Saturday, 30th September and Sunday, 1st October 2017

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:10 pm

I got into crosswords as an avoiding doing what I should be thing,still the case.Though partly a rare if not unique finding something I am not completely useless at.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:10 pm

Clanger disco greats has got something FANTASTIC lined up for this evening.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:14 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:From the party that brought us Brexit (means Brexit)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 75191.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Scottish Conservative leader Ruth Davidson has attacked politicians being over-optimistic about Brexit, claiming it “sells people short”.

Ruthie can feel those 13 seats slipping away.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:15 pm

At roughly what time,please?

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:15 pm

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/foot ... 75266.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Gerard Figueras has insisted that should the region secure independence then all the Catalan teams in La Liga would have to decide what league they wanted to play in – meaning Barcelona, Espanyol and Girona could end up in England, France or even Italy.

Yeah? I think Nigel might have something to say about that.
Not to mention plate tectonics.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:16 pm

I saw Ruth Davidson in a pub in Edinburgh this time last year.
Only just resisted the temptation to go and say 'hello'.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:17 pm

HindleA wrote:At roughly what time,please?

You can't avoid it that easily.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:17 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:From the party that brought us Brexit (means Brexit)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 75191.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Scottish Conservative leader Ruth Davidson has attacked politicians being over-optimistic about Brexit, claiming it “sells people short”.
Ruthie can feel those 13 seats slipping away.

Though it did annoy me that she was included in that recent YouGov poll on the Tory leadership, when as things stand SHE'S NOT ELIGIBLE.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:26 pm

http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/new ... 74456.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Good - if it means a resurgence in night trains.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:41 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Though it did annoy me that she was included in that recent YouGov poll on the Tory leadership, when as things stand SHE'S NOT ELIGIBLE.

Like all the stupid polls including David Miliband,who was obviously never coming back.

She has a longstanding hatred of BoJo of course.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:49 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
They managed to get Alec Douglas-Home into the Commons, could probably do that for Davidson. They'd have to choose better than they did for Johnson, who's got too many "Citizens of Nowhere" moving to his constituency for comfort.

Actually, you did say "at things stand", so this is likely exactly what you meant, isn't it?

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:55 pm

When did I write that?

Political circumstances now probably make it a considerably trickier undertaking than whenever that was.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 1:58 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
They managed to get Alec Douglas-Home into the Commons, could probably do that for Davidson. They'd have to choose better than they did for Johnson, who's got too many "Citizens of Nowhere" moving to his constituency for comfort.
Actually, you did say "at things stand", so this is likely exactly what you meant, isn't it?

They may have a while yet. I can't see them calling an election before they think they can win it, and so that means 2022. By then Brexit will have happened, Corbyn will be five years older, and lots of events will have intervened.

So, if May went in, say late 2020/early 2021, by then newer faces might be possible. Cleverley? Raab?

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:05 pm

Johnny Mercer? He's got a rather marginal seat though.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:07 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:Johnny Mercer? He's got a rather marginal seat though.

He has a good story, but not really a central figure for them.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:07 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:When did I write that?

Political circumstances now probably make it a considerably trickier undertaking than whenever that was.

I think it would be easy enough. It's not like the Mid 90s, where very many people would vote Labour or Lib Dem almost equally to get rid of the Tories. The Lib Dems are still too weak. The Tories wouldn't lose a seat like Christchurch now in a by-election.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:09 pm

SpinningHugo wrote:
Tubby Isaacs wrote:Johnny Mercer? He's got a rather marginal seat though.
He has a good story, but not really a central figure for them.

Nor's Cleverley. And Raab's too obviously a shyster.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:14 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:When did I write that?

Political circumstances now probably make it a considerably trickier undertaking than whenever that was.
I think it would be easy enough. It's not like the Mid 90s, where very many people would vote Labour or Lib Dem almost equally to get rid of the Tories. The Lib Dems are still too weak. The Tories wouldn't lose a seat like Christchurch now in a by-election.

Labour thought Leyton was unloseable back in 1965. Patrick Gordon Walker's ghost still haunts politicians of all parties when it comes to blatant parachutes.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:17 pm

Private ambulance firm contracted by the NHS goes into administration

Private Ambulance Service, which operates 126 vehicles and employs 300 people, is expected to stop trading on 9 October

A private ambulance service that has contracts with the NHS and other private health organisations faces closure after going into administration.

Private Ambulance Service has been serving hospitals such as Watford General, St Albans hospital and Bedford hospital. (Guardian)

(I think the word "private" (second paragraph, second line) should, as things stand at present, be inside commas or brackets.)

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... nistration

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:28 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Tubby Isaacs wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:When did I write that?

Political circumstances now probably make it a considerably trickier undertaking than whenever that was.
I think it would be easy enough. It's not like the Mid 90s, where very many people would vote Labour or Lib Dem almost equally to get rid of the Tories. The Lib Dems are still too weak. The Tories wouldn't lose a seat like Christchurch now in a by-election.
Labour thought Leyton was unloseable back in 1965. Patrick Gordon Walker's ghost still haunts politicians of all parties when it comes to blatant parachutes.

New one on me, interesting. But swing of 8.7% only.

He might have had some unfair baggage from losing Smethwick too, especially in a white part of London not far from more racially mixed areas. Even with the care policy muck up, virtually none of them did this year.

By comparison, the appalling Christopher Chope in Christchurch got three and a half times second place Labour's vote in Christchurch. Those old people aren't voting Labour.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:38 pm

But they HAVE voted LibDem in relatively recent memory.....

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:51 pm

Has there been any analysis of "conversion rates" as you get older ie.if you can keep people with you if not forever but longer.Also I noted the difference in voting Labour/Tory mortgage holders wasn't much different(rather than paid off)?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 2:58 pm

[youtube]JmZk9RLZEn4[/youtube]

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:03 pm

See also Martin Amis

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:11 pm

Theresa May ‘saved the Union’ - Ruth Davidson

Read more at: http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/n ... -1-4574448" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:12 pm

'course she did Ruth.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:22 pm

Police Are Preparing For Thousands Of Protesters At The Conservative Party Conference

estimates put the numbers in the tens of thousands — in at least two planned protests as the conference gets underway.
https://www.buzzfeed.com/patricksmith/p ... .emdBkdrgB" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:24 pm

Kettle had enough,no stamina these days,sadly.I have spares.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:31 pm

Forever might be pushing it a bit.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:35 pm

Some dispute on the running order.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:35 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:But they HAVE voted LibDem in relatively recent memory.....

Pensioners are nailed on for the Tories for the foreseeable.

The FT reckon May could prop up their house prices again with more Right to Buy.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:38 pm

But not a steady state,you become a pensioner it doesn't necessarily mean you suddenly vote Tory,Some shit coming by the way for some.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:41 pm

https://www.farminguk.com/news/NFU-to-b ... 47531.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
It will be the NFU’s first stand at the annual conference. The Barn will bring all the elements of the British farmed countryside right into the city of Manchester.

There's nothing like the rustic smell of pig farm.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:54 pm

We have one near here.At least they didn't vote Tory,or did they?

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 3:55 pm

If the Tories could Davidson into a seat after the 2021 Scottish election, she's their best bet I suppose. Could be done.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:03 pm

Me next kettle competition.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:04 pm

HindleA wrote:But not a steady state,you become a pensioner it doesn't necessarily mean you suddenly vote Tory,Some shit coming by the way for some.

You probably do in Christchurch, if you're not already!

I've done this before, haven't I, given the impression I think all pensioners have a wonderful time? They don't, not by a long chalk.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:07 pm

SpinningHugo wrote:If the Tories could Davidson into a seat after the 2021 Scottish election, she's their best bet I suppose. Could be done.

Why would the Scottish Elections come into it? Westminster's the bigger prize for any Unionist party, and they can only go so low with PR in the Scottish Parliament.

Scottish seat in Westminster might be interesting, but none safe enough.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:09 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
https://www.farminguk.com/news/NFU-to-b ... 47531.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
It will be the NFU’s first stand at the annual conference. The Barn will bring all the elements of the British farmed countryside right into the city of Manchester.
There's nothing like the rustic smell of pig farm.

Red sky at night,
Get orf moy laaaand!

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:10 pm

HindleA wrote:But not a steady state,you become a pensioner it doesn't necessarily mean you suddenly vote Tory,Some shit coming by the way for some.

That's something I wonder about. Of course the Tories have looked after pensioner interests to hang on to their vote, but are current pensioners also more attracted to conservatism in the first place because their formative years were the very conservative '50s and early '60s. Will pensioners who were in their 20s during the 1970s (ie those retiring right now) be as conservative (with small "c") in their old age?

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:12 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:
HindleA wrote:But not a steady state,you become a pensioner it doesn't necessarily mean you suddenly vote Tory,Some shit coming by the way for some.
You probably do in Christchurch, if you're not already!

I've done this before, haven't I, given the impression I think all pensioners have a wonderful time? They don't, not by a long chalk.

I went to Christchurch once and was a bit freaked out by the abundance of union jack bunting. Met a guy in the church (a church?) measuring the distance between the chairs.

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:14 pm

I am quite sure that with a bit more exposure Davidson will be seen for what she is - a not very pleasant Tory and it is possible, if not probable, that that the Tory revival in Scotland has peaked - especially if Scot lab can avoid electing Sarwar

The Davidson popularity is built on that rather unpleasant exploitation of the Unionist/Nationalist split - which is criticised when Sturgeon has done it.

Oh, and pensioners like the Tories do they and are happy with at the cash the Tories throw at them........look at all that nice unearned wealth they are sitting on, and we are looking short of cash. Also, they were the most keen on Brexit. Perhaps those nice Tory pensioners in places like Christchurch would like to dig deep to pay for what they have inflicted on the rest of the country?

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:25 pm

Yeah, Davidson has an "Orange" streak with shows through in Scottish politics. Would that be a problem in UK politics though?

I agree they're likely to go backwards in Scotland. So as I see it, not that much point in her hanging about there.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:28 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
Tubby Isaacs wrote:
HindleA wrote:But not a steady state,you become a pensioner it doesn't necessarily mean you suddenly vote Tory,Some shit coming by the way for some.
You probably do in Christchurch, if you're not already!

I've done this before, haven't I, given the impression I think all pensioners have a wonderful time? They don't, not by a long chalk.
I went to Christchurch once and was a bit freaked out by the abundance of union jack bunting. Met a guy in the church (a church?) measuring the distance between the chairs.

Are you a visitor of churches? I am. Never been to Hampshire for that purpose though.

You've probably picked up from Roger that Christchurch isn't just famous for pensioners now. It's famous for its accident-prone free school.

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/parkfield-sch ... -new-site/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:31 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:Yeah, Davidson has an "Orange" streak with shows through in Scottish politics. Would that be a problem in UK politics though?

I agree they're likely to go backwards in Scotland. So as I see it, not that much point in her hanging about there.

I am not sure being 'orange' is that relevant in England....may appeal to some Kippers and the right of the Tories but her views on Brexit and her personal situation would also be likely to put just as many off from that end of the political spectrum

Being and ex inhabitant of Scotland and with some friends up there I try to keep a watch on the politics up there and she has been helped by the Scottish independence discussion and the uselessness of Scottish Labour in recent years. Her politics are in general still pretty right wing and I am not sure she is suited to the UK stage. Sturgeon is still the dominant force up there, and if Labour go to the left you could see them taking back some of those seats they lost a few years ago - Sarwar would not be a good choice in my view from what I hear from my ex-labour voting friends

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:42 pm

@Tubby not a pop/annoyance sorry for way of expressing if it came across that way.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:44 pm

HindleA wrote:@Tubby not a pop/annoyance sorry for way of expressing if it came across that way.

It didn't at all. But I've "gaffed" on that front before.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:56 pm

Maybe because I have always been hard left in immoveability on the voting front and wouldn't contemplate voting Tory,regardless of circumstances,for purely selfish reasons of we are all generally better off,previously used safequards remain in place etc,I look for a way to attain or maintain that enough in enough people not to be persauded or continue to be by the bastard Tory party.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 4:58 pm

Davidson's been pretty one-dimensional, with the focus on Unionism. But that was exactly the right tactics for her party in Scotland, so I wouldn't necessarily say she can't broaden out from that. There's been a few signs of good sense in swerving the most poisonous parts of Westminster Toryism.

And she is pretty right wing, no doubt about that. I wonder though if that could work in getting most of the people who vote for May out, while having a positive distance from Hard Brexit. "Don't anyone dare fuck with my patriotism!" while she softens the EU policy, from wherever we are.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 30 Sep, 2017 5:02 pm

PF - sun's nearly over 't yard arm
turn page now!