Thursday 20th April 2017

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 1:07 pm

Morally corrupt is a phrase to repeat ad infinitum.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 1:47 pm

What's wrong with a bit of class war rhetoric, more of that sort of thing.

NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 1:55 pm

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F***ing disgraceful.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 1:58 pm

"But things can, and they will, change. Britain needs a Labour government that is prepared to fight for people in every part of the country, our towns, villages, as well as big cities. A Labour government that isn’t scared to take on the cosy cartels that are hoarding this country’s wealth for themselves.

...the Conservatives, drunk on a failed ideology, are hell bent on cutting every public service they get their hands on, and they will use all of the divide-and-rule tricks of the Lynton Crosby trade to keep their rigged system intact. Don’t be angry at the privatisers profiting from our public services, they whisper, be angry instead at the migrant worker just trying to make a better life. Don’t be angry at the government ministers running down our schools and hospitals, they tell us, be angry instead at the disabled woman or the unemployed man.

It is the rigged economy the Tories are protecting that Labour is committed to challenging. So many people in modern Britain do what seems like the right thing to do. They get jobs, they spend all day working hard, they save to buy their own home, they raise children, they look after elderly or sick relatives. And yet, at the end of it, they get almost nothing left over as a reward. Compare their lives with the multinational corporations and the gilded elite who hide their money in the Cayman Islands because the Conservatives are too morally bankrupt to take them on.

Labour in power will end this racket and make sure that everybody pays their taxes which fund our public services. We will overturn this rigged system. For all Theresa May’s warm words on the steps of Downing Street the Conservatives will never do any such thing. Seven years of broken promises show us that on pay, the deficit, the NHS, our schools, our environment."

- J Corbyn

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1597850 ... 17-general" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That's good, I like that.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:02 pm

Get your violins out.
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Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:03 pm

I think May could be in for a serious shock. She's banking on an increased majority, but the lib dems are going to win seats back, it was their collapse that gave the tories the majority in 2015. Labour cant really lose any more in Scotland, and I cant see the Tories improving in wales, likely to fall back at least in Gower and probably Brecon. FPTP might just scupper her plans. Corbyn looks energised - he clearly loves campaigning - and Labour have a massive ground game. Broadcast media will struggle with impartiality but it will be a better hearing than Labour have had in two years. Social media will have a bigger impact this time around, although not decisive yet. Throw in Tory election expenses, May's inability to blag like the pig-fucker, and the general mood of anger in the country and this whole General Election could badly backfire.

What happens if her majority is about the same, or even reduced or hung? A second brexit referendum would be the condition the libs demand, and she cant deliver that with her crazy wing. Labour would, I assume, happily agree.

Going before the boundary changes, regardless of the polls, is absolute madness. She must be desperate, and that means something big is coming.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:06 pm

Hope you're right, tem. I can't see her majority increasing in line with the current polls, anyway, it's very easy for her to disappoint against those.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:10 pm

THE CONSERVATIVE LEFT

In some respects, it is the right who are Marxists and we leftists who are conservatives.
http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad.com ... -left.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:13 pm

Temulkar wrote:I think May could be in for a serious shock. She's banking on an increased majority, but the lib dems are going to win seats back, it was their collapse that gave the tories the majority in 2015. Labour cant really lose any more in Scotland, and I cant see the Tories improving in wales, likely to fall back at least in Gower and probably Brecon. FPTP might just scupper her plans. Corbyn looks energised - he clearly loves campaigning - and Labour have a massive ground game. Broadcast media will struggle with impartiality but it will be a better hearing than Labour have had in two years. Social media will have a bigger impact this time around, although not decisive yet. Throw in Tory election expenses, May's inability to blag like the pig-fucker, and the general mood of anger in the country and this whole General Election could badly backfire.

What happens if her majority is about the same, or even reduced or hung? A second brexit referendum would be the condition the libs demand, and she cant deliver that with her crazy wing. Labour would, I assume, happily agree.

Going before the boundary changes, regardless of the polls, is absolute madness. She must be desperate, and that means something big is coming.

I don't. I expect a large increase in the Tory majority. The Lib Dems may get back to around 25 seats, but Labour will lose around 50 I'd expect, giving her a much more comfortable majority, and five more years.

We'll see of course. I didn't expect Corbyn to win the leadership. the UK to vote for Brexit or for Trump to win. Strange things do happen. But it could be that Labour does much worse than I'd predict, as well as a bit better.

I should add, however, that it is useful to have people's predictions so that we can see if they have good judgment.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:18 pm

NonOxCol wrote:

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F***ing disgraceful.

Nick Robinson, you're working for the BBC responsible for providing impartial news in your public service position. I shouldn't know your personal feelings regarding political party policy.

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:21 pm

SpinningHugo wrote:
Temulkar wrote:I think May could be in for a serious shock. She's banking on an increased majority, but the lib dems are going to win seats back, it was their collapse that gave the tories the majority in 2015. Labour cant really lose any more in Scotland, and I cant see the Tories improving in wales, likely to fall back at least in Gower and probably Brecon. FPTP might just scupper her plans. Corbyn looks energised - he clearly loves campaigning - and Labour have a massive ground game. Broadcast media will struggle with impartiality but it will be a better hearing than Labour have had in two years. Social media will have a bigger impact this time around, although not decisive yet. Throw in Tory election expenses, May's inability to blag like the pig-fucker, and the general mood of anger in the country and this whole General Election could badly backfire.

What happens if her majority is about the same, or even reduced or hung? A second brexit referendum would be the condition the libs demand, and she cant deliver that with her crazy wing. Labour would, I assume, happily agree.

Going before the boundary changes, regardless of the polls, is absolute madness. She must be desperate, and that means something big is coming.
I don't. I expect a large increase in the Tory majority. The Lib Dems may get back to around 25 seats, but Labour will lose around 50 I'd expect, giving her a much more comfortable majority, and five more years.

We'll see of course. I didn't expect Corbyn to win the leadership. the UK to vote for Brexit or for Trump to win. Strange things do happen. But it could be that Labour does much worse than I'd predict, as well as a bit better.

I should add, however, that it is useful to have people's predictions so that we can see if they have good judgment.

That's not a prediction, that is speculation. It's a bit too early to predict anything, other than something bad is around the corner.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:29 pm

SpinningHugo wrote:
Temulkar wrote:I think May could be in for a serious shock. She's banking on an increased majority, but the lib dems are going to win seats back, it was their collapse that gave the tories the majority in 2015. Labour cant really lose any more in Scotland, and I cant see the Tories improving in wales, likely to fall back at least in Gower and probably Brecon. FPTP might just scupper her plans. Corbyn looks energised - he clearly loves campaigning - and Labour have a massive ground game. Broadcast media will struggle with impartiality but it will be a better hearing than Labour have had in two years. Social media will have a bigger impact this time around, although not decisive yet. Throw in Tory election expenses, May's inability to blag like the pig-fucker, and the general mood of anger in the country and this whole General Election could badly backfire.

What happens if her majority is about the same, or even reduced or hung? A second brexit referendum would be the condition the libs demand, and she cant deliver that with her crazy wing. Labour would, I assume, happily agree.

Going before the boundary changes, regardless of the polls, is absolute madness. She must be desperate, and that means something big is coming.
I don't. I expect a large increase in the Tory majority. The Lib Dems may get back to around 25 seats, but Labour will lose around 50 I'd expect, giving her a much more comfortable majority, and five more years.

We'll see of course. I didn't expect Corbyn to win the leadership. the UK to vote for Brexit or for Trump to win. Strange things do happen. But it could be that Labour does much worse than I'd predict, as well as a bit better.

I should add, however, that it is useful to have people's predictions so that we can see if they have good judgment.

It's not really our judgement in question. It's other people's. And they seem to me to be supporting Brexit rather than supporting the Tories or Theresa May. So applying turnout predictions based on historical Tory turnout will over-estimate the Tory lead, I suspect, but I have no idea how much. An increase in the Tory majority seems more than likely, nonetheless. The May elections will provide an early indication of how well the polls have adjusted for previous errors. So guessing outcomes at this stage seems a little unnecessary tbf. Also, in terms of Brexit, the pro or anti EU sentiments of individual candidates, across party lines, may tell some interesting stories. I'm expecting Rees-Mogg, for instance, to be re-elected with a slimmer majority as his Eurosceptic views do not appear to have gone down well in this predominantly remain voting area (judging by the critical letters in the local paper!)

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:29 pm

gilsey wrote:THE CONSERVATIVE LEFT

In some respects, it is the right who are Marxists and we leftists who are conservatives.
http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad.com ... -left.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Responsibly representing the people, making sure the country's various infrastructures (transportation, health, social care, communications, security, energy, environment) are in good shape isn't sexy stuff, you know? It's public administration, usually duller than hell. It's vital to everything bold and beautiful though. No venture gets off the ground unless civilisation backs it up.

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:32 pm

Good day to you all

There is one poster on here we already know has bad judgement based on all the predictions made previously without any self doubt or self awareness being exhibited

One area where the Tories have seemed to excel is making those who are 'rich' (and a household income of 70K is up there) feel poor and those who are poor feel rich and that those who have less than them are parasites

I think it was Willow or PF who suggested that Tory competence is linked to house prices and ehilst householders feel protected that is their focus

No house building, no inheritance tax and no property taxes to undermine this feeling

The property market is a massive distortion and I read earlier in the week that there could be a 400bn inheritance windfall for those lucky enough to get it....not subject to much tax either

More and more I see protection of house value as the main focus of those who tend to vote. Those in non permanent residences are often those who fall off the radar

Is there anything in this or am I off the Mark?

Not living in the UK I look over at how the house asset price disparity with salaries can be sustained. The end I suppose is we become a more renting society (like the continent) with safeguards, we continue in an ad hoc chaotic manner as seems to be the case now or there is a collapse in prices to long term norms.....all of which suggest a big change over the next generation

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:33 pm

it’s early days. Corbyn’s critics sometimes argued that his campaign would collapse on exposure to the electorate. Instead his first proper campaign outing was a success.

-AS

NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:36 pm

citizenJA wrote:
NonOxCol wrote:

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F***ing disgraceful.
Nick Robinson, you're working for the BBC responsible for providing impartial news in your public service position. I shouldn't know your personal feelings regarding political party policy.

Not just him, is it? Most of BBC Politics has gone native for so long, they're not even bothered how they might appear to people who don't swallow the bloody tabloids and Mail day in day out.

Peston, meanwhile, is simply reflecting the inherent laziness of the privileged class when it comes to use of politicised language. See also "politics of envy", or bloody Humphrys and his £26k comment this morning.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:39 pm

howsillyofme1 wrote: More and more I see protection of house value as the main focus of those who tend to vote. Those in non permanent residences are often those who fall off the radar

Is there anything in this or am I off the Mark?

I think there's quite a lot in it.

Also, I think high rents have a knock-on effect on economic growth, sucking cash out of the economy in much the same way as privatised service companies take the profits off-shore, or certainly don't re-invest them.

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 2:50 pm

Thanks gilsey

Also I have a question as to where all the money from 'public' spending goes?

I have seen in the private sector that outsourcing can bring certain improvements in certain cost positions but in the end it is much more expensive but this is hidden away.

Also the money spent by the Government to private companies will go on salaries which will then circulate back to a certain amount due to taxes or spending (and a lot of these salaries have been reduced as part of the contract). The rest will then go to the companies and with a reduction in corporation tax and moving of money abroad this can be minimised

Is the fact that a lot of public spending transfers to private companies and is lost?

Has anyone ever looked seriously on the overall impact of using outsourcing over in house when it comes to Government spending?

I am not an accountant so could have got this all completely wrong

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:16 pm

StephenDolan wrote:The bigging up of Cooper. Deary me.

It does seem a tad co-ordinated tbh.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:19 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:The bigging up of Cooper. Deary me.
It does seem a tad co-ordinated tbh.

Who else have the PLP got given that Khan isn't an MP?

And she was good yesterday, much better than Corbyn.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:23 pm

Asking the occasional pointed question as a backbench MP isn't *that* hard, you know.

Her performance in the SC under Ed distinctly underwhelmed. Her 2015 leadership campaign was dreary, complacent and visionless.

She has also been banging on and on and on about immigration since the referendum - or have you airbrushed all that out now?

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:24 pm

She stood and she lost I seem to remember......badly!

She hardly covered herself in glory when in cabinet either

Shows the lack of imagination in the PLP

Oh, and how about a novel idea....the PLP support the elected leader during an election

Haven't shown themselves to be that loyal even in 2010 and 2015....and that turned out well

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:26 pm

And I actually doubt that most Labour MPs, or members, share your view of Starmer SH.

I know I don't.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:28 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:And I actually doubt that most Labour MPs, or members, share your view of Starmer SH.
I
I know I don't.

I am pretty sure they do. He isn't the great white hope.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:34 pm

He has more substance to him IMO than the previous holder of that title (Jarvis)

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:34 pm

@howsillyofme1

We're still paying for the 2008 global financial crash. Austerity and the propping up of paper stock and property assets has protected those who had most benefited from the boom years at the expense of those who didn't. Hence the entrenched and growing societal and inter-generational divide.

In that sense, those who invested in the property that was sold to US buyers on mortgages they later defaulted on, are probably technically the actual people who ended up with all our money. That's my theory, anyway.

Incidentally, personally I don't think Corbyn should overdo the whole "6th wealthiest country in the world" too much. Part of that is simply by virtue of having a big population. Even if successfully spread out between everyone equitably, which is presumably his aim, our GDP per capita only puts us at about 25th. Comfortable enough, but we certainly don't have the natural resources to rival say Australia, however good our economic management and however fair our society. Part of tackling our runaway asset bubble is facing the reality that we can't afford it. That's what house prices 7 times average earnings is telling us. Quite how you convince voters to value the pound in their pocket over the pound in their house and get them to vote accordingly, though, is another matter. But there have to be ways more effective than simply asking them to support more housing for other people and a lower house price for them. They seem unwilling to go for that and hence more Tory rule because the Tories protect house prices.

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:40 pm

Thanks Willow for that

I think the last paragraph shows the difficulty we have

We need more houses as a society (or dwellings I should say) but at no cost to the value of the houses of current houseowners

It is I agree a consequence of this time of no inflation and low interest rates which allow asset bubbles....

Something has to give though and it could be nasty when it happens

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:42 pm

I would like to ask the poster above how he is 'pretty sure' of the opinion of other people...

Is there any evidence of this or is it just overwhelming arrogance?

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 3:59 pm

howsillyofme1 wrote:I would like to ask the poster above how he is 'pretty sure' of the opinion of other people...

Is there any evidence of this or is it just overwhelming arrogance?

Oh, I think we all know the answer to that.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 4:00 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:He has more substance to him IMO than the previous holder of that title (Jarvis)

That Jarvis piece in the NS was an embarrassment (the praise by some here and elsewhere is an indication of how desperate people are for signs of life).

But, as with Jarvis, they (and we) have had time to see Starmer in action now and know what those who've seen him in legal action already did. He is ok, but not up to much.

Better than Jarvis though, I agree. Jarvis, I think, had enough sense to know his limitations.

The problems for Cooper, other than the obvious, are well represented on this board though

1. She has been rejected once. People don't like admitting error, and going back to her would feel like the entire Corbyn project was a pointless mistake. (Which, of course, it was.)

2. She is associated with some bad policies under the fag end days of Brown.

And I agree with regard to immigration. Her wing of Labour has disgraced itself over free movement. Corbyn is much better, but he is unbound by any desire to win.

That said, I think she is easily the brightest and best Labour have. I think the PLP have finally twigged that as well.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 4:10 pm

Labour have now ruled out a second Brexit referendum. A spokesman for Jeremy Corbyn said:

A second referendum is not our policy and it won’t be in our manifesto.

Earlier, after Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell refused to rule the idea out (see 11.40am), the party issued a statement that played down the prospect of a second Brexit referendum under Labour, without ruling it out entirely. (See 12.11pm.)

This is what happens during election campaign. The decision process gets compressed. Under scrutiny from the media, parties get forced to clarify things, with the result that sometimes issues get resolved in hours that had previously been fudged for weeks, months or even years.

After trying to feel more positive about Corbyn, this sets me back a bit. I'm not unhappy with Labour not proposing a second referendum, it's not the most attractive policy, but by ruling out supporting one, they take a lot of pressure off May regardless of how many seats they manage to hang on to.

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 4:15 pm

Gerard Coyne suspended from Unite - not looking good for his leadership bid... If the DPA allegations are proven he is in for some trouble. It's really not going according to plan for the snivelling ABC cultists, is it.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 4:20 pm

Not my particular kind of music,granted.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 4:30 pm

@ Toby,Lenny,after a jacuzzi and suitably refreshed will begin to wing his way to correct address from tomorrow.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 4:50 pm

Q.Is there any law about finger flicking accompanied by blowing raspberries,farting in the direction of and general showings of displeasure against placards?.Only,and I am sill in shock about this,a Vote Tory one,not even trying to hide,appeared in 2015 in my chosen socialist paradise village.Nothing happened last time ,but if it reappears I don't to give the bastard the satisfaction of me being warned/fined or anything.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 4:59 pm

My view is that v flicking is compulsory where appropriate.
(Tories)

: vs double.jpg (1.98 KiB) Viewed 10953 times

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 4:59 pm

Though amusing given misspellng of road name in brickwork,and part of my village tour as well as this is where the villagers removed a shop from common land by horse and cart.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 5:00 pm

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 5:00 pm

I have a feeling we're going to need it.

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 5:16 pm

Looks like Dugher is standing down. Every cloud and all that

This exodus of the damned is quite revealing really.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 5:41 pm

Blenkinsop - standing down
Dugher - standing down (possibly)
Coyle - might lose (Hughes now favourite at the bookies, apparently)
Austin - might lose
Jess "f*** off" Phillips - might lose

Anybody seeing a pattern here? Even if the above all lose their seats, others in similarly precarious positions might well hold on for Labour (and I am thinking of a few here who could never be described as Corbyn friendly) because they actually care about the party, not just selfish solipistic self-promotion via a both gullible and corrupt media.

A possible silver lining from what is likely to overall be a depressing election.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 5:43 pm

I'll take any silver lining I can get at the moment.
crikey, I'll take a grey lining.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 5:43 pm

http://www.careinfo.org/care-england-la ... al-review/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Provider representative body Care England, in the face of opposition from Essex Council, is proceeding to judicial review of the fee rates Essex pays to independent care home providers.

The judicial review brought by Care England seeks to challenge the lawfulness of the Council’s fee setting decision in respect of the ‘old contract’ and its refusal to review the rates under the ‘new contract’.

Care England believes the Council’s actions to date to be a breach of its responsibilities under the Care Act 2014.

Care England chief executive Professor Martin Green said the association was deeply concerned about the Council’s conduct towards the care home market within Essex and as a result, the sustainability of that market.

“This is an important challenge in support of providers in Essex and those new and existing residents receiving care,” said Prof. Green.

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 5:48 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Blenkinsop - standing down
Dugher - standing down (possibly)
Coyle - might lose (Hughes now favourite at the bookies, apparently)
Austin - might lose
Jess "f*** off" Phillips - might lose

Anybody seeing a pattern here? Even if the above all lose their seats, others in similarly precarious positions might well hold on for Labour (and I am thinking of a few here who could never be described as Corbyn friendly) because they actually care about the party, not just selfish solipistic self-promotion via a both gullible and corrupt media.

A possible silver lining from what is likely to overall be a depressing election.

At the moment, I reckon a 1 in 4 chance of a hung parliament.

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 5:51 pm

Willow904 wrote:
Labour have now ruled out a second Brexit referendum. A spokesman for Jeremy Corbyn said:

A second referendum is not our policy and it won’t be in our manifesto.

Earlier, after Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell refused to rule the idea out (see 11.40am), the party issued a statement that played down the prospect of a second Brexit referendum under Labour, without ruling it out entirely. (See 12.11pm.)

This is what happens during election campaign. The decision process gets compressed. Under scrutiny from the media, parties get forced to clarify things, with the result that sometimes issues get resolved in hours that had previously been fudged for weeks, months or even years.
After trying to feel more positive about Corbyn, this sets me back a bit. I'm not unhappy with Labour not proposing a second referendum, it's not the most attractive policy, but by ruling out supporting one, they take a lot of pressure off May regardless of how many seats they manage to hang on to.

Have they ruled out supporting one though?
If their manifesto doesn't explicitly rule out having one, then wouldn't that leave it open that they could still support a referendum at some point.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 6:17 pm

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/t ... r_facebook" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tories accused of 'election bribe' by unveiling help for the disabled while campaign gets under way

Post by **refitman** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 6:29 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Blenkinsop - standing down
Dugher - standing down (possibly)
Coyle - might lose (Hughes now favourite at the bookies, apparently)
Austin - might lose
Jess "f*** off" Phillips - might lose

Anybody seeing a pattern here? Even if the above all lose their seats, others in similarly precarious positions might well hold on for Labour (and I am thinking of a few here who could never be described as Corbyn friendly) because they actually care about the party, not just selfish solipistic self-promotion via a both gullible and corrupt media.

A possible silver lining from what is likely to overall be a depressing election.

Have to say, it's a shame that Dugher has been so poor as a party representative, as he is quite a good constituency MP.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 6:29 pm

Whatever,happens they are going to have to sort the mess the last Governments left.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 6:31 pm

EU will welcome Britain back if election voters veto Brexit

Exclusive: European parliament president Antonio Tajani said EU departure process could easily be reversed if there is change of UK government

The president of the European parliament has said Britain would be welcomed back with open arms if voters change their minds about Brexit on 8 June, challenging Theresa May’s claim that “there is no turning back” after article 50.

Speaking after a meeting with the prime minister in Downing Street, Antonio Tajani insisted that her triggering of the departure process last month could be reversed easily by the remaining EU members if there was a change of UK government after the general election and would not even require a court case. (Guardian)

I suppose that will galvanise all the pro-"Brexit" people to go out and vote for the Conservatives.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... eto-brexit

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 20 Apr, 2017 6:31 pm

"Sorry old chap,we've fucked the whole system"