Thursday 9th March 2017

Post by **refitman** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 7:10 am

Morning all.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 7:24 am

Morning

http://www.communitycare.co.uk/2017/03/ ... -care-act/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The care package changes testing the limits of the Care Act

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 7:58 am

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... s-ted-cruz" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Healthcare hearing: Democrats try to stall bill as Ted Cruz voices pessimism

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 8:09 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbcsurrey" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://www.surreycc.gov.uk/your-counci ... i-requests" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 8:35 am

https://www.ifs.org.uk/tools_and_resources/budget/515" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

IFS briefing at 13.00,will be posted above.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 8:45 am

Morning all.

David Allen Green‏ @Law_and_policy 23m23 minutes ago
More
The 2015 Conservative manifesto pledges on safeguarding UK in single market and for no increases in NI have both now been 'clarified'.

I heard Hammond doing his best to ignore the manifesto commitment and try and stick to the "well, it was in the legislation!"

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 9:07 am

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... dApp_Tweet" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Cutting tax, clawing back disability benefits: Hammond’s plan is familiar
Frances Ryan

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 9:18 am

Well now...

Given a number of disgruntled Tories that might be indeed tricky.

ScarletGas · Post by **ScarletGas** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 9:30 am

The below is from the Resolution foundation (quoted in the Guardian) who, to be fair, seem be a little isolated in welcoming this change.

This is a welcome and progressive change that will mean the bottom 54 per cent of self-employed earners pay less national insurance, or none at all. Those earning over £16,250 will pay more, with anyone earning over £50,000 paying a little over £600 more tax each year.

What strikes me is that (if I read it right) 54% of self employed earn less than £16,250 per annum.

Correct me if I read it incorrectly, but if I am right, I find that figure puts into perspective a situation I already thought was pretty scandalous.

Post by **adam** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 9:47 am

ScarletGas wrote:The below is from the Resolution foundation (quoted in the Guardian) who, to be fair, seem be a little isolated in welcoming this change.

This is a welcome and progressive change that will mean the bottom 54 per cent of self-employed earners pay less national insurance, or none at all. Those earning over £16,250 will pay more, with anyone earning over £50,000 paying a little over £600 more tax each year.

What strikes me is that (if I read it right) 54% of self employed earn less than £16,250 per annum.

Correct me if I read it incorrectly, but if I am right, I find that figure puts into perspective a situation I already thought was pretty scandalous.

BBC news story from last October
Self-employed 'now earning less than in 1995'

According to the research, average self-employed wages were £240 a week in the 2014-15 financial year - the most recent period for which data is available - down from about £300 a week in 1994-95.

The Resolution Foundation - a think tank that aims to improve pay for families - partly blamed the changing nature of the self-employed workforce.

The foundation said that many more people had taken up lower-paid jobs in the so-called "gig economy", essentially self-employed workers taking on a variety of different roles, while the proportion of self-employed business owners with their own staff had fallen. The number of hours worked by the self-employed had also declined.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 9:52 am

ScarletGas wrote:The below is from the Resolution foundation (quoted in the Guardian) who, to be fair, seem be a little isolated in welcoming this change.

This is a welcome and progressive change that will mean the bottom 54 per cent of self-employed earners pay less national insurance, or none at all. Those earning over £16,250 will pay more, with anyone earning over £50,000 paying a little over £600 more tax each year.

What strikes me is that (if I read it right) 54% of self employed earn less than £16,250 per annum.

Correct me if I read it incorrectly, but if I am right, I find that figure puts into perspective a situation I already thought was pretty scandalous.

I'm not sure that's totally correct. There's an increase in the lower tax threshold to factor in?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:02 am

France, Harris poll:

Macron (EM-NI): 26% ↑
Le Pen (FN-ENF): 25%
Fillon (LR-EPP): 20% ↓
Hamon (PS-S&D): 13% ↓
Melenchon (FG-Left) 12%

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:12 am

HindleA wrote:France, Harris poll:

Macron (EM-NI): 26% ↑
Le Pen (FN-ENF): 25%
Fillon (LR-EPP): 20% ↓
Hamon (PS-S&D): 13% ↓
Melenchon (FG-Left) 12%

Wow, that's tight. What's the format used to get through / eliminate?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:16 am

https://about-france.com/presidential-e ... #electoral" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:22 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-39204711" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Councils 'exploiting' outsourced care workers, union says

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:26 am

I've seen the proposed self-employed NIC rise described as progressive. And Rees-Mogg seems unhappy about it. Kind of makes me wonder why Labour are opposing it, tbh.

Could Labour not have focused today on some of the bigger injustices, such as ongoing cuts to families and disabled alongside cuts to inheritance tax for a handful of the super wealthy? Or more on the money being wasted on free schools?

Can't help but feel the NIC rise is getting a lot of media interest because it primarily affects self-employed people on good incomes like, well, people working in the media. People who have so far been carefully cushioned from austerity by Osborne who, to be frank, could possibly afford to contribute a bit more.

Post by **adam** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:30 am

StephenDolan wrote:
HindleA wrote:France, Harris poll:

Macron (EM-NI): 26% ↑
Le Pen (FN-ENF): 25%
Fillon (LR-EPP): 20% ↓
Hamon (PS-S&D): 13% ↓
Melenchon (FG-Left) 12%
Wow, that's tight. What's the format used to get through / eliminate?

Top two through to a run-off.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:34 am

Willow904 wrote:I've seen the proposed self-employed NIC rise described as progressive. And Rees-Mogg seems unhappy about it. Kind of makes me wonder why Labour are opposing it, tbh.

Could Labour not have focused today on some of the bigger injustices, such as ongoing cuts to families and disabled alongside cuts to inheritance tax for a handful of the super wealthy? Or more on the money being wasted on free schools?

Can't help but feel the NIC rise is getting a lot of media interest because it primarily affects self-employed people on good incomes like, well, people working in the media. People who have so far been carefully cushioned from austerity by Osborne who, to be frank, could possibly afford to contribute a bit more.

It's what it represents. A break of a key manifesto pledge that was used as an attack line against Labour in 2015.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:40 am

Thanks for the France info folks.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:50 am

StephenDolan wrote:
Willow904 wrote:I've seen the proposed self-employed NIC rise described as progressive. And Rees-Mogg seems unhappy about it. Kind of makes me wonder why Labour are opposing it, tbh.

Could Labour not have focused today on some of the bigger injustices, such as ongoing cuts to families and disabled alongside cuts to inheritance tax for a handful of the super wealthy? Or more on the money being wasted on free schools?

Can't help but feel the NIC rise is getting a lot of media interest because it primarily affects self-employed people on good incomes like, well, people working in the media. People who have so far been carefully cushioned from austerity by Osborne who, to be frank, could possibly afford to contribute a bit more.
It's what it represents. A break of a key manifesto pledge that was used as an attack line against Labour in 2015.

I guess.

And yet it lands Labour arguing alongside Rees-Mogg against what looks like a progressive tax reform.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:54 am

Willow904 wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:
Willow904 wrote:I've seen the proposed self-employed NIC rise described as progressive. And Rees-Mogg seems unhappy about it. Kind of makes me wonder why Labour are opposing it, tbh.

Could Labour not have focused today on some of the bigger injustices, such as ongoing cuts to families and disabled alongside cuts to inheritance tax for a handful of the super wealthy? Or more on the money being wasted on free schools?

Can't help but feel the NIC rise is getting a lot of media interest because it primarily affects self-employed people on good incomes like, well, people working in the media. People who have so far been carefully cushioned from austerity by Osborne who, to be frank, could possibly afford to contribute a bit more.
It's what it represents. A break of a key manifesto pledge that was used as an attack line against Labour in 2015.
I guess.

And yet it lands Labour arguing alongside Rees-Mogg against what looks like a progressive tax reform.

The NI change is a good and progressive one.

Which is why all the opposition is coming from the right (the Torygraph is in flames).

Labour is just not relevant.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:56 am

Scottish voting intentions: #local elections2017: STV/IpsosMORI poll:
SNP 46%
Con 19%
Lab 17%
Grns 8%
LD 6%
UKIP 3%

Some encouraging signs for the Greens there.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 10:59 am

Willow904 wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:
Willow904 wrote:I've seen the proposed self-employed NIC rise described as progressive. And Rees-Mogg seems unhappy about it. Kind of makes me wonder why Labour are opposing it, tbh.

Could Labour not have focused today on some of the bigger injustices, such as ongoing cuts to families and disabled alongside cuts to inheritance tax for a handful of the super wealthy? Or more on the money being wasted on free schools?

Can't help but feel the NIC rise is getting a lot of media interest because it primarily affects self-employed people on good incomes like, well, people working in the media. People who have so far been carefully cushioned from austerity by Osborne who, to be frank, could possibly afford to contribute a bit more.
It's what it represents. A break of a key manifesto pledge that was used as an attack line against Labour in 2015.
I guess.

And yet it lands Labour arguing alongside Rees-Mogg against what looks like a progressive tax reform.

If this and the single market manifesto pledges can be ditched, then the "it was in our manifesto" excuse is no longer relevant and can be highlighted. It questions their honesty. Strange bedfellows doesn't mean that this is the wrong position to take by Labour, absolutely it is the right way to go.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:14 am

Good morfternoon.

For information -

Chris Leslie (@ChrisLeslieMP)

Commons Library confirm for me: "Government will have to introduce separate primary legislation" (to introduce any National Insurance rise)
March 9, 2017

(Politics Live, Guardian)

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:20 am

Good-morning, everyone.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:22 am

RogerOThornhill wrote:Well now...

Given a number of disgruntled Tories that might be indeed tricky.

Though the bark of "Tory rebels" - in the HoC, anyway - has proved rather bigger than their bite thus far.......

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:24 am

I think the line for Labour is "Tory Brexit NI rise" to go wit "Tory Brexut cuts".

It's very hard to respond to a budget on the day, and sounds like it wasn't the best. But still plenty of time to get stuck in.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:25 am

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
RogerOThornhill wrote:Well now...

Given a number of disgruntled Tories that might be indeed tricky.

Though the bark of "Tory rebels" - in the HoC, anyway - has proved rather bigger than their bite thus far.......

Yep. Are we in 1994 VAT on fuel territory? Probably not.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:27 am

SpinningHugo wrote:Scottish voting intentions: #local elections2017: STV/IpsosMORI poll:
SNP 46%
Con 19%
Lab 17%
Grns 8%
LD 6%
UKIP 3%

Some encouraging signs for the Greens there.

Also a 50-50 split on independence, apparently. Which may or may not help explain the rather unimpressive - by recent Scottish standards - Tory figure.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:32 am

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1581868 ... failure-of" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Labour Press
These statistics demonstrate the total failure of Tories’ punitive social security regime - Debbie Abrahams

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:33 am

Talk that the Government are very wary of saying "Brexit". Say it. Brexit cuts, Brexit tax rises, Brexit inflation, Brexit fuel bill rises.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:36 am

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1581871 ... -a-damning" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Labour Press
These NHS performance statistics are a damning indictment of Theresa May’s neglect of our NHS - Jonathan Ashworth

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:39 am

https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/s ... a-2016-17/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:46 am

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/ec ... udget-2017" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The disability benefit cuts Philip Hammond forgot to mention in Budget 2017

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:47 am

"Spreadshit Phil"

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 11:56 am

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk ... e-yet-come" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The biggest Budget rows could be yet to come

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 12:24 pm

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 18371.html
Processing EU citizens' applications to stay in Britain 'could take 50 years'

Well it's not like there's anything more useful or constructive to do with our collective time

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 12:31 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/housing-net ... nefit-camp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I'm 82 and MPs need to hear my views on this devastating housing benefit cap

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 12:35 pm

https://ukcampaign4change.com/2017/03/0 ... harmacies/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Capita said to owe thousands to pharmacies

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 12:41 pm

HindleA wrote:https://ukcampaign4change.com/2017/03/0 ... harmacies/

Capita said to owe thousands to pharmacies

Are we to assume that Capita already have the money from the NHS, but are sitting on it (and, presumably, collecting the interest)?

Edited - typo

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 12:43 pm

Dutch grid operator Tennet and Denmark’s Energinet have reached agreement on further developing a large renewable European electricity system in the North Sea.
The plan, first unveiled in June 2016, will play an important part in meeting the 2050 climate goals formulated in the Paris Agreement (COP21), the partners said in a statement on Wednesday. Discussions with other potential partners are ongoing.
http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2 ... anan-demo/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 1:01 pm

https://ukcampaign4change.com/2017/03/0 ... -the-book/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A classic “waterfall” IT project disaster – yet officials went by the book

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 1:34 pm

Just 85.1% of patients attending A&E were seen within four hours in January - making it the worst month on record.

The latest figure for NHS England is down from 86.2% of patients in December, also a record low at the time, and is the worst performance since monthly reporting began in 2010.

The target for hospitals is 95% - a figure emergency departments have failed to meet since July 2015.

There were 492,231 emergency admissions in January 2017, an increase of 1.5% compared to January 2016, and a year-on-year rise of 3.3%.

It means 73,342 patients were not seen within the four-hour target.

And almost 1,000 people waited more than 12 hours to be admitted to A&E departments in January - the highest figure on record for trolley waits, when patients are put on trolleys or in side rooms while a bed is found for them.

The equivalent figure for January last year was just 158.

Appalling ! There is plenty more yearly comparable figures in this article - alas, nobody pointing out that under Labour, the waiting time limit was 98% and was largely met throughout Labour's time in power.

http://news.sky.com/story/worst-month-o ... s-10795364" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 1:39 pm

@yahyah if you're looking in

Bonuses for 86,700 staff at John Lewis and Waitrose have been cut for the fourth year in a row.

Employees will get a 6% bonus, more than three weeks' wages, down from 10% last year and the lowest since 1954, when it was 4%.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-39216159" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I see John Lewis and staff bonus & it makes me think of you

Please log in again

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 1:43 pm

Have just seen this morning's Graun editorial on the budget. The kindest thing I can say is that few takes have aged less well more quickly.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 2:00 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... CMP=twt_gu" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Why do politicians continue to push the zombie creed of austerity?
Eliane Glaser

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 2:34 pm

From the G live blog.

Paul Johnson from the IFS has this to say about the NIC rise:

He suggested politicians and voters were to blame with Britain having an unfair and inefficient tax system.

"Clearly the most controversial announcement yesterday was the increase in self-employed NI rates. This appears to break a foolish manifesto commitment not to raise any of the major taxes. On the other hand it is a small change taking a small step to correcting a big problem with the current tax system. That problem needs a much more thorough review and strategy to deal with it, as do many other problems in the tax system. If politicians continue to make silly manifesto pledges about not changing taxes and the rest of us resist sensible changes such as this we will end up with the tax system we deserve – inefficient, inequitable, complex and increasingly unable to raise revenue in the face of a changing economy."

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 2:58 pm

That seems like fair comment.

So what should Labour do?

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 3:03 pm

pk1 wrote:
Just 85.1% of patients attending A&E were seen within four hours in January - making it the worst month on record.

The latest figure for NHS England is down from 86.2% of patients in December, also a record low at the time, and is the worst performance since monthly reporting began in 2010.

The target for hospitals is 95% - a figure emergency departments have failed to meet since July 2015.

There were 492,231 emergency admissions in January 2017, an increase of 1.5% compared to January 2016, and a year-on-year rise of 3.3%.

It means 73,342 patients were not seen within the four-hour target.

And almost 1,000 people waited more than 12 hours to be admitted to A&E departments in January - the highest figure on record for trolley waits, when patients are put on trolleys or in side rooms while a bed is found for them.

The equivalent figure for January last year was just 158.
Appalling ! There is plenty more yearly comparable figures in this article - alas, nobody pointing out that under Labour, the waiting time limit was 98% and was largely met throughout Labour's time in power.

http://news.sky.com/story/worst-month-o ... s-10795364" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yeah but Labour target culture bad. Blah blah Wales.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Thu 09 Mar, 2017 3:04 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
SpinningHugo wrote:Scottish voting intentions: #local elections2017: STV/IpsosMORI poll:
SNP 46%
Con 19%
Lab 17%
Grns 8%
LD 6%
UKIP 3%

Some encouraging signs for the Greens there.
Also a 50-50 split on independence, apparently. Which may or may not help explain the rather unimpressive - by recent Scottish standards - Tory figure.

It's incredibly good for the SNP, seeing they've basically passed all the hard decisions on to councils, like Westminster has.