FlyTheNest

Morning all.

Good morning.

Sorry I haven't looked in for some time but have been busy. Besides I've been avoiding the squabbling, which I hope has subsided however I did see last night's Question Time and watched one man who knew his mind and one that seemed uncertain, spending much of his time telling us the views of the other, often sleighting him.

As for the public, I now realise why I hate people.

Morning all.

Already looking forward to AK's round-up of yesterday's results.

On the subject of grammar schools, which I see was being discussed yesterday, I watched a discussion on Channel 4 News the other day where a Tory MP stated that we accept streaming within schools so why not between schools? It thoroughly amazes me how ignorant some people can be yet still they are voted to represent us. The difference is absolutely clear, once in a school that is where you remain, whereas streaming within a school generally applies to individual or categories of subjects.

I fear that man was subject to too much hand-holding during his formative years and not endowed with freedom of thought.

Afterthought: I forgot to mention moving within streams too. Doh. Even then I mean between.

StephenDolan wrote:Morning all.

Already looking forward to AK's round-up of yesterday's results.

Have seen some results. Labour down % in all of them.

Anyone got a local view of the spectacular Lib Dem revival in Mosborough, Sheffield ?
They won the seat after the death of a popular Labour councillor.
The Mirror describe it as Labour crushed.

Lib Dems 45.6% [+31.8]
Labour 31.1% [-9.2]
Greens, Cons & UKIP also down.

https://twitter.com/britainelects" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/la ... st-8796901" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

''Carwyn Jones to warn Wales ''will not consent'' to a Brexit deal that means leaving the European single market''
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/polit ... l-11862131" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Morning.

Bless, someone thinks that it's only "Labour drones" who are against this grammar school idea. Maybe I'll just leave this here.

Former Tory minister says grammar schools fail disadvantaged children


https://www.theguardian.com/education/2 ... d-children

Former Conservative universities minister Lord Willetts has spoken out against Theresa May’s plan to lift the ban on new grammar schools, underlining the opposition she is likely to face within her own party.

Willetts, who is now the chair of thinktank the Resolution Foundation, said he had not changed his views since the Conservatives were in opposition, and the evidence suggested they failed to help disadvantaged children.

“I’m afraid that was the evidence then and it still is the evidence,” he told the Today programme.

Oh, evidence eh? Well who needs that...so last year.

Grammar schools should be an interesting fight in parliament. Can't see any reference to this in their 2015 manifesto?

Kumon, explore learning etc must be pretty happy at the extra kids likely to attend.

StephenDolan wrote:Grammar schools should be an interesting fight in parliament. Can't see any reference to this in their 2015 manifesto?

Kumon, explore learning etc must be pretty happy at the extra kids likely to attend.

No, it wasn't in the manifesto which is why they can't overturn any Lords defeat on this when - or if - it gets to that stage.

Interesting that this is a green paper so a consultation - we might find that opposition from all sides as it clearly is, is so strong that it gets dropped.

Good morning

Just back from UK...see activity on here is pretty low and some familiar faces absent

AK, PF, Roger and others still posting interesting things though

By the way, has yahyah become a surrogate SH, seeming to take pleasure in seeing Labour 'crushed'?

Not nice seeing Labour lose anywhere but I will await a more nuanced and interesting assessment from Anatoly

Dear me, David Willetts - yes, the Tory MP David Willetts - is now part of the Blob!

RogerOThornhill wrote:

StephenDolan wrote:Grammar schools should be an interesting fight in parliament. Can't see any reference to this in their 2015 manifesto?

Kumon, explore learning etc must be pretty happy at the extra kids likely to attend.

No, it wasn't in the manifesto which is why they can't overturn any Lords defeat on this when - or if - it gets to that stage.

Interesting that this is a green paper so a consultation - we might find that opposition from all sides as it clearly is, is so strong that it gets dropped.

Can't the government force it through, Cameron was keen on using any mechanism possible previously if memory serves.

I must say that Theresa has grown into her role. No longer the stern faced lady stuck at Home, she has learned to smile to camera and does a far better job at it than that dour Gordon Brown for example.

That was a typo btw, there is a world of difference between into and onto.

StephenDolan wrote: Can't the government force it through, Cameron was keen on using any mechanism possible previously if memory serves.

Not if it wasn't in the manifesto - IIRC if it wasn't the Lords can delay it by a year but can't block entirely.

Also, and from a noted edu advisor which mirrors my thinking.

Robert Hill ‏@Robt_Hill 23m23 minutes ago

It's clear that Nick Timothy and not @JustineGreening is really the SoS - education policy being led by former leader of lobby group
2 retweets 0 likes

Greening's having to play catch-up on this - No 10 is making all the running. It's also why they didn't require the services of Rachel Wolf any longer. With Nick Timothy in No 10, why do you need a separate edu advisor?

yahyah wrote:

StephenDolan wrote:Morning all.

Already looking forward to AK's round-up of yesterday's results.

Have seen some results. Labour down % in all of them.

Anyone got a local view of the spectacular Lib Dem revival in Mosborough, Sheffield ?
They won the seat after the death of a popular Labour councillor.
The Mirror describe it as Labour crushed.

Lib Dems 45.6% [+31.8]
Labour 31.1% [-9.2]
Greens, Cons & UKIP also down.

https://twitter.com/britainelects" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/la ... st-8796901" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Morning YahYah

Shocking

local reaction on twittering ( momentum held a Sheffield4Corbyn social on election day )

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Good morfternoon.

I think we missed this yesterday (sorry if it was just me) -

Sajid Javid: devolution deal 'off the table' for north-east of England

Communities secretary withdraws legislation after council leaders fail to agree on multimillion-pound devolution deal (Guardian)

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... ajid-javid

And (same subject) -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-37312978

PorFavor wrote:Good morfternoon.

I think we missed this yesterday (sorry if it was just me) -

Sajid Javid: devolution deal 'off the table' for north-east of England

Communities secretary withdraws legislation after council leaders fail to agree on multimillion-pound devolution deal (Guardian)

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... ajid-javid

And (same subject) -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-37312978

I saw it late last night. 'Multimillion' = 30m, between 7 LAs who are finding it resistible. The idea of them working together under a single mayor? Is it just me who finds it bizarre?
55degreesnorth may have something more to say about it.

Further to yahyah's earlier post this, from LabourList -

In Sheffield at least, the leadership election does not seem to have gone down well. Labour last night lost a by-election in the Mosborough ward to the Lib Dems and saw its vote slump by more than nine per cent, just three weeks after Corbyn attracted 2,500 people to a speech in the steel city.

It is, of course, just one seat but, much like the recent result in Stockton, the vote will be seized upon by both sides as proof of the need to unite behind the leader - or to oust him, depending on your stance.

I don't want to be seen as negative (which means I will be being so) but I am disappointed to see so-called Labour supporters using a council by-election defeat to continue their relentless blaming of the leader or his supporters for every defeat

Their posts contain little else

Who knows why that by election was lost...perhaps we will find out later but the clear linking of it to Momentum is tiresome

Under Corbyn's leadership Labour have held their own in most elections. Not improving as fast as we would like but the bad defeat in 2015 still looms large

I am not claiming every win was down to him and every defeat was despite him but those who are posting like this are the first to shout cultists and accuse others of dogmatism

Disappointing but not surprising

PorFavor wrote:Further to yahyah's earlier post this, from LabourList -

In Sheffield at least, the leadership election does not seem to have gone down well. Labour last night lost a by-election in the Mosborough ward to the Lib Dems and saw its vote slump by more than nine per cent, just three weeks after Corbyn attracted 2,500 people to a speech in the steel city.

It is, of course, just one seat but, much like the recent result in Stockton, the vote will be seized upon by both sides as proof of the need to unite behind the leader - or to oust him, depending on your stance.

Hi PF

It is a disappointing result but too many are jumping to conclusions without providing data

Things such as the reason for the election, the demographic, the history, the candidate are so important in local by elections

All we see though are the fact we lost and the fact momentum had a rally and immediately one is assumed to be the cause of the other

There are many reasons for Labour to be doing badly at a local and national level

I could just as easily blame Smith and the disloyalty of the PLP as reasons but I have no evidence

No wonder people have left the board when we see posts like some of those further up

Just popped back to say that Theresa is about to speak about grammar schools on the BBC News Channel although I'm not sure I shall have time to pass comment thereafter.

To be honest, after last night where Smith told barefaced lies about his previous statements on Prevent and negotiating with ISIS - both of which are on video - I find it truly repugnant that anyone would want to vote for him. His smear about Corbyn and anti-semitism and race was probably the most sickening of all, though. Its gutter politics from the Zac Goldsmith playbook and utterly reprehensible. Just like Project Snide on here has driven away many posters, Smith's Project Snide is turning away voters.

yahyah wrote:

StephenDolan wrote:Morning all.

Already looking forward to AK's round-up of yesterday's results.

Have seen some results. Labour down % in all of them.

Though that stat on its own is misleading. They massively increased their majority in a marginal seat in Mansfield, and held another in Barrow.

Yet another good result for UKIP in Kent, which really does seem to be turning into a bit of a redoubt for them even as they slump elsewhere.

And as for the Sheffield result, the ward is in the far south of the city and was historically in Derbyshire. Labour's candidate was from Stocksbridge - look that up on a map.

Why??

Theresa suggests that frustration with politics expressed by the referendum result equates to lack of opportunity related to grammar schools. Who writes this bloody stuff?

Temulkar wrote:To be honest, after last night where Smith told barefaced lies about his previous statements on Prevent and negotiating with ISIS - both of which are on video - I find it truly repugnant that anyone would want to vote for him. His smear about Corbyn and anti-semitism and race was probably the most sickening of all, though. Its gutter politics from the Zac Goldsmith playbook and utterly reprehensible. Just like Project Snide on here has driven away many posters, Smith's Project Snide is turning away voters.

I didn't watch it. I can't bear it any more. I voted for Owen Smith but, to be honest, both sides (electorally speaking) appear to be going nowhere fast.

Lost Soul wrote:

yahyah wrote:

StephenDolan wrote:Morning all.

Already looking forward to AK's round-up of yesterday's results.

Have seen some results. Labour down % in all of them.

Anyone got a local view of the spectacular Lib Dem revival in Mosborough, Sheffield ?
They won the seat after the death of a popular Labour councillor.
The Mirror describe it as Labour crushed.

Lib Dems 45.6% [+31.8]
Labour 31.1% [-9.2]
Greens, Cons & UKIP also down.

https://twitter.com/britainelects" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/la ... st-8796901" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Morning YahYah

Shocking

local reaction on twittering ( momentum held a Sheffield4Corbyn social on election day )

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As a local, do you have an explanation of why Labour chose a candidate from *Stocksbridge* for this seat?

Meanwhile, the LibDem winner actually lived in the ward. I suspect their leaflets pretty much wrote themselves........

I'm convinced, Theresa, every child should go to a grammar school.

The simplest way to tackle lack of inclusivity in faith schools is to abandon the faith bit.

utopiandreams wrote:The simplest way to tackle lack of inclusivity in faith schools is to abandon the faith bit.

I don't think that's how Theresa May sees it -

Theresa May to relax faith schools admissions rules

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37314149

Yes she said as much during her preamble, PF, but also said that Seikh and Muslim schools don't attract other applicants whether or not allowed. Virtually everything I heard from her reeks of separate tiers even if she maintained otherwise.

Good-morning, everyone.

From the Head of content at the TES.



Quite.

Gove's reaction will be key I think - given that May sacked him, she's taking a big risk here.

AnatolyKasparov wrote:

Lost Soul wrote:

yahyah wrote: Have seen some results. Labour down % in all of them.

Anyone got a local view of the spectacular Lib Dem revival in Mosborough, Sheffield ?
They won the seat after the death of a popular Labour councillor.
The Mirror describe it as Labour crushed.

Lib Dems 45.6% [+31.8]
Labour 31.1% [-9.2]
Greens, Cons & UKIP also down.

https://twitter.com/britainelects" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/la ... st-8796901" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Morning YahYah

Shocking

local reaction on twittering ( momentum held a Sheffield4Corbyn social on election day )

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As a local, do you have an explanation of why Labour chose a candidate from *Stocksbridge* for this seat?

Meanwhile, the LibDem winner actually lived in the ward. I suspect their leaflets pretty much wrote themselves........

Well the previous councillor Isobel Bowler lived in Ranmoor. Which, although a bit closer to Mosborough , isn't exactly local ( in the nipping down to the corner shop sense )
Stocksbridge is only 16 miles away from Mosborough .

Breaking...

Three charged with fraud and false accounting over supermarket Tesco's accounts in 2014, Serious Fraud Office says

But...but...I thought that sort of thing only happened in the useless public sector!

She's not wrong though, is she? Academies. Free Schools. Curriculum reforms. Ofsted. What a highly predicted clusterfuck.

The Tory solution? Make it even worse.

Anyway:

#GrammerSchools Is Trending On Twitter And The Irony Is Almost Too Much - The Huffington Post - UK
https://apple.news/ANUPnuok6N46dB7ZGfG6xYA" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

RogerOThornhill wrote:From the Head of content at the TES.



Quite.

Gove's reaction will be key I think - given that May sacked him, she's taking a big risk here.

That was not my take on it, ROT, albeit she spoke of Cameron's reforms rather than Gove's... I'm not entirely sure now she did mention another and possibly Gove too. Anyway she spoke highly of the reforms during Cameron's reign and said 1.4m more children are now in schools ranked high or outstanding. However every time I hear politicians speaking of the opportunities offered by academies I cannot help but think of the opportunity to profit by becoming a 'sponsor'.

Since May has decided to speak of education and the supposed well-being of our kids I am a little surprised that having had a recent reminder of the Olympic legacy alongside growing concerns of childhood obesity, possibly a far more serious problem, she has not chosen to say anything whatsoever on the subject. I thought education a far more rounded topic than merely academic.

Lost Soul wrote:

AnatolyKasparov wrote:

Lost Soul wrote: Morning YahYah

Shocking

local reaction on twittering ( momentum held a Sheffield4Corbyn social on election day )

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As a local, do you have an explanation of why Labour chose a candidate from *Stocksbridge* for this seat?

Meanwhile, the LibDem winner actually lived in the ward. I suspect their leaflets pretty much wrote themselves........

Well the previous councillor Isobel Bowler lived in Ranmoor. Which, although a bit closer to Mosborough , isn't exactly local ( in the nipping down to the corner shop sense )
Stocksbridge is only 16 miles away from Mosborough .

Its literally on the other side of the city, though - people notice these things.

(and just as Mosborough was historically part of Derbyshire, Stocksbridge was once outside Sheffield's jurisdiction and remains geographically seperate)

A thing that will actually help less well off Londoners rather than the more well off ones:

Everything You Need To Know About The Bus Hopper Fare - Londonist
https://apple.news/AIy7CY6DpN12flM_NeB4u8A" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Particularly as they're far more likely to a) travel by bus from the outskirts into the centre and b) need to change busses to get all the way to work (and back).

About time.

Boris Johnson stopped it from happening sooner. Of course.

I received a YouGov survey today. All about sports gear - so I gave up since almost none of the questions were relevant to\answerable by me. Did anyone else get it (and persevere)? Did it change?

I also got yet another e-mail (intended for my misguided American namesake) from Eric Trump who was asking for money for his Dad. Buddy, can you spare a dime?






Edited - typo

Incidentally, I have no idea what this means as far as academisation policy goes - as far as I can tell, it wasn't mentioned apart from the bits where private schools and unis will have to sponsor academies in certain circumstances.

Have they finally realised that their target for full academisation by 2020-22 is simply not possible?

It seems I missed Jewish and Hindu schools in my earlier comment on faith schools.

AnatolyKasparov wrote:

Lost Soul wrote:

yahyah wrote: Have seen some results. Labour down % in all of them.

Anyone got a local view of the spectacular Lib Dem revival in Mosborough, Sheffield ?
They won the seat after the death of a popular Labour councillor.
The Mirror describe it as Labour crushed.

Lib Dems 45.6% [+31.8]
Labour 31.1% [-9.2]
Greens, Cons & UKIP also down.

https://twitter.com/britainelects" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/la ... st-8796901" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Morning YahYah

Shocking

local reaction on twittering ( momentum held a Sheffield4Corbyn social on election day )

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As a local, do you have an explanation of why Labour chose a candidate from *Stocksbridge* for this seat?

Meanwhile, the LibDem winner actually lived in the ward. I suspect their leaflets pretty much wrote themselves........

Do you know for a fact, though, that Labour passed over a more local option when selecting their candidate? If no one locally was willing and able to stand for Labour, that's a whole other problem and not so obviously solvable.

Me neither, ROT, you'd think universities never engaged with schools or their students listening to some of the utterances from politicians.

I have no idea there whatsoever (and would be interested to hear from anybody who does know)

At least the current increase in membership might make that sort of thing less of a problem in a few years, always assuming that it is maintained

JonnyT1234 wrote:A thing that will actually help less well off Londoners rather than the more well off ones:

Everything You Need To Know About The Bus Hopper Fare - Londonist
https://apple.news/AIy7CY6DpN12flM_NeB4u8A" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Particularly as they're far more likely to a) travel by bus from the outskirts into the centre and b) need to change busses to get all the way to work (and back).

About time.

Boris Johnson stopped it from happening sooner. Of course.

I do think the importance of local government and the impact the most minor of policies can make to people's lives is often overlooked. While Labour is imploding somewhat at a national level, at a local level there is still a lot of opportunity for the party to do a lot of good. I hope Andy Burnham wins the Manchester mayoral contest and manages to do something positive for the city.

Temulkar wrote:To be honest, after last night where Smith told barefaced lies about his previous statements on Prevent and negotiating with ISIS - both of which are on video - I find it truly repugnant that anyone would want to vote for him. His smear about Corbyn and anti-semitism and race was probably the most sickening of all, though. Its gutter politics from the Zac Goldsmith playbook and utterly reprehensible. Just like Project Snide on here has driven away many posters, Smith's Project Snide is turning away voters.

Quite, Tem - and well said.

I am at a loss to understand why it's considered "shocking" and a "disaster" that one council seat is lost by a candidate who does not live in the area and is won by a candidate who does.
Incidentally, the Labour candidate apparently expressed his dislike of Jeremy Corbyn. That may have been influential.
That ward is in the safe Labour seat of Sheffield South East, held (through boundary changes) since 1992 by one Clive Betts. Mr.Betts is the man who proposed the return of elections to shadow cabinet.
Sheffield Momentum were, according to the pictures on their Twitter feed, out doorstepping in Mosborough prior to the council elections; possibly the voters weren't impressed with what they had to say - equally possible is that they did, but did not approve of the candidate's lack of support for the democratically elected leader of his party.
I think it is likely that several things have come in to play here - the local ties of the successful candidate; the possibility that people are not supportive of Corbyn; the possibility that they are and won't vote for someone who isn't; or a general pissed-off attitude to Labour and/or the shenanigans it and the local MP have engaged in.

What really annoys me is the apparent glee with which this is being seized upon by people who support Smith as though - as with everything that has ever happened anywhere at any time - that this loss of one local council seat is somehow Corbyn's "fault".
Sheffield South East CLP have not made a nomination for this leadership contest.

No wonder some people who support Corbyn don't feel they can post here any more.

Before I go I did feel a little coy about mentioning last night's Question Time but referring back to my view of the public, one comment by a member of the audience that went unchallenged was holding Corbyn to blame for Labour's diminished support in Scotland. It never occurred to me that an individual back-bench London MP had been responsible.

Willow904 wrote:I do think the importance of local government and the impact the most minor of policies can make to people's lives is often overlooked. While Labour is imploding somewhat at a national level, at a local level there is still a lot of opportunity for the party to do a lot of good. I hope Andy Burnham wins the Manchester mayoral contest and manages to do something positive for the city.

There was an article in the Graun (I think) yesterday or the day before about Labour local government representatives thoughts on the Labour Leadership election - a Harris one, iirc, so... But one interesting point made in it was how the PLP has basically ignored elected local government members for a very long time (including Miliband, etc). You'd think that they would be routinely asking them about what's happening on the ground.

One of the examples given was the way in which the Tory's austerity cuts are completely corrupt with Labour councils having budgets slashed most and some Tory ones actually seeing their's increased (not a completely uncommon thing under any government of course, but particularly brazen in previous one). It was an easy target for Labour to attack but it would have gone against the Miliband/Ball's austerity-lite mantra. God knows how many votes that will have cost them at the election.

utopiandreams wrote:Before I go I did feel a little coy about mentioning last night's Question Time but referring back to my view of the public, one comment by a member of the audience that went unchallenged was holding Corbyn to blame for Labour's diminished support in Scotland. It never occurred to me that an individual back-bench London MP had been responsible.

It was all Jeremy McCorbyn's fault.