Thursday 13th April 2017

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 6:49 pm

US drops largest non-nuclear bomb on Isis affiliate in Afghanistan, military says

GBU-43/B, known as the ‘mother of all bombs’, dropped for the first time, to target ‘tunnel complex’ used by Islamic State in Khorosan (Guardian)

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... amic-state

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 6:53 pm

@Bonnylad

Whoops!

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 7:09 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/ ... regulation" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Data watchdog looks at whether No 10 covered up Uber correspondence
Information commissioner’s office investigates amid claims Cameron tried to protect taxi app from tougher regulation

Bonnylad · Post by **Bonnylad** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 7:13 pm

@PorFavor

Your 6,865 posts 'trumps' my puny 50-you win!

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 7:22 pm

But you have a better thanked to post ratio.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 7:25 pm

HindleA wrote:But you have a better thanked to post ratio.

You can be so cruel . . .

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 7:26 pm

Did somebody say "quality, not quantity"?

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 7:30 pm

Grammar schools dominated by the wealthy, DfE's own data shows

Analysts say data released to show benefits for ‘ordinary working families’ just confirms advantage of higher earners (Guardian)

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2 ... data-shows

No need to thank me . . .

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 8:29 pm

SpinningHugo wrote:
tinybgoat wrote:
gilsey wrote:How many years are people going to bang on about it? Which school Abbott sent her son to is ancient history, surely.
I think I read somewhere that he actually was responsible, she'd given him the choice, maybe you'd say her principles should have prevented that.
Yep, seeing as she's been re-elected 3 times since, we can probably presume her constituents have got over it.

In Hackney North they weigh the Labour vote rather than count it.

Good thing she didn't resign then, she must be doing something right.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 8:31 pm

Just voted...in the Unison NEC elections,hopefully next week,most probably week after in locals.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 8:36 pm

Labour said that because EU rules meant certain public contracts currently had to be opened to competition from elsewhere in Europe, Brexit could "allow public bodies to use local pounds on local jobs and businesses".
It said this would "therefore create scope for additional flexibility" for public bodies to "require the use of local or regional suppliers after Brexit", meaning cash could be directed "back into local economies".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39588431" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Surely this would mean giving up on any kind of soft Brexit? Certainly,no single market option would allow this.

Labour also said the UK should assess the impact on local councils of its membership of a World Trade Organization procurement agreement - which the UK is part of as an EU member - requiring contracts above certain thresholds to be opened up to foreign competition.

In fact, even WTO rules would be out, it seems. Economic isolationism, for a country that is extremely reliant on imports for essentials such as food and clothes? Really?

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 8:41 pm

Willow904 wrote:
Labour said that because EU rules meant certain public contracts currently had to be opened to competition from elsewhere in Europe, Brexit could "allow public bodies to use local pounds on local jobs and businesses".
It said this would "therefore create scope for additional flexibility" for public bodies to "require the use of local or regional suppliers after Brexit", meaning cash could be directed "back into local economies".
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39588431" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Surely this would mean giving up on any kind of soft Brexit? Certainly,no single market option would allow this.

Labour also said the UK should assess the impact on local councils of its membership of a World Trade Organization procurement agreement - which the UK is part of as an EU member - requiring contracts above certain thresholds to be opened up to foreign competition.
In fact, even WTO rules would be out, it seems. Economic isolationism, for a country that is extremely reliant on imports for essentials such as food and clothes? Really?

The same policies Benn supported.

The PLP would be kicking up a fuss, if any of them took Corbyn seriously.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 8:52 pm

SpinningHugo wrote:
Willow904 wrote:
Labour said that because EU rules meant certain public contracts currently had to be opened to competition from elsewhere in Europe, Brexit could "allow public bodies to use local pounds on local jobs and businesses".
It said this would "therefore create scope for additional flexibility" for public bodies to "require the use of local or regional suppliers after Brexit", meaning cash could be directed "back into local economies".
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39588431" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Surely this would mean giving up on any kind of soft Brexit? Certainly,no single market option would allow this.

Labour also said the UK should assess the impact on local councils of its membership of a World Trade Organization procurement agreement - which the UK is part of as an EU member - requiring contracts above certain thresholds to be opened up to foreign competition.
In fact, even WTO rules would be out, it seems. Economic isolationism, for a country that is extremely reliant on imports for essentials such as food and clothes? Really?

The same policies Benn supported.

The PLP would be kicking up a fuss, if any of them took Corbyn seriously.

Neatly encapsulated summary of why Corbyn and the loony left have no clue whatsoever about Brexit or the realities of the modern world.

Not exactly a shock given Corbyn failed his A levels, got a job at a union and then spent the rest of his life sitting on the back benches or in SWP meetings.

Yes WTO rules ban state aid, just ask Boeing.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 9:13 pm

*applauds wildly*

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

never mind the fact that he's the head of a charity and they're supposed to be politically neutral.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 9:27 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-39568458" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Landlord adverts posted online 'target young for sex'

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 9:35 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:*applauds wildly*

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

never mind the fact that he's the head of a charity and they're supposed to be politically neutral.

It is a fair point, but Young is also, annoyingly, technically correct.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 9:38 pm

HindleA wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-39568458

Landlord adverts posted online 'target young for sex'

How is this legal? Never mind morals like how could anybody actually consider inflicting this sort of misery on another human being.

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 9:43 pm

'The Loony Left'

Why does this forum attract such people?

It seems to becoming Con Home on here!

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 9:51 pm

howsillyofme1 wrote:'The Loony Left'

Why does this forum attract such people?

It seems to becoming Con Home on here!

Your shouty attacks still aren't a good look.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:07 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/science/201 ... ladus-nasa" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Small Saturn moon has most conditions needed to sustain life, Nasa says
Space organization finds that hydrogen erupts out of underground ocean on Enceladus, meaning it has the water, chemistry and energy sources life requires

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:14 pm

TechnicalEphemera wrote:
RogerOThornhill wrote:*applauds wildly*

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

never mind the fact that he's the head of a charity and they're supposed to be politically neutral.
It is a fair point, but Young is also, annoyingly, technically correct.

Well, Corbyn tried not to. And Milne sent his kids private.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:16 pm

Tesco sorry for Good Friday beer advert

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-39587226" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:18 pm

TechnicalEphemera wrote:
howsillyofme1 wrote:'The Loony Left'

Why does this forum attract such people?

It seems to becoming Con Home on here!
Your shouty attacks still aren't a good look.

Though as you said about Toby Young, he arguably has a point on this occasion. Let's leave "loony left" for the Tory tabloids, ta

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:23 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-cana ... ow_twitter" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Canada unveils plans to legalise recreational marijuana

Initially, only fresh and dried cannabis, cannabis oils, seeds and plants would be licensed for sale, but adults could grow up to four plants and make edibles at home for their personal use.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:33 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
TechnicalEphemera wrote:
howsillyofme1 wrote:'The Loony Left'

Why does this forum attract such people?

It seems to becoming Con Home on here!
Your shouty attacks still aren't a good look.
Though as you said about Toby Young, he arguably has a point on this occasion. Let's leave "loony left" for the Tory tabloids, ta

How else do you describe people who clearly have no clue how the world works and come up with economic statements as set out above?

Leave the WTO is now recommended policy? How do you campaign on that and not get laughed out of the room?

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:34 pm

Isn't it OK to explore what a more left wing EU might look like? There must be a socialist internationalist version of the world that doesn't involve untrammelled capitalism.

We always talk about THE Single Market. It's not even called that. There are a lot of other single markets that could exist. If Labour doesn't think about how these single markets might better serve the ordinary person, who will?

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:36 pm

SpinningHugo wrote:
TechnicalEphemera wrote:
RogerOThornhill wrote:*applauds wildly*

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

never mind the fact that he's the head of a charity and they're supposed to be politically neutral.
It is a fair point, but Young is also, annoyingly, technically correct.
Well, Corbyn tried not to. And Milne sent his kids private.

Not entirely happy to give Corbyn a free pass on that, but on Milne I stand corrected Toby Young was technically wrong and a twat.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:36 pm

TechnicalEphemera wrote:How else do you describe people who clearly have no clue how the world works and come up with economic statements as set out above?

Leave the WTO is now recommended policy? How do you campaign on that and not get laughed out of the room?

TE this is a FORUM. We benefit from a variety of views.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:37 pm

Call them "hard left" or "far left" if you wish - though as pointed out much (though, it must be said, *not* all) if Corbyn's declared programme is similar to Ed M's.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:41 pm

HindleA wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-cana ... ow_twitter

Canada unveils plans to legalise recreational marijuana

Initially, only fresh and dried cannabis, cannabis oils, seeds and plants would be licensed for sale, but adults could grow up to four plants and make edibles at home for their personal use.

Interesting. Native Americans are more likely to use marijuana than other Canadians. It'll be interesting to see the impact of decriminalization.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:48 pm

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Isn't it OK to explore what a more left wing EU might look like? There must be a socialist internationalist version of the world that doesn't involve untrammelled capitalism.

We always talk about THE Single Market. It's not even called that. There are a lot of other single markets that could exist. If Labour doesn't think about how these single markets might better serve the ordinary person, who will?

Yes, it is fine to explore a more left wing EU, that is to a degree what the Social Chapter was all about. Indeed the EU often cuts a deal for single market access that requires the rights of its citizens to be respected. See the huge impact of their privacy legislation.

However the single market is a set of rules that can only be changed from within the EU. To argue leaving the EU will allow us to ignore those rules (not if we want access), and to then suggest leaving the WTO for this supposed left wing single market (single as in a market of one tiny country) isn't doing that. It is simply a flight of fantasy, destroying what little economic credibility Labour has left.

Socialist interventionist single markets don't today exist in any trade block (the EU being the closest to it). Countries that tried those things in isolation pretty much all slid into debt and dictatorship.

So yes we should have a more left wing Single Market, but for now the best Labour can do is campaign to stay in the one we have. Because the alternative isn't some left wing socialist utopia, it a free market hell with Liam Shared Values Fox doing the cheerleading.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:50 pm

I don't how they are going/how practical it is to police the amount limit.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 10:52 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Call them "hard left" or "far left" if you wish - though as pointed out much (though, it must be said, *not* all) if Corbyn's declared programme is similar to Ed M's.

I think that is a disservice to the far left, a nebulous concept at best. We have a loony right (Peter Bone) and we call it as such.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:03 pm

https://talkpoverty.org/2017/04/13/wash ... ain-wrong/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Washington Post’s Data on Social Security Disability is Just Plain Wrong

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:05 pm

Seems to a World Wide phenomena,regardless of stance,to be honest.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:05 pm

PorFavor wrote:
US drops largest non-nuclear bomb on Isis affiliate in Afghanistan, military says

GBU-43/B, known as the ‘mother of all bombs’, dropped for the first time, to target ‘tunnel complex’ used by Islamic State in Khorosan (Guardian)
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... amic-state

Just read that over yonder
I gasped and I'm crying
terrible terrible thing

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:09 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ist-united" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Our Brexit-driven disregard for Ireland is perilous

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:10 pm

HindleA wrote:https://talkpoverty.org/2017/04/13/wash ... ain-wrong/

The Washington Post’s Data on Social Security Disability is Just Plain Wrong

That is pretty damning. Not only wrong, but in many cases the data isn't even recorded.

The problem is there is no real penalty for publishing rubbish studies. Remember all this austerity stuff, nobody remembers its economic rationale was blown away by a simple Excel error in the original study.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:17 pm

TechnicalEphemera wrote:How else do you describe people who clearly have no clue how the world works and come up with economic statements as set out above?

Leave the WTO is now recommended policy? How do you campaign on that and not get laughed out of the room?

Ignorant, or maybe liars but not necessarily motivated by wickedness. I didn't understand anything about fundamental economic reality at all until a couple of years ago. I'm University educated and it wasn't a bad institution. I just know a little now, not much at all. I know enough to know you're right. It's hard, TE. It's in some powerful people’s interests to keep people ignorant.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:19 pm

TechnicalEphemera wrote:
HindleA wrote:https://talkpoverty.org/2017/04/13/wash ... ain-wrong/

The Washington Post’s Data on Social Security Disability is Just Plain Wrong
That is pretty damning. Not only wrong, but in many cases the data isn't even recorded.

The problem is there is no real penalty for publishing rubbish studies. Remember all this austerity stuff, nobody remembers its economic rationale was blown away by a simple Excel error in the original study.

You've every right to expect rational responses to current information. We all do. We're not getting rational policy or action from leadership.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:28 pm

In British context,in does my nut in,that even in sympathetic pieces they get the fundamentals wrong,granted such things as being on out of work benefits does not mean you are out of work,indeed may mean that despite not even expected to,you are, doesn't help and requires explanation,but on such things,misanthropic policy is so much easier to follow and secure support for.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:30 pm

HindleA wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-39568458

Landlord adverts posted online 'target young for sex'

It'll be a cinch. Tory government have created the perfect conditions for those no longer entitled to receive social security assistance. Sickening.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:31 pm

citizenJA wrote:
TechnicalEphemera wrote:
HindleA wrote:https://talkpoverty.org/2017/04/13/wash ... ain-wrong/

The Washington Post’s Data on Social Security Disability is Just Plain Wrong
That is pretty damning. Not only wrong, but in many cases the data isn't even recorded.

The problem is there is no real penalty for publishing rubbish studies. Remember all this austerity stuff, nobody remembers its economic rationale was blown away by a simple Excel error in the original study.
You've every right to expect rational responses to current information. We all do. We're not getting rational policy or action from leadership.

It is clearly not a day for rationality.

From the pages of ~~Hello Magazine~~ The Guardian

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... y-star-gps

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:35 pm

Yep, that's junk.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:41 pm

Not sure,the kettle just clicked,from seemingly nowhere the idea of a cup of tea came into my head.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:43 pm

The worlds greatest PR disaster rumbles on. Journalists are now collecting and publishing peoples bad experiences on United Airlines.

You can imagine how well that is going for the airline.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:49 pm

Please resist personally denigrating the current Labour leader's CV and education
What good does it do?
Dispassionate, relevant criticisms will likely get better results
Or not what do I know

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:53 pm

TechnicalEphemera wrote:The worlds greatest PR disaster rumbles on. Journalists are now collecting and publishing peoples bad experiences on United Airlines.

You can imagine how well that is going for the airline.

It's not bothering me at all witnessing a belligerent corporation having lost the plot get its comeuppance in real time

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 13 Apr, 2017 11:58 pm

Goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA

Post by **refitman** » Fri 14 Apr, 2017 12:48 am

TechnicalEphemera wrote: It is clearly not a day for rationality.

From the pages of ~~Hello Magazine~~ The Guardian

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... y-star-gps

Seems pretty standard fare for the Lost In Showbiz column. Normally Marina Hyde taking the piss though.