Wednesday 17th February 2016

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 5:36 pm

Maybe we are an echo chamber

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 5:47 pm

Mirror Politics ‏@MirrorPolitics 12m12 minutes ago
Lib Dems considering complaint to Electoral Commission over £5m Tory "propaganda" ads http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/to ... ic-7388723" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

The Tories have splashed almost £5m of public money on 'propaganda' for George Osborne's so-called National Living Wage.

And the Mirror can reveal the Liberal Democrats are considering making a complaint to the Electoral Commisssion over the ads, which they say are designed to "push the Conservative political agenda."

The Department for Business Innovation and Skills (BIS) campaign included £1.7m worth of TV ads and more than £750,000 worth of posters.

The total budget of £4.95m could cover the wages of 372 people for a year.

Didn't the coalition govt splash public money on ads re the workplace pension and other initiatives? I seem to remember various people shouting 'I'm IN' at me for a while.

utopiandreams · Post by **utopiandreams** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 5:48 pm

Willow904 wrote:In addition to my above post, I should point out that I'm well aware of the flaw in my state investment in land theory - what's to stop the Tories selling it all off at a loss the next time they get in. Which is something to be said for Blair's PFI at least, our new hospitals and schools being leased from the private sector at least prevents the Tories selling them out from under us. Indeed, it has been slim pickings for Tory privatisers on the back of the New Labour years. Maybe if they sell the shirt off Britain's back this time, people may finally see them for the vultures they truly are.

I sort of agree with your analysis (previous post), Willow, provided of course that council properties are not allowed to become sink estates, something that may be even more likely with current plans for even less security of tenure, perhaps in pockets rather than full estates with rtb, but even these end up as insecure tenancies. Anyway one thing mass social housing did provide was affordable housing including to those 'aspiring' to ownership before financial deregulation made homes just another asset for speculation.

As for Tories and their wholesale dumping of public assets they are now already pushing the boundaries with Housing Associations. Nothing is safe in their hands and they must be stopped by any means short of a revolution. I'm sure they're pushing the limits of legality (as is demonstrated by the number of judgments that go against them) but it's difficult when they're also responsible for the legislature.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 5:50 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Mirror Politics ‏@MirrorPolitics 12m12 minutes ago
Lib Dems considering complaint to Electoral Commission over £5m Tory "propaganda" ads http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/to ... ic-7388723" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

The Tories have splashed almost £5m of public money on 'propaganda' for George Osborne's so-called National Living Wage.

And the Mirror can reveal the Liberal Democrats are considering making a complaint to the Electoral Commisssion over the ads, which they say are designed to "push the Conservative political agenda."

The Department for Business Innovation and Skills (BIS) campaign included £1.7m worth of TV ads and more than £750,000 worth of posters.

The total budget of £4.95m could cover the wages of 372 people for a year.
Didn't the coalition govt splash public money on ads re the workplace pension and other initiatives? I seem to remember various people shouting 'I'm IN' at me for a while.

Yet the Tory/Libs cut advertising to remind vulnerable groups to consider having a flu jab.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 5:50 pm

yahyah wrote:Maybe we are an echo chamber

Except for me of course. I'm not at all echoey.

Mind you - that survey is crap - don't you think? It even admits you have to agree with things you might not necessarily agree with in order to move on. I was often faced with a binary choice - with neither position being something I properly agreed with.

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 5:56 pm

Not so sure about PFI hospitals, Willow, ours is reported to be designed with the potential for being turned retail (shopping centre) if it fails. And our unnecessary and very new library already running into trouble and the old one already demolished, or it is underway. And the book stock sadly diminished and replaced by somebodies idea of what ought to be in it. The council can barely manage to pay wages, what madness, while provisioning the debt on the thing. Anyway, they have now moved the countrys largest language centre into the new library, so two prime sites have been vacated, they must have not really understood the maths, or alternatively they are just outright corrupt in their dealings, and the library buffs will be assailed by language students, I can't believe it will be a quiet place, and the very well established language school has lost a historic site and may have a poor prognosis for survival as it is no longer independent but will sink or swim with the library. Which is no longer opening at weekends. Not a hospital, I know, but a PFI project on a much smaller scale. Every panel on every ward and treatment area of our hospital is purpose designed to fit the curved architecture of the building, replacing a tap or light fitting involves replacing the panel, thank goodness bulbs are exempt from the craziness. This includes things like paper towels and gels and other disposables, which are non standard sizes, and which get plenty of wear and tear. There is a slightly glum feeling among the various hospital staff these days after a couple of years of elation at being in a brand new clean and well provisioned building, and also a slight look of bafflement. The nurses in particular have to walk miles more a day. But then they were never consulted about the deaign. A big issue is that while wards can be monitored on screen from the nurses station, they cannot actually see who is coming and going because the corridors are curved, there is no line of sight, as a result nearly all wards are locked. Will we, as tax payers have to conrinue to fund such places, you bet we will, while profits are made by the companies that are already starting the takeover of services we would much prefer to remain truly a part of the NHS.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 5:59 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Jo Maugham QC
‏@JolyonMaugham
Don't force landlords to make homes fit for human habitation because some owner occupied homes aren't says Philip Davies MP.

Jo Maugham QC ‏@JolyonMaugham 22m22 minutes ago
Philip Davies MP does actually perform a useful social function as a walking alarm bell. If he supports it, it's bad policy.

Jo Maugham QC ‏@JolyonMaugham 20m20 minutes ago
If you want to read his argument yourself, you can do so here h/t @nearlylegal (put a penny in the swear jar first). http://www.ehn-online.com/news/article. ... e%20burden" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …
Karen Buck ‏@KarenPBuckMP 16m16 minutes ago
Karen Buck Retweeted Jo Maugham QC
Warning- original article brings on a severe headache.

Oh, my gracious lord

"One question I have for those in favour of this legislation is – should it cover all properties – i.e. not just privately rented ones? The talk has all been about the state of rented accommodation but the Law Commission’s Report looked at “unfit housing by tenure” and it is very interesting indeed to note that it was not just properties in the private rented sector which were deemed to be unfit.

In fact, when the report was undertaken, in England 5.5 per cent of properties that were owner occupied were said to be unfit. Just to be clear this is people who live in their own properties where that property is said to be unfit.

To try to see if there was any more up to date information on this, I looked at the latest English Housing Survey. It says that 17.3 per cent of people who bought their homes in the last 3 years and 19.8 percent of older owner-occupiers had homes, which were classed as non-decent.

If the concern is about properties being decent and fit for human habitation then shouldn’t this bill have covered all properties and not just those in the private rented sector? Isn’t that actually the logical conclusion of the argument? If this is not about burdening landlords then I am sure that must be the case."

'If this is not about burdening landlords then I am sure that must be the case...'

Right - fabulous - revise the bill making all homes, regardless of tenure, fit for human habitation - works perfectly well, very fine.
Davies doesn't make that connection, does he.
Davies would look confused presented with such a bill.
feather-head

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:01 pm

Obituary of Kevin Fitzpatrick RIP.

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016 ... k-obituary" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:08 pm

Mark Urban ‏@MarkUrban01 24m24 minutes ago
In Greece tonight as the refugee crisis brings it to point of being fenced off from the rest of Europe #newsnight

Shameful.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:11 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
yahyah wrote:Maybe we are an echo chamber
Except for me of course. I'm not at all echoey.

Mind you - that survey is crap - don't you think? It even admits you have to agree with things you might not necessarily agree with in order to move on. I was often faced with a binary choice - with neither position being something I properly agreed with.

Oh, it was rubbish, like one of those magazine quiz's which are actually designed to be rubbish so no one takes them the wrong way and just sees them for the bit of fun they are. Many of the questions would tend to an "it depends" kind of answer which wasn't an option and, of course, it asked you whether you were in or out or on fence and a large part of your grouping simply echoed that back at you.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:12 pm

http://www.theguardian.com/housing-netw ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Housing benefit is the lifeblood of women’s refuges – and it's under threat

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:13 pm

307,880 signatures

utopiandreams · Post by **utopiandreams** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:21 pm

I did once try to figure out what PFI projects were commissioned by whom and for what from Treasury or government papers since the usual suspects are always pointing the finger at Labour for NHS hospitals yet Osborne is responsible for similar levels across all projects. I gave up because all such projects seemed to be lumped together and I found it extremely difficult singling out the PFI ones. I guess other documentation does exist that makes it possible. Having said that I believe PFI is given a harsher press than is deserved compared to the typical maintenance and repair leases commonly used for business premises.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:35 pm

A rather good piece on the EU shenanigans I thought

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/02/17/europ ... index.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:50 pm

PFI was escalated considerably under Labour - in 2009 Osborne accused the then Labour government of using a flawed model; he said that the PFI system should be more transparent and he would remove "perverse incentives" (how they love that expression!) which hide liabilities and keep them off the treasury balance sheet.

In his first year as Chancellor, he progressed 61 schemes worth £7 Billion - he was accused of borrowing through intermediaries to hide the costs from the debt/deficit. The Treasury Select Committee said a few years ago that PFI liabilities should be brought on to the balance sheet; the OBR agreed. This has not happened.

There are many companies which form the consortia who get PFI contracts - one police force has one called "Blue Light". One of the reasons why we can't find out much about the various financial vehicles used etc. is due to commercial confidentiality.

It's all a mess. Some PFI deals are for 40 years. Madness.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:53 pm

Same here, UD. Wanted to see the start dates for PFIs, but couldn't find a convenient list.

This is good about PFI- not as bad as the quoted numbers make it sound. But still not that good.

https://colinrtalbot.wordpress.com/2015 ... ting-them/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:57 pm

I'm not against PFI in principle, and it certainly enabled Labour to do some much needed building when thing were past repair or no longer fit forn purpose. What I question is the vanity aspects of how it was used, and the bad decision making that went along with them. The library and hospital may have been commissioned under a Labour government, but the council concerned was a tory one, 2000-2012 I believe. There is no doubt the hospital is benefitting people, special beneficiaries have been injured servicemen. The future though is not so certain, its immensely expensive to run, and that must have been apparent from the outset. I have seen good modern hospitals in other parts of the world that are much more functional. But ours is one hospital and we also have this library. And I don't recall our symphony hall being such a problem, but we are also just one city, I wonder about other cities and how they are faring. Not to be able to afford to staff a brand new library in a city with as many students as we have is bonkers, and tbh the universities have in recent times acquired a lot of prime land on which are now what one must assume to be very profitable halls of residence, many occupied by those feepaying foreign students who pay between 25 and 40k for the privilege of being here before they have had so much as a meal. I am mystified by all this, because we should be doing quite well but it is all abysmal news, and I have conclude it must be engineered to be that way, because the money certainly flows, but only one way.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 6:57 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Mirror Politics ‏@MirrorPolitics 12m12 minutes ago
Lib Dems considering complaint to Electoral Commission over £5m Tory "propaganda" ads http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/to ... ic-7388723" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

The Tories have splashed almost £5m of public money on 'propaganda' for George Osborne's so-called National Living Wage.

And the Mirror can reveal the Liberal Democrats are considering making a complaint to the Electoral Commisssion over the ads, which they say are designed to "push the Conservative political agenda."

The Department for Business Innovation and Skills (BIS) campaign included £1.7m worth of TV ads and more than £750,000 worth of posters.

The total budget of £4.95m could cover the wages of 372 people for a year.
Didn't the coalition govt splash public money on ads re the workplace pension and other initiatives? I seem to remember various people shouting 'I'm IN' at me for a while.

Just watched a really expensive ad encouraging Exporting ...

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:01 pm

ephemerid wrote:PFI was escalated considerably under Labour - in 2009 Osborne accused the then Labour government of using a flawed model; he said that the PFI system should be more transparent and he would remove "perverse incentives" (how they love that expression!) which hide liabilities and keep them off the treasury balance sheet.

In his first year as Chancellor, he progressed 61 schemes worth £7 Billion - he was accused of borrowing through intermediaries to hide the costs from the debt/deficit. The Treasury Select Committee said a few years ago that PFI liabilities should be brought on to the balance sheet; the OBR agreed. This has not happened.

There are many companies which form the consortia who get PFI contracts - one police force has one called "Blue Light". One of the reasons why we can't find out much about the various financial vehicles used etc. is due to commercial confidentiality.

It's all a mess. Some PFI deals are for 40 years. Madness.

That was when I first felt disquiet about Blair's political leaning ...

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:03 pm

In his first year as Chancellor, he progressed 61 schemes worth £7 Billion - he was accused of borrowing through intermediaries to hide the costs from the debt/deficit. The Treasury Select Committee said a few years ago that PFI liabilities should be brought on to the balance sheet; the OBR agreed. This has not happened.

The ONS got most of it brought on balance sheet in 2006. Don't think very much is off balance sheet now.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:03 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Mirror Politics ‏@MirrorPolitics 12m12 minutes ago
Lib Dems considering complaint to Electoral Commission over £5m Tory "propaganda" ads http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/to ... ic-7388723" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

The Tories have splashed almost £5m of public money on 'propaganda' for George Osborne's so-called National Living Wage.

And the Mirror can reveal the Liberal Democrats are considering making a complaint to the Electoral Commisssion over the ads, which they say are designed to "push the Conservative political agenda."

The Department for Business Innovation and Skills (BIS) campaign included £1.7m worth of TV ads and more than £750,000 worth of posters.

The total budget of £4.95m could cover the wages of 372 people for a year.
Didn't the coalition govt splash public money on ads re the workplace pension and other initiatives? I seem to remember various people shouting 'I'm IN' at me for a while.
Just watched a really expensive ad encouraging Exporting ...

Yes - if it's the same one that I've seen, it's crap, isn't it? How many businesses say, "Ooh, exporting! Never thought of that!"

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:06 pm

Asda removes food bank donation points from UK stores

Supermarket chain ceases scheme, which allowed customers to donate food bought in store or brought from home, without announcing to media (Guardian)

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016 ... m-uk-store

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:07 pm

Willow904 wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
yahyah wrote:Maybe we are an echo chamber
Except for me of course. I'm not at all echoey.

Mind you - that survey is crap - don't you think? It even admits you have to agree with things you might not necessarily agree with in order to move on. I was often faced with a binary choice - with neither position being something I properly agreed with.
Oh, it was rubbish, like one of those magazine quiz's which are actually designed to be rubbish so no one takes them the wrong way and just sees them for the bit of fun they are. Many of the questions would tend to an "it depends" kind of answer which wasn't an option and, of course, it asked you whether you were in or out or on fence and a large part of your grouping simply echoed that back at you.

Absolutely unf*****gbelievable
'Listen to DC'?
Me?
I answered Dave's pronouncements don't matter to me at all.
He's a known liar and untrustworthy.
He may reform, but that doesn't change history, does it?
Your Dominant Strand
Listen to DC
I'm actually very offended by this, so, I guess Ashcroft, Dave and Sam Cam consider their day made.
Not because I'm so important, but because that's the level of Tory aspiration
'piss off a lefty ooohh, life is good'
Members of the Listen To DC group are younger
younger than what?
and more likely to be female
sharp as a tack, Ashcroft, get you!
and voted Conservative over Labour
Only if you altered my ballot
by 54% to 27%; only 4% voted UKIP.
No percent of me voted UKIP
Crucially, though currently unsure how to vote,
What the f***? Did the Linux operating system I'm using crash your party dress, Ashcroft or what?
they are the group most likely to say they could be persuaded to remain if David Cameron recommended it on the basis of a successful renegotiation.
Only if you used Sam Cam's answers to you shite poll, Ashcroft.
When it comes to issues at stake in the referendum, the Listen To DC group is almost as likely to mention free movement or free trade as immigration or border control.
what does this even mean?
Three quarters of the group currently think leaving the EU represents a bigger risk than staying.
Yep.
Members also tend think the country is on the right track and that life in Britain is better than it was thirty years ago
Except that's opposite of what I indicated, why ask me my opinion if you're just going to change the answers? Get some help.
and to be optimistic about the future:
yes, I'm optimistic because I'm not Ashcroft or his broken poll
they see changes in the economy bringing more improvements than threats to their standard of living,
Only if those changes remove Tory government
believe it is possible for someone who works hard to be successful in Britain whatever their background,
just go to hell with your poll, Ashcroft-O-Meter is broken
and that recent changes in society have been for the better.
bull.
shite.
They are more likely than most to think multiculturalism, globalisation and immigration have been forces for good.
Yep, that's true.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:12 pm

THE Department for Work and Pensions’s (DWP) fitness for work test provider has been accused of “bribing” Scotland’s frontline junior doctors with a massive salary of up to £90,000 to carry out tests on the country’s vulnerable mentally and physically disabled.

http://www.thenational.scot/news/dwp-ag ... tors.12977

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:16 pm

Vote Leave reported to police over 'front campaigns' email
A Labour MP has asked the police to investigate pro-Brexit campaign Vote Leave after a senior Conservative eurosceptic suggested the group could use front organisations to get around spending limits, PoliticsHome can reveal.
- See more at: https://www.politicshome.com/party-poli ... 6nWTA.dpuf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Once you get the taste ...

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:19 pm

Following reports on social media that collection trolleys and boxes had disappeared from stores across Scotland, as well as in Hampshire, Lancashire, Norwich and Newcastle, the Guardian has established that Asda, which is owned by the US retail giant Walmart, has removed donation points from all of its UK stores.

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016 ... CMP=twt_gu

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:21 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
Following reports on social media that collection trolleys and boxes had disappeared from stores across Scotland, as well as in Hampshire, Lancashire, Norwich and Newcastle, the Guardian has established that Asda, which is owned by the US retail giant Walmart, has removed donation points from all of its UK stores.

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016 ... CMP=twt_gu

Are they selling wonky veg off cheaply as their alternative ....?

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:24 pm

PF ... Snap!

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:24 pm

Guardian politics ‏@GdnPolitics 2m2 minutes ago
Two Conservative MPs scheduled to speak at Ukip spring conference http://d.gu.com/KXRWRc" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:26 pm

Sorry about your survey result citizen.

But got to laugh - and hope you have too.

It just proves how totally crap it is.

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:34 pm

I guess something I meant to say was that all the fancy buildings, costly too are no good if the main thing that makes them function as resources does not work. I'm referring to the human workers who run the places on a daily basis, we aren't replaceable yet, and will not be in the non-commercial world, which is why I am shouting loud for real change, not just sticking plasters over a cranky old system that has its roots in Victorian times. And thats not to say I don't value the good tradional things, on the contrary I am a lover of continuity of a certain kind that leads to progress, rather than a kind of neo-dereliction. At some time we need to reconnect to real values not the populist ones, the sticky sweets of blame and shame and the puddingy lure of working virtue. I want to see a solutions based creative future, where technology takes care of the boring backbreaking bits and wr can get on ith creatively making it possible for the world and its people to survive together. Oh, I am dreaming today, my hit of synthetic dopamine is needed to move me to more than words. I guess I want a future for my children and everyone elses too. All the ones I read of here.

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:37 pm

It was crap. But I think it still got most of us right, perhaps because we could see which way off the fence we needed to fall! CJA I love your outrage, and the way you tick the man off. More of this in real life for all the usual suspects please!

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:41 pm

I am so missing Toby.

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:43 pm

Me too, RR, for the humour and the love.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:45 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:I am so missing Toby.

He's not been back, has he? A bit worrying. I hope he's ok.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:46 pm

Siraj Datoo ‏@dats 16 mins16 minutes ago

Missing from Zac Goldsmith's Wikipedia page: A whole section about his inheritance, after it was removed today:

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?d

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:51 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Mirror Politics ‏@MirrorPolitics 12m12 minutes ago
Lib Dems considering complaint to Electoral Commission over £5m Tory "propaganda" ads http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/to ... ic-7388723" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

The Tories have splashed almost £5m of public money on 'propaganda' for George Osborne's so-called National Living Wage.

And the Mirror can reveal the Liberal Democrats are considering making a complaint to the Electoral Commisssion over the ads, which they say are designed to "push the Conservative political agenda."

The Department for Business Innovation and Skills (BIS) campaign included £1.7m worth of TV ads and more than £750,000 worth of posters.

The total budget of £4.95m could cover the wages of 372 people for a year.
Didn't the coalition govt splash public money on ads re the workplace pension and other initiatives? I seem to remember various people shouting 'I'm IN' at me for a while.
Just watched a really expensive ad encouraging Exporting ...

The cost of "Exporting Is Great" ads is £2.4 Million.

The cost of "Workie" (the purple monster) ads is £8.5 Million.

The cost of "We're All In" ads is £3.5 Million.

I cannot find the cost of the 'flu vaccination ads which were discontinued in 2014.

Public Health England has a massive document which describes its' "marketing strategy" - this involves various programmes for healthier lifestyles etc. and drones on about how health car professionals and charities should deliver them.

A lot of money is spent on government ads. Some campaigns are good, some bad, and some are very necessary.
The uptake of 'flu vaccines in vulnerable has fallen slightly in England. But not in Wales.

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 7:56 pm

Re. Toby.

I know a bit about him and where he usually ends up when he gets sent to hospital.

What I don't know is how many, if any, of you know him quite well.

I was thinking of ringing the hospitals concerned to see if he's an in-patient and send him a message - but I don't know if that would be considered an intrusion (by us or by him).

I'd be grateful if you could let me know if you think this is a good idea.

Thanks.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:02 pm

I'm getting really worried about Toby. If there is anyway of letting him know we're thinking of him and wishing him well - I think that would be worth trying. Just sending good wishes shouldn't be considered an intrusion, should it?

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:07 pm

Really good idea...I'm sure it wouldn't be considered an intrusion...

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:09 pm

Mmmm. Just found this on Facebook.
Can't say whether it's right or not because we don't have an Asda in Bracknell.

Did you know Asda 5p bags donates all money to dementia research. Their 6p bags? they keep all the profit. Did you also notice the 5p bags are nowhere on display? You have to ask for them!!! To which I get told the 6p ones are better, the 5p ones won't be strong enough to hold my wine. The 5p bags are locked away. When I look around all I see everywhere are ppl using 6p bags. If you think how many hundreds of bags could be sold per day all to help dementia ... God knows how I carried wine before the 6p bags came out... how did we cope. Do the right thing ppl. Annoy the hell out of them and get your 5p bags and help dementia sufferer's

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:09 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:Sorry about your survey result citizen.

But got to laugh - and hope you have too.

It just proves how totally crap it is.

I was surprised how mortified I felt. I was hesitant to do it at all but went ahead, answered truthfully. I thought I must have misunderstood the questions and gave something a zero when I meant a ten or whatever but no - the poll is interesting only in a 'How Not To Construct An Honest Poll' sort of example. It literally managed to give results antithetical to what I'd answered. It's wrong.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:16 pm

ephemerid wrote:Re. Toby.

I know a bit about him and where he usually ends up when he gets sent to hospital.

What I don't know is how many, if any, of you know him quite well.

I was thinking of ringing the hospitals concerned to see if he's an in-patient and send him a message - but I don't know if that would be considered an intrusion (by us or by him).

I'd be grateful if you could let me know if you think this is a good idea.

Thanks.

I should very much like to know how Toby is doing.
I'm worried about him.
I don't have contact information.
I don't think it'd be intrusive if you'd make inquiries, Ephemerid.
I'll be fine, if for some reason, Toby didn't wish for me to be given any information. I write that sincerely, I send him my love, however much he or his family want to contact or not, completely understand.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:20 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
Siraj Datoo ‏@dats 16 mins16 minutes ago

Missing from Zac Goldsmith's Wikipedia page: A whole section about his inheritance, after it was removed today:

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?d

I didn't see anything about Goldsmith on the page.
Was that the point?
Have I missed something?
Never let me do anther Ashcroft survey, please.
Really unnerved the hell out of me.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:22 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:I am so missing Toby.

I hope Beryl's keeping Toby company. I like Beryl. I know she's a cartoon character. I love her.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:24 pm

seeingclearly wrote:It was crap. But I think it still got most of us right, perhaps because we could see which way off the fence we needed to fall! CJA I love your outrage, and the way you tick the man off. More of this in real life for all the usual suspects please!

Thank you for letting me know!
Oh, I was angry.
Just spitting mad and a little scared, too, really, it was creepy.
I didn't answer like that, honest.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:29 pm

seeingclearly wrote:I guess something I meant to say was that all the fancy buildings, costly too are no good if the main thing that makes them function as resources does not work. I'm referring to the human workers who run the places on a daily basis, we aren't replaceable yet, and will not be in the non-commercial world, which is why I am shouting loud for real change, not just sticking plasters over a cranky old system that has its roots in Victorian times. And thats not to say I don't value the good tradional things, on the contrary I am a lover of continuity of a certain kind that leads to progress, rather than a kind of neo-dereliction. At some time we need to reconnect to real values not the populist ones, the sticky sweets of blame and shame and the puddingy lure of working virtue. I want to see a solutions based creative future, where technology takes care of the boring backbreaking bits and wr can get on ith creatively making it possible for the world and its people to survive together. Oh, I am dreaming today, my hit of synthetic dopamine is needed to move me to more than words. I guess I want a future for my children and everyone elses too. All the ones I read of here.

A beautiful mind, yours.
I like the ideas your writing give me.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:31 pm

We should not abandon vellum – it tells us that our laws are serious

- Jacob Rees-Mogg

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... aper-costs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:34 pm

Also found this on Facebook, but can't Save the Image to post it....

BBC South TodayLike Page

14 hrs ·
The search is on for the owners of a three-year-old Dalmatian, called Harvey. He was found in Hampshire...150 miles away from home. He's microchipped but the phone number doesn't work...He's registered to a vets in Wales. Is being cared for by the RSPCA.

http://bbc.in/1Xxgk83" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Wed 17 Feb, 2016 8:37 pm

Latest sanctions statistics for those interested.

https://www.gov.uk/government/statistic ... ember-2015" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ESA(including legacy benefits)numbers still going up.