Saturday 10th & Sunday 11th June 2017

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 5:39 pm

Pleasing turn of phrase ... oh ... too late, sorry PF

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 5:41 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:Pleasing turn of phrase ... oh ... too later, sorry PF

It's probably better than being previouser . . .

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 5:47 pm

(innocent of illicit editing emoticon)

Post by **refitman** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 5:51 pm

RIP Batman.

Post by **refitman** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 5:56 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
Some Tory (Guardian Live):
“Our manifesto was all about what we’ll stop them having and what we’ll not give them and what’s good for them and that’s frankly electoral poison and a complete disaster...there had not been appropriate consultation on it...and when you have to explain that you’re not taking food from children’s mouths and taking homes from your core supporters, then you’re losing an election.
Hands up anyone who remembers a Tory manifesto that wasn't all about telling the plebs what we can't have, because it would be inappropriate to tax the wealthy/ corporations.

et 'kin' c.

Stuart Jackson, who also says that since losing his seat, he hasn't heard from May or Sir Patrick McLoughlin (party chairman).

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 5:57 pm

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/lo ... 83171.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
London Bridge attack: NHS staff praised for preventing death toll rising after dozens critically hurt
Doctors revealed they were able to keep the death toll to a minimum because they are so used to dealing with stab wounds seen during London's knife crime epidemic

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:05 pm

I was going to watch BBC Newsnight. But - guess who they'll be speaking to.

Edited - typo

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:08 pm

What is it with the BBC and Farage ?

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:11 pm

Stewart Jackson is a complete merchant banker (rhyming slang) though. And has one of the most risible comb-overs ever

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:13 pm

https://twitter.com/iankatz1000" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Nicholas Watt says DUP will demand that the Tories drop benefit cuts.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:27 pm

yahyah wrote:https://twitter.com/iankatz1000

Nicholas Watt says DUP will demand that the Tories drop benefit cuts.

Followed your link and spotted this -

Ian Katz‏Verified account @iankatz1000 16m16 minutes ago

.@nicholaswatt says snr Tory figures prepared for "all eventualities" during Thurs night even drafting resignation speech for PM #newsnigh

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:30 pm

https://www.indy100.com/article/dup-wik ... al-7783711" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
DUP's wikipedia page keeps being somewhat embroidered by people who aren't delighted by them

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:40 pm

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
Willow904 wrote:@SpinningHugo

Brexit-wise, things are at least less gloomy than they were 2 days ago. Nigel Farage and Rupert Murdoch were not happy bunnies yesterday.

More importantly, after a long, surreal year where the Tories have shown a remarkably united front on Europe, the cracks are starting to appear. We have Ed Vaizey suggesting a softer approach may be needed, as Anna Soubry suggests May should consider her position and George Osborne lobs in hand grenades from his position at the Evening Standard.

Brexit cut across traditional left/right political positions and still has the potential to disrupt old loyalties and long standing political coalitions. The remarkable thing to me, thus far, was how little this had hitherto affected the Tories compared to Labour, presumably because of the less equivocal position of the majority of Tory voters. That there is even a hint that might be about to change is encouraging to me.
Yes I hope so.

The other thing that I feel is rarely discussed is the pressure within the rest of the EU for change, for example Macron had a list of proposals in his manifesto. My hope is that the UK starts to pull back from May's hard Brexit and starts to explore other options that may currently appear unachievable. With proper negotiations and discourse, the gap between Brexit Britain and the rest of the EU could narrow to the point where leaving becomes largely pointless.

I'm not saying I think this will happen, but that it could. The result would be a better EU with the UK still in it.

Paul -- that's the dream solution that has also crossed my mind !

Shame on me , I haven't read the Macron manifesto , but have noticed that Yanis Varoufakis has a lot of time for him . And for Corbyn too.

Let's See how the economy goes in the next few months, with my own hope that the Tories are still 'in charge' of the bordel .

NonOxCol · Post by **NonOxCol** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:41 pm

yahyah wrote:What is it with the BBC and Farage ?

FFS. What possible relevance does he have to what is clearly the most pressing issue this weekend (the DUP)?

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:44 pm

Labour should have won against May’s ‘open goal’, says MP

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -open-goal" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

‘Not good enough!’ Labour ex-minister blasts Jeremy Corbyn despite strong election performance

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics ... 61876.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I heard the Weasel Chris Leslie on Toady this morning, and SEETHED.

Little shit . When he lost in 2005, up came a cushy number .in a Blairite thinktank , and now there is a well-funded little anti-Corbyn sideline for the family —

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 93556.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Ex Lib Dem peer one of the biggest donors to new anti-Corbyn Labour campaign

Little shit X 2 !

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:45 pm

Gavin Barwell appointed as new Downing St. Chief of Staff.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 6:58 pm

Leslie would likely have been deselected had the previous parliament ran its full course. One of the reasons to regret that it didn't.

He is now a totally powerless irrelevance, almost as good. Ignore him.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:11 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Leslie would likely have been deselected had the previous parliament ran its full course. One of the reasons to regret that it didn't.

He is now a totally powerless irrelevance, almost as good. Ignore him.

AK -- none of us get on the Toady programme, and into at least two newspapers , just at the right moment

I like to keep track of the saboteurs .

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:37 pm

DUP agrees 'confidence' deal with Tories (BBC News website)

That's all there is at the moment.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:39 pm

But here's the link, in any case -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-40236152

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:40 pm

Glad that the DUP have confidence in the Tories, because nobody else has!

I'm here all week etc.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:48 pm

Will "eight seats short of an overall majority" catch on as the new "picnic short of a sandwich"?

Edited - tidy up

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:51 pm

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/s ... 026879ec5e" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Simon Schama has issued a blistering assessment of Theresa May’s ability to conduct Brexit negotiations by suggesting the UK would be better represented by “someone at random out of the Yellow Pages.”

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:51 pm

“You cannot possibly have someone as incompetent, spectacularly incompetent, as Theresa May has proved themselves going into the negotiations for Brexit,” he added.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:53 pm

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/d ... s-10600796" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
DUP makes 'outline agreement' with Tories to prop up Theresa May's government after general election humiliation
The Democratic Unionist Party will have a "confidence and supply" arrangement with the Conservatives, but the deal stops short of a formal coalition

Post by **refitman** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:58 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/d ... s-10600796
DUP makes 'outline agreement' with Tories to prop up Theresa May's government after general election humiliation
The Democratic Unionist Party will have a "confidence and supply" arrangement with the Conservatives, but the deal stops short of a formal coalition

They've learnt from the Lib Dems.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 7:58 pm

So the "coalition is better than confidence and supply" argument didn't hold sway, then.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:06 pm

"Strong and stable" has now seamlessly morphed into "stability and certainty". I feel so much better.

Edited to add -

[Downing Street said]“We welcome this commitment, which can provide the stability and certainty the whole country requires as we embark on Brexit and beyond. The details will be put forward for discussion and agreement at a Cabinet meeting on Monday.” (Guardian)

Just in case anyone was wondering.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:13 pm

Bumboils.

Post by **refitman** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:16 pm

PorFavor wrote:Bumboils.

FIFY

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:19 pm

Article 50: the trigger that never was?
With the start of Brexit negotiations drawing closer David Wolchover argues that the Prime Minister has not triggered Art 50 of the Treaty on European Union

On 29 March Sir Tim Barrow delivered a letter from the UK Prime Minister Theresa May to European Council President Donald Tusk purporting to give notice under Art 50(2) of the Treaty on European Union of Britain’s decision to quit the EU.

Extraordinary as it may seem, this article argues there was no legal basis for such notice, the letter had no legal effect and it completely failed in its declared purpose. In short, Art 50 has not been activated. The letter was a faux trigger, a chimera, an illusion, not the real thing.

https://www.counselmagazine.co.uk/artic ... -never-was" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:29 pm

@AngryAsWell

Thanks for the link. I started but I couldn't finish - I'll have another go tomorrow! (Not that I'm any sort of legal expert.)

Edited to add-

Or any other sort of expert

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:29 pm

Graun Live

The announcement that the government will be looking at a confidence and supply deal rather than a full coalition comes after a number of concerns were raised by Tory MPs about anything more formal.

Ruth Davidson, the Conservative leader in Scotland, stressed that she did not want to see an arrangement that would weaken the government’s position over equality. In particular, the concerns focus on the Democratic Unionist party’s opposition to gay marriage and extending abortion rights.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:42 pm

On Gavin Barwell's appointment as Downing Street chief of staff -

The move also shows an attempt to reach out to Tories who lost their seat after claims that May has failed to show contrition. (Guardian)

She can't give them all a job in Downing Street, surely?

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:42 pm

PorFavor wrote:@AngryAsWell

Thanks for the link. I started but I couldn't finish - I'll have another go tomorrow! (Not that I'm any sort of legal expert.)

Edited to add-

Or any other sort of expert

Must admit I don't understand it all but (seems) to say that there should have been a vote in parliament (in favour of leaving EU) before A50 sent.
Posted to see if SH had any view on it.
I have seen this argument on twitter before and a lawyer I follow thinks this aspect will be picked up to be clarified before negotiations start. He seemed to be having a joke about it with an EU MEP a couple of weeks ago.

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:52 pm

Is the plan to see what Hugo says and then assume the opposite is the case?

He does have a very good record of being wrong

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:53 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... servatives" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Forget religion: DUP’s support for Tories is about the money
The ultra-conservative DUP will strike a hard bargain with Theresa May’s Conservatives but won’t foist militant Protestantism on Westminster

Guess they must have found the magic money tree after all

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 8:59 pm

Has anyone noted that without a majority (confident & supply doesn't count as part of majority), the Tory manifesto no longer applies so HoL can block anything - including financial - they don't like the look of (that's if it gets through commons).

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 9:06 pm

If this means the present boundary changes are killed off (the DUP are spitting mad at the NI proposals) then that's one thing good to come out of this I suppose.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 9:06 pm

Night night.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 9:11 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:Has anyone noted that without a majority (confident & supply doesn't count as part of majority), the Tory manifesto no longer applies so HoL can block anything - including financial - they don't like the look of (that's if it gets through commons).

On that subject this was posted earlier by Mark Elliot.

https://publiclawforeveryone.com/2017/0 ... arliament/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 9:21 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:Has anyone noted that without a majority (confident & supply doesn't count as part of majority), the Tory manifesto no longer applies so HoL can block anything - including financial - they don't like the look of (that's if it gets through commons).
On that subject this was posted earlier by Mark Elliot.

https://publiclawforeveryone.com/2017/0 ... arliament/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thank you

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 9:48 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:
RogerOThornhill wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:Has anyone noted that without a majority (confident & supply doesn't count as part of majority), the Tory manifesto no longer applies so HoL can block anything - including financial - they don't like the look of (that's if it gets through commons).
On that subject this was posted earlier by Mark Elliot.

https://publiclawforeveryone.com/2017/0 ... arliament/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thank you

Salisbury Convention iirc.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 9:54 pm

http://news.sky.com/story/why-the-torie ... n-10911525" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The 30 Tory seats with the slimmest majorities

1. Southampton Itchen (31 majority, Labour second)
2. Richmond Park (45 majority, Lib Dems second)
3. Stirling (148 majority, SNP second)
4. St Ives (312 majority, Lib Dems second)
5. Pudsey (331 majority, Labour second)
6. Hastings & Rye (346 majority, Labour second)
7. Chipping Barnet (353 majority, Labour second)
8. Thurrock (345 majority, Labour second)
9. Preseli Pembrokeshire (314 majority, Labour second)
10. Calder Valley (609 majority, Labour second)
11. Norwich North (507 majority, Labour second)
12. Broxtowe (865 majority, Labour second)
13. Stoke-on-Trent South (663 majority, Labour second)
14. Telford (720 majority, Labour second)
15. Bolton West (936 majority, Labour second)
16. Aberconwy (635 majority, Labour second)
17. Northampton North (807 majority, Labour second)
18. Hendon (1,072 majority, Labour second)
19. Mansfield (1,057 majority, Labour second)
20. Middlesbrough South & Cleveland East (1,020 majority, Labour second)
21. Milton Keynes South (1,725 majority, Labour second)
22. Northampton South (1,159 majority, Labour second)
23. Pendle (1,279 majority, Labour second)
24. Milton Keynes North (1,915 majority, Labour second)
25. Morecambe & Lunesdale (1,399 majority, Labour second)
26. Finchley & Golders Green (1,657 majority, Labour second)
27. Camborne & Redruth (1,577 majority, Labour second)
28. Putney (1,554 majority, Labour second)
29. Harrow East (1,757 majority, Labour second)
30. Watford (2,092 majority, Labour second)

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 10:03 pm

howsillyofme1 wrote:Is the plan to see what Hugo says and then assume the opposite is the case?

He does have a very good record of being wrong

You forgot to add that you do not believe that he has had a knee operation ,

or IF he did , that you hope it is very very painful .

Careless !

A few of you people are the most spiteful and mean-minded I've seen on the internet, like a gang of kids persecuting in a school playground .

IF SH is a troll you , supposedly all being adults, are not obliged to play his game .

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 10:08 pm

frog222 wrote:
howsillyofme1 wrote:Is the plan to see what Hugo says and then assume the opposite is the case?

He does have a very good record of being wrong
You forgot to add that you do not believe that he has had a knee operation ,

or IF he did , that you hope it is very very painful .

Careless !

A few of you people are the most spiteful and mean-minded I've seen on the internet, like a gang of kids persecuting in a school playground .

IF SH is a troll you , supposedly all being adults, are not obliged to play his game .

Get back in your box! Some people on here produce some over the top and hysterical posts

Hugo is wrong on virtually every call he makes but still gives his opinion in a style that is arrogant and dismissive of all dissenting views

My comment was a statement of fact - I look at an opinion of Hugo's and assume it is wrong as he is has shown himself to be so in most cases

I have no view on his knee - in fact, I am not sure what the relevancy is to anything

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 10:12 pm

Oh dear...

Britain Elects‏
@britainelects
Following
More
Theresa May ties with Jeremy Corbyn on who would make best Prime Minister:

[via YouGov / Sunday Times front page. Actual figures to follow]

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 10:16 pm

oh look the country's falling apart.
over there!
look!

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 10:17 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:Oh dear...

Britain Elects‏
@britainelects
Following
More
Theresa May ties with Jeremy Corbyn on who would make best Prime Minister:

[via YouGov / Sunday Times front page. Actual figures to follow]

That is literally hilarious.
But my god the-will-of-the-people is a difficult to discern.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sat 10 Jun, 2017 10:18 pm

pleasing turn of phrase ...