FlyTheNest

ohsocynical wrote:We would hope that if the No vote wins, Cameron would go down on his knees and thank Gordon Brown in particular, not to mention Darling, Ed, and the countless Labour No supporters who've been out on the doorsteps in Scotland - not that we've seen much of that on the TV.

There is as much chance of that happening as seeing pink elephants flying past my window.

Rebecca wrote:

PorFavor wrote:Iain Smith speaking up for the "No" vote. That's torn it . . .

And, like ErnstRemarx, I wish the Scots all the best of luck, whatever the result.

Can I NOT wish my ex mother-in-law well?Or those guys who called Ed M a serial murderer?Holding a grudge here.

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:

ohsocynical wrote:We would hope that if the No vote wins, Cameron would go down on his knees and thank Gordon Brown in particular, not to mention Darling, Ed, and the countless Labour No supporters who've been out on the doorsteps in Scotland - not that we've seen much of that on the TV.

There is as much chance of that happening as seeing pink elephants flying past my window.

Rumour has it The Leader sees them all the time and, in fact, UKIP are considering fielding one as a candidate next year.

Rebecca wrote:

PorFavor wrote:Iain Smith speaking up for the "No" vote. That's torn it . . .

And, like ErnstRemarx, I wish the Scots all the best of luck, whatever the result.

Can I NOT wish my ex mother-in-law well?Or those guys who called Ed M a serial murderer?Holding a grudge here.

JackPranker wrote:

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:

ohsocynical wrote:We would hope that if the No vote wins, Cameron would go down on his knees and thank Gordon Brown in particular, not to mention Darling, Ed, and the countless Labour No supporters who've been out on the doorsteps in Scotland - not that we've seen much of that on the TV.

There is as much chance of that happening as seeing pink elephants flying past my window.

Rumour has it The Leader sees them all the time and, in fact, UKIP are considering fielding one as a candidate next year.

Not brown elephants thought. Nooooooo...

RobertSnozers wrote:

letsskiptotheleft wrote:Ok I have waxed lyrical, now judge for yourselves..

Yes Rebecca, the NO have been on the back foot when it comes to passionate arguments.

Wow! That was a hell of a speech, wasn't it? It was my kind of speech too - quoting Marx, and unashamedly standing up for the NHS and the welfare state.

Why couldn't we have seen that Gordon Brown a little more in 2007-10??

AnatolyKasparov wrote:The "serial murderer" one was a bit puzzling.

People who didn't know a) that Ed wasn't even an MP at the time of the Iraq war and b) didn't support it, one presumes?

Retweeted by New Statesman
Media Mole ‏@ns_media 16m
Sky's Kay Burley calls a Scottish Yes supporter "a bit of a knob" live on air http://www.newstatesman.com/media-mole/ ... b-live-air" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

rebeccariots2 wrote:

Retweeted by New Statesman
Media Mole ‏@ns_media 16m
Sky's Kay Burley calls a Scottish Yes supporter "a bit of a knob" live on air http://www.newstatesman.com/media-mole/ ... b-live-air" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

RobertSnozers wrote:

rebeccariots2 wrote:

AnatolyKasparov wrote:The "serial murderer" one was a bit puzzling.

People who didn't know a) that Ed wasn't even an MP at the time of the Iraq war and b) didn't support it, one presumes?

Yes, very puzzling. I found myself wondering if they had actually thought he was Tony Blair. (Thank goodness he's stayed away this time. Small mercies.)

It's a case of Labour = Iraq = Mass murderer, I imagine.

Never mind that Labour (and not least Blair) brought about peace in Northern Ireland. The way the oh so very pro-Labour BBC has been talking about it recently you'd think it was all John Major and Iain Bloody (and I use the term advisedly) Paisley.

RobertSnozers wrote:The nasty pro-union BBC just reported Gordon Brown's speech - or rather, just the part where he said Scotland risked falling through an 'economic trapdoor', leaving out all of the positive stuff about the strength and history of the Union, co-operation, the creation of devolution, NHS, welfare state etc together (which was a majority of the speech) - then reporting Salmond's reply that the No campaign was being negative and only the Yes campaign offered a positive vision.

With bias like this, who needs objectivity?

RobertSnozers wrote: Very true. I think by the time be became to be PM, he'd forgotten all his radicalism in favour of a sort of managerial, Blair-like style which just didn't suit him. There's a school of thought in personnel development that people shouldn't actually spend too much time developing the areas of their skillset that they are weakest at, and should focus more narrowly on the things they do well anyway. This would have worked for Brown, I think. Trying to out-Cameron Cameron was never going to work.

Mr Brown has picked career civil servants to become his principal advisers on international relations in an attempt to show that he is moving away from Mr Blair's much-criticised style of "sofa government".

Simon McDonald, 46, a former UK ambassador to Israel who heads Iraq policy at the Foreign Office, will replace Sir Nigel Sheinwald as chief foreign policy adviser. Jon Cunliffe, 54, the second permanent secretary at the Treasury, is set to take over from Kim Darroch as the Prime Minister's main adviser on European policy.

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
No. That was why he (and the rest of his crew) voted against an EU ban on ivory imports, scared of the brown elephants coming over here and taking his pink elephants jobs.

RobertSnozers wrote:

letsskiptotheleft wrote:

RobertSnozers wrote: Wow! That was a hell of a speech, wasn't it? It was my kind of speech too - quoting Marx, and unashamedly standing up for the NHS and the welfare state.

Why couldn't we have seen that Gordon Brown a little more in 2007-10??

Indeed. The biggest tragedy of Gordon Brown was attempting to be something he wasn't, he wasn't a Blair like personality, showing faux concern, if he stuck to who he really was, an intellectual, not a populist, dour at times, who would have cared, I wouldn't?

Very true. I think by the time be became to be PM, he'd forgotten all his radicalism in favour of a sort of managerial, Blair-like style which just didn't suit him. There's a school of thought in personnel development that people shouldn't actually spend too much time developing the areas of their skillset that they are weakest at, and should focus more narrowly on the things they do well anyway. This would have worked for Brown, I think. Trying to out-Cameron Cameron was never going to work.

ohsocynical wrote:Personal ambition has crossed my mind quite a few times over the last few weeks:

Salmond will be either:

Leader/President/Prime Minister of Independent Scotland
Or:
Leader of an opposition party within the UK.

Salmond "could step down by November" if Scotland votes No
Scottish First Minister could make way for his deputy Nicola Sturgeon if independence is rejected.
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/20 ... d-votes-no

rebeccariots2 wrote:

ohsocynical wrote:Personal ambition has crossed my mind quite a few times over the last few weeks:

Salmond will be either:

Leader/President/Prime Minister of Independent Scotland
Or:
Leader of an opposition party within the UK.

Salmond "could step down by November" if Scotland votes No
Scottish First Minister could make way for his deputy Nicola Sturgeon if independence is rejected.
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/20 ... d-votes-no

Can't see it myself. Salmond stepping down that is. Who knows how the vote is going to go ....

RobertSnozers wrote:

Rebecca wrote:Well now,Salmond says that Scotland will be Englands new best friend.How stupid does he think we are?

Seriously?

The way he's talking today suggests he thinks a Yes vote is a long shot.

RobertSnozers wrote:

letsskiptotheleft wrote:

RobertSnozers wrote: Wow! That was a hell of a speech, wasn't it? It was my kind of speech too - quoting Marx, and unashamedly standing up for the NHS and the welfare state.

Why couldn't we have seen that Gordon Brown a little more in 2007-10??

Indeed. The biggest tragedy of Gordon Brown was attempting to be something he wasn't, he wasn't a Blair like personality, showing faux concern, if he stuck to who he really was, an intellectual, not a populist, dour at times, who would have cared, I wouldn't?

Very true. I think by the time be became to be PM, he'd forgotten all his radicalism in favour of a sort of managerial, Blair-like style which just didn't suit him. There's a school of thought in personnel development that people shouldn't actually spend too much time developing the areas of their skillset that they are weakest at, and should focus more narrowly on the things they do well anyway. This would have worked for Brown, I think. Trying to out-Cameron Cameron was never going to work.

TechnicalEphemera wrote:Genius, Shetland is now considering leaving Scotland and remaining in the Union (should there be a yes vote).

Ah hang on it is just some Lib Dem talking shite.

RobertSnozers wrote:
It's a case of Labour = Iraq = Mass murderer, I imagine.

Never mind that Labour (and not least Blair) brought about peace in Northern Ireland. The way the oh so very pro-Labour BBC has been talking about it recently you'd think it was all John Major and Iain Bloody (and I use the term advisedly) Paisley.

RobertSnozers wrote:

Rebecca wrote:Well now,Salmond says that Scotland will be Englands new best friend.How stupid does he think we are?

Seriously?

The way he's talking today suggests he thinks a Yes vote is a long shot.

Eric_WLothian wrote:

RobertSnozers wrote:

Rebecca wrote:Well now,Salmond says that Scotland will be Englands new best friend.How stupid does he think we are?

Seriously?

The way he's talking today suggests he thinks a Yes vote is a long shot.

He's been saying this for ages - the relationship between England and Scotland will be improved with independence!

It's going to be so friendly that you'll underwrite our banks, subsidise our green energy, share research funding - oh, and your students won't mind paying fees which no other EU country pays.

PorFavor wrote:Goodnight, everyone.

TechnicalEphemera wrote:

Eric_WLothian wrote:

RobertSnozers wrote: Seriously?

The way he's talking today suggests he thinks a Yes vote is a long shot.

He's been saying this for ages - the relationship between England and Scotland will be improved with independence!

It's going to be so friendly that you'll underwrite our banks, subsidise our green energy, share research funding - oh, and your students won't mind paying fees which no other EU country pays.

I think in the event of a yes vote he is going to be shocked by the attitude of rUK. He won't get anything out of the negotiations.

PorFavor wrote:Goodnight, everyone.

ohsocynical wrote:To keep the little sanity I have left, I've made arrangements to be out for some of tomorrow. A nearby Tesco superstore has introduced a section of American foodstuffs so we're going to pop in, buy Mr Ohso a bottle of genuine American Root Beer, and then sit in Windsor Great Park for a couple of hours.The weather forecast isn't bad, so it's a last chance to catch some rays.
I'll break my embargo on giving Tesco any of my money just this once, because Mr Ohso is down in the dumps and missing Spike.

refitman wrote:

ohsocynical wrote:To keep the little sanity I have left, I've made arrangements to be out for some of tomorrow. A nearby Tesco superstore has introduced a section of American foodstuffs so we're going to pop in, buy Mr Ohso a bottle of genuine American Root Beer, and then sit in Windsor Great Park for a couple of hours.The weather forecast isn't bad, so it's a last chance to catch some rays.
I'll break my embargo on giving Tesco any of my money just this once, because Mr Ohso is down in the dumps and missing Spike.

Brace yourself in the American section. The one near me has is and it's very expensive (I should never have bought the bacon popcorn).

letsskiptotheleft wrote:Ok I have waxed lyrical, now judge for yourselves..

[youtube]J39bBV7CBJk[/youtube]

Yes Rebecca, the NO have been on the back foot when it comes to passionate arguments.

yahyah wrote:I know I always lower the tone but as well as having a crush on Alastair Darling back in the day I used to find Gordon Brown sexy.
He reminded me of my first love who broke my heart, a Marxist who was ten years older than me and used to work in the international section of the TUC. [Hi if you're an FTNer Tom, too late mate I'm happily married now].

And are we in an alternate universe ?

The Mail headline:
'Barnstorming Brown delivers the speech of his career in passionate final plea to save the Union... so why wasn't he in charge of the No campaign from the start?'

He has said he would stand for the Scottish Parliament to attack the SNP lies on the NHS, wonder if he means either way, if Yes or No wins ?

Wouldn't it be a thing if Yes just scraped a victory and their first elected government under independence was a Labour one with Brown at the helm ?

ohsocynical wrote:Martin Rowson ‏@MartinRowson 3m
Trying to remember when I first described David Cameron in public as a useless fat pink fuck. Think it was do raffle at PEN Quiz 2011..


I think I love Martin Rowson.

This means waste from Hunterston and Torness reactors could be prevented from being stored at Sellafield and would have to be dealt with in Scotland instead.

Rebecca wrote:

yahyah wrote:I know I always lower the tone but as well as having a crush on Alastair Darling back in the day I used to find Gordon Brown sexy.
He reminded me of my first love who broke my heart, a Marxist who was ten years older than me and used to work in the international section of the TUC. [Hi if you're an FTNer Tom, too late mate I'm happily married now].

And are we in an alternate universe ?

The Mail headline:
'Barnstorming Brown delivers the speech of his career in passionate final plea to save the Union... so why wasn't he in charge of the No campaign from the start?'

He has said he would stand for the Scottish Parliament to attack the SNP lies on the NHS, wonder if he means either way, if Yes or No wins ?

Wouldn't it be a thing if Yes just scraped a victory and their first elected government under independence was a Labour one with Brown at the helm ?

Ed Miliband ,PM of Uk and Gordon Brown PM of Scotland.Now that would be a dream scenario.

Shetland may reconsider its place in Scotland after yes vote, says Carmichael
Scotland secretary says if the islands were to vote no but national vote was a yes, Shetland would consider its options