Wednesday 21st June 2017
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Welcome to FTN. New posters are welcome to join the conversation. You can follow us on Twitter @FlythenestHaven You are responsible for the content you post. This is a public forum. Treat it as if you are speaking in a crowded room. Site admin and Moderators are volunteers who will respond as quickly as they are able to when made aware of any complaints. Please do not post copyrighted material without the original authors permission.
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Wednesday 21st June 2017
Morning
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... -in-runoff" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Republicans also won South Carolina 5th but closer than expected.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... -in-runoff" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Republicans also won South Carolina 5th but closer than expected.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Universal credit rollout in North Kensington halted after tower fire
https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... um=twitter" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... um=twitter" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Apparently "consultation" on social care in Queen's Speech'
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Same with "energy cap"
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
8 Brexit related Bills
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Not in full regalia and a car apparently.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Morning folks,
A German perspective on the state of the UK:
http://www.voxeurop.eu/en/2017/uk-and-brexit-5121166
A German perspective on the state of the UK:
http://www.voxeurop.eu/en/2017/uk-and-brexit-5121166
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Yep looks like Keir Starmer has a busy year ahead!HindleA wrote:8 Brexit related Bills
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
It'll be like the art 50 debacle I assume. When push comes to shove, they'll vote with the government for fear of being labelled Remainera.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Yep looks like Keir Starmer has a busy year ahead!HindleA wrote:8 Brexit related Bills
The letter in the graun today from the 50 Labour MPs saying we should be members of, and not just have meaningless access to, the single market is similarly hypocritical.
Some of those clowns (though not all) voted for invoking article 50 without conditions. (Eg the appalling Umunna). All of them fight on a manifesto committing Labour to leaving the single market.laughable fools.
Last edited by SpinningHugo on Wed 21 Jun, 2017 10:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Morning all.
Quite.Mark Thomas @markthomasinfo 2m2 minutes ago
More
Everyday is a day of rage in the Daily Mail.
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
You find it laughable, reasonable folk call it politics.SpinningHugo wrote:It'll be like the art 50 debacle I assume. When push comes to shove, they'll vote with the government for fear of being labelled Remained.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Yep looks like Keir Starmer has a busy year ahead!HindleA wrote:8 Brexit related Bills
The letter in the graun today from the 50 Labour MPs saying we should be members of, and not just meaningless access to, the single market is similarly hypocritical.
Some of those clowns (though not all) voted for invoking article 50 without conditions. (Eg the appalling Umunna). All of them fight on a manifesto committing Labour to leaving the single market.laughable fools.
Labour have positioned themselves nicely here and in truth you know it. They have a simple test to apply: "Brexit for the many not the few". If they can say hand on heart that the proposal is not in the interests of the many, they can and will I'm sure vote against.
This will be quite a lot of things and I look forward to some forensic work from Starmer.
This is not to say there are no pitfalls for Labour. Freedom of movement will cause some trouble. But listening to Hammond too, it looks MUCH less likely than a few months back that we will leave the Single Market.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Morning all.
Couple of things I was ruminating on this morning.
Possibly having another GE so soon must be a potential drain on party finances.
The Tories increase in the CDE vote, is this Brexit led or are they heading towards a parallel with the GOP?
Couple of things I was ruminating on this morning.
Possibly having another GE so soon must be a potential drain on party finances.
The Tories increase in the CDE vote, is this Brexit led or are they heading towards a parallel with the GOP?
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
There's an awful lot of Tories talking about today's protest and the fact the police are over-stretched.
These will be the same that would quite like to see even bigger cuts in the public sector...
These will be the same that would quite like to see even bigger cuts in the public sector...
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
HindleA wrote:Universal credit rollout in North Kensington halted after tower fire
https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... um=twitter" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
What an admission of failure that is.A DWP spokesperson said: “The priority is to make sure people affected by the Grenfell Tower fire get the help they need. That’s why we will defer the rollout of the full universal credit service to North Kensington that was due to take place next month
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Indeed. Why delay it, IDS said that all on UC would be better off.gilsey wrote:HindleA wrote:Universal credit rollout in North Kensington halted after tower fire
https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... um=twitter" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;What an admission of failure that is.A DWP spokesperson said: “The priority is to make sure people affected by the Grenfell Tower fire get the help they need. That’s why we will defer the rollout of the full universal credit service to North Kensington that was due to take place next month
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Stewart Wood.
UK politics 2017-19 will be dominated by two trends: the chaos of Brexit paralysing government, & the chaos of government paralysing Brexit.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Really good thread on Brexit
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Booo to our political class. Booo to our media. Shame on them all.
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Booo to our political class. Booo to our media. Shame on them all.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Politically? Yes Labour did very well.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
This will be quite a lot of things and I look forward to some forensic work from Starmer.
This is not to say there are no pitfalls for Labour. Freedom of movement will cause some trouble. But listening to Hammond too, it looks MUCH less likely than a few months back that we will leave the Single Market.
In terms of ensuring we all are not made very much worse off, in particular the poorest?
No, Labour's Brexit position is utterly disgraceful in that regard.
Starmer will just roll over, just like last time. Because Labour's policy is the same as the Tory's.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Blessed are the piss takers.
http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/uk_59493 ... 9ed1a6/amp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/uk_59493 ... 9ed1a6/amp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Did we have this? There's a mistake in it re social care in the tory manifesto, but that's a minor quibble. Reactionary/progressive neo-liberals vs. social democracy, and has a go at Toynbee, who I stopped reading yonks ago so I'm glad to see it.
http://www.primeeconomics.org/articles/ ... democracy-" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.primeeconomics.org/articles/ ... democracy-" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Universal provision far more than a vote-grabber, it is the only viable and sustainable way to organize a just society
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Which Tory? There are still a few leftSpinningHugo wrote:Politically? Yes Labour did very well.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
This will be quite a lot of things and I look forward to some forensic work from Starmer.
This is not to say there are no pitfalls for Labour. Freedom of movement will cause some trouble. But listening to Hammond too, it looks MUCH less likely than a few months back that we will leave the Single Market.
In terms of ensuring we all are not made very much worse off, in particular the poorest?
No, Labour's Brexit position is utterly disgraceful in that regard.
Starmer will just roll over, just like last time. Because Labour's policy is the same as the Tory's.
Actually Hammond and Corbyn sound quite close on Brexit don't they?
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
from the Graun's daily politics."The Queen’s speech will include plans for “a publicly-funded advocate to act on behalf of families involved in a Hillsborough-style tragedy”
They could call it 'Legal Aid'.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Duke of Edinburgh poorly, taken into hospital last night. Something weird happened at the start of News at 10 on the BBC - the news channel had the presenter sitting at the desk just waiting whilst BBC1 had a test screen saying 'we will clear this fault as soon as possible' - I wondered if somebody had died then. Of course it might have bene nothing to do with this...
I still believe in a town called Hope
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
First thing, this group includes the vast majority of pensioners. Labour had a big lead with WORKING people in those categories.StephenDolan wrote: The Tories increase in the CDE vote, is this Brexit led or are they heading towards a parallel with the GOP?
Secondly, yes I think Brexit was a significant factor - anybody else remember May's appeal for Labour people to "lend" their votes to her because of it?
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Corbyn personally wants us out of the EU. Hammond doesn't. For Corbyn, McDonnell, Milne, Murray, Fisher, ad Lansman, the EU is a capitalist ramp preventing the UK from doing all the wonderful state aid things it would like to do.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Which Tory? There are still a few leftSpinningHugo wrote:Politically? Yes Labour did very well.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
This will be quite a lot of things and I look forward to some forensic work from Starmer.
This is not to say there are no pitfalls for Labour. Freedom of movement will cause some trouble. But listening to Hammond too, it looks MUCH less likely than a few months back that we will leave the Single Market.
In terms of ensuring we all are not made very much worse off, in particular the poorest?
No, Labour's Brexit position is utterly disgraceful in that regard.
Starmer will just roll over, just like last time. Because Labour's policy is the same as the Tory's.
Actually Hammond and Corbyn sound quite close on Brexit don't they?
Maybe on this one issue Corbyn has changed his mind from his voting record over 35 years. His actions before, during and since the referendum don't support that.
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
During the referendum he and McDonnell toured labour constituencies and labour audiences and repeatedly hammered out the message that we needed to vote remain, that the EU was imperfect but leaving would be much much worse. I saw McDonnell, my other half saw McDonnell and Corbyn. Labour voters voted remain at roughly the same percentage as green, lib dem and SNP voters. 'Corbyn lost the referendum' (which you don't say here but it's a path you're going down) is nonsense.SpinningHugo wrote:
Corbyn personally wants us out of the EU. Hammond doesn't. For Corbyn, McDonnell, Milne, Murray, Fisher, ad Lansman, the EU is a capitalist ramp preventing the UK from doing all the wonderful state aid things it would like to do.
Maybe on this one issue Corbyn has changed his mind from his voting record over 35 years. His actions before, during and since the referendum don't support that.
I still believe in a town called Hope
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Not just that, but "Corbyn DELIBERATELY lost the referendum". For a few people, it really is a modern day version of the Dolchstosslegende.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
#adam wrote:During the referendum he and McDonnell toured labour constituencies and labour audiences and repeatedly hammered out the message that we needed to vote remain, that the EU was imperfect but leaving would be much much worse. I saw McDonnell, my other half saw McDonnell and Corbyn. Labour voters voted remain at roughly the same percentage as green, lib dem and SNP voters. 'Corbyn lost the referendum' (which you don't say here but it's a path you're going down) is nonsense.SpinningHugo wrote:
Corbyn personally wants us out of the EU. Hammond doesn't. For Corbyn, McDonnell, Milne, Murray, Fisher, ad Lansman, the EU is a capitalist ramp preventing the UK from doing all the wonderful state aid things it would like to do.
Maybe on this one issue Corbyn has changed his mind from his voting record over 35 years. His actions before, during and since the referendum don't support that.
I didn't say he lost the referendum. It would have been lost regardless. I wasn't even making a complaint about the lacklustre Labour referendum campaign. I'm saying that it is highly unlikely that he has changed his mind about the EU, and there is no real evidence that he has. He behaves as political expediency requires him to.
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
I don't think this is terribly likely, but I wonder whether in delaying any formal agreement with the DUP the government are pleased to avoid having to list more nakedly partisan legislation in the Queen's Speech.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Though it is claimed May's pipedream to censor the internet is still in there?adam wrote:I don't think this is terribly likely, but I wonder whether in delaying any formal agreement with the DUP the government are pleased to avoid having to list more nakedly partisan legislation in the Queen's Speech.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
No fox-hunting, no new grammar schools? Quick, BBC, get Farage on the blower!
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... ns-for-you" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... fing-notes" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... fing-notes" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Last edited by HindleA on Wed 21 Jun, 2017 11:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
So the first winners from GE2017 are foxes and comprehensive schools it seems
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Oh and school dinners
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Children and small animals.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Oh and school dinners
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
...and no Trump visit
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Bonnie Greer
@Bonn1eGreer
Has HM joined... @EUflagMafia?
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
But then. she is well known for dressing very carefully to suit the occasion ....
@Bonn1eGreer
Has HM joined... @EUflagMafia?
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
But then. she is well known for dressing very carefully to suit the occasion ....
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Has there been an actual announcement on that?AngryAsWell wrote:...and no Trump visit
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Hello. Firefighters' initial reaction to Grenfell.
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There is someone on the thread who blames the man with the fridge.
Job done once again by the RW press.
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
There is someone on the thread who blames the man with the fridge.
Job done once again by the RW press.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Just look at that "someone's" Twitter bio. I don't think they needed much "convincing" by the press quite franklyNonOxCol wrote:Hello. Firefighters' initial reaction to Grenfell.
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
There is someone on the thread who blames the man with the fridge.
Job done once again by the RW press.
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Sad to see but not surprising continued zero recognition that social care is not "the elderly" increasingly obvious intended fundamental pernicious.divisive propagandisation of the "generational theft/fairness theme.One third.of working age for one thing.Any consultation predicated on falsity,burden/cost rather than judicious investment is fundamentally flawed and doesn't bode well.IMHO.
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Some interesting reads on this site, which I don't think I've seen before.
http://www.progressivepulse.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
eg
http://www.progressivepulse.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
eg
Amid the seeming surprise of the Serious Fraud Office opting to prosecute Barclays Bank personnel (at last) there is one particular aspect that we should try to draw attention to.
The BBC says that Barclays may have ‘given’ the money to Qatar to buy its own shares. If Barclays had the money in the first place there would presumably be no reason to give it to anyone – they already had it!
But Barclays didn’t ‘give’ it, they created it.
What should become crystal clear in the prosecution is that Barclays could create the money only by making a loan.
Barclays didn’t have the money but they could create it as a loan for a willing party – out of thin air.
Indeed Professor Richard Werner has always maintained that this is exactly what happened.
The serious Fraud Office obviously thinks along the same lines. Let us hope the fact that it is a criminal trial does not prevent the public from learning that this system of money creation is going on all the time and creates 97% of money in the economy.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Re Trump-very unlikely,not definitive.
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
From the G
Like Black Rod, another ancient fixture of our constitution is the Labour MP Dennis Skinner, a republican, who by tradition always makes a joke at this point. This time it’s rather a good one – a reference to the fact the Queen is heading for Royal Ascot later.
Get your skates on. First race is at half past two.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
I'm reading all state visits are announced in the Queens speech, as indeed was the Spanish visit - later this year - in this one.AnatolyKasparov wrote:Has there been an actual announcement on that?AngryAsWell wrote:...and no Trump visit
Not being in has been taken as "not happening" by the pundits I'm reading on twitter.
*edit to help a stray "e" find its way home
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
[youtube]zIktNjgbf4s[/youtube]
"Fall seven times, get up eight" - Japanese proverb
Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Good-afternoon, everyone
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistic ... in#history" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... nd-ons-may" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... nd-ons-may" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Local flats acquired according to the Beeb.
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Re: Wednesday 21st June 2017
Sixty-eight flats in £2bn luxury block to be given to families whose lives were devastated in Grenfell blaze
EXCLUSIVE: fire-hit residents to be given permanent homes in luxury block
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/s ... 69876.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
EXCLUSIVE: fire-hit residents to be given permanent homes in luxury block
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/s ... 69876.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;