Friday 11th August 2017

Post by **refitman** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 7:09 am

Morning all.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 9:21 am

Good morfternoon.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 10:01 am

Noonret from doog.

You see, it's a palindrome, like Bolton.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 10:45 am

Good morning all, anything happening this morning?

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 11:14 am

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Good morning all, anything happening this morning?

If it is, then the press is colluding in the "silly season" thing. Part of me thinks that there must be something happening. The other part of me thinks that, despite "Brexit" (am I allowed to say that?), the government really has ceased all activity for the hols. After all, there's nothing urgent that needs attending to.

Oh, and war games.

Edited - typo

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 11:36 am

AH finally getting some much needed shut eye I hope?

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 12:07 pm

https://www.rt.com/uk/399292-venezuela- ... arms-sale/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Unlike the conflict in Yemen, which is barely acknowledged by British politicians, the civil unrest gripping the socialist republic of Venezuela has drawn the pious condemnation of ministers. So why is the UK still selling weapons to Caracas?

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 12:38 pm

tinybgoat wrote:https://www.rt.com/uk/399292-venezuela- ... arms-sale/
Unlike the conflict in Yemen, which is barely acknowledged by British politicians, the civil unrest gripping the socialist republic of Venezuela has drawn the pious condemnation of ministers. So why is the UK still selling weapons to Caracas?

Somebody condemn someone. Quick!

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 1:01 pm

tinybgoat wrote:https://www.rt.com/uk/399292-venezuela- ... arms-sale/
Unlike the conflict in Yemen, which is barely acknowledged by British politicians, the civil unrest gripping the socialist republic of Venezuela has drawn the pious condemnation of ministers. So why is the UK still selling weapons to Caracas?

Yes. Crackers, isn't it?

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 1:05 pm

Tata Steel set to unveil new pension scheme for tens of thousands of workers

Scheme to replace British steel pension scheme expected to clear way for Tata to merge European business with ThyssenKrupp

A spokesman for the steel trade unions told the Press Association: “If accurate, we welcome this development which will lead to certainty for scheme members following a year of unprecedented turmoil. (Guardian)

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... of-workers

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 1:08 pm

Donald Trump (re North Korea) is "locked and loaded" (Sky News).

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 1:21 pm

Awful Jeffrey Lord sacked by CNN.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 2:02 pm

PorFavor wrote:
tinybgoat wrote:https://www.rt.com/uk/399292-venezuela- ... arms-sale/
Unlike the conflict in Yemen, which is barely acknowledged by British politicians, the civil unrest gripping the socialist republic of Venezuela has drawn the pious condemnation of ministers. So why is the UK still selling weapons to Caracas?
Yes. Crackers, isn't it?

Some people actually seriously pushing the "selling them arms isn't as bad as saying nice things about them" take on Twitter.

I'm done

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 2:25 pm

Migrant rescue ship sails to aid of stranded far-right activists

German NGO says its rescue vessel is sailing to help a group of anti-immigration activists after their ship got into trouble off the coast of Libya (Guardian)

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... -activists

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 2:32 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
tinybgoat wrote:https://www.rt.com/uk/399292-venezuela- ... arms-sale/
Unlike the conflict in Yemen, which is barely acknowledged by British politicians, the civil unrest gripping the socialist republic of Venezuela has drawn the pious condemnation of ministers. So why is the UK still selling weapons to Caracas?
Yes. Crackers, isn't it?

Some people actually seriously pushing the "selling them arms isn't as bad as saying nice things about them" take on Twitter.

I'm done

[/quote]

Who?

SpinningHugo · Post by **SpinningHugo** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 2:32 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:]https://www.rt.com/uk/399292-venezuela- ... arms-sale/
Unlike the conflict in Yemen, which is barely acknowledged by British politicians, the civil unrest gripping the socialist republic of Venezuela has drawn the pious condemnation of ministers. So why is the UK still selling weapons to Caracas?

Some people actually seriously pushing the "selling them arms isn't as bad as saying nice things about them" take on Twitter.

I'm done

Who?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 2:41 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:AH finally getting some much needed shut eye I hope?

Recovering from a traumatic haircut experience.It has gone up 50p,I did argue it was the same amount of hair as last time,to no avail.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 2:43 pm

Not interested in responding to bad faith insinuations tbh.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:22 pm

School inspections and outcomes: management information

https://www.gov.uk/government/statistic ... s-outcomes" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:23 pm

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... plications" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Transparency data
Free schools: open schools and successful applications

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:24 pm

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... etins-2017" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Guidance
Housing Benefit general information bulletins 2017

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:25 pm

https://www.gov.uk/government/statistic ... 17#history" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Prison population figures

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:26 pm

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... model-list" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Electric Vehicle Homecharge Scheme approved chargepoint model list

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:32 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... dApp_Tweet" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

UK family found guilty of enslaving homeless and disabled people
Lincolnshire gang forced at least 18 victims to work for little or no pay and live in squalor for up to 26 years

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:35 pm

I got the sense that Maduro needed to defend himself because the US were trying to remove him via the violent opposition. Now it's bad to sell him arms to do that?

It was a bit more than "saying nice things". Corbyn and Livingstone did publicity stunts with the Chavismo crowd.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:40 pm

https://capx.co/the-housing-crisis-an-a ... self-harm/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The housing crisis: an act of devastating economic self-harm

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:43 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:I got the sense that Maduro needed to defend himself because the US were trying to remove him via the violent opposition. Now it's bad to sell him arms to do that?

It was a bit more than "saying nice things". Corbyn and Livingstone did publicity stunts with the Chavismo crowd.

You are defending the indefensible here, Tubby.

What this has demonstrated is that the government and MSM don't actually give two hoots about the genuine suffering of the Venezuelan people.

Its just a game to them.

Don't play along with it.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:55 pm

You can always make the issue the media if you want to.

Anybody says the stuff he did about another country that goes tits up, and people will come after you for it. See eg Daniel Hannan (Iceland) and George Osborne (Ireland). I reminded people of their awful judgement when the chance came. Nobody said "What do you care about Iceland?" or "What about Saudi Arabia?" And as far as I know, Hannan only wrote a stupid article about Iceland, and wassn't even aspiring to lead the Tory Party in the European Parliament, let alone be Prime Minister.

I wasn't at all happy with the implication I'd never had any interest in Venezuela, made against me with no evidence the other night. I've read and posted on it on another board, for starters. And my brother's partner is from there. I was fairly supportive until a friend off this other board told me to jump off the train before it hit the buffers. I did, and I don't have access to the advice the Leader of the Opposition has.

I think he is much more circumspect now, and fair enough.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 3:57 pm

Osborne thought Ireland's boom was down to low tax and education. He really did. Missing an unsustainable property and banking boom isn't all that different from missing an unsustainable oil boom really. Hannan though Iceland's boom was because they weren't in the EU. Which is even more bizarre.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 4:05 pm

HindleA wrote:https://www.gov.uk/government/statistic ... 17#history

Prison population figures

One of those very rare moments when you think Gove had a raw deal. I'd allow him his bit of fun with making prisons a bit like public schools- prison governors know how mitigate nonsense from ministers- if we had him reducing numbers. Not all that much, but just enough to get rid of a couple of unsuitable Victorian prisons. The proceeds from the sale could have been useful too.

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 4:05 pm

Mason is excellent on the vacuous failure at the heart of the 'moderates' ideology. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -economics" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 4:20 pm

Mason is dreadful on the economic disaster of Hard Brexit, and playing cake and eat it rubbish. We had a humane migration system before, and lots of us want to keep it. Plus the usual "Take that Europhiles, Greece, eh, eh?" as if Brexit is some form of solidarity.

The Lib Dems are shot, because of tuition fees, but the debts can be mitigated by any future government. Corbyn was right to say they could be looked at. A permanent hit to the UK by Brexit is much, much worse than that.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 4:27 pm

Wouldn't it be logical for Mason with his concern for Greece (absolutely genuine, he did extensive reporting for Channel 4 News from there) and strong opposition to austerity, to argue for the UK making cheap loans to the Greek Government?

If you don't do that, then you're basically telling other countries to take writedowns on their loans without doing anything yourself, and that's not going to come across well. I think the reason we don't hear too much about this is that Mason and others know the score. The Greek Government can't be trusted and the signal to Italy would be very dangerous.

A horrible situation for sure.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 4:35 pm

What was Lord sacked for?

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 4:44 pm

Mason.

A model based on wage stagnation, excess financial profit, relentless privatisation and stagnant productivity was always going to blow up – and that’s what happened in 2008.

Pre 2008 stagnant productivity? Complete fiction.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 5:00 pm

Mason is Mason, he's always been a mix of keen insights and arrant delusional silliness and always will be. I suppose its the inner SWPer within him

He still gets that things need to seriously change, which on its own puts him above the large majority of "centrists".

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 5:13 pm

I 'd normally agree with that, but I think Hard Brexit and the money at stake is bringing the centrists back into the game.

I fully appreciate the problem the Labour frontbench has with Brexit though.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 5:14 pm

HindleA wrote:What was Lord sacked for?

Tweeting Sieg Heil to a leftwinger.

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 5:27 pm

Whilst it's only the free charts, I am beating Voltaire in Satire, and in the top ten in Historical Fiction.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Best-Sellers-K ... =UTF8&tf=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 5:36 pm

Molly McKew‏Verified account
@MollyMcKew
CNN: North Korea about to attack Guam
MSNBC: North Korea about to attack Guam
Fox News: new search for Clinton's Benghazi emails.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 6:41 pm

https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/1 ... similarity" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Scottish Government plans for blocking benefit claimant appeals criticised for similarity to discredited DWP policy

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 7:07 pm

"This is nothing like the evil Westminister version a Tartan Tory bot said."

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 7:28 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/pic ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Martin Rowson on Donald Trump’s North Korea threat

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 7:55 pm

http://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/departme ... story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Department for Transport announces new operator for West Midlands franchise

A new train operator for the West Midlands franchise has been announced - with a number of changes in store for North Staffordshire passengers.

Changes will include

Stone, Alsager and Kidsgrove will lose their direct train to London - with passengers having to change at Stafford.
Stoke-on-Trent will also lose its budget service to the capital, but Virgin Trains will still run direct to Euston.
Trains between Crewe and London Euston will be faster as a result of fewer stops between them.
Passengers from Kidsgrove, Stone, Alsager and Stoke-on-Trent will have a new direct service to Birmingham and Wolverhampton, which will start at Crewe and also pass through Stafford and other West Midlands destinations.

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 7:55 pm

HindleA wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/pic ... are_btn_tw

Martin Rowson on Donald Trump’s North Korea threat

Rowson chooses the day that the original Humpty Dumpty blew up at the siege of Gloucester to post that.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 8:15 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... CMP=twt_gu" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Guardian view on nudity: grin and bare it
Editorial

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 8:25 pm

https://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/d ... -act-case/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

DPO plans court vigil as it intervenes in ‘hugely significant’ Care Act case

The case has been brought by Luke Davey, a disabled person with high support needs, whose support package was “slashed” after the closure of the Independent Living Fund (ILF) in June 2015.

Without adequate levels of support, more and more disabled people are existing, not living – trapped at home without support, choice or control, excluded from participating in, and contributing to, community life.

“Although the Care Act and the introduction of the wellbeing principle were meant to transform social care and put us and our wellbeing at the centre of the process, we know it does not happen in practice.

Such cuts leave disabled people at risk of harm, and cause emotional, physical and mental distress.

“This is a hugely significant moment, because disabled people through their organisation are intervening in court proceedings to make their voices heard and ensure the law which was designed to transform social care works for them.

“This case is likely to determine how the wellbeing duty, which was introduced by the Care Act, will be applied in practice and what difference it will make.”

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 9:10 pm

Ukip allows anti-Muslim activist to stand in leadership contest

National executive’s approval of Anne Marie Waters threatens to cause major divisions over party’s future direction (Guardian)

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ip-contest

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 9:53 pm

bleeding fourth

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Fri 11 Aug, 2017 10:30 pm

HindleA wrote:http://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/departme ... story.html

Department for Transport announces new operator for West Midlands franchise

A new train operator for the West Midlands franchise has been announced - with a number of changes in store for North Staffordshire passengers.

Changes will include

Stone, Alsager and Kidsgrove will lose their direct train to London - with passengers having to change at Stafford.
Stoke-on-Trent will also lose its budget service to the capital, but Virgin Trains will still run direct to Euston.
Trains between Crewe and London Euston will be faster as a result of fewer stops between them.
Passengers from Kidsgrove, Stone, Alsager and Stoke-on-Trent will have a new direct service to Birmingham and Wolverhampton, which will start at Crewe and also pass through Stafford and other West Midlands destinations.

Sounds like some good stuff, but pretty galling for those places losing their direct trains to London.

Good example though of the indirect benefits of HS2. It should be running to Crewe by 2027. That means the fastest London-Manchester trains are off this section, and more services to other places like these can run.

edit- fastest London-Liverpool trains should be off too. That's a lot of train paths.