Saturday 24th & Sunday 25th January 2015

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:23 pm

Has Cameron said he'll do the debates yet?

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:29 pm

#FinishTheTories going strong.

: Pedigree Chump.jpg (45.16 KiB) Viewed 7219 times

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:34 pm

@rebeccariots2

Further to your Ukip story the BBC has this:

UKIP MEP Amjad Bashir suspended over 'serious' financial issues

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30967633

It's a bit light on detail but fuller coverage has been given on BBC News24, so I expect the written article will be filled out a bit in due course. Amjad Bashir was poised to defect to the Conservatives and apparently Nigel Farage has said they're welcome to him (or words to that effect).

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:37 pm

PorFavor wrote:@rebeccariots2

Further to your Ukip story the BBC has this:

UKIP MEP Amjad Bashir suspended over 'serious' financial issues
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30967633

It's a bit light on detail but fuller coverage has been given on BBC News24, so I expect the written article will be filled out a bit in due course. Amjad Bashir was poised to defect to the Conservatives and apparently Nigel Farage has said they're welcome to him (or words to that effect).

Ta PF. Blimey - defect to the Conservatives? - surely that would be a capital crime for a UKipper? He may be getting off lightly.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:40 pm

: Election 2015 Predictions.jpg (57.99 KiB) Viewed 7211 times

John Rentoul ‏@JohnRentoul 2h2 hours ago
Trailer for my column in the @IndyOnSunday tomorrow: election predictions http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2015/01/ ... edictions/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; … pic.twitter.com/pSHWyLMySz

I haven't read it - so can't provide any advance spoilers or warnings.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:40 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:Has Cameron said he'll do the debates yet?

Give the poor bloke a break. He's in mourning. Flags at half-mast and all.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:42 pm

PorFavor wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:Has Cameron said he'll do the debates yet?
Give the poor bloke a break. He's in mourning. Flags at half-mast and all.

How long do you think his mourning period will be? Victorian length?

LadyCentauria · Post by **LadyCentauria** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:44 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:
LadyCentauria wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:...and now its the Greens turn for a bit of misleading press attention.

The Queen could be moved to a COUNCIL HOUSE if Green Party gains power

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/qu ... se-5034477" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Mwahahahaa. Why would someone who owns other houses in her own right need council housing? Just for starters.
The thing that got me about this is NB said it, but it was in an off hand (supposed to be) funny kind of way "Oh well, sure we can find her a council house as we will build lots....."
and the press are doing to the Greens exactly what they have done to Labour for the last 5 years, jumped on a careless - funny - comment and slaughtered (or tried to slaughter) them for it.
This is why we have stilted, stifled politicians who won't answer a straight question for fear it will be turned against them, or that its a trick question. The Greens at the moment are looking fresh and clean, but not for long with this kind of slimy treatment.
I'm not (as everyone knows) a Green supporter and should perhaps have been cheered by them getting some bad press, but it made me cringe to be honest.
We need a fair and honest press.

You're right, and perhaps I should have said the more that I was going to say – and my reaction was prompted more by a, sadly, typical red-top front page than by what a politician may or may not have said. This is only a part of it:

The stock photo of Buck House – which belongs to the Crown Estates (not to the Queen or the Royal Family) and is administered by the Government of the day via an arms-length Civil Service department – is, naturally, what 'the media' are going to show if anyone mentions abolition of the Monarchy and council housing in the same breath or even the same speech/comment. Apart from the State Rooms, it is mostly made up of offices and flats – and there's a point to be made that those flats could usefully house quite a number of people, although the staff who live there would need rehousing themselves as would any minor royals who live there – even though they already pay rent, unless they are there on 'official duties'. The ALMO which runs the Crown Estate has a duty to get 'best value' from the buildings and land it administrates and I don't think that it lets any dwellings at the equivalent of social rent any longer – although it used to in respect of former tied-workers' and retired workers' homes. Buck House is worth far more to the Treasury as a tourist-trap than as anything else – although they'd doubtless be very happy to enter a contract with an hospitality firm to let the flats at a very-expensive-indeed rate to very wealthy tourists. Just imagine how much you could charge people for a fifteen minute slot for waving-from-the-balcony purposes

But, if the Monarchy were abolished the replacement Head of State would either be the Prime Minister or a President of some sort, and they would need a notable building on a grand scale in which to host all the Official Visits, etc., and they'd need an Official Residence, too.

The Queen, herself, could not qualify for social housing as she is the owner of other properties and land, in her own right, and has a large annual income from those estates and farms.

That's still only a part of the thoughts prompted by that front page headline. The article itself just shows how bloody careful anyone needs to be when the press are around – it certainly doesn't get across the message that the Green Party has plans for a massive expansion of council-housing and its restoration to respectability as a natural part of the 'housing options' available to people in the UK. That's the message the Greens need to get across – and it might appeal to more members of the public than abolition of the Monarchy would. But, just as with the Labour policies, it'll have to be put across on the doorsteps. Hope that clarifies, somewhat.

Edit: to correct 'politicaion' to 'politician'. The former looks sort of portuguese to my eyes. Any further errors can stand...

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:46 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:Has Cameron said he'll do the debates yet?
Give the poor bloke a break. He's in mourning. Flags at half-mast and all.
How long do you think his mourning period will be? Victorian length?

At least. And then when he emerges, they'll be COBRA meetings and stuff. And he must be due for another holiday ("Blackberry" notwithstanding).

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:46 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:Has Cameron said he'll do the debates yet?

No, and nor has Clegg. The thought of them *both* being empty chaired

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:52 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:Has Cameron said he'll do the debates yet?
No, and nor has Clegg. The thought of them *both* being empty chaired

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:54 pm

Historical records are interpretations of what happened seen through the authors' eyes. My posts here writing about who Henry VIII was are my impressions of what I've read or seen dramatised from the work of others. Alison Weir's biographies of the time are probably the bedrock of my knowledge of the life of Henry VIII. She's one scholar out of many.

I'm human, not omnipotent, I've limitations I need to be aware of in order to look after my & friends, family's best interests & peace of mind. I like learning new things for its own sake. Thomas Cromwell's little daughter, Grace, asked to be taught Greek in a moving set of scenes in Wolf Hall. Hilary Mantel worked a lot of temporary jobs; she called her employment history 'checkered' or something like that. I understand this.

I work hard, I'm motivated by myself but I require structure, the guidance of a capable administrator working with a team of others to accomplish whatever it is we're doing. A poor administrator, or leader, promoted beyond their ability, too stupid to know the goal or their role or without their ego safely managed dooms the project unless the team is knowledgeable enough to effectively, collectively, manage the stupid, egotistical leader, creating a solidarity through that management & completing their task. It can happen but it's rare, that last. That's why a bad leader is bane of most peoples' existence.

Thank you, my friends.
I love you, yes.

JA

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:58 pm

PorFavor wrote:
TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
Rebecca wrote: But,Grim,were you given a Winston Churchil funeral jigsaw puzzle?It was very difficult.
I was always a reader, not a jigsaw puzzler, even at 3 1/2.

Well, looks like we got ourselves a reader . . . .

Every day needs a Bill Hicks routine quote.

Toby Latimer · Post by **Toby Latimer** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 6:59 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:...and now its the Greens turn for a bit of misleading press attention.

The Queen could be moved to a COUNCIL HOUSE if Green Party gains power

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/qu ... se-5034477" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[youtube]xujHlWzWW98[/youtube]

Bring it on

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:02 pm

citizenJA wrote:Historical records are interpretations of what happened seen through the authors' eyes. My posts here writing about who Henry VIII was are my impressions of what I've read or seen dramatised from the work of others. Alison Weir's biographies of the time are probably the bedrock of my knowledge of the life of Henry VIII. She's one scholar out of many.

I'm human, not omnipotent, I've limitations I need to be aware of in order to look after my & friends, family's best interests & peace of mind. I like learning new things for its own sake. Thomas Cromwell's little daughter, Grace, asked to be taught Greek in a moving set of scenes in Wolf Hall. Hilary Mantel worked a lot of temporary jobs; she called her employment history 'checkered' or something like that. I understand this.

I work hard, I'm motivated by myself but I require structure, the guidance of a capable administrator working with a team of others to accomplish whatever it is we're doing. A poor administrator, or leader, promoted beyond their ability, too stupid to know the goal or their role or without their ego safely managed dooms the project unless the team is knowledgeable enough to effectively, collectively, manage the stupid, egotistical leader, creating a solidarity through that management & completing their task. It can happen but it's rare, that last. That's why a bad leader is bane of most peoples' existence.

Thank you, my friends.
I love you, yes.

JA

Hope you didn't think I was criticising you? You are so right, history is all about interpretation (look at our discussions about Churchill earlier); and your interpretation, the way you see Henry (for example), is every bit as valid as mine.

Spacedone · Post by **Spacedone** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:03 pm

StephenDolan wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
TheGrimSqueaker wrote: I was always a reader, not a jigsaw puzzler, even at 3 1/2.

Well, looks like we got ourselves a reader . . . .
Every day needs a Bill Hicks routine quote.

Oh excellent we've got a few Bill Hicks fans on here

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:04 pm

BBC now announcing that Amjad Bashir has defected to the Conservatives (from UKIP) - alongside the earlier news that UKIP had suspended him re allegations of financial nature.

I particularly love this sentence from the UKIP statement about his suspension on their website:

UKIP will not tolerate anyone abusing their positions in the party, as we have a firm commitment to differing ourselves from the existing political classes.

http://www.ukip.org/amjad_bashir_mep_su ... estigation

Spacedone · Post by **Spacedone** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:11 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:BBC now announcing that Amjad Bashir has defected to the Conservatives (from UKIP) - alongside the earlier news that UKIP had suspended him re allegations of financial nature.

I particularly love this sentence from the UKIP statement about his suspension on their website:
UKIP will not tolerate anyone abusing their positions in the party, as we have a firm commitment to differing ourselves from the existing political classes.
http://www.ukip.org/amjad_bashir_mep_su ... estigation

Presumably the Tories don't have any problems with dodgy finances then?

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:17 pm

The Tories have apparently attracted David Campbell Bannerman back to them from UKIP.

Wonder if a few more senior folk will bail out.

Hobiejoe · Post by **Hobiejoe** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:18 pm

Spacedone wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:BBC now announcing that Amjad Bashir has defected to the Conservatives (from UKIP) - alongside the earlier news that UKIP had suspended him re allegations of financial nature.

I particularly love this sentence from the UKIP statement about his suspension on their website:
UKIP will not tolerate anyone abusing their positions in the party, as we have a firm commitment to differing ourselves from the existing political classes.
http://www.ukip.org/amjad_bashir_mep_su ... estigation
Presumably the Tories don't have any problems with dodgy finances then?

A badge of honour for most of them

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:19 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:BBC now announcing that Amjad Bashir has defected to the Conservatives (from UKIP) - alongside the earlier news that UKIP had suspended him re allegations of financial nature.

I particularly love this sentence from the UKIP statement about his suspension on their website:
UKIP will not tolerate anyone abusing their positions in the party, as we have a firm commitment to differing ourselves from the existing political classes.
http://www.ukip.org/amjad_bashir_mep_su ... estigation

This bit...

interference with UKIP candidate selection processes

Weren't there some UKIP activists that resigned in protest at what was going on re candidate selection?

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:36 pm

LadyCentauria wrote:
That's still only a part of the thoughts prompted by that front page headline. The article itself just shows how bloody careful anyone needs to be when the press are around [/i]

[My bold]

I'm wondering if that's the reason for politicians not replying to Tweets. Twitter is a brilliant way to get a message across, but it works both ways. It's so, so easy to be pounced on and words twisted. Can't say that I blame them.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:43 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:The Tories have apparently attracted David Campbell Bannerman back to them from UKIP.

Wonder if a few more senior folk will bail out.

Out of the frying pan, into the fire. The poor souls don't know where to turn next.

mbc1955 · Post by **mbc1955** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:44 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:BBC now announcing that Amjad Bashir has defected to the Conservatives (from UKIP) - alongside the earlier news that UKIP had suspended him re allegations of financial nature.

I particularly love this sentence from the UKIP statement about his suspension on their website:
UKIP will not tolerate anyone abusing their positions in the party, as we have a firm commitment to differing ourselves from the existing political classes.
http://www.ukip.org/amjad_bashir_mep_su ... estigation

Rats leaping onto the sinking ship.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:47 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:The Tories have apparently attracted David Campbell Bannerman back to them from UKIP.

Wonder if a few more senior folk will bail out.

Thought be'd been back a while. His wiki biog says he went back to the Tories in 2011.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Campbell_Bannerman" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He's a serial "undecided"...

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 7:51 pm

Goodnight, everyone.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:05 pm

PorFavor wrote:Goodnight, everyone.

Night PF

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:05 pm

Wolf Hall had me when Bernard Hill appeared on screen.

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:13 pm

ephemerid wrote:Re. John Harris.
Showmaster and he are pals, and it's Show's belief that JH is actually pretty left - he does not like New Labour and passionately hates Blairites.
I think some of the criticism here is unfair - of all the G's hacks, he's the only one who gets out there and actually talks to real people.
He was also a lone voice at the G who really understood what the H&SC Bill would mean from the start - the others took a while to catch on.
I think he's not as bad as he's painted here....(ducks)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I agree on John Harris. I was in touch with him for a while when he contacted me regarding a post on youth unemployment and sanctions several years ago. He did some excellent work for a while and then I got the sense of a heavy editorial hand, certainly the usual titles and subtitles stuff, but also a few out of character paragraphs at the end of articles. I'm not assuming or saying this happened, it's just how it seems to me. I started reading more carefully after a very different brush with the press gave me an insight into how things can be rejigged to read differently, and now do this with everything. I thought I could see this in some of his stuff, but there you go, all unprovable and hearsay, lol. Nevertheless it seemed to me he was genuinely interested and he remained in contact for a lot longer than he needed to. I think he's a good 'un too.

LadyCentauria · Post by **LadyCentauria** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:19 pm

PorFavor wrote:Goodnight, everyone.

Goodnight, PF. Sweet dreams.

Toby Latimer · Post by **Toby Latimer** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:31 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
LadyCentauria wrote:
That's still only a part of the thoughts prompted by that front page headline. The article itself just shows how bloody careful anyone needs to be when the press are around [/i]
[My bold]

I'm wondering if that's the reason for politicians not replying to Tweets. Twitter is a brilliant way to get a message across, but it works both ways. It's so, so easy to be pounced on and words twisted. Can't say that I blame them.

I've had replies from John McDonnell, at least four over the last couple of years which was good of him.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:34 pm

Well here it is me darlins ... David Cameron is 'delighted' to have him.

Ukip MEP Amjad Bashir defects to the Conservatives
Bashir dismisses ‘extremely serious’ allegations made against him by Ukip as being absurd and made up
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... servatives

David Cameron told the Sunday Telegraph that he was “absolutely delighted” by Bashir’s decision.

Cameron said: “I’m absolutely delighted that Amjad has decided to leave Ukip and join the Conservative Party.”

Bashir, who is a Muslim from a Pakistani background, had an “inspiring” story, the prime minister said. “It’s another sign that in this great country of ours you can come to Britain without very much and you can be a member of the European parliament, an MP, sit in the cabinet.”

Imagine that ...

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:36 pm

Tim Montgomerie ن retweeted
Craig Woodhouse @craigawoodhouse · 2h 2 hours ago
I suspect there's a massive inquest going on at Tory HQ as to how they lost control of the Amjad Bashir defection narrative.

Fox in the chicken house, Dave. Shappsy will be no match for that - no match at all.

Editing to add:

Craig Woodhouse @craigawoodhouse · 35m 35 minutes ago
Contrast between UKIP's handling of defections (top secret, bombshell announcements) with this Tory one (shambles) is amazing.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:40 pm

Toby Latimer wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:
LadyCentauria wrote:
That's still only a part of the thoughts prompted by that front page headline. The article itself just shows how bloody careful anyone needs to be when the press are around [/i]
[My bold]

I'm wondering if that's the reason for politicians not replying to Tweets. Twitter is a brilliant way to get a message across, but it works both ways. It's so, so easy to be pounced on and words twisted. Can't say that I blame them.

I've had replies from John McDonnell, at least four over the last couple of years which was good of him.

The problem with Twitter and footballers is well documented, and of course in politics just ask Emily about it.

It is a very risky medium for engaging with the public.

As far as the Greens and consigning Liz to a council house, it is very misleading to claim it is a Green policy (although I rather wish it was).

However anybody here think any Green voters give a toss about the Royal family?

Seems a damage free story to me.

Toby Latimer · Post by **Toby Latimer** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:41 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:Well here it is me darlins ... David Cameron is 'delighted' to have him.

Ukip MEP Amjad Bashir defects to the Conservatives
Bashir dismisses ‘extremely serious’ allegations made against him by Ukip as being absurd and made up
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... servatives

David Cameron told the Sunday Telegraph that he was “absolutely delighted” by Bashir’s decision.

Cameron said: “I’m absolutely delighted that Amjad has decided to leave Ukip and join the Conservative Party.”

Bashir, who is a Muslim from a Pakistani background, had an “inspiring” story, the prime minister said. “It’s another sign that in this great country of ours you can come to Britain without very much and you can be a member of the European parliament, an MP, sit in the cabinet.”
Imagine that ...

Does Fishpointer mention the fact that Bashir was previously a long term Tory Party activist, it's not like he wouldn't know

: ScreenShot00108.jpg (46.72 KiB) Viewed 7073 times

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:43 pm

Could be getting even more like a swap shop between UKIP and the Tories soon - from the BBC longer article:

The defection is thought to have been brokered by another Tory MEP, the heavily Eurosceptic Daniel Hannan.

There are already rumours that at least one other UKIP MEP is considering their position following Mr Bashir's resignation.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30967633

LadyCentauria · Post by **LadyCentauria** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:43 pm

Have just had a little look around on purely local stuff. The 'exclusive collection' of luxurious townhouses – which are being built on what was a part of our small council estate – were first marketed last year in Malaysia, are being offered at around two-and-a-half million quid each, and will attract a Council Tax Band G rating which (being just inside Wandsworth's boundary) is less than £1,200 for 2014/5 including the Commons precept and the precept for the London Assembley/Mayor. The 2 or 3 bedroom flats within this 'collection' – all described as part of a 'gated-community' and ranging from £625,000 to £1,150,000 – will, of course be in much lower bands.

Makes me think, would basing CT for new-builds on purchase-price plus square-footage or number of bedrooms make more sense?

Toby Latimer · Post by **Toby Latimer** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:44 pm

And his company has previous for dodgy activities

: ScreenShot00109.jpg (79.32 KiB) Viewed 7071 times

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... immigrants" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:44 pm

Toby Latimer wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:Well here it is me darlins ... David Cameron is 'delighted' to have him.

Ukip MEP Amjad Bashir defects to the Conservatives
Bashir dismisses ‘extremely serious’ allegations made against him by Ukip as being absurd and made up
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... servatives

David Cameron told the Sunday Telegraph that he was “absolutely delighted” by Bashir’s decision.

Cameron said: “I’m absolutely delighted that Amjad has decided to leave Ukip and join the Conservative Party.”

Bashir, who is a Muslim from a Pakistani background, had an “inspiring” story, the prime minister said. “It’s another sign that in this great country of ours you can come to Britain without very much and you can be a member of the European parliament, an MP, sit in the cabinet.”
Imagine that ...

Does Fishpointer mention the fact that Bashir was previously a long term Tory Party activist, it's not like he wouldn't know
ScreenShot00108.jpg

Tories and Kippers are turning into a right double act aren't they. Funnier than parody.

giselle97 · Post by **giselle97** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:45 pm

ohsocynical wrote:Do you want to hear something daft?

Recently I had a health scare. My immediate and only thought was regret for all the books I'd never get to read. I felt dreadful about it afterwards because family never got a look in.
Thankfully the health scare was a wrong diagnoses, but it was such a powerful feeling which hasn't left me that I'm making it top priority to re-read all the books I remember enjoying in the past as well as new novels by favourite authors. Plus political books when I can find them.

My latest find from Egham's Oxfam shop is Michael Heseltine's autobiography....I'm not keen on autobiographies because authors can be deceitful when writing about themselves but anything covering Maggies reign of terror is sure to be interesting.

My Christmas presents (requested because I wouldn't personally go on Amazon or pay these "people") were:-

22 Days in May - the birth of the Lib Dem - Conservative Coalition (David Laws)
The Orange Book - Reclaiming Liberalism (Edited by Paul Marshall & David Laws)
5 Days in May - the Coalition and Beyond (Andrew Adonis)

I'm reading them in that order.

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:47 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:
LadyCentauria wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:...and now its the Greens turn for a bit of misleading press attention.

The Queen could be moved to a COUNCIL HOUSE if Green Party gains power

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/qu ... se-5034477" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Mwahahahaa. Why would someone who owns other houses in her own right need council housing? Just for starters.
The thing that got me about this is NB said it, but it was in an off hand (supposed to be) funny kind of way "Oh well, sure we can find her a council house as we will build lots....."
and the press are doing to the Greens exactly what they have done to Labour for the last 5 years, jumped on a careless - funny - comment and slaughtered (or tried to slaughter) them for it.
This is why we have stilted, stifled politicians who won't answer a straight question for fear it will be turned against them, or that its a trick question. The Greens at the moment are looking fresh and clean, but not for long with this kind of slimy treatment.
I'm not (as everyone knows) a Green supporter and should perhaps have been cheered by them getting some bad press, but it made me cringe to be honest.
We need a fair and honest press.

I so agree with this. I've been trying to say this to disabled activists for several years, get jumped on for doing so, the word Labour is anathema to them because of all the distortion. But many will vote Green and already The Greens are coming in for this attention which they are not used to, or jot the way larger parties are. And if they do get any kind of power sharing role they will get even more because there's been a singular failure to clean up the media. It's impossible for the press right now to label them as the same as everyone else, because there manifesto is really radical and idealistic, but none of this will stop in May it will just carry on. The Greens in any such arrangement will then be accused of just being more of the same for having to make the inevitable compromises, and for not having really explained to their voters that their manifesto is a long term aim and not a five year plan. Can you imagine what the media would have done to Labour if they presented a manifesto as a long term aim? It's only really possible to write a true election manifesto on what's possible in the electorally foreseeable future. I've read the Green manifesto and nowhere does it show those intermediate stages that will need to be taken. Though I guess that some Greens have ideas on that. But people think it will happen overnight, just like many cybernats think Scotland will instantly transform. In the meantime outcomes for the election are looking less and less clear, which worries the heck out of me. Everything in the media is designed to keep people in a divisive present or a distorted past. And seemingly a lot of people swallow it whole.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:50 pm

giselle97 wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:Do you want to hear something daft?

Recently I had a health scare. My immediate and only thought was regret for all the books I'd never get to read. I felt dreadful about it afterwards because family never got a look in.
Thankfully the health scare was a wrong diagnoses, but it was such a powerful feeling which hasn't left me that I'm making it top priority to re-read all the books I remember enjoying in the past as well as new novels by favourite authors. Plus political books when I can find them.

My latest find from Egham's Oxfam shop is Michael Heseltine's autobiography....I'm not keen on autobiographies because authors can be deceitful when writing about themselves but anything covering Maggies reign of terror is sure to be interesting.
My Christmas presents (requested because I wouldn't personally go on Amazon or pay these "people") were:-

22 Days in May - the birth of the Lib Dem - Conservative Coalition (David Laws)
The Orange Book - Reclaiming Liberalism (Edited by Paul Marshall & David Laws)
5 Days in May - the Coalition and Beyond (Andrew Adonis)

I'm reading them in that order.

You are brave, stoic and quite exceptional to put yourself up for reading all three of those, G97. Hats off to you .... particularly for The Orange Book - I think that would stick in my craw.

Mr Riots is always going on at me that I should be reading some 'improving' books ... I'm not sure those would qualify though.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:50 pm

giselle97 wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:Do you want to hear something daft?

Recently I had a health scare. My immediate and only thought was regret for all the books I'd never get to read. I felt dreadful about it afterwards because family never got a look in.
Thankfully the health scare was a wrong diagnoses, but it was such a powerful feeling which hasn't left me that I'm making it top priority to re-read all the books I remember enjoying in the past as well as new novels by favourite authors. Plus political books when I can find them.

My latest find from Egham's Oxfam shop is Michael Heseltine's autobiography....I'm not keen on autobiographies because authors can be deceitful when writing about themselves but anything covering Maggies reign of terror is sure to be interesting.
My Christmas presents (requested because I wouldn't personally go on Amazon or pay these "people") were:-

22 Days in May - the birth of the Lib Dem - Conservative Coalition (David Laws)
The Orange Book - Reclaiming Liberalism (Edited by Paul Marshall & David Laws)
5 Days in May - the Coalition and Beyond (Andrew Adonis)

I'm reading them in that order.

Christ, why not just dress in hessian, roll in nettles and beat yourself with a whip. The Martin Luther approach to self flagellation seems infinitely preferable to reading that filth.

You only have two arms, once you have chewed both of them off there is nowhere else to go.

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:52 pm

seeingclearly wrote:
ephemerid wrote:Re. John Harris.
Showmaster and he are pals, and it's Show's belief that JH is actually pretty left - he does not like New Labour and passionately hates Blairites.
I think some of the criticism here is unfair - of all the G's hacks, he's the only one who gets out there and actually talks to real people.
He was also a lone voice at the G who really understood what the H&SC Bill would mean from the start - the others took a while to catch on.
I think he's not as bad as he's painted here....(ducks)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I agree on John Harris. I was in touch with him for a while when he contacted me regarding a post on youth unemployment and sanctions several years ago. He did some excellent work for a while and then I got the sense of a heavy editorial hand, certainly the usual titles and subtitles stuff, but also a few out of character paragraphs at the end of articles. I'm not assuming or saying this happened, it's just how it seems to me. I started reading more carefully after a very different brush with the press gave me an insight into how things can be rejigged to read differently, and now do this with everything. I thought I could see this in some of his stuff, but there you go, all unprovable and hearsay, lol. Nevertheless it seemed to me he was genuinely interested and he remained in contact for a lot longer than he needed to. I think he's a good 'un too.

Thanks for that, SC.

Of course he is not on the G's staff. He's a freelance, so he has to compete in a way some of the other regulars don't

Show got to know him when he lived here in Hay. Show is marginally to the left of Foot so if he thinks JH is a lefty, he likely is.

Whatever. He writes what he writes and they publish what they publish.....

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 8:59 pm

By the way Ohso, if you are still around. I love that you found Michael Heseltine's autobiography in the Egham Oxfam bookshop. That's so Gerry and Margo.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 9:00 pm

PorFavor wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
PorFavor wrote: Give the poor bloke a break. He's in mourning. Flags at half-mast and all.
How long do you think his mourning period will be? Victorian length?
At least. And then when he emerges, they'll be COBRA meetings and stuff. And he must be due for another holiday ("Blackberry" notwithstanding).

Not to mention shoals of fish waiting to be pointed at.

LadyCentauria · Post by **LadyCentauria** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 9:03 pm

In one of my earlier posts, which I'd already edited for spillung mistooks, I think I said ALMO where I might have meant a sort-of QUANGO. And, although the Crown Estates were, supposedly, to be operated for the benefit of the nation any income from sales (lots of them!) or rentals just goes into the Treasury/Exchequer apart from the amount that is hived off to pay for whatever remains of the Civil List.

Going to watch the thing about ~~Holstein~~ – Gah!!! - Holbein on BBC Two now so you'll be safe from my ramblings for a while at least!

P.S. Only two days until the last hundred days of the Coalition Govt. – or, as I prefer to call them, The Collision

Love

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 9:05 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:By the way Ohso, if you are still around. I love that you found Michael Heseltine's autobiography in the Egham Oxfam bookshop. That's so Gerry and Margo.

Poverty amongst the uppers very evident as you wander around the burgeoning charity shops. Lots of them, but the pickings are lean and what there is, is expensive. Except for the book and one I found for my uncle on the history of Hollywood, I kept my purse firmly in my pocket. I reckon another couple of years with the Tories and charity shops will start failing.

giselle97 · Post by **giselle97** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 9:07 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
giselle97 wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:Do you want to hear something daft?

Recently I had a health scare. My immediate and only thought was regret for all the books I'd never get to read. I felt dreadful about it afterwards because family never got a look in.
Thankfully the health scare was a wrong diagnoses, but it was such a powerful feeling which hasn't left me that I'm making it top priority to re-read all the books I remember enjoying in the past as well as new novels by favourite authors. Plus political books when I can find them.

My latest find from Egham's Oxfam shop is Michael Heseltine's autobiography....I'm not keen on autobiographies because authors can be deceitful when writing about themselves but anything covering Maggies reign of terror is sure to be interesting.
My Christmas presents (requested because I wouldn't personally go on Amazon or pay these "people") were:-

22 Days in May - the birth of the Lib Dem - Conservative Coalition (David Laws)
The Orange Book - Reclaiming Liberalism (Edited by Paul Marshall & David Laws)
5 Days in May - the Coalition and Beyond (Andrew Adonis)

I'm reading them in that order.
You are brave, stoic and quite exceptional to put yourself up for reading all three of those, G97. Hats off to you .... particularly for The Orange Book - I think that would stick in my craw.

Mr Riots is always going on at me that I should be reading some 'improving' books ... I'm not sure those would qualify though.

Know your enemy, RR2, that's all it's about!

giselle97 · Post by **giselle97** » Sat 24 Jan, 2015 9:11 pm

Just finished watching Elvis 68 Comeback - there is no one who can wear black leather trousers like that. Woo hoo!