Friday, 2nd June 2017

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 5:52 am

Good morfternoon.

NonOxCol's link (last night) to the Owen Jones thing is intriguing.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 7:40 am

If all else fails, talk about Len McCluskey.

Len McCluskey, one of Jeremy Corbyn’s closest allies and leader of Britain’s biggest union, is facing claims that his re-election in April should be declared void because of multiple rule breaches.

McCluskey’s support has been seen as vital to maintaining Corbyn’s leadership of Labour over two years of challenges from senior MPs. (Politics Live, Guardian)

NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 7:53 am

Morning. Thanks PF - I do urge people to read it because I suspect you ain't getting anything from the BBC or press.

Meanwhile, here's some shit-hot right-wing takes on Trump and Paris:

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NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 7:58 am

(By the way, those hot takes are in the wrong order, like a Pointless jackpot win on the first answer...!)

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 8:44 am

The BBC blurb on today's Radio 4 Woman's Hour (10 am) -

Woman's Hour has invited the leaders of the political parties to talk about their manifestos ahead of the General Election and what they would do for women. Jenni is joined by the leader of the Liberal Democrats Tim Farron.

We also talk to Justine Greening about the Conservative Party's manifesto. Amber Rudd had been due to take part. Theresa May declined our earlier invitation. (BBC radio schedule listing)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08rp395

Edited - tidy up

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 8:45 am

Morning all.

I like this from Michael Deacon - the logic of May's position is something she clearly can't grasp...

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RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 8:54 am

https://twitter.com/jackseale/status/870409176857681920

Jack Seale‏
@jackseale
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Imagine paying £80k tax on your £850k inheritance, leaving you with a mere £770,000. Horrific scenario for ordinary hardworking families

Yes, there's very much a sense of "How dare you take money away from me which I didn't do anything to earn but benefit by accident of birth!"

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 9:15 am

RogerOThornhill wrote:https://twitter.com/jackseale/status/870409176857681920

Jack Seale‏
@jackseale
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Imagine paying £80k tax on your £850k inheritance, leaving you with a mere £770,000. Horrific scenario for ordinary hardworking families

Yes, there's very much a sense of "How dare you take money away from me which I didn't do anything to earn but benefit by accident of birth!"

This is good on inheritance tax

https://www.lrb.co.uk/v27/n11/david-run ... -murderers" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

with a dig at blair most here will like.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 9:34 am

Why did the Conservatives pick Theresa May as their leader? They must have known, up close, what she was like. I thought she'd be ok (for them, that is) but I don't know her. They do. Puzzles me.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 9:38 am

Rebecca Long-Bailey, the shadow business secretary, will be speaking alongside Corbyn and she will say:

Unlike the Conservatives, Labour will make full use of all policy levers to drive growth and economic development, working in partnership with the private sector and trade unions to rebalance our economy so that it serves the many, not just the few.

Labour’s industrial strategy will have real muscle, powered by our National Transformation Fund and £250bn of investment from our new National Investment Bank and network of Regional Development Banks.

We will deliver a million good jobs over the course of the next parliament.
(Politics Live, Guardian)

Finance, numbers and a time-frame. Pathetic.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 9:40 am

PorFavor wrote:Good morfternoon.

NonOxCol's link (last night) to the Owen Jones thing is intriguing.

Here it is --

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Have to wait to see what happens, empty radio chairing , no programme, or a spoof ?

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 9:41 am

PorFavor wrote:Why did the Conservatives pick Theresa May as their leader? They must have known, up close, what she was like. I thought she'd be ok (for them, that is) but I don't know her. They do. Puzzles me.

I don't think they had anyone better. it was her or Andrea Leadsom.

Johnson would have been better at campaigning, but has no judgement.

They really are utterly shambolic. I can't think of one positive reason they've given for voting Tory (unless you happen to hate animals).

As i still expect the tories to win comfortably, that is a bit of a worry considering the government of the country will be in their incompetent hands.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 9:44 am

Not sure about the "comfortably" bit.

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 9:48 am

PorFavor wrote:Not sure about the "comfortably" bit.

Depends what you mean.

In terms of seats, they'll get a big majority I expect, just not the crushing landslide it once looked like.

May's authority is badly damaged though, as she is clearly shit at this.

Post by **adam** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 9:55 am

SpinningHugo wrote:
PorFavor wrote:Not sure about the "comfortably" bit.
Depends what you mean.

In terms of seats, they'll get a big majority I expect, just not the crushing landslide it once looked like.

May's authority is badly damaged though, as she is clearly shit at this.

I think the labour campaign has consistently been very good and rarely better than good (or at least other than very brief things that will happen in any campaign) whilst the tories have barely hit competent most of the time. I hate to be miserable about things (no, really) and part of this is simply that I will not allow myself to believe anything else after the ways the last few elections etc have gone, but I also think they'll win a comfortable majority.

She only needs a gain of about 6 or 7 seats to claim to have the best tory result, in terms of seats, for 30 years. That's how it will be sold if she gets it - not a massive come down after huge expectations but the biggest conservative mandate for a generation. You saw what they were like after the referendum, and indeed coming together after failing to do as well as they expected in 2010 - they're very good at utilising power when they have it.

Whether the party will be happy to leave her in place for 2022 is another question but so much will happen in the next few years that it's too early to say anything sensible about it.

I am, obviously, wrong about everything and you may take heart from that if you don't like what I say.

NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:14 am

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Fucking ungrateful snowflakes.

"After all we've done for you since 2009".

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:27 am

NonOxCol wrote:

Fucking ungrateful snowflakes.

"After all we've done for you since 2009".

The thing I find baffling is when they whine that an audience in a particular part of the country isn't representative of the country as a whole. Why on earth should it be?

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:31 am

Ooh!

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The Telegraph‏Verified account
@Telegraph
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#BREAKING: Conservative candidate Craig Mackinlay has been charged over 2015 election expenses. More to follow

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:33 am

Conservative MP Craig Mackinlay, who was interviewed under caution over election expenses in South Thanet, has been charged. (Sky News)

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:34 am

Good news. Great timing.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:35 am

@RogerOThornhill

Snap. As usual. I think I should leave these things to you - you're quicker.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:37 am

PorFavor wrote:@RogerOThornhill

Snap. As usual. I think I should leave these things to you - you're quicker.

Nah, it's so good to see it twice...

From Chris Cook.

This was absolutely *not* expected to happen.

This was not expected to happen *by the Tories*.

Oh dear...

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:39 am

Here is the CPS statement in full. It’s from Nick Vamos, its head of special crime.

On 18 April we received a file of evidence from Kent Police concerning allegations relating to Conservative party expenditure during the 2015 general election campaign. We then asked for additional enquiries to be made in advance of the 11 June statutory time limit by when any charges needed to be authorised.

Those enquiries have now been completed and we have considered the evidence in accordance with the Code for Crown Prosecutors.

We have concluded there is sufficient evidence and it is in the public interest to authorise charges against three people.

Craig Mackinlay, 50, Nathan Gray, 28, and Marion Little, 62, have each been charged with offences under the Representation of the People Act 1983 and are due to appear at Westminster Magistrates’ Court on 4 July 2017.

Criminal proceedings have now commenced and it is extremely important that there should be no reporting, commentary or sharing of information online which could in any way prejudice these proceedings. (Politics Live, Guardian - my emphasis)

Edited - tidy up

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:44 am

PorFavor wrote:Conservative MP Craig Mackinlay, who was interviewed under caution over election expenses in South Thanet, has been charged. (Sky News)

<pedant mode on> There is no such thing as an MP at the moment <pedant mode off>

Now, as you were

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:45 am

10:39

The decision to charge Craig Mackinlay does not stop him being a candidate in next week’s election. His name is on the ballot for the poll and that does not change. (Politics Live, Guardian)

Should this not read:

"The decision to charge Craig Mackinlay does not stop him being a losing candidate in next week’s election. His name is on the ballot for the poll and that does not change"?

Edited - bit of a punctuation challenge

NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:45 am

Needless to say, 12 hours later, we're still waiting for the "individual statement" "due any minute"...

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StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:48 am

Charges against Little look really bad?

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:48 am

And you know who played a major role in Mackinlay's campaign (even if they have avoided getting charged)? Tim Nickothy, that's who.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:54 am

I can just picture Crick having a cheeky grin about now.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 10:57 am

Keir Starmer allowing Dominic Raab (and others) to talk all over him on Sky News. He (KS) needs to be more assertive. He's not really getting a look-in. Smiling beatifically doesn't achieve anything.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:04 am

Good-morning, everyone

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:04 am

Question Time will have to be ultra careful there's nothing prejudicial said about these charges tonight.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:08 am

StephenDolan wrote:Charges against Little look really bad?

She's the one to go after!

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:09 am

The MSM will desperately try and keep the focus on Mackinlay, who can be painted as a desperate lone candidate fighting a nasty battle against Farage.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:20 am

StephenDolan wrote:Question Time will have to be ultra careful there's nothing prejudicial said about these charges tonight.

Yes. Bit of a dent for the Conservatives, though. I hope Theresa May is feeling strong and stable enough to turn up.

NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:25 am

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This is obviously a rhetorical question, and the second response is absolutely spot on.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:34 am

AnatolyKasparov wrote:And you know who played a major role in Mackinlay's campaign (even if they have avoided getting charged)? Tim Nickothy, that's who.

Yes - but Len McCluskey . . .

Eric_WLothian · Post by **Eric_WLothian** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:37 am

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
PorFavor wrote:Conservative MP Craig Mackinlay, who was interviewed under caution over election expenses in South Thanet, has been charged. (Sky News)
<pedant mode on> There is no such thing as an MP at the moment <pedant mode off>

Now, as you were

<super pedant mode on> He was Craig Mackinlay MP when interviewed under caution in March. <super pedant mode off>

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:40 am

Eric_WLothian wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
PorFavor wrote:Conservative MP Craig Mackinlay, who was interviewed under caution over election expenses in South Thanet, has been charged. (Sky News)
<pedant mode on> There is no such thing as an MP at the moment <pedant mode off>

Now, as you were
<super pedant mode on> He was Craig Mackinlay MP when interviewed under caution in March. <super pedant mode off>

I think I said that (above). Well, alright, not the March bit . . .

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:40 am

PorFavor wrote:Keir Starmer allowing Dominic Raab (and others) to talk all over him on Sky News. He (KS) needs to be more assertive. He's not really getting a look-in. Smiling beatifically doesn't achieve anything.

Given that its Raab, maybe its a case of "give themselves enough rope to hang themselves" in operation?

Eric_WLothian · Post by **Eric_WLothian** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 11:55 am

PorFavor wrote:
Eric_WLothian wrote:[quote="AnatolyKasparov
<pedant mode on> There is no such thing as an MP at the moment <pedant mode off>
Now, as you were
<super pedant mode on> He was Craig Mackinlay MP when interviewed under caution in March. <super pedant mode off>

I think I said that (above). Well, alright, not the March bit . . .[/quote]

Yes - I was just having a gentle dig at AK's response. No offence (or plagiarism) intended.

(and now I've had to drop your original quote because of the three-quote rule)!
edited to add: screwing up the nesting in the process.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 12:00 pm

Well. Another outlier.

Britain Elects @britainelects

Westminster voting intention:

CON: 45% (-4)
LAB: 40% (+6)
LDEM: 7% (-)

(via @IpsosMori)
Chgs. w/ mid May

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 12:06 pm

Ouch.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tom Newton Dunn‏Verified account
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Tom Newton Dunn Retweeted George Osborne
The Standard could really get to the bottom of these expenses allegations and interview the Tory who ran the 2015 campaign. Oh hang on...

Good to see a bit of Tory infighting here...

Eric_WLothian · Post by **Eric_WLothian** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 12:08 pm

Looks like some of the more prominent SNP MPs may be on shaky ground (although the headline is too definite):

General Election Poll: Angus Robertson set to lose Moray seat

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/g ... -1-4464050" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

SNP must be strapped for cash though (from a couple of weeks ago):

Alex Salmond’s campaign to be reelected as MP for the Gordon constituency has received a boost after his online crowdfunder surpassed its target. The former First Minister aimed to raise £5,000 by June 4 but has comfortably reached that ammount with weeks to spare.

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/g ... -1-4451152" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 12:17 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... withdrawal" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Paris agreement: Europe and China vow to keep fighting global warming

(as opposed to England and some bits of America (but not New York or Pittsburg)

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 12:19 pm

It has to be said that Ed is very good at Twitter...

Ed Miliband‏Verified account
@Ed_Miliband
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Ed Miliband Retweeted Christopher Hope
.@WestEndJCP Can I report someone who has failed to attend two job interviews in 48 hours. I know where she lives. What is the sanction?

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 12:25 pm

Here's another one -

A new Ipsos MORI poll is out. Joe Murphy has written it up for the Evening Standard and it shows the Conservative lead at just five points, down 10 from when Ipsos MORI polled in the middle of last month.

Here are the figures:

Conservatives: 45% (down 4)

Labour: 40% (up 6)

Lib Dems: 7% (no change) (Politics Live, Guardian)

Edited to add -

Or the same one again?

NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 12:32 pm

This is the writer of the 'Liar Liar' protest song:

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Put it next to the BBC journalist Owen Jones spoke to about May and local radio...

and responses to this:

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AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 12:34 pm

MORI's pre-"adjusted" figures have a Labour lead

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 02 Jun, 2017 12:36 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
PorFavor wrote:Keir Starmer allowing Dominic Raab (and others) to talk all over him on Sky News. He (KS) needs to be more assertive. He's not really getting a look-in. Smiling beatifically doesn't achieve anything.
Given that its Raab, maybe its a case of "give themselves enough rope to hang themselves" in operation?

Starmer trying not to burst into hearty laughter