Thursday 29th September 2016

Post by **refitman** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 7:10 am

Morning all.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 8:02 am

Morning.

Carwyn's named our [Wales, that is] rep to the NEC, Blaeunau Gwent Assembly member Alun Davies.
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/polit ... s-11952008" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 8:03 am

As a new swinger myself, I thought this interesting

http://www.newstatesman.com/2016/09/why ... ical-party" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 8:09 am

Morning All

Last night I suggested to HindleA that he shouldn't drink Yorkshire Tea because Taylor's of Harrogate were Tories. I've had this in my head for ages, but can find little evidence. So for the time being I retract

The Harrogate MP did work for Taylors previously and David Cameron has visited them.....

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 8:13 am

That's a relief because I've 720 Yorkshire tea bags awaiting brewing. My other half gets through huge quantities of the stuff.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 8:44 am

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:and David Cameron has visited them.....

Bit surprised that they haven't gone into liquidation then.

Morning all.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 9:10 am

Morning all.

http://www.parliament.uk/business/commi ... nse-16-17/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

All lanes running on the M4. Hmm.

'Chair's comments
Louise Ellman, Chair of the Transport Committee, commented:

"The Department for Transport is blatantly ignoring the safety concerns set out in our report. We had barely received the response to our report before the Government endorsed an all lane running scheme on the M4.

The Committee isn't arguing with the Government about the need for more capacity on our motorways, or their statement that motorways are our safest roads. We support smart motorways such as the M42 scheme.

But we take real issue with the Government's assertion that all lane running schemes on motorways are no different to other types of roads without hard shoulders. Motorways are a different class of road and drivers have different expectations when using them.'

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 9:27 am

RogerOThornhill wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:and David Cameron has visited them.....
Bit surprised that they haven't gone into liquidation then.

Morning all.

What, Dave Cameron, a man who couldn't organise a brew-up in a patisserie, and they let him near the Yorkshire Gold???

Some stuff from their website suggests they may be sound:

https://www.bettysandtaylors.co.uk/our-approach/

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 9:56 am

Contender for Worst Job in the World...

Britain’s civil service scales up to meet Brexit challenge

https://www.ft.com/content/08fc5978-858 ... z4LdFNUppi

Similar questions hang over the role played by Sir Ivan Rogers, the head of the UK’s Permanent Representative in Brussels, who has a dual reporting line to both Mr Davis and Mr Johnson. The IFG warns that “this will need to be managed carefully to avoid confusion and conflict”.

The rest of it - usual chaos.

Lonewolfie · Post by **Lonewolfie** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 10:12 am

Morfterbubble afterall...

Firstly - my apologies to @Hugo....the 'lower orders' comment did indeed 'cross the line'....however...it was based in the frustration at the continuous referral to those without the financial means to live comfortably as 'the poor'....speaking for myself personally now, I believe(TM) that people are people, not units to be valued by their access to money - in the modern world there is absolutely no excuse for anyone to be 'poor'...it is not beyond the wit of man to live in such a society, just beyond the wit of Thatcherism.

I don't think we've had this?...

Theresa May is running a 'government with no policies', claims Ken Clarke

The Remain campaigner said: "Nobody in the government has the first idea of what they're going to do next on the Brexit front."
He also hit out at the ‘Three Brexiteers’ , Boris Johnson, David Davis and Liam Fox, suggesting they were unable to work together.
He added: “Whatever is negotiated will be denounced by the ultra-Eurosceptics as a betrayal… Theresa May has had the misfortune of taking over at the most impossible time. She faces an appalling problem of trying to get these ‘Three Brexiteers’ to agree.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09 ... laims-ken/

Quick...someone find a shiny squirrel...

....and wrt tea....surely everyone knows that all good Marxists only drink poncy hippy teas?...'cos proper tea is theft?

OK, OK, I'll get my coat and won't let the door hit me on the a**e on the way out

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 10:48 am

Good-morning, everyone.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 10:51 am

Difficult to know what term other than "poor" is possible. I am open to suggestions. Most others I can think of ("disadvantaged"?) are similarly negative.

I recommend this brief 5 minute talk on Brexit

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 11:17 am

yahyah wrote:Morning.

Carwyn's named our [Wales, that is] rep to the NEC, Blaeunau Gwent Assembly member Alun Davies.
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/polit ... s-11952008" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Who nearly lost his seat in May. Hmmm.......

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 11:30 am

The Institute for Government's Brexit report here.
http://www.instituteforgovernment.org.u ... ing-brexit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

16 pages of how they've done nowt yet.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 11:38 am

Masterly inactivity.........or not??

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 11:47 am

Picture of 720 tea bags lined up in orderly fashion.

They did not die in vein.

JonnyT1234 · Post by **JonnyT1234** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 12:08 pm

Millions have less than £100 in savings, study finds - BBC News
https://apple.news/AzhpxQMUtSsK-f8meVTh7Ag" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Estimated at more than 16 million. A fifth of the population.

I'm sure IDS will be along soon to tell us how easy it is to survive an entire breakfast hour on half that amount.

Edit:

Since April, basic-rate taxpayers have been allowed to earn up to £1,000 a year in a savings account, and pay no income tax. The Personal Savings Allowance, as it is known, is worth £500 a year to higher-rate taxpayers

One of those political scams sold as being for the poor when in reality it's another get more money for nothing scheme for the wealthier echelons.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 12:27 pm

JonnyT1234

Any hope of solidification?

JonnyT1234 · Post by **JonnyT1234** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 12:35 pm

Five Things We Learned From Corbyn's Conference Speech - The Huffington Post - UK
https://apple.news/ACtJ4u31ZTHe9zl5oGk5rHw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Horrible Buzzfeed format aside, not a bad summation - can't say I agree with it all but I do agree with the gist of it.

One comment in particular I disagree with is the author's (Paul Waugh) assertion that the Ten Commandments line was a sleight on Miliband, when the more obvious point being made by Corbyn was that he is not God, like the more ardent followers seem to think. If it was a sleight at Miliband, it was a secondary message to that one.

Also downplays greatly the emphatic denunciation of anti-Semitism and other abuse that Corbyn made during his speech.

As for olive branches, there were plenty of those made if you were paying attention - a very significant number. But also plenty of lines in the sand drawn too. No push over is Mr Corbyn, it has become abundantly clear the past year.

On a personal note, thought the speech started very strongly (I was only able to watch from about half way through so initial impressions were based on Sparrow's reportage) but felt that it got flabby in the final third, which feeling may have had more to do with my having to work while also trying to listen and the work winning out over the speech.

I haven't watched Corbyn speak for a while, but definitely a much more polished delivery than some other occasions. Best when talking about the things he was passionate about rather than the canned lines on things he wasn't. Which is pretty much what everyone is like unless you're a performer.

Highlighting Rayner, etc. during the speech: perhaps signposting potential challengers for the leadership when he stands down?

Content-wise. Chuffing hell. Clear red water at long bloody last. None of that we're just like the Tories, but a kinder and gentler Tory, bullshit that has done so much damage to the party since 1997. And ballsy too. To paraphrase, "if you don't like it, then you don't like it. We'll win without you." If Miliband had been like that, he may well have won the last election instead of haemorrhaging core support while winning nothing back from the other side. [Note to Bitterites: perhaps your strategy of knifing Miliband in the back whenever the opportunity presented itself was (also) pretty fucking stupid, heh. It's what gave you Corbyn, when you could have had the more centrist Miliband leading and actually be back in power today.]

JonnyT1234 · Post by **JonnyT1234** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 12:40 pm

HindleA wrote:JonnyT1234

Any hope of solidification?

Only if I stop wearing shorts. Being an idiot, I'm aiming to get to October with knees still on show. While wearing sandals. [Evil laugh].

JonnyT1234 · Post by **JonnyT1234** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 12:44 pm

Many apologies for the source but interesting nonetheless. Naturally, if the government was remotely competent they would have thought this through before setting the terms of the referendum. But, hey ho.

In its battle for Brexit, the government is bringing a knife to the legal gunfight - The Telegraph
https://apple.news/AB6QGnDKNQXunUTl5Y6Tzng" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:04 pm

JonnyT1234 wrote:
Since April, basic-rate taxpayers have been allowed to earn up to £1,000 a year in a savings account, and pay no income tax. The Personal Savings Allowance, as it is known, is worth £500 a year to higher-rate taxpayers
One of those political scams sold as being for the poor when in reality it's another get more money for nothing scheme for the wealthier echelons.

That's poorly written, isn't it. The allowance for higher rate taxpayers is £500, so actually worth £200. Zero allowance for 45%ers. Who have all their cash in ISAs anyway.
The only good thing you could say for it is that some poorer people have probably been paying tax on their savings when they shouldn't, having failed to tell their bank not to deduct it, so that will end. Don't spend it all at once.

I used to think GB was a terrible tinkerer, but GO made him look rational.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:20 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
yahyah wrote:Morning.

Carwyn's named our [Wales, that is] rep to the NEC, Blaeunau Gwent Assembly member Alun Davies.
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/polit ... s-11952008" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Who nearly lost his seat in May. Hmmm.......

To be fair to him the Independent who stood in 2011, and came in second well ahead of Plaid in term of votes, didn't stand this time. Plaid targeted areas like Blaenau and don't forget the mini outbreak of 'I' a real lefty me' Leanne Wood mania which would have helped their candidate this year.

I met him back in 2008 and was impressed by him then.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:21 pm

Afternoon all. Back from my stint with Y5 swimming lesson.

When any Tory talks about Labour MPs and how dim they are and how repellent...Well, at least Labour haven't got this idiot.

I’m a British MP, and I’d Vote For Trump In a Heartbeat If I Could

http://heatst.com/world/im-a-british-mp ... sm_tw_post

No prizes for guessing who.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:32 pm

Hilary? Bloody L.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:32 pm

HindleA wrote:Picture of 720 tea bags lined up in orderly fashion.

They did not die in vein.

Don't feel sorry for them. Three big boxes of 240 each, wobbling on a high shelf, the little blighters have nearly brained me the number of times they've fallen on my bonce.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:37 pm

Oh dear...

Theresa May's big thinker - an interview with George Freeman

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk ... ge-freeman

May has endured her heaviest dissent over education, and Freeman was notably lukewarm about the idea of new grammar schools. “As well as her position” on the latter, he emphasised, “the Prime Minister set out a much broader vision”. Asked whether he understood MPs’ objections to academic selection, he said “there will be all the usual consultation and discussions through parliament about specific measures”.

That's not really on-message now is it?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:42 pm

Wonder why usually multiples of eighty.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:44 pm

Good question HA. I buy the big boxes when they are on offer, and in case we get snowed in.
That's one of the effects of anxiety, always worrying about a tea shortage or massive price hike

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:45 pm

HindleA wrote:Wonder why usually multiples of eighty.

720 is a multiple of 80.

Edit: As is 240!

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:47 pm

Wonder if anybody ever counts them to check(apart from me)

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:56 pm

Dear (insert tea company)

I have used your firm for some years as I thought your product was of good quality and firm to be trusted.Imagine my horror on discovering only 719 tea bags were contained in a product that clearly stated there was 720.This is a heinous betrayal of trust and I am seriously considering never buying from you again,telling my friends,writing to the press and perhaps appearing on television.Perhaps some recompense may dissuade me,something like free tea for the rest of my life.Look forward to your reply.

Yours

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:56 pm

HindleA wrote:Wonder if anybody ever counts them to check(apart from me)

I do. I'd rather count tea bags than do housework.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 1:58 pm

I don't go as far as to weigh them individually.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 2:00 pm

Counting tea bags is housework

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 2:05 pm

HindleA wrote: Counting tea bags is housework

Thirsty work too I would imagine.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 2:06 pm

HindleA wrote:Picture of 720 tea bags lined up in orderly fashion.

They did not die in vein.

I know some people drink so much tea they're almost injecting it into their bloodstream, but still

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 2:11 pm

https://mainlymacro.blogspot.co.uk/2016 ... l?spref=tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Immigration and the experts
(Mainly macro)

Some politicians and large sections of the print media deliberately fuel popular misconceptions because they can use it to their advantage. Others feel they have to go with those misperceptions because otherwise they will lose votes. Much of the broadcast media see it as their duty to ‘reflect popular concern’ but feel less compelled to reflect expert opinion. But if you think this is inevitable and natural, imagine what would happen if a senior politician started blaming immigrants for bringing in diseases. Well you don’t have to imagine.

Watching certain Labour politicians trying to get on to the anti-immigration bandwagon is painful to see. Some are the same politicians who also argued that Labour had to accept austerity after the 2015 General Election. Now immigration is much more complex than austerity, as I discuss here, but that is all the more reason to respect the evidence. (Those who still wonder why Jeremy Corbyn is so popular among party members should note he is sticking with his principles on both austerity and immigration.) But I think it is wrong to just blame politicians. Responsibility must also rest with most of the media, who (as we saw in the Brexit campaign) treat economic evidence very differently from medical evidence.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 2:17 pm

http://www.rcgp.org.uk/news/2016/septem ... ssion.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

RCGP urges Jeremy Hunt to accept invitation to BMA quality of care discussion

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 2:23 pm

Age UK campaign against the abolition of Attendance Allowance

https://campaigns.ageuk.org.uk/ea-actio ... d=Facebook" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 2:32 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2016/ ... plnews_d-2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Closure of help-to-buy scheme confirmed by Philip Hammond
Chancellor says aims of mortgage guarantee scheme, to shut by end of 2016, have been ‘successfully achieved’

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 3:37 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2016/ ... lip-davies" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tory MP’s complaint about Russell Howard jibes rejected by BBC Trust

Guess which MP part two.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 3:40 pm

To be fair he probably couldn't spell hippokracy never mind know what it meant.

JonnyT1234 · Post by **JonnyT1234** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 4:12 pm

White elephant has landed at Hinkley. Big crater in country's finances now forming. Financially illiterate morons still running country.

JonnyT1234 · Post by **JonnyT1234** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 4:13 pm

HindleA wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/media/2016/ ... lip-davies

Tory MP’s complaint about Russell Howard jibes rejected by BBC Trust

Guess which MP part two.

This is actually much harder than you are making it out to be. It could be so many of them.

JonnyT1234 · Post by **JonnyT1234** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 4:16 pm

citizenJA wrote:
HindleA wrote:Wonder if anybody ever counts them to check(apart from me)
I do. I'd rather count tea bags than do housework.

I see no point. I'd lose track because I'd keep making cups of tea to concentrate on the task at hand.

ScarletGas · Post by **ScarletGas** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 4:43 pm

HindleA wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/media/2016/ ... lip-davies

Tory MP’s complaint about Russell Howard jibes rejected by BBC Trust

Guess which MP part two.

I am wondering how any sane and rational person could not view Phillip Davies as a windbag and a hypocrite. Probably got lessons in both from his female doppelganger (who he shared a flat with whilst she was an MP I understand) Esther McVile

For once its good to see the BBC reject a complaint from someone other than me!!

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 4:53 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-engla ... 1c54fed723" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

South Yorkshire PCC calls for the removal of the Chief Constable

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 4:53 pm

yahyah wrote:Good question HA. I buy the big boxes when they are on offer, and in case we get snowed in.
That's one of the effects of anxiety, always worrying about a tea shortage or massive price hike

I've just opened my last box of 260 teabags and panic has already set in . . .

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 29 Sep, 2016 4:53 pm

Good morfternoon.