote:The case for membership was higher than that, even if you don't rate the organization itself. A question to avoid, I think.StephenDolan wrote:Ahem. Step forth Corbyn on the last leg. Roundly condemned afterwards for his 7 out of 10 comment,should've been 10/10.yahyah wrote:
Too true Paul. That's why I feel Labour should be saying that, and saying it loud.
Am trying to remember the debates at that time. Who was standing up and shouting about the havoc the lack of nuance would wreak ?
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
I nearly stopped reading at 'chicken coup'. Yes, 11.06 speaks for a lot of people.pk1 wrote:The comment at 11.06 speaks for me. When I recall how Steve worked so hard at disproving the Mid-Staffs stuff (speaking of which, where is St Julie since she got her gong - job done I guess) to see him so entrenched in nonsense & conspiracy theories is sad.
https://skwawkbox.org/2017/01/26/labour ... t-take-it/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Not sure if MargeJones99 is a parody, so difficult to tell these days.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
The wasp woman has spoken
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
For membership? 10. But that would have been made to look silly too, I accept that.
His problem is that he doesn't get the EU at all, and can't speak with any authority on it. That came across more generally.
As a friend of mine put it, Denmark is like Britain, in the EU and not in the Eurozone. Wouldn't we like to be much more like Denmark? We would, and it can't be the EU's fault that we aren't.
His problem is that he doesn't get the EU at all, and can't speak with any authority on it. That came across more generally.
As a friend of mine put it, Denmark is like Britain, in the EU and not in the Eurozone. Wouldn't we like to be much more like Denmark? We would, and it can't be the EU's fault that we aren't.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... its-europe" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Labour’s Brexit chaos is now so exposed it threatens to tear the party apart
Steve Richards
"Splits over Europe go back decades but past leaders had the skills to paper over the cracks"
Labour’s Brexit chaos is now so exposed it threatens to tear the party apart
Steve Richards
"Splits over Europe go back decades but past leaders had the skills to paper over the cracks"
Last edited by HindleA on Fri 27 Jan, 2017 4:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
I'm story Stephen. I don't understand your 'ahem....' remark.
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Interesting that miliband thinks a 3 line whip is sensible on A50.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Which one yy?yahyah wrote:I'm story Stephen. I don't understand your 'ahem....' remark.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
More sort of buzzed than spoken.HindleA wrote:The wasp woman has spoken
Have to admit the pic was taken a few years ago.
My waist isn't quite that small anymore, and I've given up grabbing half naked men with my long limbs.
edited to add...you'd have to see the whole pic to understand the latter part of my post.
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Or, to quote a letter to, I think, Private Eye, 'just because the EU is shit doesn't mean the alternative is any less shit'.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:I agree with this.yahyah wrote:@willow
Good post. Your point about people like Abbott fetishing a referendum result, that's what worries. It leaves a huge opportunity for the right to exploit it. There may be pressure for other votes so we can let 'the people' speak on other issues. How could Labour argue against a government implementing awful policies if the people 'speak' and say they want them in a referendum vote ?
Abbott use of 'elites' grated with me too. She sounded patronising to voters in the Labour vulnerable areas.
Well done Tulip Siddiq.
But the root of the mess, as I see it, is the asking of a binary question on a subject that most (I'm guessing) folk feel massively ambivalent about.
There wasn't a place to say "I'm not entirely happy with how the EU is working, but I suspect leaving is a bad idea", or "I think we should leave the EU but consider what aspects of the EU we might be able to stay part of".
One world, like it or not - John Martyn
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
''Ahem. Step forth Corbyn on his last leg. Roundly condemned for his 7 out of 10 argument. Should have been 10 out of 10.''
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/uk ... es-9705681" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Not surprising from Paul Nuttall.
Not surprising from Paul Nuttall.
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
We would?Tubby Isaacs wrote:For membership? 10. But that would have been made to look silly too, I accept that.
His problem is that he doesn't get the EU at all, and can't speak with any authority on it. That came across more generally.
As a friend of mine put it, Denmark is like Britain, in the EU and not in the Eurozone. Wouldn't we like to be much more like Denmark? We would, and it can't be the EU's fault that we aren't.
FTNers would.
I think we're in this mess because not enough people in this country agree.
I'm giving up on hope.
One world, like it or not - John Martyn
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Not sure what you mean by "at this stage of proceedings".StephenDolan wrote:Would anyone have been supportive of a 3 line whip against at this stage of proceedings?
I would prefer Labour policy to be to vote against if none of the amendments are accepted, if that's what you mean. How to vote if amendments are accepted can't be decided until you know what they are.
"Fall seven times, get up eight" - Japanese proverb
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Look out lads !yahyah wrote:More sort of buzzed than spoken.HindleA wrote:The wasp woman has spoken
Have to admit the pic was taken a few years ago.
My waist isn't quite that small anymore, and I've given up grabbing half naked men with my long limbs.
edited to add...you'd have to see the whole pic to understand the latter part of my post.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
It won't take Anatoly long to do his by election roundup this week. Looks like only one in Scotland.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Yes I don't remember that either yahyahyahyah wrote:PaulfromYorkshire wrote:I agree with this.yahyah wrote:@willow
Good post. Your point about people like Abbott fetishing a referendum result, that's what worries. It leaves a huge opportunity for the right to exploit it. There may be pressure for other votes so we can let 'the people' speak on other issues. How could Labour argue against a government implementing awful policies if the people 'speak' and say they want them in a referendum vote ?
Abbott use of 'elites' grated with me too. She sounded patronising to voters in the Labour vulnerable areas.
Well done Tulip Siddiq.
But the root of the mess, as I see it, is the asking of a binary question on a subject that most (I'm guessing) folk feel massively ambivalent about.
There wasn't a place to say "I'm not entirely happy with how the EU is working, but I suspect leaving is a bad idea", or "I think we should leave the EU but consider what aspects of the EU we might be able to stay part of".
Too true Paul. That's why I feel Labour should be saying that, and saying it loud.
Am trying to remember the debates at that time. Who was standing up and shouting about the havoc the lack of nuance would wreak ?
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... -emissions" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Westminster council to become first to charge extra to park diesel cars
Westminster council to become first to charge extra to park diesel cars
- AngryAsWell
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
How can they tell a diesel car just by looking at it? (or am I missing something ? - again)HindleA wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... -emissions
Westminster council to become first to charge extra to park diesel cars
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
In the era of Trump and May we should probably avoid headlines like this
They probably think it's the best use for them.Prince Harry pounds London pavements with homeless youngsters
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
personally I am outside of the metro elite but in concert with friends still in it
LET'S FACE IT I'M JUST 'KIN' SEETHIN'
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Charge for woodburners too ?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-38746482" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-38746482" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
If the car park has numberplate recognition it will be straightforward I guess....AngryAsWell wrote:How can they tell a diesel car just by looking at it? (or am I missing something ? - again)HindleA wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... -emissions
Westminster council to become first to charge extra to park diesel cars
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Hide that before PorFavor sees it.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:In the era of Trump and May we should probably avoid headlines like thisThey probably think it's the best use for them.Prince Harry pounds London pavements with homeless youngsters
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Am more bothered (as has been outlined better by others now) about the fact that we are not opposing it in word at this stage. We will be tarnished by this parroting of the Tory narrative (metropolitan elite, restrictions on immigration etc) in due course. And rightly so, I'm afraid.StephenDolan wrote:With respect pk, that's not what I'm asking. There's been a lot of support for Labour to be against A50 being invoked, I wondered if any that had expressed this opinion would've been supportive of a TLW against invocation.pk1 wrote:The time for the whip is surely after the bill & amendments, not before. Corbyn jumped the gun and as with so much he does, he's shot it into his own foot.StephenDolan wrote:Would anyone have been supportive of a 3 line whip against at this stage of proceedings?
LET'S FACE IT I'M JUST 'KIN' SEETHIN'
- tinyclanger2
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Diet schmiet.
Have just partaken of a PIECE OF CHEESE.
And I don't care who knows about it!
Have just partaken of a PIECE OF CHEESE.
And I don't care who knows about it!
LET'S FACE IT I'M JUST 'KIN' SEETHIN'
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Brits could never stomach the tax levels. Too many generations of letting the rich get away with it (because they are not seen to be scrounging off us, despite reality) and despising anyone with less than us. Can't see us turning it around any time soon.gilsey wrote:We would?Tubby Isaacs wrote:For membership? 10. But that would have been made to look silly too, I accept that.
His problem is that he doesn't get the EU at all, and can't speak with any authority on it. That came across more generally.
As a friend of mine put it, Denmark is like Britain, in the EU and not in the Eurozone. Wouldn't we like to be much more like Denmark? We would, and it can't be the EU's fault that we aren't.
FTNers would.
I think we're in this mess because not enough people in this country agree.
I'm giving up on hope.
LET'S FACE IT I'M JUST 'KIN' SEETHIN'
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
It comes from the same stable of new dubious sports that includes juggling the kids.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:In the era of Trump and May we should probably avoid headlines like thisThey probably think it's the best use for them.Prince Harry pounds London pavements with homeless youngsters
LET'S FACE IT I'M JUST 'KIN' SEETHIN'
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Yesterday I had creamy celeriac and pear soup with focaccia and Welsh butter, delicious buttery risotto with Perl Wen cheese and spinach - the spinach was the healthy part of the meal, salted chocolate cremeaux [fancy name for mousse] with creme fraiche ice cream. I didn't care and I still don't.
Eat, drink and be merry. For tomorrow it'll still all be crap.
Eat, drink and be merry. For tomorrow it'll still all be crap.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Have some more cheese for that.tinyclanger2 wrote:Am more bothered (as has been outlined better by others now) about the fact that we are not opposing it in word at this stage. We will be tarnished by this parroting of the Tory narrative (metropolitan elite, restrictions on immigration etc) in due course. And rightly so, I'm afraid.StephenDolan wrote:With respect pk, that's not what I'm asking. There's been a lot of support for Labour to be against A50 being invoked, I wondered if any that had expressed this opinion would've been supportive of a TLW against invocation.pk1 wrote: The time for the whip is surely after the bill & amendments, not before. Corbyn jumped the gun and as with so much he does, he's shot it into his own foot.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
https://labourlist.org/2017/01/labour-w ... ens-quits/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Good-evening, everyone.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
George Monbiot's tweets yesterday are interesting.
''a political disaster'' ''for those who continue to maintain the three line whip story is untrue...'' ''why not allow a free vote''
''I was thrilled when Jeremy Corbyn became leader of the Labour party but it is now one fiasco after another. I have now lost faith ''
''I hoped Corbyn would be effective....neither hope has materialised''.
Owen Jones has been naughty and not ignored the polls. He's been quoting Labour's and Corbyn's ratings in the polls as 'not sustainable'.
''a political disaster'' ''for those who continue to maintain the three line whip story is untrue...'' ''why not allow a free vote''
''I was thrilled when Jeremy Corbyn became leader of the Labour party but it is now one fiasco after another. I have now lost faith ''
''I hoped Corbyn would be effective....neither hope has materialised''.
Owen Jones has been naughty and not ignored the polls. He's been quoting Labour's and Corbyn's ratings in the polls as 'not sustainable'.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Diane Abbot on R4 has just said
"Clearly if we don't get any of our amendments though, then we will have to review our position" (about voting to let A50 go ahead)
..........??
Is it me?
"Clearly if we don't get any of our amendments though, then we will have to review our position" (about voting to let A50 go ahead)
..........??
Is it me?
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Flippin' Ada. The tide is turning.
The Canary's [yes The Canary] editorial says Corbyn's made a colossal mistake.
http://www.thecanary.co/2017/01/27/jere ... editorial/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The Canary's [yes The Canary] editorial says Corbyn's made a colossal mistake.
http://www.thecanary.co/2017/01/27/jere ... editorial/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
So, those of us who are 'obsessed by Brexit' and oppose triggering Article 50 are not alone, and any attempt to paint it us as 'red Tories' etc will not stand up when our arguments and concerns are agreed with by people like Monbiot, The Canary and Harry Leslie Smith who says Corbyn is wrong on it.
Phew...what a relief. It was like living in an alternate universe but it looks like reality is finally dawning.
Phew...what a relief. It was like living in an alternate universe but it looks like reality is finally dawning.
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
No. No it isn't.AngryAsWell wrote:Diane Abbot on R4 has just said
"Clearly if we don't get any of our amendments though, then we will have to review our position" (about voting to let A50 go ahead)
..........??
Is it me?
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
It's this horsesh** bothering me no end regardless who it comes from - talk and act coherently, don't say one thing then say something else. This matters, the contradiction above. It matters a lot. Don't turn around and let fly something totally contradictory from previous action or statements.AngryAsWell wrote:Diane Abbot on R4 has just said
"Clearly if we don't get any of our amendments though, then we will have to review our position" (about voting to let A50 go ahead)
..........??
Is it me?
- AngryAsWell
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
I was washing up and it was noisy in the kitchen (dishwasher broken) so need to find it on Iplayer to make sure, but I swear that's how it came across.yahyah wrote:No. No it isn't.AngryAsWell wrote:Diane Abbot on R4 has just said
"Clearly if we don't get any of our amendments though, then we will have to review our position" (about voting to let A50 go ahead)
..........??
Is it me?
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Good night, sorry to be leaving when you have just arrived JA.
- RogerOThornhill
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Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Another one of those pesky facts getting in the way of a good story...
Ross McCafferty @RossMcCaff 14m14 minutes ago
Trump predicted the Brexit vote when he was in Scotland.
Not that much of an achievement considering he arrived the day after
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
Dang. Just sent you a message.yahyah wrote:Good night, sorry to be leaving when you have just arrived JA.
Goodnight, yahyah.
Re: Friday 27th January 2017
She's here at 8mins50. I quote verbatim:AngryAsWell wrote:I was washing up and it was noisy in the kitchen (dishwasher broken) so need to find it on Iplayer to make sure, but I swear that's how it came across.yahyah wrote:No. No it isn't.AngryAsWell wrote:Diane Abbot on R4 has just said
"Clearly if we don't get any of our amendments though, then we will have to review our position" (about voting to let A50 go ahead)
..........??
Is it me?
"The leadership has a lot of sympathy with people in heavily remain constituencies who find themselves in difficulty. It's not a question of voting with the Tories. This is a question of opening the process, we will seek to amend and if we're not able to get any of our amendments through, clearly we'll have to review our position"
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0890kvs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
So her Parliamentary colleagues are downgraded to mere 'people' now too....