Friday 6th.November 2015

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 4:59 am

Good (early!) morning, everyone!
Had some sleep (yay!), not so yellow (yay!), and pain receding (yay!). I might be getting better......sleep all over the place, but as a chronic insomniac that's SNAFU as my father used to say (Situation Normal All Fucked Up)

Thanks to all for the links yesterday on Osborne/tax credits/etc.

If Osborne "raids" the Universal Credit budget, the general view seems to be that he will fiddle with the earnings taper. In theory, UC claimants lose 65p in every £1 they earn (in fact, it's more if they get the housing element) and the idea seems to be that Osborne might increase that loss to 75p in the pound; if he does, the whole ethos of UC (ie. that claimants are better off in work) is under attack.

Of course, as many fact-checkers have shown, most UC claimants won't be much better off in work anyway - whatever IDS says - and the principle of the new benefit has already been eroded to the point that the original ethos has disappeared......plus, the IFS reckons that even if Osborne does this he won't raise enough to mitigate the tax credit cuts. There are only 146,000 UC claimants as I write.

Tim Montgomerie says that Osborne could lose his job over this - somehow I doubt that he will. Having failed to achieve every target he set himself since 2010, having doubled the national debt (now standing at £1.6 Trillion), and having given us the Omnishambles budget, he has been getting away with all manner of crapola and is still seen (by some) as a good Chancellor.

The only good thing about all of this is that many "shy Tory voters" are beginning to see what the Tories are really like when they are let loose - I have to confess to feeling a bit of schadenfreude.....but if Tory cruelty gets people angry and wanting change, that's OK with me, even if it's only based on self-interest.

I see there was some trouble at the Million Mask March in London - and having seen some of the footage, I'm not surprised. The Met made it clear beforehand that it would come down hard on anyone who didn't behave as ordered, and it did. As with any protest, a few idiots spoil the event for the majority - but most of the protesters were peaceful, and I don't think the kettling etc. was called for.
Absolutely no mention whatsoever on the BBC early bulletins - and a tiny article on the BBC News website. Ho hum......

If anyone has seen comments on CIF from Gav67 (who is very keen to share info on benefits/politics), you might be interested in looking at his website. He's an artist and is working on a comic - benandantiastralbodyguard.wordpress.com Obviously, I've told him about this place and I hope he comments here.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 7:03 am

Morning all.

Just caught up with Newsnight. Decent probing of Jo Johnson the Universities Minister. It's always amusing to hear a the exact same line repeated again and again, no matter how the questioning becomes more and more narrowed.

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:05 am

The very brilliant & all round lovely bloke Harry Leslie Smith has been tweeting a few pics of the company he has been keeping the last couple of days. He is a great inspiration when I get pissed off with my lot.

: CS_mlMnWUAAJMQU.jpg (57.09 KiB) Viewed 10691 times

: CS_nseQWwAEdDqe.jpg (108.01 KiB) Viewed 10691 times

: CS_sa5XWsAAC-uf.jpg (114.31 KiB) Viewed 10691 times

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:06 am

With Dan the man

: CTFiOfhWcAAkXDa.jpg (43.65 KiB) Viewed 10690 times

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:13 am

Morning all. Thank you for the pics Toby - they are a tonic. Anything to do with Harry is generally a tonic.

Here's a repost of mine from last night. Because it bears reading. Truly we are in Kafka territory and have been for quite some time.

Anonymous jobseeker: Why the Universal Credit system is not working
https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ... ot-working

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:20 am

''Most people have no interest in their GP surgery opening at weekends, a survey of almost a million patients has found.

In a further blow to Prime Minister David Cameron 's pledge to introduce seven-day services, new research showed that 81 per cent of patients do not find current GP opening times inconvenient.

Just 15 per cent said weekend opening would make it easier for them to see a doctor, while only 2 per cent said they would be able to attend Sunday appointments.''
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/bl ... ay-6779450" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The survey was researched by the University of East Anglia & the University of Oxford, and used data from the national 2014 General Practice Patient Survey.
Surveys were sent to patients from all 8,011 practices in England, and 881,000 people responded.

So if patients don't feel the need for it, what's the real agenda behind the Tory plans ?

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:20 am

& good morning all.

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:22 am

I hope I still have an ounce of his nous & joie de vivre if I ever get past 90

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:26 am

''Chile admits Pablo Neruda might have been murdered by Pinochet regime''
http://www.theguardian.com/books/2015/n ... het-regime" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Not exactly news, but another reminder of what Thatcher's buddy was capable of.

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:28 am

There may be a theme in those pics

The current leader

The previous leader

The one who never wanted to be leader

The possible favourite to be next leader.

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:35 am

See the knives are out in the indy, and a heavy pasting for Abbott on the beeb last night, she was said to be mouthy, but tbh for once what she did say was fairly plain and I would agree with it, and she barely got a word in following a meeting she chaired, but never set the platform for or the subject up for discussion. She was roundly condemned by a very vocal Syrian lady who, from what I could ascertain from the three sources I saw, was arguing a completely different point from the one up for discussion. Couldn't help thinking there's so much confusion about Syria, this was just more. If this lady wants ro get rid of Assad then surely Stop the War meetings aren't the way forward, but Andrew N. kept on keeping on and Diane and he surely would have made it up with each other behind the scenes. Cant help feeling there was something very stagey about it all, the meeting in question looked totally chaotic and all the action was on the floor. Peter Tatchell also weighing in. Who are the losers in this? Apparently Labour. So it was no surprise to see the Indy article, sorry no link, all the usual parliamentary suspects. Never mind the public may not notice, theres other stuff happening. Fully expecting some negative commentary very soon from favourite hacks.

Toby those pics were very reassuring. They have made my morning.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:39 am

Do you want it linked SC ? Will do so if you want.

I was in two minds about posting the link, partly aware of the need to keep an eye on the 'moderates' and their plotting, and partly wanting to bury my head in the sand as it is so depressing.

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:40 am

Here's another one that made my morning.

: Lewes-Bonfire-night.jpg (38.91 KiB) Viewed 10646 times

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 8:57 am

Courtesy Mr White

: ScreenShot00929.jpg (26.99 KiB) Viewed 10619 times

: ScreenShot00928.jpg (78.18 KiB) Viewed 10619 times

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:02 am

yahyah wrote:Do you want it linked SC ? Will do so if you want.

I was in two minds about posting the link, partly aware of the need to keep an eye on the 'moderates' and their plotting, and partly wanting to bury my head in the sand as it is so depressing.

I didnt link for the same reason, it was my first read of the day. Horribly depressing, and the timing of the two seemed linked. I thought it might spoil peoples breakfast. BTL especially.

The Pablo Neruda story was new to me and left me with a big lump in my throat and a rage about that dreadful woman with her dreadful clothes and even more dreadful friends. £100,000 while people go hungry and homeless; its hard to maintain a compassionate attitude when you have a raging heart.

On the plus side, and with apologies if this is a non-story for most, the lovely Minghyur Rinpoche has just emerged from a four year retreat, with a wondeful shine.

Peace.

And so glad, Ephie, that you are feeling somewhat better.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:03 am

Ladbrokes latest odds for Oldham West
1/16 Labour
8/1 UKIP
50/1 Cons
100/1 LD

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:13 am

Thanks for the update on Rinpoche SC.

I've spent an hour a day for the last four years reading Dharma texts and trying to practice meditation to develop bodhicitta. Constant grappling with Nagarjuna's Madhyamaka as well !

Developing compassion for those who are hurting so many is not easy.
But at least a point comes where one can experience the emptiness of the feelings and not just completely go with anger.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:17 am

From today's Waugh Zone email ...

... The Indy’s Andy Grice is no longer pol ed (he’s my ex-boss so I’m biased), but he’s still getting good yarns. Today he reports that Corbyn could be hit by a wave of resignations by moderate frontbenchers in an attempt to destabilise his leadership and pave the way for a coup aimed at ousting him. “There will be an uprising in the PLP [Parliamentary Labour Party] at some point,” one Labour MP told The Independent. “But we have to get our timing right. We may only have one shot.” The danger of this tactic of course is that there are plenty of new intake Corbynistas willing to step into the shoes of any mass resigners...

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 37m37 minutes ago
You can also read today's #WaughZone on the web: http://huff.to/1NwlBtY" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Oldham, Tory attacks on tax credit cuts, Bojo's bro + much more

Attempts to destabilise the leadership such as that are bound to have a terrible rebound from the membership - new and old. Please will MPs just get on with the job of representing their constituents and being the opposition. The energy wasted with this sort of stuff ... pah. And I would be saying this regardless of who had won the leadership contest.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:18 am

This is good from Fraser Nelson.

Fraser Nelson ‏@FraserNelson 37m37 minutes ago
Osborne's choice: abandon his £12bn welfare cuts target, or destroy the Tories' claim to be the 'workers party' http://goo.gl/ytlcQX" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:19 am

They won't be happy until they have destroyed the party.

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:21 am

rebeccariots2 wrote:This is good from Fraser Nelson.

Fraser Nelson ‏@FraserNelson 37m37 minutes ago
Osborne's choice: abandon his £12bn welfare cuts target, or destroy the Tories' claim to be the 'workers party' http://goo.gl/ytlcQX" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They've got no such claim. Never had.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:24 am

rebeccariots2 wrote:This is good from Fraser Nelson.

Fraser Nelson ‏@FraserNelson 37m37 minutes ago
Osborne's choice: abandon his £12bn welfare cuts target, or destroy the Tories' claim to be the 'workers party' http://goo.gl/ytlcQX" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

My money is on a halfway house that'll be applauded as demonstrating his fine political powers by a compliant media.

As for the moderate resignations, that'll demonstrate how inclusive they want to be. When it serves their purpose only.

Quick question regarding the income streams of the party, which (individual or entity) do you think align themselves with the self labelled moderates (SLM) ?

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:27 am

It worries me that Osborne will inevitably cave in, and just grab more money from easy targets like ESA, PIP etc. The MSM don't go into meltdown over these issues as they did with the Question Time nail bar crying lady

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:43 am

Morning
https://disabilitybenefitsconsortium.wo ... allowance/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Disability charities launch Parliamentary review into cuts to Employment and Support Allowance

As part of work on the Welfare Reform and Work Bill a Parliamentary review is being undertaken led by Crossbenchers Lord Low, Baroness Meacher and Baroness Grey-Thompson.

FWIW Lord Low was involved in garnering evidence ,when the last Government attempted to remove DLA Mobility from care home/residential school attendees which unsurprisingly revealed the non justification for doing so.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:49 am

@Toby what is left to plunder,in that regard?

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 9:58 am

I don,t put anything past them.There was talk of taxing PIP a few weeks ago, I don't think they would think twice about scrapping or reducing the support group premium too.

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 10:12 am

The WCA could be tightened up so that even less ppl qualify, along with a charge to Maximus, only refundable if you get 15 points or more

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 10:15 am

Toby - thank you, thank you, thank you!
OGRPPFG with his pants/pig on fire is Da Troof and no mistake.

Ms.Riots - thanks again, saw this yesterday. The jobseeker in question doesn't say what his profession is, but he is evidently an educated and articulate individual - just the sort of person whose experience and opinions are sorely needed in this debate. It is assumed by many - including the likes of "Trisha" - that jobseekers are uniformly thick, fit only for crappy jobs (which is all UJM has to offer) and undeserving of their benefits.
The article also highlights how long people are having to wait for their first UC payment. Even if you have a straightforward JSA-only UC claim, the wait is (in theory) 5 to 6 weeks for the first 4 weeks'-worth of benefit; some people have had to wait for months due to complications with the housing element, and housing associations in the pilot areas have reported much higher rent arrears when their tenants claim UC.
Bearing in mind that UC was supposed to be paid to 1 Million people by April 2015, the timetable for roll-out is way behind. Again. Or is it again?

We've been saying for a long time here that DWP is a rogue department - the likes of "Trisha" seem to be everywhere; even savvy claimants like me have endless problems with payments etc.; and I can't see things improving any time soon.

Interesting factoid - Osborne is the first Chancellor ever to cut a benefit that nobody's getting.

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 10:27 am

HindleA wrote:@Toby what is left to plunder,in that regard?

Morning, A.

Support Group ESA comes to mind. There won't be a WRAG component if Osborne gets his way; the obvious thing to me is that he could go for the £36.20 and cut it to the current WRAG level. He might time-limit NI conts-based SG ESA too.
Also, if you are on Income-based SG ESA, you can claim the Enhanced Disability Premium of £15.75. He could abolish that.
Of course, it wouldn't save anything like the dosh h would need to mitigate tax credit cuts.

I think he'll tinker with Housng Benefit entitlement again. He's already raided Universal Credit.

LadyCentauria · Post by **LadyCentauria** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 10:36 am

Oh guys, please don't give them ideas

@Ephie: Thanks for the morning post and for the link to Gav67's brilliant blog - what a great artist and storyteller he is! So, the DWP are claiming 146,000 people now on UC. I wonder what proportion of them are actually receiving financial support and how many still 'count' as on UC because they claimed it only for a very short period in between jobs. Ie., earning above the limits but still subject to UC regulations and sanctions. This, bearing in mind that most people who lose a job and claim JSA/UC are back in work ,and no longer claiming, within six months.
@Toby: Your series of pics put a wide smile on my face

Thank you.
@seeingclearly: Thank you, particularly, for the news of Minghyur Rinpoche - and for your posts late last night.

Swift Edit to fix formatting

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 10:48 am

rebeccariots2 wrote:From today's Waugh Zone email ...

... The Indy’s Andy Grice is no longer pol ed (he’s my ex-boss so I’m biased), but he’s still getting good yarns. Today he reports that Corbyn could be hit by a wave of resignations by moderate frontbenchers in an attempt to destabilise his leadership and pave the way for a coup aimed at ousting him. “There will be an uprising in the PLP [Parliamentary Labour Party] at some point,” one Labour MP told The Independent. “But we have to get our timing right. We may only have one shot.” The danger of this tactic of course is that there are plenty of new intake Corbynistas willing to step into the shoes of any mass resigners...

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 37m37 minutes ago
You can also read today's #WaughZone on the web: http://huff.to/1NwlBtY" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Oldham, Tory attacks on tax credit cuts, Bojo's bro + much more
Attempts to destabilise the leadership such as that are bound to have a terrible rebound from the membership - new and old. Please will MPs just get on with the job of representing their constituents and being the opposition. The energy wasted with this sort of stuff ... pah. And I would be saying this regardless of who had won the leadership contest.

These people have shown already that they are all mouth. And also dismally incompetent

And haven't most of those types absented themselves from the front bench already? I can think of maybe half a dozen MPs who might concievably be up for this, and Jez is likely to conduct a reshuffle and bring in more lefty younger types at some point anyway.

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 10:57 am

I thought Victoria Coren was impressive on QT last night. Justine Greening useless. Chuka equally so.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 11:02 am

As others have already pointed out, having a backbencher as the Labour "spokesperson" hasn't been *that* common in recent years.......

LadyCentauria · Post by **LadyCentauria** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 11:04 am

I say please don't give them ideas but I suppose we do have to think about these things as they're likely to do all or any of them - or sneak up with summat we've not considered. As for whoever it is that's plugging the idea of SFB resignations and coups, I hope it's more a case of someone's wishful thinking because it would be disaster for the Labour Party. And who could they think to put in charge? Do they not get it that thousands - tens of thousands, even - of regular Party Members would quit, losing a valuable income stream and valuable activists. And the Tories would laugh their fucking heads off and rub their hands with glee...

Anyroad, on another note:

The Department for Business, Innovation and Skills will today publish its Green Paper on higher education.
As well as a new regulator called the ‘Office for Students’, the document will outline how the Teaching Excellence Framework could operate, and will unveil plans to make it easier for new institutions to receive the power to award degrees.
The Universities Minister said the Office for Students would have “a clear remit to champion value for money and the student interest in its decision-making”.

The new Teaching Excellence Framework will use financial incentives to “encourage a greater focus on high quality teaching and graduate employment prospects”.
The Green Paper says universities will be assessed against student satisfaction, student drop-out rates and graduate employment prospects.
Universities that are judged to be passing these tests will be allowed to increase tuition fees in line with inflation.

BIS also plans to make it “less bureaucratic” for new institutions to join the higher education sector by allowing them to award degrees and be given the title ‘university’ more quickly.

https://www.politicshome.com/education/ ... sity-shake
And, according to other reports, at least part of the cost of this will come from savage cuts to FE colleges.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 11:09 am

RobertSnozers wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:From today's Waugh Zone email ...

... The Indy’s Andy Grice is no longer pol ed (he’s my ex-boss so I’m biased), but he’s still getting good yarns. Today he reports that Corbyn could be hit by a wave of resignations by moderate frontbenchers in an attempt to destabilise his leadership and pave the way for a coup aimed at ousting him. “There will be an uprising in the PLP [Parliamentary Labour Party] at some point,” one Labour MP told The Independent. “But we have to get our timing right. We may only have one shot.” The danger of this tactic of course is that there are plenty of new intake Corbynistas willing to step into the shoes of any mass resigners...

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 37m37 minutes ago
You can also read today's #WaughZone on the web: http://huff.to/1NwlBtY" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Oldham, Tory attacks on tax credit cuts, Bojo's bro + much more
Attempts to destabilise the leadership such as that are bound to have a terrible rebound from the membership - new and old. Please will MPs just get on with the job of representing their constituents and being the opposition. The energy wasted with this sort of stuff ... pah. And I would be saying this regardless of who had won the leadership contest.
I'm beginning to wonder if *that* wing of the party will ever STFU. You don't need a particularly long memory to see that this goes back to Brown's leadership - every so often there'd be a resignation, or a speech, or an 'unattributable briefing', nowhere near enough to unseat the leader but just enough to keep the leadership permanently on the back foot. And it's not just any so-called 'moderates', let's call them what they are - Blairites. They don't have to have been a supporter of Blair during his premiership, but they are the ones who espouse that vision of Labour and would rather lose to the Tories than accept anything else. These attacks would have happened if Burnham had won, and qiuite possibly if Cooper had won, too.

Though it was slightly different under Miliband - the uncertain nature of his original mandate meant he never felt fully secure and constantly tried to mollify and appease his critics (even though they would only ever, in fact, be satisfied with his resignation) Corbyn's overwhelming mandate from the membership does a great deal to neutralise his lack of support in the PLP, plus he isn't inclined to temporising anyway.

In a way its just a question of time, quite a few of these people will be gone in 2020 and even more by 2025.

They know, deep down, that they are on the wrong side of history and it is killing them

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 11:10 am

yahyah wrote:Thanks for the update on Rinpoche SC.

I've spent an hour a day for the last four years reading Dharma texts and trying to practice meditation to develop bodhicitta. Constant grappling with Nagarjuna's Madhyamaka as well !

Developing compassion for those who are hurting so many is not easy.
But at least a point comes where one can experience the emptiness of the feelings and not just completely go with anger.

Hardest work anyone can do, yahyah, thank you for your work.

Good morning, everyone.

LadyCentauria · Post by **LadyCentauria** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 11:12 am

frightful_oik wrote:I thought Victoria Coren was impressive on QT last night. Justine Greening useless. Chuka equally so.

Agree, wholeheartedly! Well, very very close to. Only that I thought Chuka marginally better than my own MP, Ms. Greening. Victoria Coren was superb - deeply factual and passionate, yet managing to slide in appropriate flashes of humour.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 11:15 am

The new Teaching Excellence Framework will use financial incentives to “encourage a greater focus on high quality teaching and graduate employment prospects”. The Green Paper says universities will be assessed against student satisfaction, student drop-out rates and graduate employment prospects. Universities that are judged to be passing these tests will be allowed to increase tuition fees in line with inflation.

If good value for money in education and training is the goal, these incentives, assessments and test results are how NOT to get it.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 11:19 am

To be fair,both parties are not adverse to skullduggery.Unbeknownst to me on transfer to ESA Support Group a reduction of £9 a week was the result,transitionally protected until it equalised,but of course a cut from what it would have been I suspect a similar method will be found.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 11:50 am

Tim Montgomerie ن ‏@montie 50m50 minutes ago
Cheerio Britain. During my year on the other side of the pond I'll be tweeting about US politics from @MontieUSA

Bye bye Montie. Didn't know you were off on a USA trip. Probably a good time for a 'compassionate' conservative to away from the heat of the Tory kitchen.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 11:55 am

I see Easyjet and Dave are living up to expectations.

Emily Ashton ‏@elashton 10m10 minutes ago
No 10 says broken-down plane at Sharm has made situation worse. But confirms 1st flight has left."British passengers are on their way home."

‏@elashton
PM's spokesman ducks repeated qs on whether Egyptians blocked Easyjet from landing at Sharm. "Clearly this is a fluid & complex situation."

Emily Ashton ‏@elashton 11m11 minutes ago
Instead No 10 takes pop at Easyjet. "Airlines need to work closely with us to ensure information they're giving to passengers is accurate"

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 12:00 pm

RobertSnozers wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:From today's Waugh Zone email ...

... The Indy’s Andy Grice is no longer pol ed (he’s my ex-boss so I’m biased), but he’s still getting good yarns. Today he reports that Corbyn could be hit by a wave of resignations by moderate frontbenchers in an attempt to destabilise his leadership and pave the way for a coup aimed at ousting him. “There will be an uprising in the PLP [Parliamentary Labour Party] at some point,” one Labour MP told The Independent. “But we have to get our timing right. We may only have one shot.” The danger of this tactic of course is that there are plenty of new intake Corbynistas willing to step into the shoes of any mass resigners...

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 37m37 minutes ago
You can also read today's #WaughZone on the web: http://huff.to/1NwlBtY" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Oldham, Tory attacks on tax credit cuts, Bojo's bro + much more
Attempts to destabilise the leadership such as that are bound to have a terrible rebound from the membership - new and old. Please will MPs just get on with the job of representing their constituents and being the opposition. The energy wasted with this sort of stuff ... pah. And I would be saying this regardless of who had won the leadership contest.
I'm beginning to wonder if *that* wing of the party will ever STFU. You don't need a particularly long memory to see that this goes back to Brown's leadership - every so often there'd be a resignation, or a speech, or an 'unattributable briefing', nowhere near enough to unseat the leader but just enough to keep the leadership permanently on the back foot. And it's not just any so-called 'moderates', let's call them what they are - Blairites. They don't have to have been a supporter of Blair during his premiership, but they are the ones who espouse that vision of Labour and would rather lose to the Tories than accept anything else. These attacks would have happened if Burnham had won, and qiuite possibly if Cooper had won, too.

Instead of anonymous backbenching making noisy, anonymous threats undermining the overall unity of Labour, an honourable Labour backbencher critical of any Labour party leader or chosen policy may choose positive mediation between themselves and Labour membership in order to continue their work within the Labour party and keep the whole unified during disagreement. Jeremy Corbyn has successfully done this for decades. A Labour MP I know won't lose to Tories for anything and values creative negotiation during disagreement rather than using anonymous sniping. He learned respectful, principled, conflict resolution, in part, from Corbyn. He's more in common with Corbyn than differences and knows it.

The Indy’s Andy Grice is no longer pol ed (he’s my ex-boss so I’m biased), but he’s still getting good yarns.

Getting stories from fictional sources. No source, no validity.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 12:08 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Tim Montgomerie ن ‏@montie 50m50 minutes ago
Cheerio Britain. During my year on the other side of the pond I'll be tweeting about US politics from @MontieUSA
Bye bye Montie. Didn't know you were off on a USA trip. Probably a good time for a 'compassionate' conservative to away from the heat of the Tory kitchen.

~~I wish all the Tories would leave for the US. Or Australia. Or stick them all on the QM2 and keep them there circling the globe in luxury.~~

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 12:11 pm

citizenJA wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Tim Montgomerie ن ‏@montie 50m50 minutes ago
Cheerio Britain. During my year on the other side of the pond I'll be tweeting about US politics from @MontieUSA
Bye bye Montie. Didn't know you were off on a USA trip. Probably a good time for a 'compassionate' conservative to away from the heat of the Tory kitchen.
I wish all the Tories would leave for the US. Or Australia. Or stick them all on the QM2 and keep them there circling the globe in luxury.

Tbf Montie is someone who does seem to hold the compassionate principles others often talk about but don't live up to.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 12:15 pm

HindleA wrote:To be fair,both parties are not adverse to skullduggery.Unbeknownst to me on transfer to ESA Support Group a reduction of £9 a week was the result,transitionally protected until it equalised,but of course a cut from what it would have been I suspect a similar method will be found.

edited to cultivate kindness rather than malice toward Tories

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 12:20 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
citizenJA wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote: Bye bye Montie. Didn't know you were off on a USA trip. Probably a good time for a 'compassionate' conservative to away from the heat of the Tory kitchen.
I wish all the Tories would leave for the US. Or Australia. Or stick them all on the QM2 and keep them there circling the globe in luxury.
Tbf Montie is someone who does seem to hold the compassionate principles others often talk about but don't live up to.

You're a kind person and an example to me, teaching me greater kindness is never too much.
I sincerely apologise for my unkind post.

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 12:32 pm

Well, Ms.J.A. - apologise if you must; I think you were right the first time. I'd have been considerably more vitriolic.

Just picked this up from the Twattosphere - no idea if it's true - @yhdoctors (Yorkshire Junior Doctors, apparently) say this - according to the BMA, the heads of medical Royal Colleges have been ordered by the government to condemn junior doctors' strike action or risk their Royal Charters.

If there is any truth in this, it is absolutely disgraceful.

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 12:43 pm

https://www.rt.com/uk/320928-child-abuse-mi6-dossier/

Former MI6 director ‘could be to blame’ for missing child abuse dossier – Labour MP

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 12:44 pm

To be clear Labour were responsible for the transfer arrangements,it just took six years to happen.Still people that haven't been so.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 06 Nov, 2015 12:58 pm

tinybgoat wrote:https://www.rt.com/uk/320928-child-abuse-mi6-dossier/
Former MI6 director ‘could be to blame’ for missing child abuse dossier – Labour MP

Not quite sure I understand how GK Young could be involved as according to wikipedia he left the service in 1961.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Kennedy_Young" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He was a nasty piece of work though - involved in all kinds of far right groups.

G.K. (as he was popularly referred to) subsequently became Chairman of the Society for Individual Freedom. He was also an early and leading member of the Conservative Monday Club serving on several of its policy committees (Chairman of the Action Fund 1967-69), (Chairman, Economics Committee) and Executive Council. He was virulently opposed to immigration and helped found the club's immigration committee. After losing an acrimonious election for the position of club chairman to Jonathan Guinness in 1974 in which he had been supported by the British National Front,[1] he set up another far-right group called Tory Action.

In 1976, Young, assisted by Frederic Bennett, created the private army 'Unison.'[2]

He might well have been the model for the Uncle Jimmy character in Regional Perrin.