Thursday 12th January 2017

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 5:47 am

Morning.

I found this interesting :-

Debate: should we be fighting for a universal basic income in Australia?
Is a universal basic income a solution to Australia’s growing inequality problem, or is it a utopian distraction that ignores suffering today?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 6:06 am

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liv ... e-12440481" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

New homes for rough sleepers pledge from Metro Mayor candidate

Used to work in the Crypt Night Shelter under the Metropolitan Cathedral and at a hostel for the homeless there.

Forthcoming book "Tales from the Crypt"

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 6:53 am

Morning all.

Twenty black alerts. Is May about to find out that a week is a long time in politics?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 7:02 am

@SD
I didn't see it but apparently there was more or less an advert for Babylon on Newsnight last night

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 7:03 am

HindleA wrote:@SD
I didn't see it but apparently there was more or less an advert for Babylon on Newsnight last night

Damn, missed it, thanks for the info. Might try catch up.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 8:15 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-38571240" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tidal lagoon: £1.3bn Swansea Bay project to be backed

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 8:24 am

Labour's problem

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/11/opin ... p=cur&_r=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(and no, it is not the obvious one)

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 8:27 am

This on Trump scandal best I've read

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/01/ca ... influence/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 9:03 am

StephenDolan wrote:
HindleA wrote:@SD
I didn't see it but apparently there was more or less an advert for Babylon on Newsnight last night
Damn, missed it, thanks for the info. Might try catch up.

Watched earlier, was pretty blatant.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 9:13 am

HindleA wrote:@SD
I didn't see it but apparently there was more or less an advert for Babylon on Newsnight last night

If you mean the weird guy who talked too fast, told an implausibly convenient anecdote about his child who had been poorly at the weekend and insisted the reason A&Es were overwhelmed was because people didn't have apps to book out of hours doctor's appointments (because dialling 111 is too complicated, presumably) then I wouldn't exactly call it an advert. More "WTF was that?!"

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 9:26 am

I should add that I couldn't take much of the guy and turned off at that point. I assume he was allowed to get a proper plug in later on, but I didn't make it that far.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 9:28 am

Morning all.

Dan Poulter on Newsnight talking about the need for more investment in the NHS.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There are some in complete denial about this but they're the usual "Tories can do no wrong" shouty right winger types anyway.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 9:34 am

Yep.

Dr Phil Hammond ‏@drphilhammond 18m18 minutes ago

I'm in favour of more funding for the NHS, but it must be spent on frontline care that's proven to work, not reckless reform & marketization

When you hear some saying that the NHS needs complete reform you kinda wonder whether they've forgotten what happened in the last 6 years...

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 9:47 am

https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/s ... e-summary/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Combined Performance Summary

NHS England.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 10:00 am

Oh, this is sad news...

Martin Kettle Verified account
‏@martinkettle

Death this morning of Anthony King, Essex professor, BBC psephologist, prolific writer, husband of Jan, most generous of friends. #tonyking

82 by the look of it so not a bad innings.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 10:06 am

Willow904 wrote:
HindleA wrote:@SD
I didn't see it but apparently there was more or less an advert for Babylon on Newsnight last night
If you mean the weird guy who talked too fast, told an implausibly convenient anecdote about his child who had been poorly at the weekend and insisted the reason A&Es were overwhelmed was because people didn't have apps to book out of hours doctor's appointments (because dialling 111 is too complicated, presumably) then I wouldn't exactly call it an advert. More "WTF was that?!"

When he gives that anecdote involving his own company's app, quotes the subscription fee then I'd consider it advertising.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 10:12 am

In Nov, 88.4% of patients were admitted/transferred/discharged from A&E within 4hrs of arrival, 95% target last hit in July 2015

At end of Nov, 90.5% of patients on waiting list waiting less than 18 weeks, missing 92% target for the 9th month in a row

6,825 patients delayed at 12am on last Thurs of Nov - highest since data collection began in Aug 10, 8th month record in a row broken

There were 193,680 delayed days in Nov 16, compared to 153,155 in Nov 15, an increase of more than a quarter (26.4%) in a year

Thanks to Claire Miller on twitter,who has more.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 10:16 am

End of November reiteration.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 10:35 am

HindleA wrote:@SD
I didn't see it but apparently there was more or less an advert for Babylon on Newsnight last night

Presumably it was the BBC's attempt at balance, they might think they're on a sticky wicket at the moment because of the perfect timing of the Hospital programme.

He was so far from being relevant to the issue Newsnight just looked ridiculous.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 10:47 am

Bad innings. Sticky wicket. Not a good day for cricket references

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 10:49 am

StephenDolan wrote:Bad innings. Sticky wicket. Not a good day for cricket references

Can't tell until both sides have batted.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 10:49 am

gilsey wrote:
HindleA wrote:@SD
I didn't see it but apparently there was more or less an advert for Babylon on Newsnight last night
Presumably it was the BBC's attempt at balance, they might think they're on a sticky wicket at the moment because of the perfect timing of the Hospital programme.

He was so far from being relevant to the issue Newsnight just looked ridiculous.

When the BBC discuss weather induced travel disruption or a natural disaster, how come they don't feature commentators with opposing viewpoints? You know, for balance.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 10:57 am

StephenDolan wrote:
Willow904 wrote:
HindleA wrote:@SD
I didn't see it but apparently there was more or less an advert for Babylon on Newsnight last night
If you mean the weird guy who talked too fast, told an implausibly convenient anecdote about his child who had been poorly at the weekend and insisted the reason A&Es were overwhelmed was because people didn't have apps to book out of hours doctor's appointments (because dialling 111 is too complicated, presumably) then I wouldn't exactly call it an advert. More "WTF was that?!"
When he gives that anecdote involving his own company's app, quotes the subscription fee then I'd consider it advertising.

So the garbled rubbish about the app was the plug? I missed him quoting the subscription fee, too busy wondering who the nutter was! It did really stand out as wildly irrelevant as NHS England is citing high levels of genuine demand as the reason behind the crisis, not people who could see a GP turning up at A&E.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 11:01 am

More or less equal? Yesterday’s publication of the latest set of statistics on income inequality by the Office of National Statistics was hailed by many as showing that inequality was continuing to diminish (albeit slowly) as top incomes shrank while lower incomes grew.
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

for the purposes of illustrating the point, imagine that existing households saw no change in their income between 2014/15 and 2015/16 and that all of the new households had incomes falling within the income range of the second quintile of households in 2014/15. All quintiles must expand by the same amount as they are simply equal fifths of whatever the household population happens to be. When the 2015/16 household population is divided up into quintiles, each of which must contain 90,000 more households than in 2014/15, the income of the bottom quintile would increase because the 90,000 lowest earners in the previous second quintile would be displaced into the bottom quintile, increasing the average income there. At the other end of the scale, 90,000 more households must be allocated to the top quintile but as all of the new households have nowhere near that income, the top quintile can only increase in size by expanding to include households previously in the 4th quintile, thus reducing average top quintile income.

Lies, damned lies and statistics.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 11:01 am

Stephen Dorrell enters the fray. Theres a lot of people partial to this playing politics lark I see.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 11:04 am

Willow904 wrote: not people who could see a GP turning up at A&E.

That was *unt's line, wasn't it. He looked like an idiot too, making that argument.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 11:05 am

RogerOThornhill wrote:Oh, this is sad news...

Martin Kettle Verified account
‏@martinkettle

Death this morning of Anthony King, Essex professor, BBC psephologist, prolific writer, husband of Jan, most generous of friends. #tonyking
82 by the look of it so not a bad innings.

Still remember him on the Beeb's results programme in 1997 - he was on top form

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 11:05 am

Willow904 wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:
Willow904 wrote: If you mean the weird guy who talked too fast, told an implausibly convenient anecdote about his child who had been poorly at the weekend and insisted the reason A&Es were overwhelmed was because people didn't have apps to book out of hours doctor's appointments (because dialling 111 is too complicated, presumably) then I wouldn't exactly call it an advert. More "WTF was that?!"
When he gives that anecdote involving his own company's app, quotes the subscription fee then I'd consider it advertising.
So the garbled rubbish about the app was the plug? I missed him quoting the subscription fee, too busy wondering who the nutter was! It did really stand out as wildly irrelevant as NHS England is citing high levels of genuine demand as the reason behind the crisis, not people who could see a GP turning up at A&E.

I was told they're making a big play for a slice of 111 and gp money.

WelshIan · Post by **WelshIan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 11:21 am

HindleA wrote:Morning.

I found this interesting :-

Debate: should we be fighting for a universal basic income in Australia?
Is a universal basic income a solution to Australia’s growing inequality problem, or is it a utopian distraction that ignores suffering today?

Link to article:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -australia" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Finland are starting a 2 year pilot scheme on UBI:
http://theconversation.com/how-finland- ... ment-70955" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There is also a small scale pilot from a private company in the USA, and this article provides some further thoughts from a US perspective:
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/18/elon-mus ... -work.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
(Apologies for the site, it is very busy with lots of adverts/pictures)

The Green Party have a policy to cap rents which would go some way towards allaying Hugo’s concerns yesterday.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 11:28 am

Good morfternoon.

I'm completely at sea re the "Babylon" conversation. What's it all about, please?

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 11:32 am

PorFavor wrote:Good morfternoon.

I'm completely at sea re the "Babylon" conversation. What's it all about, please?

Me too

But stop me before I babble on.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 11:48 am

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babylon_Health" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Babylon Health

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 12:05 pm

Stephen asked about them a couple of days ago.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 12:07 pm

Tom Newton Dunn (@tnewtondunn)

Theresa May to reveal her plan for Brexit next week - speech probably on Tuesday, as well as Supreme Court verdicthttps://t.co/F4AUjn9ARU" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
January 12, 2017

(Politics Live, Guardian)

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 12:13 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... is-johnson" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

UK, Greece and Turkey join Cyprus peace talks in Geneva

I lived in JFK Avenue

https://www.thevintagenews.com/2016/05/ ... rt-cyprus/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 12:31 pm

HindleA wrote:Stephen asked about them a couple of days ago.

Indeed I did and thanks.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 12:38 pm

Good-afternoon, everyone.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:04 pm

MSM doing a better job of highlighting the NHS problems than Labour at the moment

Sky Views: May weaponising NHS all by herself

http://news.sky.com/story/sky-views-may ... f-10725599" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:16 pm

http://touchstoneblog.org.uk/2017/01/we ... worse-off/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

We are more equal (because we are all worse off)

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:16 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:MSM doing a better job of highlighting the NHS problems than Labour at the moment

Erm, really?

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:21 pm

Did we mention Jez's spokesman telling Estonia to get lost if Russia attacks it? Far away country, innit.

The Tories aren't even bothering trying to get rid of him. What does that tell you?

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:28 pm

Milne is Milne.

That doesn't have to stop one feeling uneasy about the all too obvious enthusiasm of some for war with Russia.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:29 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:MSM doing a better job of highlighting the NHS problems than Labour at the moment
Erm, really?

Considering the NHS is Labours biggest "trust" factor in the public eye - yes. Corbyn did well yesterday, but they should be out shouting about NHS loudly and clearly everyday.
Or maybe I've missed it.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:30 pm

Mum who spent 12 hours in hospital corridor 'saw OAP waiting on trolley DIE in front of her'
"It was disgusting he should die on a trolley in the room in front of everyone - there is no dignity in that and for it to happen in front of everyone was just awful"

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mu ... rs-9608076" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:31 pm

Anna Soubry MPVerified account
‏@Anna_Soubry
It appears there will be no parliamentary debates on #SingleMarket #CustomsUnion #FreeMovement before A50 is triggered. This is unacceptable

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:32 pm

Labour are constantly campaigning on the NHS - indeed some Blairite types actually attack them for doing so ("comfort zone" blah blah)

And this is an area where on the ground activism can have as much impact as media appearances.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:32 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Milne is Milne.

That doesn't have to stop one feeling uneasy about the all too obvious enthusiasm of some for war with Russia.

Estonians are eager for war with Russia? Ukranians?

Jez wouldn't commit to honouring NATO treaties in the leadership debate.

I hope the Eastern Europeans tell him to stick his "alternative Brexit" summit.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:35 pm

RIP Graham Taylor.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:36 pm

Oh Christ.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 1:39 pm

Once memorably (if rather cruelly) described by Edward Pearce as "the pass back to the goalie in human form". By all accounts a decent bloke, though.