Monday 10th April 2017
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Welcome to FTN. New posters are welcome to join the conversation. You can follow us on Twitter @FlythenestHaven You are responsible for the content you post. This is a public forum. Treat it as if you are speaking in a crowded room. Site admin and Moderators are volunteers who will respond as quickly as they are able to when made aware of any complaints. Please do not post copyrighted material without the original authors permission.
Monday 10th April 2017
Morning all.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Good morning
So has the attack by the US on a sovereign state ( no matter how repugnant it is) brought any positives?
Our country seems diminished and the US seem to have no idea what to do next
An attack like this has to be really well thought through and likely consequences scenarioed
We now see Russia and Iran lining up clearly behind Syria....and almost issuing a 'come on then let's have it' comment
Seems to me to have been a shambles but then again our useless Government will get off untouched as the media will be interested more who is shagging who and significant parts of the opposition support them.
But 'doing something' and looking tough is always so much easier than trying to solve a phenomenally complex situation by diplomacy!
So has the attack by the US on a sovereign state ( no matter how repugnant it is) brought any positives?
Our country seems diminished and the US seem to have no idea what to do next
An attack like this has to be really well thought through and likely consequences scenarioed
We now see Russia and Iran lining up clearly behind Syria....and almost issuing a 'come on then let's have it' comment
Seems to me to have been a shambles but then again our useless Government will get off untouched as the media will be interested more who is shagging who and significant parts of the opposition support them.
But 'doing something' and looking tough is always so much easier than trying to solve a phenomenally complex situation by diplomacy!
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
It entirely depends upon whether chemical weapons continue to be used.howsillyofme1 wrote:Good morning
So has the attack by the US on a sovereign state ( no matter how repugnant it is) brought any positives?
Our country seems diminished and the US seem to have no idea what to do next
An attack like this has to be really well thought through and likely consequences scenarioed
We now see Russia and Iran lining up clearly behind Syria....and almost issuing a 'come on then let's have it' comment
Seems to me to have been a shambles but then again our useless Government will get off untouched as the media will be interested more who is shagging who and significant parts of the opposition support them.
But 'doing something' and looking tough is always so much easier than trying to solve a phenomenally complex situation by diplomacy!
If they are not, then yes, it achieved something.
Similarly, we can judge the earlier tactic of not taking military action against Assad, and relying upon the voluntary destruction through agreement with Russia, to have failed by the same measure.
As for "diplomacy", that doesn't help any more than Corbyn's arguing for a 'political' solution. It is just wishing for the peaceful ends, without specifying any means whereby that can be achieved. It would be laughable, were the issue not so serious.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Well there seems to be a little less confidence that Assad was responsible but my assumption is still that he isSpinningHugo wrote:It entirely depends upon whether chemical weapons continue to be used.howsillyofme1 wrote:Good morning
So has the attack by the US on a sovereign state ( no matter how repugnant it is) brought any positives?
Our country seems diminished and the US seem to have no idea what to do next
An attack like this has to be really well thought through and likely consequences scenarioed
We now see Russia and Iran lining up clearly behind Syria....and almost issuing a 'come on then let's have it' comment
Seems to me to have been a shambles but then again our useless Government will get off untouched as the media will be interested more who is shagging who and significant parts of the opposition support them.
But 'doing something' and looking tough is always so much easier than trying to solve a phenomenally complex situation by diplomacy!
If they are not, then yes, it achieved something.
Similarly, we can judge the earlier tactic of not taking military action against Assad, and relying upon the voluntary destruction through agreement with Russia, to have failed by the same measure.
As for "diplomacy", that doesn't help any more than Corbyn's arguing for a 'political' solution. It is just wishing for the peaceful ends, without specifying any means whereby that can be achieved. It would be laughable, were the issue not so serious.
Oh and I have little confidence in the intelligence services within theatre
I have said before I see no great difference between 'toxic chemical weapons and 'explosive' chemical weapons......perhaps we should show some of the aftermath of bomb attacks as well...not a pretty sight I imagine.
As to your last point. I am not sure what your solution to Syria is if not a diplomatic one? Are you proposing a military one...where is your solution
And the US has just attacked a sovereign state - that is an escalation! An escalation with no plan
And can you tell me you **** what Corbyn has to do with it all?
Why do you never criticise the pathetic antics of our current Government who are making us look ridiculous.....oh I forgot they are Tories and you are one!
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Good Corbyn everybody!
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
1. Really? What is the plausible story anybody has given that it was not Assad? None at all that I have heard.howsillyofme1 wrote:
Well there seems to be a little less confidence that Assad was responsible but my assumption is still that he is
Oh and I have little confidence in the intelligence within theatre of our intelligence services
I have said before I see no great difference between 'toxic chemical weapons and 'explosive' chemical weapons......perhaps we should show some of the aftermath of bomb attacks as well...not a pretty sight I imagine.
As to your last point. I am not sure what your solution to Syria is if not a diplomatic one? Are you proposing a military one...where is your solution
And the US has just attacked a sovereign state - that is an escalation! An escalation with no plan
And can you tell me you **** what Corbyn has to do with it all?
Why do you never criticise the pathetic antics of our current Government who are making us look ridiculous.....oh I forgot they are Tories and you are one!
2. One is prohibited by international law. The other is not.
3. I doubt that a good solution is possible now. It was possible that if the west had intervened militarily earlier, that Assad could have been removed and a stable alternative government taken power. As it is, it looks like Assad's butchers will remain in power. The best that can be hoped for is that Russia is persuaded to stop Assad using chemical weapons.
4. It has indeed. Attacking sovereign states is sometimes justifiable. If they commit grotesque war crimes, like using chemical weapons against their own populations, it is justifiable to use force to try and stop that. For other situations see also Kosovo and Rwanda.
5. I am English and it is important to know what the leader of the opposition thinks on central questions like this. Corbyn, the former chair of Stop the War (sic), unsurprisingly takes the same view on this as they do. He has always opposed all military action anywhere by the west. Like Stop the War, he is quick to condemn the US, but slow to criticise Putin. His suggested alternatives are always nice ends ("peace") without any means being specified.
6. That seems like whataboutery to me. On this question, was the limited military action against Assad right, the government is right. Corbyn disagrees. Most of the PLP don't agree with Corbyn of course, but then they don't represent Labour any longer. I consider that to be unfortunate, as you know.
Re: Monday 10th April 2017
And Good Corbinge to you, too.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Good Corbyn everybody!
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
My emphasis. This is clearly contestable. This is a Forum. Please discuss not assert.SpinningHugo wrote:1. Really? What is the plausible story anybody has given that it was not Assad? None at all that I have heard.howsillyofme1 wrote:
Well there seems to be a little less confidence that Assad was responsible but my assumption is still that he is
Oh and I have little confidence in the intelligence within theatre of our intelligence services
I have said before I see no great difference between 'toxic chemical weapons and 'explosive' chemical weapons......perhaps we should show some of the aftermath of bomb attacks as well...not a pretty sight I imagine.
As to your last point. I am not sure what your solution to Syria is if not a diplomatic one? Are you proposing a military one...where is your solution
And the US has just attacked a sovereign state - that is an escalation! An escalation with no plan
And can you tell me you **** what Corbyn has to do with it all?
Why do you never criticise the pathetic antics of our current Government who are making us look ridiculous.....oh I forgot they are Tories and you are one!
2. One is prohibited by international law. The other is not.
3. I doubt that a good solution is possible now. It was possible that if the west had intervened militarily earlier, that Assad could have been removed and a stable alternative government taken power. As it is, it looks like Assad's butchers will remain in power. The best that can be hoped for is that Russia is persuaded to stop Assad using chemical weapons.
4. It has indeed. Attacking sovereign states is sometimes justifiable. If they commit grotesque war crimes, like using chemical weapons against their own populations, it is justifiable to use force to try and stop that. For other situations see also Kosovo and Rwanda.
5. I am English and it is important to know what the leader of the opposition thinks on central questions like this. Corbyn, the former chair of Stop the War (sic), unsurprisingly takes the same view on this as they do. He has always opposed all military action anywhere by the west. Like Stop the War, he is quick to condemn the US, but slow to criticise Putin. His suggested alternatives are always nice ends ("peace") without any means being specified.
6. That seems like whataboutery to me. On this question, was the limited military action against Assad right, the government is right. Corbyn disagrees. Most of the PLP don't agree with Corbyn of course, but then they don't represent Labour any longer. I consider that to be unfortunate, as you know.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
The reasons why I consider the government to be right are given above.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:My emphasis. This is clearly contestable. This is a Forum. Please discuss not assert.SpinningHugo wrote:1. Really? What is the plausible story anybody has given that it was not Assad? None at all that I have heard.howsillyofme1 wrote:
Well there seems to be a little less confidence that Assad was responsible but my assumption is still that he is
Oh and I have little confidence in the intelligence within theatre of our intelligence services
I have said before I see no great difference between 'toxic chemical weapons and 'explosive' chemical weapons......perhaps we should show some of the aftermath of bomb attacks as well...not a pretty sight I imagine.
As to your last point. I am not sure what your solution to Syria is if not a diplomatic one? Are you proposing a military one...where is your solution
And the US has just attacked a sovereign state - that is an escalation! An escalation with no plan
And can you tell me you **** what Corbyn has to do with it all?
Why do you never criticise the pathetic antics of our current Government who are making us look ridiculous.....oh I forgot they are Tories and you are one!
2. One is prohibited by international law. The other is not.
3. I doubt that a good solution is possible now. It was possible that if the west had intervened militarily earlier, that Assad could have been removed and a stable alternative government taken power. As it is, it looks like Assad's butchers will remain in power. The best that can be hoped for is that Russia is persuaded to stop Assad using chemical weapons.
4. It has indeed. Attacking sovereign states is sometimes justifiable. If they commit grotesque war crimes, like using chemical weapons against their own populations, it is justifiable to use force to try and stop that. For other situations see also Kosovo and Rwanda.
5. I am English and it is important to know what the leader of the opposition thinks on central questions like this. Corbyn, the former chair of Stop the War (sic), unsurprisingly takes the same view on this as they do. He has always opposed all military action anywhere by the west. Like Stop the War, he is quick to condemn the US, but slow to criticise Putin. His suggested alternatives are always nice ends ("peace") without any means being specified.
6. That seems like whataboutery to me. On this question, was the limited military action against Assad right, the government is right. Corbyn disagrees. Most of the PLP don't agree with Corbyn of course, but then they don't represent Labour any longer. I consider that to be unfortunate, as you know.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 75776.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
syria-boris-johnson-poodle-missile-strikes-cruise-donald-trump-assad-chemical-weapons
syria-boris-johnson-poodle-missile-strikes-cruise-donald-trump-assad-chemical-weapons
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
A UK government source dismissed the criticism of Mr Johnson: “The important thing is that this is Britain helping to influence US policy on Syria and Russia, far from being a poodle.
“Three months ago Syria wasn't really an issue for them but our push and recent events have made a difference.”
The source did not explain that influence the UK has so far had on US policy.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Yes. "poodle" is the insult the Russian government has used about the UK for its following the US on its opposition to the use of chemical weapons.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 75776.html
syria-boris-johnson-poodle-missile-strikes-cruise-donald-trump-assad-chemical-weapons
lol, indeed.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Fixed that for you. There has been no democratic mandate that I noticed.SpinningHugo wrote:Yes. "poodle" is the insult the Russian government has used about the UK for its following the President of the US on its opposition to the use of chemical weapons.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 75776.html
syria-boris-johnson-poodle-missile-strikes-cruise-donald-trump-assad-chemical-weapons
lol, indeed.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... rard-coyne" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
len-mccluskey-has-lost-the-plot-over-unite-election-says-rival-gerard-coyne
Gerard Coyne has a "rant" in the Guardian about McCluskey.
len-mccluskey-has-lost-the-plot-over-unite-election-says-rival-gerard-coyne
Gerard Coyne has a "rant" in the Guardian about McCluskey.
Asked if he would seek to withdraw Unite’s support for Corbyn if he won, Coyne argued it was not his priority.
Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Morning.
Why we are where we are, part 94 in an ongoing series...
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Why we are where we are, part 94 in an ongoing series...
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Monday 10th April 2017
By the way, there's a truly staggering tweet from Michael White in amongst the replies.NonOxCol wrote:Morning.
Why we are where we are, part 94 in an ongoing series...
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Well, maybe not that staggering really.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
A pre-emptive attack on a sovereign nation is also against international law....good luck with that. How does Israel fit into this? Holds two types of WMD 'illegally'
War crimes......a lot of people could be said to be guilty of these
Who set the US up as the judge jury and executioner on this
I deplore the use of chemical weapons and also many other weapons as well.
There is no point arguing with you due to you lack of intellectual capability to understand complexity and to change your mind
I may not agree often with Tubby or TE but they are a class above you
War crimes......a lot of people could be said to be guilty of these
Who set the US up as the judge jury and executioner on this
I deplore the use of chemical weapons and also many other weapons as well.
There is no point arguing with you due to you lack of intellectual capability to understand complexity and to change your mind
I may not agree often with Tubby or TE but they are a class above you
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Yes it is (Some deny that. I don't). See also the intervention in Kosovo, which was also in my opinion contrary to international law, but the right thing to do. We should have intervened in Rwanda. Sometimes it is right to break the law. International law is, in my opinion, seriously defective in many respects. That doesn't mean it has no weight.howsillyofme1 wrote:A pre-emptive attack on a sovereign nation is also against international law....good luck with that. How does Israel fit into this? Holds two types of WMD 'illegally'
War crimes......a lot of people could be said to be guilty of these
Who set the US up as the judge jury and executioner on this
I deplore the use of chemical weapons and also many other weapons as well.
There is no point arguing with you due to you lack of intellectual capability to understand complexity and to change your mind
I may not agree often with Tubby or TE but they are a class above you
As for Israel, that is the usual whataboutery.
Yes, I am clearly too stupid to follow the subtleties of your argument.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Morning all.
This was flagged up to me on the social media.
https://www.pri.org/stories/2017-04-09/ ... -heres-why" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
This was flagged up to me on the social media.
https://www.pri.org/stories/2017-04-09/ ... -heres-why" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Pig wrestling. The pig enjoys the mud. Me, not so much.
- tinyclanger2
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Trump's poodle.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 75776.html
syria-boris-johnson-poodle-missile-strikes-cruise-donald-trump-assad-chemical-weapons
The sweet smell of "freedom"
LET'S FACE IT I'M JUST 'KIN' SEETHIN'
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
I'm thinking more gimp. Let out of the dungeon when it serves the purpose of Trump.tinyclanger2 wrote:Trump's poodle.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 75776.html
syria-boris-johnson-poodle-missile-strikes-cruise-donald-trump-assad-chemical-weapons
The sweet smell of "freedom"
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
I guess it's only a matter of before Fallon and Fox are praising Eric Prince and his efficient company.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Morning all.
On the story in The Times about the NHS wanting to borrow money from hedge funds.
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Tories would be awfully tempted to get private money in but would imagine the Treasury would slap it down.
On the story in The Times about the NHS wanting to borrow money from hedge funds.
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Tories would be awfully tempted to get private money in but would imagine the Treasury would slap it down.
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/3-mi ... it-changes" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
3 million households set to benefit from Universal Credit changes
So much disingenuous tosh and downright inaccuracies,Contributory versions don't come under UC as but one.
3 million households set to benefit from Universal Credit changes
So much disingenuous tosh and downright inaccuracies,Contributory versions don't come under UC as but one.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Ah, how very confidence inspiring.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... rard-coyne
len-mccluskey-has-lost-the-plot-over-unite-election-says-rival-gerard-coyne
Gerard Coyne has a "rant" in the Guardian about McCluskey.Asked if he would seek to withdraw Unite’s support for Corbyn if he won, Coyne argued it was not his priority.
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Open consultation
Reducing litter: penalties for environmental offences
https://consult.defra.gov.uk/environmen ... penalties/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Reducing litter: penalties for environmental offences
https://consult.defra.gov.uk/environmen ... penalties/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
https://www.gov.uk/government/consultat ... ent-powers" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Open consultation
Trade Union Act 2016: consultation on the Certification Officer’s enforcement powers
Open consultation
Trade Union Act 2016: consultation on the Certification Officer’s enforcement powers
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Stop PIP reassessments for patients with progressive diseases, campaigners say
MPs and charities say rising number of retesting claimants with incurable diseases such as Parkinson’s or multiple sclerosis makes little sense
Stop PIP reassessments for patients with progressive diseases, campaigners say
MPs and charities say rising number of retesting claimants with incurable diseases such as Parkinson’s or multiple sclerosis makes little sense
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
So no harm in preceding "the government is right" with "in my view".SpinningHugo wrote:The reasons why I consider the government to be right are given above.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:My emphasis. This is clearly contestable. This is a Forum. Please discuss not assert.SpinningHugo wrote:
1. Really? What is the plausible story anybody has given that it was not Assad? None at all that I have heard.
2. One is prohibited by international law. The other is not.
3. I doubt that a good solution is possible now. It was possible that if the west had intervened militarily earlier, that Assad could have been removed and a stable alternative government taken power. As it is, it looks like Assad's butchers will remain in power. The best that can be hoped for is that Russia is persuaded to stop Assad using chemical weapons.
4. It has indeed. Attacking sovereign states is sometimes justifiable. If they commit grotesque war crimes, like using chemical weapons against their own populations, it is justifiable to use force to try and stop that. For other situations see also Kosovo and Rwanda.
5. I am English and it is important to know what the leader of the opposition thinks on central questions like this. Corbyn, the former chair of Stop the War (sic), unsurprisingly takes the same view on this as they do. He has always opposed all military action anywhere by the west. Like Stop the War, he is quick to condemn the US, but slow to criticise Putin. His suggested alternatives are always nice ends ("peace") without any means being specified.
6. That seems like whataboutery to me. On this question, was the limited military action against Assad right, the government is right. Corbyn disagrees. Most of the PLP don't agree with Corbyn of course, but then they don't represent Labour any longer. I consider that to be unfortunate, as you know.
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Who else's view would you think I was expressing?AnatolyKasparov wrote:
So no harm in preceding "the government is right" with "in my view".
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Rupert the Bear circa 1936
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
I think it is a reasonable request.I tend to talk at people.It just makes sense in pursuance of genuine discussion,in my view.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
"The government is right" is a statement of factSpinningHugo wrote:Who else's view would you think I was expressing?AnatolyKasparov wrote:
So no harm in preceding "the government is right" with "in my view".
"I think the government is right" or "In my view etc" is an opinion.
Different.
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Do you really want me to police this new stylistic directive?RogerOThornhill wrote:"The government is right" is a statement of factSpinningHugo wrote:Who else's view would you think I was expressing?AnatolyKasparov wrote:
So no harm in preceding "the government is right" with "in my view".
"I think the government is right" or "In my view etc" is an opinion.
Different.
I will if you like....
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk ... il-service" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Whitehall woes: why is no one talking about our crumbling civil service
Whitehall woes: why is no one talking about our crumbling civil service
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
If you look at my original post (that Hugo pretty much ignored and twisted back to his favourite subject) you will see I didn't overtly criticise the action itself but rather the planning of the aftermath
It seems from subsequent actions that no-one had really any idea what came next and how the diplomatic aftermath managed
We now have the British foreign secretary looking a bit silly at best and the US scrabbling around
I come back to my main point....the US attacking Syria directly is an escalation...whether a right or wrong one depends on what happens now
It seems from subsequent actions that no-one had really any idea what came next and how the diplomatic aftermath managed
We now have the British foreign secretary looking a bit silly at best and the US scrabbling around
I come back to my main point....the US attacking Syria directly is an escalation...whether a right or wrong one depends on what happens now
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Reiterated £10 an hour minimum wage straight in 2020.
Haven't we got a slow down coming? Has anybody actually modelled the effects?
Haven't we got a slow down coming? Has anybody actually modelled the effects?
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Owen Paterson comes up with another class of foreign worker we need. Abattoir workers.
Who are the bad ones again?
Who are the bad ones again?
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Interesting article - wonder at what point someone says "We need to look at what's done by government and how many departments we actually need and what they do". Big job but one that needs doing from time to time. Companies do this and have strategic planning at the centre of the organisations - Governments ought to do this too - and be open about it.HindleA wrote:http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk ... il-service
Whitehall woes: why is no one talking about our crumbling civil service
If I could go on my hobby-horse for a minute, I wonder how many people, if they knew about it in advance, would go for this:
"What we'll do is take away responsibility for oversight of schools from local authorities and give it all to the DfE and its civil servants who will simply do what the DfE tells them to"
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
- RogerOThornhill
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Staying with the civil service...
The civil service was cut down so far that when they're faced with an enormous challenge like Brexit - everything else goes to pot.
Henry ManceVerified account
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Great story - civil servants are so busy with Brexit that expiring outsourcing contracts are just being rolled over https://www.ft.com/content/fa80d526-1b7a-11e7-a266-" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The civil service was cut down so far that when they're faced with an enormous challenge like Brexit - everything else goes to pot.
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
See I'd be happier with the £10 minimum if I thought eg Carwyn Jones had been consulted.
"Carwyn, you represent a poor region. What are investors going to make of it?"
"Carwyn, you represent a poor region. What are investors going to make of it?"
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Rail is an exception to that. Lots of changes with franchises. It's unusual though in that the government are putting money in and being reasonably far sighted with investment (even if it's all years behind schedule ).RogerOThornhill wrote:Staying with the civil service...
Henry ManceVerified account
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Great story - civil servants are so busy with Brexit that expiring outsourcing contracts are just being rolled over https://www.ft.com/content/fa80d526-1b7a-11e7-a266-" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The civil service was cut down so far that when they're faced with an enormous challenge like Brexit - everything else goes to pot.
Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Ha!SpinningHugo wrote:As for Israel, that is the usual whataboutery.
You might not be doing this here, but the idea that you can't consider an issue in light of another issue is just risible.
In 2014, as part of their bombardment of and invasion of Gaza and amongst many other things then and at other times, bombed three UNWRA schools and in doing so probably were committing war crimes, carried out the targeted killings of hundreds of civilians and attacked civilian infrastructure.
If one state in the region can act with impunity in this way but another needs to be bombed, there's something wrong, and something worth talking about. Arguing that it is whataboutery to discuss Israel's role in the middle east makes anything else you say nonsense.
I still believe in a town called Hope
Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Fuck's SAKE.
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
So easy to believe as well.
Motorway bridge near Woodall Services (M1) northbound - last week there was a banner saying "BREXIT BRING IT ON". This week it says "BREXIT WE WANT IT HARD AND FAST".
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
So easy to believe as well.
Motorway bridge near Woodall Services (M1) northbound - last week there was a banner saying "BREXIT BRING IT ON". This week it says "BREXIT WE WANT IT HARD AND FAST".
Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Labour aren't in a position to implement anything by "2020" so I doubt much thought has been given to the cost in terms of jobs and in terms of costs to councils trying to provide social care etc.Tubby Isaacs wrote:Reiterated £10 an hour minimum wage straight in 2020.
Haven't we got a slow down coming? Has anybody actually modelled the effects?
Besides, wages don't operate in a vacuum. It's the mismatch between incomes and essential outgoings that affects standard of living. I'd prefer more focus on housing costs and energy monopolies. But then Ed Miliband had proposals on rent reforms and energy reforms which I liked but others presumably didn't, so no doubt whacking up the minimum wage will prove "popular" despite the obvious problems and the fact being paid more doesn't help if house costs go straight up in reaction.
"Fall seven times, get up eight" - Japanese proverb
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
I would hope somebody is looking into who is behind this......NonOxCol wrote:Fuck's SAKE.
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
So easy to believe as well.
Motorway bridge near Woodall Services (M1) northbound - last week there was a banner saying "BREXIT BRING IT ON". This week it says "BREXIT WE WANT IT HARD AND FAST".
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Snippity snip snip...
North Sea oil and gas industry cost the UK taxpayer £396million in 2016
edit - too much snipping
Story from the graun at the weekendWillow904 wrote: and energy monopolies.
North Sea oil and gas industry cost the UK taxpayer £396million in 2016
edit - too much snipping
I still believe in a town called Hope
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Funnily enough, somebody in the Labour Party has thought about thisWillow904 wrote:Labour aren't in a position to implement anything by "2020" so I doubt much thought has been given to the cost in terms of jobs and in terms of costs to councils trying to provide social care etc.Tubby Isaacs wrote:Reiterated £10 an hour minimum wage straight in 2020.
Haven't we got a slow down coming? Has anybody actually modelled the effects?
Besides, wages don't operate in a vacuum. It's the mismatch between incomes and essential outgoings that affects standard of living. I'd prefer more focus on housing costs and energy monopolies. But then Ed Miliband had proposals on rent reforms and energy reforms which I liked but others presumably didn't, so no doubt whacking up the minimum wage will prove "popular" despite the obvious problems and the fact being paid more doesn't help if house costs go straight up in reaction.
Pledge 2
Pledge 6We will build over a million new homes in five years, with at least half a million council homes, through our public investment strategy.
We will end insecurity for private renters by introducing rent controls, secure tenancies and a charter of private tenants’ rights, and increase access to affordable home ownership.
OK these are not policies, but there's a bit more to the Labour offer than they are given credit for in the MSM!We will act to protect the future of our planet, with social justice at the heart of our environmental policies, and take action to fulfil the Paris climate agreement.
We will ensure a fair transition to a low-carbon economy, and drive the expansion of the green industries and jobs of the future, using our National Investment Bank to invest in public and community-owned renewable energy.
We will deliver clean energy and curb energy bill rises for households – energy for the 60 million, not the Big Six energy companies. We will defend and extend EU environmental protections.
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Re: Monday 10th April 2017
Indeed.Willow904 wrote:Labour aren't in a position to implement anything by "2020" so I doubt much thought has been given to the cost in terms of jobs and in terms of costs to councils trying to provide social care etc.Tubby Isaacs wrote:Reiterated £10 an hour minimum wage straight in 2020.
Haven't we got a slow down coming? Has anybody actually modelled the effects?
Besides, wages don't operate in a vacuum. It's the mismatch between incomes and essential outgoings that affects standard of living. I'd prefer more focus on housing costs and energy monopolies. But then Ed Miliband had proposals on rent reforms and energy reforms which I liked but others presumably didn't, so no doubt whacking up the minimum wage will prove "popular" despite the obvious problems and the fact being paid more doesn't help if house costs go straight up in reaction.
Have any costings been done for social care wages, for example? That money from private school fees VAT could have been useful as a start.
I have a horrible feeling that the plan from here is to fire out stuff like this for the base.