Saturday 10th & Sunday 11th June 2017

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:17 pm

Jeremy Hunt has just arrived at Downing Street.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:19 pm

Sajid David is there (Downing Street), too.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:24 pm

PorFavor wrote:Jeremy Hunt has just arrived at Downing Street.

with NHS pin

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:25 pm

Liam Fox stays as Trade Secretary.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:27 pm

http://metro.co.uk/2017/06/11/a-dup-pos ... l-6701339/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:29 pm

So Trump’s too scared to come to the UK. Who says protest doesn’t work?
If he can’t bomb it or tweet against it, the US president’s cupboard of responses seems bare. So we are denied a spectacle but saved a distraction
Hugh Muir

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -president" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:34 pm

I'm stepping away from the computer for a little while
Mr citizen is a good friend
I'll check in a little later on
love,
cJA

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:40 pm

http://metro.co.uk/2017/06/11/the-dup-c ... s-6701540/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The DUP could insist on Nigel Farage having a role in Brexit negotiations

Nah. Nigel doesn't like anyone who's unelected.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:41 pm

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:42 pm

Justin Greening keeps Education.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:42 pm

The Deranged Fiefdom of GB and NI

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:51 pm

Perhaps if I nip down to Number 10 and start talking enough gibberish, she might give me a job.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:53 pm

After starting off Brexit negotiations with TM showing off about being difficult, and now fucking the EU about with this ludicrous election, I really can't imagine a better next step than introducing Nige into the mix.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:56 pm

Sajid David (Communities) keeps his job.

David Lidington has been made Justice Secretary and Lord Chancellor.

Edited - typo

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 4:57 pm

Priti Patel is just arrivin' at Downing Street.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:00 pm

I've just had an e-mail from the Labour Party asking me to join.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:06 pm

Jeremy Hunt stays at Health.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:09 pm

(Jeremy Hunt remains Health Secretary in recognition for the Fantastic Job he's made of it so far)

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:11 pm

#meldmania

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:14 pm

Andrea Leadsom turned up bearing a pot of jam.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:17 pm

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 84241.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Labour gains 150,000 new members as Jeremy Corbyn prepares for new election battle

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:19 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 84241.html
Labour gains 150,000 new members as Jeremy Corbyn prepares for new election battle

Should I leave and then join again to bump up the numbers?

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:19 pm

I can't even be bothered linking to the story in the Independent that says Juncker told May to call the election

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:21 pm

PorFavor wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 84241.html
Labour gains 150,000 new members as Jeremy Corbyn prepares for new election battle

Should I leave and then join again to bump up the numbers?

Good plan.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:23 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:I can't even be bothered linking to the story in the Independent that says Juncker told May to call the election

Who reckons that's the case? I can't find it.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:30 pm

PorFavor wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:I can't even be bothered linking to the story in the Independent that says Juncker told May to call the election
Who reckons that's the case? I can't find it.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 84641.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:33 pm

Oh - forgot.

Chris Grayling is still Transport, and Gavin Thingy is still Chief Whip.

I think I've missed a couple.

Priti Patel is still International Development, but haven't heard yet about Andrea Leadsom.

Post by **refitman** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:34 pm

Cabinet reshuffle in full

Here are all the cabinet moves, and non-moves, we’ve had so far.

Promoted

Damian Green

Was: work and pensions secretary

Now: first secretary of state and a cabinet office minister

David Gauke

Was: chief secretary to the Treasury

Now: work and pensions secretary

David Lidington

Was: leader of the Commons

Now: justice secretary

(As leader of the Commons Lidington did stand in for Theresa May at PMQs, and had a high profile in the Commons, and so in some respects he may regret this move. But as justice secretary he will get to run his own department, which is enough for it to count as a promotion.)

Demoted

Liz Truss

Was: justice secretary

Now: chief secretary to the Treasury

No change

Philip Hammond - chancellor

Amber Rudd - home secretary

Boris Johnson - foreign secretary

David Davis - Brexit secretary

Sir Michael Fallon - defence secretary

Greg Clark - business secretary

Liam Fox - international trade secretary

Justine Greening - education secretary

Sajid Javid - communities secretary

Alun Cairns - Welsh secretary

Jeremy Hunt - health secretary

Gavin Williamson - chief whip

Chris Grayling - transport secretary

Priti Patel - international development secretary

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:36 pm

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/econ ... -1.3115759" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Nick Timothy, May’s deposed joint chief of staff, got something right in his farewell statement when he declared that the UK is a divided country

Can't imagine how that's come about. What with the Tories in charge for so much of it and everything.

NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 5:47 pm

Oh, that Chris Deerin spat from earlier, re left wing people being right about Corbyn?

It escalated quickly. See Owen Jones's Twitter. You really won't be surprised to see which Tory media staple makes Deerin out to be the poor abused victim of the piece.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:03 pm

Express: Meddling Juncker told TM to call election.

Is there any chance that we could just start acting like a nation with some kind of dignity.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:15 pm

refitman wrote:
Cabinet reshuffle in full

Here are all the cabinet moves, and non-moves, we’ve had so far.

Promoted

Damian Green

Was: work and pensions secretary

Now: first secretary of state and a cabinet office minister

David Gauke

Was: chief secretary to the Treasury

Now: work and pensions secretary

David Lidington

Was: leader of the Commons

Now: justice secretary

(As leader of the Commons Lidington did stand in for Theresa May at PMQs, and had a high profile in the Commons, and so in some respects he may regret this move. But as justice secretary he will get to run his own department, which is enough for it to count as a promotion.)

Demoted

Liz Truss

Was: justice secretary

Now: chief secretary to the Treasury

No change

Philip Hammond - chancellor

Amber Rudd - home secretary

Boris Johnson - foreign secretary

David Davis - Brexit secretary

Sir Michael Fallon - defence secretary

Greg Clark - business secretary

Liam Fox - international trade secretary

Justine Greening - education secretary

Sajid Javid - communities secretary

Alun Cairns - Welsh secretary

Jeremy Hunt - health secretary

Gavin Williamson - chief whip

Chris Grayling - transport secretary

Priti Patel - international development secretary

Good Truss has gone, and Liddington will probably be ok.

Post by **refitman** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:18 pm

SpinningHugo wrote:
refitman wrote:
Cabinet reshuffle in full

Here are all the cabinet moves, and non-moves, we’ve had so far.

Promoted

Damian Green

Was: work and pensions secretary

Now: first secretary of state and a cabinet office minister

David Gauke

Was: chief secretary to the Treasury

Now: work and pensions secretary

David Lidington

Was: leader of the Commons

Now: justice secretary

(As leader of the Commons Lidington did stand in for Theresa May at PMQs, and had a high profile in the Commons, and so in some respects he may regret this move. But as justice secretary he will get to run his own department, which is enough for it to count as a promotion.)

Demoted

Liz Truss

Was: justice secretary

Now: chief secretary to the Treasury

No change

Philip Hammond - chancellor

Amber Rudd - home secretary

Boris Johnson - foreign secretary

David Davis - Brexit secretary

Sir Michael Fallon - defence secretary

Greg Clark - business secretary

Liam Fox - international trade secretary

Justine Greening - education secretary

Sajid Javid - communities secretary

Alun Cairns - Welsh secretary

Jeremy Hunt - health secretary

Gavin Williamson - chief whip

Chris Grayling - transport secretary

Priti Patel - international development secretary
Good Truss has gone, and Liddington will probably be ok.

Still failed to appoint someone with law experience though.

Post by **refitman** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:22 pm

refitman wrote:
SpinningHugo wrote: Good Truss has gone, and Liddington will probably be ok.
Still failed to appoint someone with law experience though.

Perhaps not entirely accurate:

...according to Wikipedia, his history PhD thesis was on “the enforcement of the penal statutes at the court of the Exchequer c.1558-c.1576”.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:23 pm

refitman wrote:

Still failed to appoint someone with law experience though.

Yes - I thought that was strange, too.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:28 pm

Does 'strange' still have any meaning?

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:29 pm

I can't find, and haven't heard, any news on Andrea Leadsom.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:31 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:Does 'strange' still have any meaning?

"Strange" means "strange"? Or maybe not now . . .

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:32 pm

refitman wrote:
refitman wrote:
SpinningHugo wrote: Good Truss has gone, and Liddington will probably be ok.
Still failed to appoint someone with law experience though.
Perhaps not entirely accurate:
...according to Wikipedia, his history PhD thesis was on “the enforcement of the penal statutes at the court of the Exchequer c.1558-c.1576”.

That will come in handy!

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:35 pm

PorFavor wrote:
refitman wrote:
refitman wrote: Still failed to appoint someone with law experience though.
Perhaps not entirely accurate:
...according to Wikipedia, his history PhD thesis was on “the enforcement of the penal statutes at the court of the Exchequer c.1558-c.1576”.
That will come in handy!

Well with the DUP dragging us back to the 9th century ...

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:36 pm

James Brokenshire stays as Northern Ireland Secretary. But we knew that already because the DUP told us earlier.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:50 pm

Gove's on his way. The joy.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:51 pm

Michael Gove is said to be on his way to Downing Street. He was sacked as justice secretary last summer and has been on the back benches ever since. (Politics Live, Guardian)

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:53 pm

@tinyclanger2

Oh good. Back to normal - I was starting to worry!

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 6:54 pm

Andrea Leadsom is now Leader of the House of Commons. Should be a laugh.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 7:02 pm

PorFavor wrote:Andrea Leadsom is now Leader of the House of Commons. Should be a laugh.

Indeed - someone is laughing already...

David Allen Green‏ @davidallengreen 10m10 minutes ago
More
David Allen Green Retweeted Beth Rigby
So in the critical role of getting complex Brexit legislation through Commons at speed over next year is...Andrea Leadsom.

Ho ho.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 7:09 pm

Michael Gove gets Environment.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 7:17 pm

SpinningHugo wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:.

Only slightly less directly Hard Brexit was presented to the electorate and it lost by about the same margin (unless you think everyone voting DUP was voting for Brexit).

So, democratically speaking the "will of the people" is fairly clear. Soft Brexit. Which will be infernally hard to deliver, but the government needs to try.

Fine.

So explain to me how you can have single market membership without freedom of movement?

How can you have a customs union without single market membership or freedom of movement (Turkey has a separate and limited customs union, but guess why the EU were prepared to accept that without freedom of movement - cf Switzerland)?

If these are not possible, explain to me how exiting the single market and no customs union is not a granite Hard Brexit?

Corbyn on Marr and McDonnell on Peston both explicitly ruled out single market membership.

The hardline Tories (Davies, IDS, Hannan) say they want tariff free access to the EU. That is what Corbyn and McDonnell also say they want. That is Hard Brexit as the barriers to trade are not tariffs. That is a £100bn (conservative) per annum cost to the UK.

This is the internal contradiction in the Labour manifesto. It wants to end freedom of movement, and have all the benefits of the single market. That is an impossibility.

I don't think Corbyn and McDonnell want us in the single market. Single market membership prevents things like state aid, widespread nationalisation, some kinds of regulation, state contract preference, and so on.

Labour is on a high through fudging this. By saying it wants to end freedom of movement it helped to neutralise the immigration issue. It then, in complete contradiction of that, says it wants all the benefits of the single market. Well, that is not on offer.

Eventually that contradiction will be a problem. Not today, but eventually.

The Tories are in the same bind. Brexit is an economic disaster. They however are the ones who will go on paying the price as they are in power. If Labour got into government, this contradiction would soon start biting upon it.

In a way, this isn't Labour or the Tories fault. The public want mutually contradictory things. Some even seem to think these problems can disappear either by being rude to the EU or really polite.

There is no soft Brexit. May was right. Brexit means Brexit. There are no different kinds of it.

You can't currently.

That's why there are negotiations isn't it? Unless I've completely misunderstood the point of two years' negotiations.

I know this is pointless. You will never change your "mind". But the EU will move to accommodate the UK, if we are reasonable.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 7:24 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:I can't even be bothered linking to the story in the Independent that says Juncker told May to call the election
Who reckons that's the case? I can't find it.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 84641.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Oh, more unnamed sources. Thanks for the link (which you provided against your better judgement - and you're right - your judgement was better than mine).

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sun 11 Jun, 2017 7:25 pm

Emma Kennedy‏Verified account @EmmaKennedy 3m3 minutes ago
More
So Gove, avid Brexiter, is going to have to explain to UK farmers where their EU subsidies have gone? Epic trolling from May.