Saturday, 30th September and Sunday, 1st October 2017

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:08 pm

"Real conservatism is compassionate and responsible. We look after people, especially our most vulnerable"

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -to-change" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The peanut in the can Tory,the "vulnerable" are necessary only to serve the purpose of self aggrandisement.Nanny Stateists extraordinaire,they need protection when the "vulnerable" dare complain.

tc2 has a message for you

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:08 pm

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:11 pm

HindleA wrote:"Real conservatism is compassionate and responsible. We look after people, especially our most vulnerable"

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -to-change" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The peanut in the can Tory,the "vulnerable" are necessary only to serve the purpose of self aggrandisement.Nanny Stateists extraordinaire,they need protection when the "vulnerable" dare complain.

"Our" most vulnerable? They're not bloody pet pekingese.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:12 pm

More on Vote Leave spending.

Maugham, the project’s founder, said: “We have spending limits to stop our democracy being captured by those with limitless sums to spend. The Electoral Commission’s role is to police those spending limits – to protect our democracy. If it doesn’t do its job our democracy can’t function.

“These facts raise obvious and serious questions about the conduct of the Electoral Commission and the referendum. Was our watchdog asleep on the job?”

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... e-spending" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:20 pm

Shuttlecocks

getting late,obviously on a random single word.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:21 pm

Probably the tone of voice I heard in my head when I read it. Interesting.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:23 pm

I think I am stuck on Frankie Howard eating a chicken tone of voice when I am reading anything.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:28 pm

[youtube]5Qf6Sv3A9zs[/youtube]

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:29 pm

Well it has been very nice posting bollox to you all,a very good night.You would have thought there would be some kind of limit before a word of sense would intervene,obviously not.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:30 pm

HindleA wrote:Well it has been very nice posting bollox to you all,a very good night.You would have thought there would be some kind of limit before a word of sense would intervene,obviously not.

See post above!

Night night.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:38 pm

PM pledges to freeze tuition fees

The Conservative Party conference will see the announcement of policies aimed to win over young voters
(BBC News website)

And that's all there is.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:43 pm

Vivian Nicholson seems to have possessed the Conservatives. They'll be announcing re-nationalisation next.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 10:44 pm

Night night.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 11:24 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ies-knives" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

May will announce a series of policy changes in the hope of halting her party’s potentially disastrous loss of support among voters under 45. These will include freezing tuition fees, which are due to rise with inflation from £9,250 in 2017-18 to about £9,500 in 2018-19, while ministers look again at the system.
She will also announce that the earnings threshold at which graduates start to pay off their loans will be increased from £21,000 to £25,000, and will go up in line with earnings after next year. That will mean a saving of about £360 in 2018-19 compared with this year for graduates earning at least £25,000.
There will also be more help offered to aspiring homeowners, and to renters. As well as a £10bn expansion of the Help to Buy loan scheme, Javid will announce that all private landlords will be required to join a redress system that allows tenants to complain and see those in breach sanctioned. Javid will also oblige letting agents to be registered with a professional body and require them to meet a set of minimum standards.

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:03 am

Nick Cohen,
"Labour conference? More like the cult of Saint Jeremy"
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... int-jeremy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Corbyn gives every appearance of wallowing in the attention. But, wisely, he adopts a saintly air of modesty. After a portrait of his head crowned by a halo was paraded in the conference centre, he told Sky News he had worked hard in the election campaign but, mighty though his labours were, he did not deserve to be sanctified. “I often feel deeply embarrassed by it. It’s not my wish and it’s not my doing.” If he meant a word of this, Corbyn would ask his aides why they appeared to take the Lord’s name in vain by addressing him as “JC” in public.

lost it, or trying to funny?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:22 am

Both

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:32 am

https://conservativepartyconference.com/agenda" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tory Party Conference Agenda

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:50 am

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1659128 ... over-young" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The fact Theresa May thinks she can win over young people by pledging to freeze tuition fees only weeks after increasing them to £9,250 shows just how out of touch she is - Rayner

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 6:07 am

HindleA wrote:http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1659128 ... over-young

The fact Theresa May thinks she can win over young people by pledging to freeze tuition fees only weeks after increasing them to £9,250 shows just how ~~out of touch~~ cynical she is - Rayner

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 6:15 am

Labour Leavers’ claims that EU blocks state takeovers are rejected by experts

EU officials bewildered by claims the union is a one-size fits all club when there are many more social democratic, statist members than the UK
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... nalisation" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn has long been sympathetic to the Labour Brexit – or “Lexit” – argument for the UK to leave the single market, if not the customs union, to escape a Brussels oligarchy that some believe has frowned on efforts by left-leaning governments to support individual industries or nationalise them to protect consumers’ and workers’ rights.

...

But a legal assessment of Labour’s 26 specific economic proposals by Andrea Biondi, director of the Centre of European Law at King’s College London, found that the effect of remaining inside the EU “would likely be negligible”.

...

Most European countries have a nationalised railway system.

..

The European commission has estimated that its history of exemptions shows that more than three-quarters of submissions for state aid have been waved through.

Some of them are even no longer run by people who invaded them centuries ago.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 6:25 am

‘Hang the Tories’ protest banner on Salford bridge denounced by MPs
Huge hand-painted sign removed from bridge by police ahead of Conservative party’s conference in Manchester
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... y-fascists" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

a) it's not huge - it's actually pretty small in world of banners
b) it seems to have been overlooked that Manchester is the home of this:
[youtube]wMykYSQaG_c[/youtube]

A simple play on song (as it were), is at least a possibility is it not.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 6:35 am

oh - and look what happened around the same event two years ago (WARNING URL IS TO MAIL):

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... y-M60.html
Anti-austerity protesters branded 'disgusting' after hanging a Tory dummy from an overpass in sick stunt

Drivers were shocked to see the suited mannequin above the M60
Police took the dummy down amid fears it would cause an accident
It comes after protesters have hurled eggs at Tory conference delegates

Faux outrage becoming a national sport.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 6:37 am

PS my point being that while I imagine the stunt 2 years ago could have been genuinely alarming for motorists - this year's is on totally different scale AND it's all been done before. AND this has what seems to be a clue to the fact that many honest getting-a-six-month-prison-sentence-for-receiving-a-pair-of-looted-shorts-compared-to-suspended-sentence-for-privileged-oxford-student-who-stabbed-her-boyfriend mancs probably sing this in the pub regularly.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 10:24 am

Nick Cohen has recycled (for the Nth time) his party piece, then. Mr Hindle's emojis are certainly not inappropriate

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 10:39 am

Luckily we don't have the death penalty, and it seems esp. unreasonable without having a trial first, but
"Hang the Tories" seems to be a fairly common phrase.
Does anyone know if this stems from the horse thief connotation?
Having googled it, there are also various references to hanging Whigs & Tories (though mainly Whigs) in Jacobite songs.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 10:44 am

tinyclanger2 wrote:PS my point being that while I imagine the stunt 2 years ago could have been genuinely alarming for motorists - this year's is on totally different scale AND it's all been done before. AND this has what seems to be a clue to the fact that many honest getting-a-six-month-prison-sentence-for-receiving-a-pair-of-looted-shorts-compared-to-suspended-sentence-for-privileged-oxford-student-who-stabbed-her-boyfriend mancs probably sing this in the pub regularly.

There's a lot more about that here, not having a go at you tc2.
https://thesecretbarrister.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It’s not just a rich white girl getting a let-off; it’s also a victim of domestic violence with severe mental health and substance misuse problems being given a chance to rebuild her life. You may not care for that latter interpretation, but it’s no less valid than the former preferred by today’s front page “Toff Justice” tabloid headlines, implicitly recycling the nasty myth that money confers mental health immunity.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 10:51 am

Good morfternoon.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 10:59 am

gilsey wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:PS my point being that while I imagine the stunt 2 years ago could have been genuinely alarming for motorists - this year's is on totally different scale AND it's all been done before. AND this has what seems to be a clue to the fact that many honest getting-a-six-month-prison-sentence-for-receiving-a-pair-of-looted-shorts-compared-to-suspended-sentence-for-privileged-oxford-student-who-stabbed-her-boyfriend mancs probably sing this in the pub regularly.
There's a lot more about that here, not having a go at you tc2.
https://thesecretbarrister.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
It’s not just a rich white girl getting a let-off; it’s also a victim of domestic violence with severe mental health and substance misuse problems being given a chance to rebuild her life. You may not care for that latter interpretation, but it’s no less valid than the former preferred by today’s front page “Toff Justice” tabloid headlines, implicitly recycling the nasty myth that money confers mental health immunity.

Understand this, and that you're not having a go. My issue with this is - are these things taken into consideration for the single mother who received said pair of shorts? Or indeed the guy who got a prison sentence for looting a couple of bottles of water? Lots of people have shit happen - many of them end up in prison. It's not that she should go to prison necessarily it's that the same standards (and willingness to help) should apply to all.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 11:01 am

Some of the sentences meted out after the 2011 riots were inhuman. And am sure many promising lives were negatively impacted by them.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 11:27 am

tinyclanger2 wrote:Some of the sentences meted out after the 2011 riots were inhuman. And am sure many promising lives were negatively impacted by them.

Couldn't agree more.

Two wrongs don't make a right, as my Mum used to say.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 11:32 am

gilsey wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:Some of the sentences meted out after the 2011 riots were inhuman. And am sure many promising lives were negatively impacted by them.
Couldn't agree more.

Two wrongs don't make a right, as my Mum used to say.

Yes as I say, I'm not saying, necessarily the Oxford student should be in jail; I'm saying other lives should be viewed equally empathetically. And indeed am put out that the life of a future surgeon is seemingly considered (by the judge) to be more promising and socially impactful than the life of a future anything else.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 11:43 am

The riots sentences are the exceptions, Lavinia Woodward isn't.

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 11:51 am

Tubby Isaacs wrote:The riots sentences are the exceptions, Lavinia Woodward isn't.

is it really exceptional for someone from an upper middle class family to be treated differently from the plebs?

I would be surprised if it is exceptional although commenting on judicial cases is difficult if you have not been party to the evidence - the judges comments in this case though suggests she was treated differently than if she had been someone from a different background

How many bankers have gone to prison for their part in the financial crisis again?

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 12:14 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
gilsey wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:Some of the sentences meted out after the 2011 riots were inhuman. And am sure many promising lives were negatively impacted by them.
Couldn't agree more.

Two wrongs don't make a right, as my Mum used to say.
Yes as I say, I'm not saying, necessarily the Oxford student should be in jail; I'm saying other lives should be viewed equally empathetically. And indeed am put out that the life of a future surgeon is seemingly considered (by the judge) to be more promising and socially impactful than the life of a future anything else.

Yes, it's the judge's comments that give the impression that if it weren't for their "worthy" career they would have been sent to jail. If the judge referenced other mitigating circumstances and said nothing about their career this one rule for the rich, one rule for the poor impression might not be formed. Having said that, I have seen leniency in some cases attributed to efforts to turn life around as a mechanic etc, so is this perception real or is it the MSM with a skewed interest in middle class people and issues? Just a thought, I don't know the stats.

As to the other, I believe the sentences related to rioting were harsh in part because the law relating to rioting is harsh, an historical hangover. Those involved in the rioting from wealthier backgrounds may have had access to better lawyers, though, and that's where inequality really kicks in, isn't it? In access to representation, which has been severely restricted and reversed under current government. So I suppose, at least, when someone makes a poster that says "hang the Tories" they are laying blame for growing inequality and injustice at the right door. When I saw the sign I felt dismayed. Not out of faux outrage, but out of a sense that we are right back where we were the last time the Tories were in power, at the centre of a bitter class battle that seems never to go away, all tentative progress in the right direction undone in just a few short years. One step forward, two steps back

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 12:51 pm

UK has lost any sense of (admittedly dark) humour it may have had. I have no idea what the poster makers meant - as I haven't talked to them. But then again nor has anyone else, and that's my problem with it.

But it could equally be no more sinister than singing Hang the Tories to the tune of Panic, or as sinister as others seem to believe. Without talking to the sign makers we will never know, but our knee jerk reaction these days it to make a big thing of it.

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 12:56 pm

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 76406.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Buckingham Palace was infuriated with Theresa May after she misled the Queen about the progress of negotiations as she sought to form a government, it has been reported.

The Prime Minister was said to have suffered a crisis of confidence in the wake of surrendering her majority in the snap general election, with aides reportedly considering enlisting a special forces commander to give her a pep talk.

I'm not sure what this means, but doesn't sound good.

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:02 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:UK has lost any sense of (admittedly dark) humour it may have had. I have no idea what the poster makers meant - as I haven't talked to them. But then again nor has anyone else, and that's my problem with it.

But it could equally be no more sinister than singing Hang the Tories to the tune of Panic, or as sinister as others seem to believe. Without talking to the sign makers we will never know, but our knee jerk reaction these days it to make a big thing of it.

Theresa May hasn't got the equivalent of the 'Oh, Jeremy Corbyn' chant, yet, but not sure this one's the best choice.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:08 pm

I'm just saying that there's a potential molehill/mountain situation here that might not have been so enthusiastically taken up in the past. On the other hand they could be completely evil rednecks with a handy gallows already set up in the back yard. The point is we don't know.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:11 pm

tinybgoat wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:UK has lost any sense of (admittedly dark) humour it may have had. I have no idea what the poster makers meant - as I haven't talked to them. But then again nor has anyone else, and that's my problem with it.

But it could equally be no more sinister than singing Hang the Tories to the tune of Panic, or as sinister as others seem to believe. Without talking to the sign makers we will never know, but our knee jerk reaction these days it to make a big thing of it.
Theresa May hasn't got the equivalent of the 'Oh, Jeremy Corbyn' chant, yet, but not sure this one's the best choice.

Well you're probably right, but for now it looks like the will of the people ... (in the environs of these blocks of flats in Manchester)

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:14 pm

tinybgoat wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 76406.html

Buckingham Palace was infuriated with Theresa May after she misled the Queen about the progress of negotiations as she sought to form a government, it has been reported.

The Prime Minister was said to have suffered a crisis of confidence in the wake of surrendering her majority in the snap general election, with aides reportedly considering enlisting a special forces commander to give her a pep talk.
I'm not sure what this means, but doesn't sound good.

So how come the rest of us knew?

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:22 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
tinybgoat wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 76406.html

Buckingham Palace was infuriated with Theresa May after she misled the Queen about the progress of negotiations as she sought to form a government, it has been reported.

The Prime Minister was said to have suffered a crisis of confidence in the wake of surrendering her majority in the snap general election, with aides reportedly considering enlisting a special forces commander to give her a pep talk.
I'm not sure what this means, but doesn't sound good.
So how come the rest of us knew?

Good point - but maybe it didn't get much coverage in the Racing Times.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:23 pm

tinybgoat wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 76406.html

Buckingham Palace was infuriated with Theresa May after she misled the Queen about the progress of negotiations as she sought to form a government, it has been reported.

The Prime Minister was said to have suffered a crisis of confidence in the wake of surrendering her majority in the snap general election, with aides reportedly considering enlisting a special forces commander to give her a pep talk.
I'm not sure what this means, but doesn't sound good.

It was clear at the time that May wasn't following protocol and was doing so to protect Tory party interests (and herself), rather than in the interests of the nation. And it was pretty obvious the Queen would not have been amused, as they say, so what is the significance of this coming out now?
Right before the Tory conference. Random chance? Or shenanigans?

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:29 pm

Mind you its Shipman, so some scepticism is required I fear. Though it is clear all is not going swimmingly at Chez May nonetheless.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 1:31 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:The riots sentences are the exceptions, Lavinia Woodward isn't.

We hope they're exceptions, and we hope Woodward isn't.

What's clear is that the justice system took a great deal of care in her case. It's far from clear that such care is taken in all cases.

Moving on, what can you say except May is utterly hopeless. She did an interview for Look North about investment in the T&W Metro which was just like Marr this am, I'm not sure she's capable of giving a straight answer. The antithesis of a safe pair of hands.

Post by **refitman** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 2:01 pm

Shapps and Heseltine have both stuck the knife into May.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 2:27 pm

Today is our PM's birthday, hope she is enjoying it.

(it is also Jimmy Carter's, I only found out they share that distinction today)

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 2:30 pm

I'll bet she is.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 2:34 pm

The metropolitian elite mancs await the Tories with enthusiasm.

: poncy metropolitan elite.jpg (84.37 KiB) Viewed 12884 times

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 2:35 pm

Keep On Runnin' (playing in the background at the Conservative conference)?

Oh - and Patrick McLoughlin "It's easy to be a big spender, but I'll get right to the point . . .".

If that was a carefully prepared Shirley Bassey joke, nobody in the hall seemed to get it.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 01 Oct, 2017 2:36 pm

Oh no. They have depicted JRM with an arrow through his head.

I guess that must mean that they're cowboys.