Wednesday 7th December 2016

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 8:57 pm

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
Tubby Isaacs wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:The Groan Editorial I'm glad at least someone agrees with me
I suppose they could in the New Year say "this plan isn't good enough, we're not going to let you invoke Article 50 in March now".

But that's going to look more obstructive than voting against this now, surely?
For me, as I've said many times, being seen to obstruct the referendum result is massively problematic.

For me, the best tactic is to put May under pressure, under scrutiny, asked hard questions, so that people can start to see for themselves that Brexit isn't going to be what they hoped.

Wait for the mood to change sufficiently that "obstructing" Brexit seems legitimate.

Exactly right.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:00 pm

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Also IMHO it's important not to overstate the "trigger" - it probably has to happen and certainly doesn't mean we will leave.

The trigger is the only leverage Labour have. Agreeing it has to be triggered is not the same as agreeing for May to trigger it on her terms to her timetable. I just don't understand why Labour would throw away the only bargaining chip they had - timing.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:10 pm

Willow904 wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Also IMHO it's important not to overstate the "trigger" - it probably has to happen and certainly doesn't mean we will leave.
The trigger is the only leverage Labour have. Agreeing it has to be triggered is not the same as agreeing for May to trigger it on her terms to her timetable. I just don't understand why Labour would throw away the only bargaining chip they had - timing.

I just don't think anyone will be able to stop Brexit through that kind of process.

People have to have time to change their minds and the opportunity to say they were wrong without losing face. That will take time, patience and a great deal of skill from the likes of Starmer.

I really believe this. You know I desperately want the UK to stay in the EU both from a personal and professional perspective.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:15 pm

Hadn't seen this from last week by Paul Krugman.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/02/opini ... trump.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Poor whites have benefited from Obamacare. They voted for Trump in huge numbers who will likely scrap it. It's possible these Obamacare receiving poor whites swung the election to Trump.

Health insurance is a very practical benefit, not something abstract and wonkish. Yet lots of people voted do themselves out of it.

That's stupidity and ignorance. The only way you can get away with this stuff is if you hide behind racism. Just as in the Deep South for 50 years, that's what the Lakes/Rust Belt has chosen to vote for.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:18 pm

2% Of Ukip Supporters Voted To Remain In The EU

http://www.lbc.co.uk/politics/parties/u ... in-the-eu/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:18 pm

Willow904 wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Also IMHO it's important not to overstate the "trigger" - it probably has to happen and certainly doesn't mean we will leave.
The trigger is the only leverage Labour have. Agreeing it has to be triggered is not the same as agreeing for May to trigger it on her terms to her timetable. I just don't understand why Labour would throw away the only bargaining chip they had - timing.

Have we even had a decent justification of March? It's all got lost behind whether the PM or Parliament decides the timing. For Parliament to vote for March without a case being made for the timing sounds like huge waste of time, except in terms of setting a legal precedent. And we've more to worry about than that.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:23 pm

Paul Krugman ‏@paulkrugman 4h4 hours ago
Uninsurance rate among whites goes from 7 to 18

Tell me Trump voters knew what they were doing?

Study here.

http://www.urban.org/research/publicati ... nciliation" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:27 pm

Similarly, the minimum wage is a very practical thing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_w ... ted_States" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Check out the Republican Governors keeping it down to the federal minimum. And check out the Republican Congress stopping the President from raising it.

And then remember that poor white people vote Republican.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:29 pm

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
Willow904 wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Also IMHO it's important not to overstate the "trigger" - it probably has to happen and certainly doesn't mean we will leave.
The trigger is the only leverage Labour have. Agreeing it has to be triggered is not the same as agreeing for May to trigger it on her terms to her timetable. I just don't understand why Labour would throw away the only bargaining chip they had - timing.
I just don't think anyone will be able to stop Brexit through that kind of process.

People have to have time to change their minds and the opportunity to say they were wrong without losing face. That will take time, patience and a great deal of skill from the likes of Starmer.

I really believe this. You know I desperately want the UK to stay in the EU both from a personal and professional perspective.

Exactly.

Think of the public opinion of austerity now, versus a few years ago.

When the facts change... etc.

Or even, when the public perception of the facts having changed...

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:31 pm

Paul KrugmanVerified account
‏@paulkrugman
So what can be done? Not easy to say. What do you do if trying to help families, but refusing to ignore reality, is seen as elitist?

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:42 pm

StephenDolan wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
Willow904 wrote: The trigger is the only leverage Labour have. Agreeing it has to be triggered is not the same as agreeing for May to trigger it on her terms to her timetable. I just don't understand why Labour would throw away the only bargaining chip they had - timing.
I just don't think anyone will be able to stop Brexit through that kind of process.

People have to have time to change their minds and the opportunity to say they were wrong without losing face. That will take time, patience and a great deal of skill from the likes of Starmer.

I really believe this. You know I desperately want the UK to stay in the EU both from a personal and professional perspective.
Exactly.

Think of the public opinion of austerity now, versus a few years ago.

When the facts change... etc.

Or even, when the public perception of the facts having changed...

There's already majority support for remaining in the single market as opposed to hard Brexit. What more are Labour waiting for in order to do their job and oppose a Tory hard Brexit? But that's not my point. My point is there is a court case going on to clarify whether May or parliament gets to decide to trigger article 50 which is now moot because parliament has just voted to give May the autonomy to trigger article 50 anyway, with no caveats, to her own timetable. It may not be binding, but Labour have prematurely boxed themselves in with this and have once again joined the Tories leaving the SNP and others to actually oppose.

Eric_WLothian · Post by **Eric_WLothian** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:47 pm

StephenDolan wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
Willow904 wrote: The trigger is the only leverage Labour have. Agreeing it has to be triggered is not the same as agreeing for May to trigger it on her terms to her timetable. I just don't understand why Labour would throw away the only bargaining chip they had - timing.
I just don't think anyone will be able to stop Brexit through that kind of process.

People have to have time to change their minds and the opportunity to say they were wrong without losing face. That will take time, patience and a great deal of skill from the likes of Starmer.

I really believe this. You know I desperately want the UK to stay in the EU both from a personal and professional perspective.
Exactly.

Think of the public opinion of austerity now, versus a few years ago.

When the facts change... etc.

Or even, when the public perception of the facts having changed...

The problem is that there are no facts about Brexit - only opinions and wishful thinking. May can publish any plan she wants but will most likely (imo) have to come back and say sorry it's been derailed. To have any meaning, Parliament need to vote on whether to accept any negotiated deal or stay in. Until the 27 EU members have had their say, UK plans mean nothing.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:48 pm

Good post, Willow.

I don't know what's going to turn up before March to make the political calculation that different. I think longer term, the weaker pound could really make itself felt. People in Brexit South Wales drive large distances to work, and I'm guessing that other declining industrial areas are much the same. That could be some expensive petrol, though of course the government could cut duty.

But we'll be on our way out then, with a head of steam behind Hard Brexit.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:49 pm

Eric_WLothian wrote:
The problem is that there are no facts about Brexit - only opinions and wishful thinking. May can publish any plan she wants but will most likely (imo) have to come back and say sorry it's been derailed. To have any meaning, Parliament need to vote on whether to accept any negotiated deal or stay in. Until the 27 EU members have had their say, UK plans mean nothing.

Exactly. "Cake and eat it, we're you're biggest customer" can be dressed up as a plan. And indeed presented as all the better for being ambitious.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:50 pm

Willow904 wrote:There's already majority support for remaining in the single market as opposed to hard Brexit. What more are Labour waiting for in order to do their job and oppose a Tory hard Brexit? But that's not my point. My point is there is a court case going on to clarify whether May or parliament gets to decide to trigger article 50 which is now moot because parliament has just voted to give May the autonomy to trigger article 50 anyway, with no caveats, to her own timetable. It may not be binding, but Labour have prematurely boxed themselves in with this and have once again joined the Tories leaving the SNP and others to actually oppose.

I'm not sure that's true since the key is that May has to come back with a Brexit plan in January.

Given that we're some months since the beginning of the May government and we don't seem any nearer to understanding what the government actually wants - apart from a red, White and Blue Brexit whatever the hell that's supposed to mean - how likely is it that they will have a fully-formed detailed plan by next month?

Answer (IMO) - not likely at all.

So...January comes. Some sort of plan gets put out.

"If that's your best plan, then we're not going to vote for triggering Art 50 because of reasons a,b,c,d etc etc"

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:51 pm

Willow904 wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote: I just don't think anyone will be able to stop Brexit through that kind of process.

People have to have time to change their minds and the opportunity to say they were wrong without losing face. That will take time, patience and a great deal of skill from the likes of Starmer.

I really believe this. You know I desperately want the UK to stay in the EU both from a personal and professional perspective.
Exactly.

Think of the public opinion of austerity now, versus a few years ago.

When the facts change... etc.

Or even, when the public perception of the facts having changed...
There's already majority support for remaining in the single market as opposed to hard Brexit. What more are Labour waiting for in order to do their job and oppose a Tory hard Brexit? But that's not my point. My point is there is a court case going on to clarify whether May or parliament gets to decide to trigger article 50 which is now moot because parliament has just voted to give May the autonomy to trigger article 50 anyway, with no caveats, to her own timetable. It may not be binding, but Labour have prematurely boxed themselves in with this and have once again joined the Tories leaving the SNP and others to actually oppose.

I'm no legal expert but this was an opposition motion so doesn't change the status of the court case at all I suspect.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:52 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:
Willow904 wrote:There's already majority support for remaining in the single market as opposed to hard Brexit. What more are Labour waiting for in order to do their job and oppose a Tory hard Brexit? But that's not my point. My point is there is a court case going on to clarify whether May or parliament gets to decide to trigger article 50 which is now moot because parliament has just voted to give May the autonomy to trigger article 50 anyway, with no caveats, to her own timetable. It may not be binding, but Labour have prematurely boxed themselves in with this and have once again joined the Tories leaving the SNP and others to actually oppose.
I'm not sure that's true since the key is that May has to come back with a Brexit plan in January.

Given that we're some months since the beginning of the May government and we don't seem any nearer to understanding what the government actually wants - apart from a red, White and Blue Brexit whatever the hell that's supposed to mean - how likely is it that they will have a fully-formed detailed plan by next month?

Answer (IMO) - not likely at all.

So...January comes. Some sort of plan gets put out.

"If that's your best plan, then we're not going to vote for triggering Art 50 because of reasons a,b,c,d etc etc"

Yes Roger. The onus is now on May. That's what cheers me up a bit

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:56 pm

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Yes Roger. The onus is now on May. That's what cheers me up a bit

Recalling that May has, to help come up with her plan, Boris, Fox and Davis is indeed quite amusing really...

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:56 pm

So...January comes. Some sort of plan gets put out.

"If that's your best plan, then we're not going to vote for triggering Art 50 because of reasons a,b,c,d etc etc"

To which the answer is "where's your plan? and why aren't you as ambitious for Britain as we are?" May wil easily run the clock down for the month before she triggers Article 50. The SNP, Lib Dems and Plaid say "see, we were right all along".

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:58 pm

Goodnight, everyone.
love,
cJA

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 9:59 pm

Even John Rentoul is saying Starmer is making the right calls!

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/kie ... 61161.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

kier-starmer-brexit-article-50-debate-labour-still-effective-opposition

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:00 pm

In fact, May's already wasted two months from announcing the March date. She can waste another month with a plan, easy.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:05 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:
Willow904 wrote:There's already majority support for remaining in the single market as opposed to hard Brexit. What more are Labour waiting for in order to do their job and oppose a Tory hard Brexit? But that's not my point. My point is there is a court case going on to clarify whether May or parliament gets to decide to trigger article 50 which is now moot because parliament has just voted to give May the autonomy to trigger article 50 anyway, with no caveats, to her own timetable. It may not be binding, but Labour have prematurely boxed themselves in with this and have once again joined the Tories leaving the SNP and others to actually oppose.
I'm not sure that's true since the key is that May has to come back with a Brexit plan in January.

Given that we're some months since the beginning of the May government and we don't seem any nearer to understanding what the government actually wants - apart from a red, White and Blue Brexit whatever the hell that's supposed to mean - how likely is it that they will have a fully-formed detailed plan by next month?

Answer (IMO) - not likely at all.

So...January comes. Some sort of plan gets put out.

"If that's your best plan, then we're not going to vote for triggering Art 50 because of reasons a,b,c,d etc etc"

Asking for a plan is fine. Labour's original motion was fine, but May hijacked it with her timetable demands and Labour voted for what she wanted and now all May has to do is wait until March as she always planned and dare Labour to go back on their word. There are no caveats useful to Labour in the motion that was passed as far as I can see, just lots of wriggle room for May to claim she can't reveal this, that or the other as it would weaken her hand with EU negotiators, exactly as she has said all along. I posted the motion above and I still struggle to see what Labour have gained in return for the only bit of leverage they had.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:06 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:Have we had this one?

Tory MPs suggest firms draw up list for bonfire of EU laws after Brexit
Michael Gove and John Whittingdale tell CBI companies should outline regulations they want scrapped when Britain exits bloc

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ter-brexit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Will it be as good as the bonfire of the quangos. Or whatever the hell it was?

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:12 pm

OK, let's wait and see what happens. I personally don't think they had a choice about going with the March deadline at the moment since they'd get absolutely slaughtered by the pro-Brexit press if they'd voted against.

Meanwhile...

Daventry UTC announces it is to close next year

http://feweek.co.uk/2016/12/07/daventry ... -next-year

Low student numbers will lead to closure at yet another University Technical College.

The trustees of UTC for New Technologies at Daventry (known as Daventry UTC), today announced that it will close on 31 August 2017, making it the sixth UTC out of 48 to shut.

Figures obtained by FE Week through Freedom of Information requests made earlier this year show that Daventry was running at 25 per cent capacity last year.

It had just 151 students enrolled in 2015/16, down from 169 in 2014/15 — despite a capacity of 600.

And as reported by FE Week in May, Daventry was the first standalone UTC to be hit with an Education Funding Agency financial improvement notice.

That really is shocking. How much money has been wasted on this ill-thought out policy?

Sure, we need technical and vocational at some point but trying to fit a 14-18 agenda into a 11-18 system was risky from the start.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:13 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:Going to be lots of headlines about Theresa May being skilful and Prime Ministerial.

I suppose you've got to hand it to someone who pulls a policy out of her arse on the Andrew Marr show, loses a court case, and still gets to do what she wants.

It's about not giving a shit. This is why the left cannot win. Interest in fact and fairness leads to prevarication, logic etc. We don't have time for all that these days. There's tattoos to have designed and shows inspired by that Japanese reality show from decades ago to watch.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:31 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:OK, let's wait and see what happens. I personally don't think they had a choice about going with the March deadline at the moment since they'd get absolutely slaughtered by the pro-Brexit press if they'd voted against.

Meanwhile...

Daventry UTC announces it is to close next year

http://feweek.co.uk/2016/12/07/daventry ... -next-year

Low student numbers will lead to closure at yet another University Technical College.

The trustees of UTC for New Technologies at Daventry (known as Daventry UTC), today announced that it will close on 31 August 2017, making it the sixth UTC out of 48 to shut.

Figures obtained by FE Week through Freedom of Information requests made earlier this year show that Daventry was running at 25 per cent capacity last year.

It had just 151 students enrolled in 2015/16, down from 169 in 2014/15 — despite a capacity of 600.

And as reported by FE Week in May, Daventry was the first standalone UTC to be hit with an Education Funding Agency financial improvement notice.
That really is shocking. How much money has been wasted on this ill-thought out policy?

Sure, we need technical and vocational at some point but trying to fit a 14-18 agenda into a 11-18 system was risky from the start.

Yeah, why would you leave the school you were at to do vocational stuff at 14? It's not like 16 is too late to do vocational stuff.

Sadly, some in Labour wanted these too. Or Andrew Adonis did anyway.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:35 pm

THE HISTORY OF FTN continued

Day 3. What a palaver (potato crisps)

Or was that just South Manchester?

Any road, Wednesday 27 August 2014 began with one Mr Hindle (A) simultaneously banging his head against a brick wall while going into battle Bodicea-stylee; a rare display of emoticon usage from the Hindle.

Quote of the day probably goes to Spaceone who followed quickly with his/her description of Farage “in his best 'ordering from a busy golf club bar' voice.” RR2 had a crack at joke about UKIP and insomnia, which brings to mind my advice to the other half about the wisdom of attempting comedy (sorry RR2 I miss you even now – comedy or no).

In a rare display of logorrhea RefitBourne gave us the line:
“Ian Birrell is an arse. That is all.”

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:36 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:Have we had this one?

Tory MPs suggest firms draw up list for bonfire of EU laws after Brexit
Michael Gove and John Whittingdale tell CBI companies should outline regulations they want scrapped when Britain exits bloc

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ter-brexit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Will it be as good as the bonfire of the quangos. Or whatever the hell it was?

Worse....

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:40 pm

THOFTN,TNBBTC (The history of FTN, the new blockbuster by Tiny Clanger)

Moreover PorFavor not only reported a problem with squirrels, but created a post which exists ENTIRELY WITHOUT EDITING. You can see it here: http://www.flythenest.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=10#p240" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **adam** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:48 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:THOFTN,TNBBTC (The history of FTN, the new blockbuster by Tiny Clanger)

Moreover PorFavor not only reported a problem with squirrels, but created a post which exists ENTIRELY WITHOUT EDITING. You can see it here: http://www.flythenest.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=10#p240" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Are the film rights up for grabs? I have some ideas for an adaptation.

[youtube]kHHitXxH-us[/youtube]

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:53 pm

Oh those halcyon days:

TechnicalEphemera on Wed 27 Aug 2014 wrote:If anybody other than windbag Salmond can explain why the yes campaign has momentum I am all ears.

To me it looks like it has a chasm of credibility to cross, I expect a shy union vote, given the huge uncertainties around the absolute basics of currency, jobs and EU membership.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 10:56 pm

adam wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:THOFTN,TNBBTC (The history of FTN, the new blockbuster by Tiny Clanger)

Moreover PorFavor not only reported a problem with squirrels, but created a post which exists ENTIRELY WITHOUT EDITING. You can see it here: http://www.flythenest.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=10#p240" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Are the film rights up for grabs? I have some ideas for an adaptation.

Please contact my agent at:
TinyClanger'sagent@ excellentthreads.co.ftn

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 11:01 pm

etc.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 11:13 pm

HindleA wrote: etc.

Question time line up ? by any chance?

Richard Burgon MPVerified account
‏@RichardBurgon
Tomorrow (Thursday) I'll be on @bbcquestiontime - I'll try to do East #Leeds and @UKLabour proud!

Look who's on with him.....

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 11:29 pm

THOFTN

Still on day 3 – and I realise I’m going to have to move quicker than a day a day or, er …
TemulkartheCalm noted (and I paraphrase rather than actually lie) that of all the places he has ever lived or visited, only the English are racist. TechnicalEphemera disagreed, as would I have done had I located the site yet by this point (but don’t worry about me I was fine, sniff), while RoT showed off about football.
FACT 1: TechnicalEphemera could be a right pain in the arse. It was great.
FACT 2: I once met Ian Dury (see RR2 on South Thanet and the man himself http://www.flythenest.org/viewtopic.php ... t=100#p363" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;).

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 11:43 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:THOFTN

Still on day 3 – and I realise I’m going to have to move quicker than a day a day or, er …
TemulkartheCalm noted (and I paraphrase rather than actually lie) that of all the places he has ever lived or visited, only the English are racist. TechnicalEphemera disagreed, as would I have done had I located the site yet by this point (but don’t worry about me I was fine, sniff), while RoT showed off about football.
FACT 1: TechnicalEphemera could be a right pain in the arse. It was great.
FACT 2: I once met Ian Dury (see RR2 on South Thanet and the man himself http://www.flythenest.org/viewtopic.php ... t=100#p363" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;).

That's a lie - it couldn't possibly happen while I support Leyton Orient - nothing to show off about!

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 11:49 pm

Ern Malley ‏@GeoffShadbold 2h2 hours ago
Louise Mensch is arguing on legal stuff with @profchalmers.
Imagine how that will work out. Like a hedgehog arguing with Larkin's lawnmower

(not checked it yet, just off to have a gander)

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 11:51 pm

Exhibit A:

http://www.flythenest.org/viewtopic.php ... t=100#p342" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
RoT showing off. About football.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Wed 07 Dec, 2016 11:56 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... tch-report" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Leyton Orient’s Romain Vincelot earns late victory at Aston Villa

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:02 am

AAW replaying headbanging as per Aug.2014.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:02 am

tinyclanger2 wrote:Exhibit A:

http://www.flythenest.org/viewtopic.php ... t=100#p342" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
RoT showing off. About football.

Pah! That was over two years ago - we got relegated and lost about gazillion* managers since then!

* This is not an exaggeration - we've actually lost count now.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:12 am

You are only a few places behind Red Star Hartlepool.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:16 am

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2 ... e-hereford" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

School library book returned more than 120 years late – with no fine

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:17 am

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... uiry-finds" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Hundreds of police officers accused of sex abuse, inquiry finds

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:42 am

tinyclanger2 wrote:THOFTN

Still on day 3 – and I realise I’m going to have to move quicker than a day a day or, er …
TemulkartheCalm noted (and I paraphrase rather than actually lie) that of all the places he has ever lived or visited, only the English are racist. TechnicalEphemera disagreed, as would I have done had I located the site yet by this point (but don’t worry about me I was fine, sniff), while RoT showed off about football.
FACT 1: TechnicalEphemera could be a right pain in the arse. It was great.
FACT 2: I once met Ian Dury (see RR2 on South Thanet and the man himself http://www.flythenest.org/viewtopic.php ... t=100#p363" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;).

I believe I said only in England have I encountered abuse because of my nationality.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:43 am

Thousands of snow geese die in Montana after landing on contaminated water
Huge flock of migratory birds landed on acidic waters of an open pit mine where employees attempted to scare them off

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... ign=buffer" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The abuse of our planet goes on.... sigh

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:47 am

Particular place,incident? Out of interest.I was warned of anti-English sentiment as a child(Dad Scottish,but English accent)and didn't get any at all,more interest due to abroad (when it wasn't that common)experiences.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:50 am

The time of "It's Scotland's Oil",An SNP MP etc.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 08 Dec, 2016 12:56 am

Then again my brother's description of me is toad,a motif that still survives today in addressed letters to MR.Toad,etc,and numerous presents to that effect.An apt descrption I am sure you agree.