Monday 30th November 2015

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 1:59 pm

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 51s51 seconds ago
.@andybell5news why can't it be delayed #Syria vote?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:00 pm

Good-afternoon, everyone. I hope the messages I've sent were received and formatted correctly. Please let me know if you've not received the message sent.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:03 pm

https://theconversation.com/the-stories ... ives-50559" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The stories that show how fit-for-work assessments are destroying lives

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:06 pm

@citizenJA

Hello. I hope you had a restful night.

Edited

Sorry - I forgot to make you bold, so to speak.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:08 pm

Thank you, everyone, for your messages sent to me and our friends. Your loving-kindness is invaluable, shared and appreciated.

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:12 pm

That was quick, decision already made? Free vote, but Labours position is to oppose.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:13 pm

DavidBraniff-Herbert ‏@the_dbh 1 min1 minute ago

Um, someone should let @BBCBreaking know that Corbyn has offered a free vote. #awkward

Right? Wrong?

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:19 pm

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 6m6 minutes ago
Confrimed by senior sources: free vote on Syria granted by Corbyn. But party position is 'strong anti-bombing'.

I'm OK with this. But I'm sure there will be those who aren't - and very vociferously so.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:21 pm

Chris Ship ‏@chrisshipitv 8m8 minutes ago
LATEST: Seems Corbyn might go for a whipped vote with a suspension of Shadow Cabinet responsibility. So like a free vote. But not.

Eh?

Torcuil Crichton ‏@Torcuil 6m6 minutes ago
No whip, a free vote for Labour MPs on action against IS on Syria. That's a bombs away signal for Cameron.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:25 pm

PorFavor wrote:@citizenJA

Hello. I hope you had a restful night.

Edited

Sorry - I forgot to make you bold, so to speak.

I cried a lot. I'm okay. I have a loving partner. Apologies for going a bit off-topic here on the thread. I await further news and will share it.

You're all dear people, each of us irreplaceable - I can't stress this enough. It's part of politics, you know, people coming together here, real people wanting to understand and share how we'd like our society organised.

Moving on to another thing I've been thinking about, disagreement among intelligent people is certain and normal. FTN is functional. Just keep at it, if you can. Keep sharing your voices. Working together is essential to get what we need to live and thrive. We can't do this individually. I don't know how to install a wind turbine or build a train. I'll need some help. Thank you for your patience with me.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:29 pm

Marcher Lord ‏@MarcherLord1 27 mins27 minutes ago

++BREAKING++
The postal vote is in and counted for #OldhamWest - Labour surge to victory with 142% of the vote

I didn't know they counted the postal vote beforehand?

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:32 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
Marcher Lord ‏@MarcherLord1 27 mins27 minutes ago

++BREAKING++
The postal vote is in and counted for #OldhamWest - Labour surge to victory with 142% of the vote
I didn't know they counted the postal vote beforehand?

It's a troll - only witless frothing right wingers think that he is in any way amusing or insightful.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:32 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Chris Ship ‏@chrisshipitv 8m8 minutes ago
LATEST: Seems Corbyn might go for a whipped vote with a suspension of Shadow Cabinet responsibility. So like a free vote. But not.
Eh?

Torcuil Crichton ‏@Torcuil 6m6 minutes ago
No whip, a free vote for Labour MPs on action against IS on Syria. That's a bombs away signal for Cameron.

From the Great Leader (Thatcher), 'Where there is order within the Labour party, let us attempt sowing maximum confusion...'

Post by **refitman** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:32 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
Marcher Lord ‏@MarcherLord1 27 mins27 minutes ago

++BREAKING++
The postal vote is in and counted for #OldhamWest - Labour surge to victory with 142% of the vote
I didn't know they counted the postal vote beforehand?

I think you can write that off as "postal votes are all fraudulent and in Labour's favour" trolling.

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:37 pm

refitman wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:
Marcher Lord ‏@MarcherLord1 27 mins27 minutes ago

++BREAKING++
The postal vote is in and counted for #OldhamWest - Labour surge to victory with 142% of the vote
I didn't know they counted the postal vote beforehand?
I think you can write that off as "postal votes are all fraudulent and in Labour's favour" trolling.

Which is the standard Kipper whine when things don't go their way electorally.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:49 pm

Corbyn written to DC requesting two full days debate.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:51 pm

http://samedifference1.com/2015/11/30/m ... transfers/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Major Delays For Forced DLA-PIP Transfers

The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) has said that it now expects the DWP to take 45% longer than planned to reassess all working age disability living allowance (DLA) claimants for personal independence payment (PIP). The OBR still expects only 74% of DLA claimants to get an award of PIP, however, leading 400,000 current DLA claimant losing out entirely.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:54 pm

Dear David

As of this morning we have not had a clear proposal from the government on when you plan to bring forward a motion to the House on air strikes in Syria or on arrangements for the debate.

In the view of the Opposition on a matter of such critical importance there must be full and adequate time for any debate in the House and only a full two day debate would ensure time for all Members who wish to participate to be able to do so.

As has happened previously a one day debate would inevitably lead to important contributions being curtailed. It is incumbent on us all to ensure the country feels there has been the fullest parliamentary discussion of what you have rightly described as a highly complex situation. In addition the debate would be much better informed by views from the Foreign Affairs and Defence Select Committees following your recent statements.

Please can you provide an assurance that any proposal the government brings forward will be on the basis that there will be a two day debate in the House of Commons.

Yours sincerely

Jeremy Corbyn MP

Leader of the Opposition

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:55 pm

Apologies if replicating what people already know/have seen.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 2:55 pm

I wish the PLP would've made Cameron sweat a bit more. 2 days is a reasonable request, but given the EVEL and what is a financial bill lack of discussion, who knows!

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 3:12 pm

Politico Daily ‏@Politico_Daily 44 mins44 minutes ago

Shad cab collective responsibility suspended for the #Syriavote Lab MPs will be whipped - front benchers voting with Govt will not be sacked

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 3:13 pm

ephemerid wrote:On balance, I think he [Corbyn] should go for a free vote - but not announce it until Cameron has set the date. Cameron is the PM - if he has the courage of his convictions, he will have that vote. Of course, he hasn't - and he looks like a tosser as it is. Delaying tactics will make him look even worse.

Ed Miliband was right in 2013; now that Cameron has changed his mind about whose side he's on, but determined to get his regime change and have his war anyway, we have to go through the entire performance again.

http://flythenest.org/viewtopic.php?p=81168#p81168

Ephemerid's entire post is excellent. I'm posting the section above to emphasise what should be a never-ending chorus until Dave and his Tory government have ended.
'Cameron is the PM'. For nearly six years. Dave Cameron - PM of Tory government, his responsibility, his government.
Put Dave on the spot - he's willingly put himself there after all - something about being good at it, according to Dave.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 3:17 pm

'Dear David,'

I love it.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 3:54 pm

ITV Press Centre ‏@itvpresscentre 14m14 minutes ago
Allegra Stratton joins @ITVNews as National Editor http://bit.ly/1XCCqo3" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 3:54 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
Marcher Lord ‏@MarcherLord1 27 mins27 minutes ago

++BREAKING++
The postal vote is in and counted for #OldhamWest - Labour surge to victory with 142% of the vote
I didn't know they counted the postal vote beforehand?

Hurrah, 142%, New Politics indeed.

I assume this is the tired old cliche about postal votes being rigged.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 3:59 pm

ohsocynical wrote:Politico Daily ‏@Politico_Daily 44 mins44 minutes ago

Shad cab collective responsibility suspended for the #Syriavote Lab MPs will be whipped - front benchers voting with Govt will not be sacked

I don't think so, which is probably why the meeting is going on. Corbyn cannot say it is Labour policy to oppose unless the SC agrees it is.

He has no mechanism to do so, the NEC statement rather made that clear.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 4:01 pm

Is it just me, or does tweeting during a meeting take away from the building a consensus / agreed approach?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 4:11 pm

StephenDolan wrote:Is it just me, or does tweeting during a meeting take away from the building a consensus / agreed approach?

I'm concerned about the compromised attention being given the meeting's topic.
'Hey, dude/dudette - you here or not?'
That's protocol lingo from a team I worked within.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 4:14 pm

PARLY ‏@ParlyApp 9m9 minutes ago
.@Jeremy_Hunt is updating MPs on contingency plans for #juniordoctors strike

Luciana Berger Retweeted
Labour's Health Team ‏@LabourHealth 4m4 minutes ago
Key question for Jeremy Hunt - why did he leave it so long before agreeing to Acas talks? Many operations would have already been cancelled

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 4:14 pm

Today - Now-ish

Secretary of State for Health, Jeremy Hunt, is to make a statement in the House of Commons on Monday 30 November 2015 on Junior Doctors' contracts.

The statement is expected to start at 4.15pm, following the conclusion of Education Questions.

Timings are approximate as Parliamentary business is subject to change.

http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/24 ... 0311da132e

He's not up yet but I guess JHunt will put in an appearance.
Maybe.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 4:16 pm

citizenJA wrote:Today - Now-ish
Secretary of State for Health, Jeremy Hunt, is to make a statement in the House of Commons on Monday 30 November 2015 on Junior Doctors' contracts.

The statement is expected to start at 4.15pm, following the conclusion of Education Questions.

Timings are approximate as Parliamentary business is subject to change.

http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/24 ... 0311da132e
He's not up yet but I guess JHunt will put in an appearance.
Maybe.

Three strikes and Hunt out.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 4:36 pm

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 3m3 minutes ago
Rumours that LibDems will vote FOR Syria bombing
But spksmn tells me that's 'presumptious', MPs/peers meet tonight + more discussions follow

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 4:40 pm

Rushanara Ali ‏@rushanaraali 2m2 minutes ago
Pleased to support @CllrJimMcMahon in Oldham yesterday, reports of segregation at event completely untrue

Good to hear that. Who started sending around the gender segregation tweets? I've seen tweets from various Ukip figures - is that where it started?

Some of the tweets about Oldham by-election are very depressing.

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 4:41 pm

StephenDolan wrote:
citizenJA wrote:Today - Now-ish
Secretary of State for Health, Jeremy Hunt, is to make a statement in the House of Commons on Monday 30 November 2015 on Junior Doctors' contracts.

The statement is expected to start at 4.15pm, following the conclusion of Education Questions.

Timings are approximate as Parliamentary business is subject to change.

http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/24 ... 0311da132e
He's not up yet but I guess JHunt will put in an appearance.
Maybe.
Three strikes and Hunt out.

Dave can't sack him, Rhyming Slang knows where the News International bodies are buried.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 4:50 pm

StephenDolan wrote:Is it just me, or does tweeting during a meeting take away from the building a consensus / agreed approach?

Never could understand they take phones away from kids at school because they distract them from lessons, stops them listening and learning, but grown ups are allowed...

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:01 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Rushanara Ali ‏@rushanaraali 2m2 minutes ago
Pleased to support @CllrJimMcMahon in Oldham yesterday, reports of segregation at event completely untrue
Good to hear that. Who started sending around the gender segregation tweets? I've seen tweets from various Ukip figures - is that where it started?

Some of the tweets about Oldham by-election are very depressing.

I think UKIP probably invented that story, they have form.

I wouldn't read too much into Oldham tweets, nobody knows what is really going on. Labour must still be favourites to win because it is very favourable ground for them, much less so for the Kippers.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:04 pm

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 19m19 minutes ago
Shad Cabinet minister @JohnHealey_MP has written to his CLP to say he will be voting against bombing in Syria
http://www.johnhealeymp.co.uk/news/Nove ... our-party/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:05 pm

Nobody's going to think that Labour's against if the Shadow Foreign Secretary and Deputy Leader vote For. It's a free vote. Just call it that.

Good on Corbyn for asking for a 2 day debate though.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:06 pm

TechnicalEphemera wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Rushanara Ali ‏@rushanaraali 2m2 minutes ago
Pleased to support @CllrJimMcMahon in Oldham yesterday, reports of segregation at event completely untrue
Good to hear that. Who started sending around the gender segregation tweets? I've seen tweets from various Ukip figures - is that where it started?

Some of the tweets about Oldham by-election are very depressing.
I think UKIP probably invented that story, they have form.

I wouldn't read too much into Oldham tweets, nobody knows what is really going on. Labour must still be favourites to win because it is very favourable ground for them, much less so for the Kippers.

Is Gilligan in the vicinity?

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:09 pm

Jim Pickard ‏@PickardJE 2m2 minutes ago
MP tells me Rosie Winterton stepping down as Labour chief whip.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:09 pm

TechnicalEphemera wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:
Marcher Lord ‏@MarcherLord1 27 mins27 minutes ago

++BREAKING++
The postal vote is in and counted for #OldhamWest - Labour surge to victory with 142% of the vote
I didn't know they counted the postal vote beforehand?

Hurrah, 142%, New Politics indeed.

I assume this is the tired old cliche about postal votes being rigged.

More specifically about Muslims.

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:10 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:Nobody's going to think that Labour's against if the Shadow Foreign Secretary and Deputy Leader vote For. It's a free vote. Just call it that.

Good on Corbyn for asking for a 2 day debate though.

That can be easily solved....change shadow Foreign Secretary!

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:11 pm

: ScreenShot01151.jpg (28.71 KiB) Viewed 4952 times

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:12 pm

Cancel that

: ScreenShot01152.jpg (30.12 KiB) Viewed 4951 times

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:13 pm

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 1m1 minute ago
Shadow Cabinet minister tells me Rosie Winterton has NOT quit. "And seems in good health!"

Jim Pickard ‏@PickardJE 2m2 minutes ago
ROSIE WINTERTON NOT STEPPING DOWN AFTER ALL

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:20 pm

... A vote on new airstrikes in Syria could be as early as Wednesday and if MPs agree the bombing could begin that night.
In order to force it through MPs are being offered an intelligence briefing and 'tea and biscuits' by the Tories to encourage them to pack the Prime Minister, a senior Labour source told MailOnline.
Britain is the only major power to have the deadly Brimstone missile - a £100,000-a-shot super-weapon that kills targets without hurting civilians in 99 per cent of cases.
Sources close to the Prime Minister say he has been 'enraged' by senior ISIS figures being able to hide in Syria and 'wants to take them out'.
He told RAF commanders: 'We've got to go out and kill the bastards,' according to the Sunday Times.
Although Jihadi John - Briton Mohammed Emwazi - was killed by a US drone he was targeted using British surveillance in the sky and on the ground in Raqqa.
Mr Cameron apparently exploded into a rage when Emwazi continued to execute hostages and said: 'He's on my television cutting the heads off my own citizens. I'm not having it'...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -vote.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

For me - this says everything that is wrong about the way Cameron is approaching this. I do not want an 'enraged', apoplectic person leading us into war.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:23 pm

Iain Martin ‏@iainmartin1 2m2 minutes ago
Breaking: someone to resign.

Iain Martin Retweeted
Stephen Pollard ‏@stephenpollard 2m2 minutes ago
I'm hearing that someone is going to resign. If not now, soon.

They're all just pissing about now ... the journos and pundits that is.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:25 pm

Emily Ashton ‏@elashton 1m1 minute ago
PM will make a statement on Syria tonight after 7pm. Understand it’ll be on TV rather than in Commons.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:26 pm

Excuse me if I am speaking out of order, am not sure what the usual protocols on forums for this type of situation are.

But are we not going to offer personal tributes to the compassionate, humourous and intelligent woman we have lost. Our loss is minor compared to those who loved/knew her in the offline world, but still real nonetheless.

Will delete this if I shouldn't have mentioned it. Apologies if it is the wrong thing.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 30 Nov, 2015 5:30 pm

A little bit of better or should I say more positive news.

Tory MPs will oppose watering down Freedom of Information Act
Former Conservative home secretary David Davis says fight to defend legislation is ‘eminently winnable’ and would be supported by more than 12 MPs
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... mation-act" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
... The former Conservative home secretary said the fight to defend the legislation was “eminently winnable”, even if the government tried to bypass parliament to introduce measures such as higher charges for requests.

“Whatever they come up with, we can find an appropriate response in one house or another,” Davis told an all-parliamentary briefing organised by the cross-party campaign to defend freedom of information. “I think this is an eminently winnable campaign to protect what I think is the strongest constitutional legacy of the [Tony] Blair government.”...