Friday 20th January 2017

[citizenJA]

The boss of Nissan Carlos Ghosn has admitted that the car giant's UK investments will be "re-evaluated" if Theresa May delivers a bad Brexit deal, despite last October's high-profile commitment by the firm to build its next Qashqai and X-Trail model at its Sunderland plant.

Indepindie

It'll become untenable, voting for Article 50

[adam]

The boss of Nissan Carlos Ghosn has admitted that the car giant's UK investments will be "re-evaluated" if Theresa May delivers a bad Brexit deal, despite last October's high-profile commitment by the firm to build its next Qashqai and X-Trail model at its Sunderland plant.

Indepindie

It'll become untenable, voting for Article 50

Do you think the conservative majority in parliament will care?

[AngryAsWell]

Indepindie

It'll become untenable, voting for Article 50

Do you think the conservative majority in parliament will care?

IF Labour got its act together with the LibDems, SNP, Green and the handful or more of tory remainers there would be no majority

[Tubby Isaacs]

The boss of Nissan Carlos Ghosn has admitted that the car giant's UK investments will be "re-evaluated" if Theresa May delivers a bad Brexit deal, despite last October's high-profile commitment by the firm to build its next Qashqai and X-Trail model at its Sunderland plant.

Indepindie

Has Jez appeared yet?

He'll be wanting to give them more subsidies.

[citizenJA]

Indepindie

It'll become untenable, voting for Article 50

Do you think the conservative majority in parliament will care?

(cJA bold)

Maybe. Taking the UK out of the single market isn't in the Tory manifesto. The Lords can defeat it.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Indepindie

It'll become untenable, voting for Article 50

Do you think the conservative majority in parliament will care?

Probably not, apart from Soubry, Clarke, maybe Morgan, Osborne, Grieve and Neil Carmichael. You have to add Kipper-Labour (Hoey etc) to those who'd vote for it. The Lexiters surely can't vote for Theresa May tax haven.

Make it a close run thing if you can't win. Make the public remember when it goes tits up that it was Tory Brexit.

[citizenJA]

Peter Hain has stated today he'll not vote for Article 50

[citizenJA]

It'll become untenable, voting for Article 50

Do you think the conservative majority in parliament will care?

Probably not, apart from Soubry, Clarke, maybe Morgan, Osborne, Grieve and Neil Carmichael. You have to add Kipper-Labour (Hoey etc) to those who'd vote for it. The Lexiters surely can't vote for Theresa May tax haven.

Make it a close run thing if you can't win. Make the public remember when it goes tits up that it was Tory Brexit.

(cJA bold)

Making voting for Article 50 less tenable. Break the impetus for it. Most MPs in the House aren't in favour of 'Brexit'.

[pk1]

Gulp

[Tubby Isaacs]

From my friend, a very high flying consultant.

NHS is as bad as in 1997.

[HindleA]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-s ... ppointment" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


UK Statistics Authority chair appointment

Sir David Norgrove has been confirmed as the government’s preferred candidate for Chair of the UK Statistics Authority.

[HindleA]

https://www.gov.uk/government/consultat ... hild-limit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Consultation outcome
Universal Credit and Child Tax Credit: exceptions to the 2-child limit

[HindleA]

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... n-act-2016" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Guidance
Political Funds: guidance on the provisions in the Trade Union Act 2016

[Tubby Isaacs]

https://www.gov.uk/government/consultat ... hild-limit


Consultation outcome
Universal Credit and Child Tax Credit: exceptions to the 2-child limit

Incredible this hasn't been dropped yet.

[HindleA]

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... siest-week" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Fifty-two NHS hospitals sent patients elsewhere in busiest week yet
Sixty-eight hospital trusts declared an alert between 8 and 15 January, and bed occupancy rate across England was 95.8%

[PaulfromYorkshire]

Brexit is now basically the Tory Government.

Yeah the problem here is there are too few Labour voters in total.

The opportunity is to bring some of those Tory remainers over along with some don't knows. I wonder how the don't knows split on Brexit.

Fingers firmly crossed :-s

[gilsey]

You surely can't deny though that if he had been elected leader, Labour wouldn't be in this dizzying mess they currently are ?!

I'm happy to deny it, I think Smith would have been way, way out of his depth.

And if Labour members had elected one of the others instead of Corbyn in the first place, Labour would be happy to support May in 'controlling immigration', ie no change from where we are now.

Labour have been screwed since 24 June no matter who the leader is.

The only way the dizzying mess could have been avoided was if Labour had won the GE2015.

[55DegreesNorth]

The boss of Nissan Carlos Ghosn has admitted that the car giant's UK investments will be "re-evaluated" if Theresa May delivers a bad Brexit deal, despite last October's high-profile commitment by the firm to build its next Qashqai and X-Trail model at its Sunderland plant.

Indepindie

My brother, who works on the lines at Nissan, says the factory gossip is that Nissan are quite happy to begin production of these models in Sunderland because they think petrol & diesel cars are living on borrowed time. They make most of the batteries in Europe (all Nissan, all Renault, and some others), so that's their future. They'll probably take a huge bribe to start Qashqai & X-Trail production in the UK, while not really caring whether they last for long.

[Willow904]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/g ... 4xmznqm2t9" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

George Osborne has landed a City job worth at least £200,000 a year, his office have confirmed.

The former Chancellor won’t be stepping down as an MP, despite his new role as an adviser to Blackrock Investments, the world’s biggest asset manager.

He's a complete shit.

[gilsey]

From my friend, a very high flying consultant.

NHS is as bad as in 1997.

I'd like to see it back in the headlines.

[gilsey]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/g ... 4xmznqm2t9

George Osborne has landed a City job worth at least £200,000 a year, his office have confirmed.

The former Chancellor won’t be stepping down as an MP, despite his new role as an adviser to Blackrock Investments, the world’s biggest asset manager.

He's a complete shit.

There's something we can all agree on.

And if the likes of Blackrock abandon the City of London before or after brexit, good riddance. How clever can they be, if they think paying that scum is value for money? Utterly corrupt.

[gilsey]

https://www.gov.uk/government/consultat ... hild-limit


Consultation outcome
Universal Credit and Child Tax Credit: exceptions to the 2-child limit

Incredible this hasn't been dropped yet.

Any policy that needs an exception for women who've been raped is a very very bad policy and it's beyond belief that they're going ahead with it.

Evidence from this
professional third party, demonstrating that the claimant’s circumstances are
consistent with those of a person who has had intercourse without consenting to it
(at a time when the conception of her third or subsequent child might have
resulted), will normally be used to determine eligibility for the exception.

Utterly disgusting.

[55DegreesNorth]

Oh, and Evening folks,
My MP was, and I presume still is, a Remain supporter. He's also the Labour chief whip, and at the moment, seems likely to be asked to whip MPs to support a decision almost none of them really agree with, along with 70%+ of the members. The ones who are going all Burnham are cacking themselves about what their constituents think about immigration, even though loads of polling shows that many Brexit voters have changed their mind (Sunderland, for example, is now 70% remain).
We have a PM going full tilt to promote a process she opposed, an opposition leader supporting a position at odds with his MPs and members, and virtual unanimity from economists and politicians that we are heading for catastrophe.
We are fucked.
I just listened to Trumps inauguration speech. Everything is fucked.

[letsskiptotheleft]

"Buy American, hire American"

Brexit loons want to negotiate with that lot, we are indeed fucked.

[PaulfromYorkshire]

Oh, and Evening folks,
My MP was, and I presume still is, a Remain supporter. He's also the Labour chief whip, and at the moment, seems likely to be asked to whip MPs to support a decision almost none of them really agree with, along with 70%+ of the members. The ones who are going all Burnham are cacking themselves about what their constituents think about immigration, even though loads of polling shows that many Brexit voters have changed their mind (Sunderland, for example, is now 70% remain).
We have a PM going full tilt to promote a process she opposed, an opposition leader supporting a position at odds with his MPs and members, and virtual unanimity from economists and politicians that we are heading for catastrophe.
We are fucked.
I just listened to Trumps inauguration speech. Everything is fucked.

I understand these feelings 55, but do hold on to the fact that voting to trigger A50 isn't the same as wanting to leave the EU.

I know it's all topsy turvy, but sometimes you have to let people follow their noses for a while. The parable of the prodigal son if you like.

Imagine how things will change round you if Nissan, AS IS HIGHLY LIKELY, do pull out of the UK.

[HindleA]

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


UK judges change court rules on child contact for violent fathers
Reforms aim to end presumption that a father must have contact with a child when there is evidence of domestic abuse

[PorFavor]

@55DegreesNorth

I missed it (Donald Trump's speech). So I tuned into the BBC only to hear a load of stupid giggling and tittering about future White House Christmas parties on account of Donald Trump being a non-drinker of alcohol. Incisive and informative stuff.





Edited to add an "r"

[HindleA]

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... vegetables" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Losing the plot: courgette crisis spreads to other vegetables
Snow across Spanish farming areas mean the growing shortages in tomatoes, salad leaves, peppers and celery - and higher prices - may last into spring

[PaulfromYorkshire]

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... vegetables


Losing the plot: courgette crisis spreads to other vegetables
Snow across Spanish farming areas mean the growing shortages in tomatoes, salad leaves, peppers and celery - and higher prices - may last into spring

Thank heavens for the perfectly lovely winter greens I've been getting in my veg box the last couple of weeks. I just stir fried some purple sprouting with sesame and soy sauce.

Yum

Chard last week, spinach and kale galore....

[HindleA]

Vote Greens.

[yahyah]

Mmm. That sounds nice.

[yahyah]

Vote Greens.

Cavolo Nero for PM. The Kippers would hate a foreigner.

[PaulfromYorkshire]

A perfect point in the proceedings to pop out for a pint

[RogerOThornhill]

Vote Greens.

Cavolo Nero for PM. The Kippers would hate a foreigner.

Nero's modern equivalent has just become POTUS...

[howsillyofme1]

Just wanted to come on and offer some support to Paul

The referendum was a disaster from beginning to end - with the vast, vast majority of the blame falling on the shoulders of Cameron, although it is difficult to find his name mentioned in any of the posts above....he really has got away with it hasn't he when a forum of the so-called left (although I am not so sure anymore) looks to cast blame elsewhere

Once the result was in then there was no choice but to invoke A50 - the alternative is to ignore the referendum, and no matter whatever you think that is really not a realistic prospect in my view. Thinking the result was a mistake does not automatically mean that it does not sit well in ignoring it

The aim should be to throw shit at the Tories during the debate and explain why the decision was made, to look for opportunities to reverse the decision once the true consequences have sunk into the brains of the electorate and make sure the truly reprehensible Tories get the blame

As was said above whoever was leader of Labour would have been in an impossible position.....perhaps the undermining of Miliband by members of his own partywas not such a great idea was it? Although lessons do not seem to have been learnt either

[HindleA]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/northern_ireland" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Historical Institutional Abuse Inquiry: 'Widespread abuse' in children's homes

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-25637486" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[yahyah]

A perfect point in the proceedings to pop out for a pint

Looks like you chose the perfect time Paul. Relax and enjoy.

Night all and thanks again to OneButton in particular.

[citizenJA]

A perfect point in the proceedings to pop out for a pint

Looks like you chose the perfect time Paul. Relax and enjoy.

Night all and thanks again to OneButton in particular.

Goodnight, yahyah!

[PorFavor]

Donald Trump has already ditched the Climate Action Plan (Sky News tickertape thingy).

[RogerOThornhill]

Worth reading the embedded tweets within...

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Tubby Isaacs]

"Buy American, hire American"

Brexit loons want to negotiate with that lot, we are indeed fucked.

Ukrainians are probably not very hopeful either.

[Tubby Isaacs]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/g ... 4xmznqm2t9

George Osborne has landed a City job worth at least £200,000 a year, his office have confirmed.

The former Chancellor won’t be stepping down as an MP, despite his new role as an adviser to Blackrock Investments, the world’s biggest asset manager.

He's a complete shit.

There's something we can all agree on.

And if the likes of Blackrock abandon the City of London before or after brexit, good riddance. How clever can they be, if they think paying that scum is value for money? Utterly corrupt.

Osborne's status could be transformed in a couple of years, as the business facing pro-Brexit oracle. Blackrock could get a bit of that rub off on them.

[Tubby Isaacs]

How can we even be triggering Article 50 without knowing what Nissan are likely to get? And by extension anybody else who fancies shaking down the government?

No answer from the government? You stick in a FOIA.

The reasons are stacking up to vote against Article 50. The more fuss made, the more the public gets to notice the issues.

[citizenJA]

How can we even be triggering Article 50 without knowing what Nissan are likely to get? And by extension anybody else who fancies shaking down the government?

No answer from the government? You stick in a FOIA.

The reasons are stacking up to vote against Article 50. The more fuss made, the more the public gets to notice the issues.

Exactly.

[howsillyofme1]

How can we even be triggering Article 50 without knowing what Nissan are likely to get? And by extension anybody else who fancies shaking down the government?

No answer from the government? You stick in a FOIA.

The reasons are stacking up to vote against Article 50. The more fuss made, the more the public gets to notice the issues.

Ask the Tories - they are the ones who will be doing the triggering

Voting en masse against will either be an empty gesture which will go against the referendum (and you cannot forget that there was a referendum with a clear question - people voted to Leave the EU, not to Remain.....angry about it but not sure what the value is in ignoring it) or it will actually prevent the triggering and the question will be....what next?

Do you have anything to say the public supports ignoring the referendum result?

Can you also point to a Labour Party statement or a direct quote from Corbyn saying there will be a 3 line whip?

[Willow904]

How can we even be triggering Article 50 without knowing what Nissan are likely to get? And by extension anybody else who fancies shaking down the government?

No answer from the government? You stick in a FOIA.

The reasons are stacking up to vote against Article 50. The more fuss made, the more the public gets to notice the issues.

Ask the Tories - they are the ones who will be doing the triggering

Voting en masse against will either be an empty gesture which will go against the referendum (and you cannot forget that there was a referendum with a clear question - people voted to Leave the EU, not to Remain.....angry about it but not sure what the value is in ignoring it) or it will actually prevent the triggering and the question will be....what next?

Do you have anything to say the public supports ignoring the referendum result?

Can you also point to a Labour Party statement or a direct quote from Corbyn saying there will be a 3 line whip?

The answer to "what next?" is that Theresa May would then have to negotiate with parliament to get article 50 through, she would have to bow to certain conditions to win majority support, one of which may be a referendum on the exit deal. May could be portrayed as the one blocking Brexit by refusing to allow the public their rightful say on the deal.

Leave voters don't need Labour to champion them, they have a majority government on their side eager to give them what they want and leave voters will undoubtedly reward the Tories with their vote at the next election. It is quite possible that there are very few leave voters left that Labour can now win by seeming to take their part at such a late stage, having refused to offer a referendum in 2015 and campaigned to remain in 2016. On the other hand Labour have an awful lot of remain voters they risk losing, however, by seemingly making no attempt to stand up to a Tory hard Brexit.

For me, from the moment leave won, remaining in the single market became the least worst option. And yet Jeremy Corbyn can't even bring himself to say the words "membership of the single market", let alone show any signs of fighting for it. If you're telling me this is how Labour should be then it's no longer the pro-EU, socially democratic party I joined. I make no predictions or claims of being able to see the future. This new Labour party could prove to be very successful. I'm just not sure it is a party that I want to belong to any more.

[tinyclanger2]

Labour shadow minister is ‘leaning towards’ voting against Article 50 in defiance of Jeremy Corbyn
Tulip Siddiq tells The Independent she must consider how decisively her constituents backed remain
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 37006.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[tinyclanger2]

Keir Starmer: 'Lib Dem leader fanning flames of division over Brexit'
Shadow Brexit secretary says Tim Farron is widening split between leave and remain voters by speaking only for one side
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017/ja ... ver-brexit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I don't feel Labour are speaking for me much. TBH

[tinyclanger2]

(on the whole)

[tinyclanger2]

Good to "see" some old "faces" here. Just a pity the circumstances are so utterly dire.

Everything changes - except that the Tories hate the British people.