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Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 8:48 am
by refitman
Morning all.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 8:55 am
by tinybgoat
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 47566.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Tory MP requests George Osborne is banned from party conference over Theresa May 'fridge murder' comments"
(Nadine Dorries)
edit to add, Good Morning.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 8:59 am
by tinybgoat
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -after-all" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Boris Johnson has insisted that Britain will still claw back £350m a week after leaving the EU, with much of that money preferably being spent on the NHS, as he warned critics of Brexit against treating 17.4 million voters as fools.
ironic,

also China Ummana, calls ' for a “period of silence” from the foreign secretary.'

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 10:14 am
by RogerOThornhill
Morning all. 'Er is not yet back indoors - looking like Monday.
Tim Stanley‏Verified account @timothy_stanley 13h13 hours ago
More
Charles Moore asks: "Is it time to place our future in Boris's hands and prepare for new leadership?"
No, no it isn't. And never will be.

Have they all gone mad at the DT?

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 10:18 am
by Willow904
https://inews.co.uk/opinion/i-worked-do ... young/amp/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I worked in Downing Street and this is how the Tories can help the young
I found this interesting. Did Theresa May really believe that spreading austerity to the older generation would win younger voters? Like, "I'm in huge student debt and will never be able to afford a house and the Tories aren't going to change this, but they're going to take my gran's bus pass away so it feels much fairer now so I'll vote for them after all." :roll:

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 10:39 am
by SpinningHugo
tinybgoat wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -after-all
Boris Johnson has insisted that Britain will still claw back £350m a week after leaving the EU, with much of that money preferably being spent on the NHS, as he warned critics of Brexit against treating 17.4 million voters as fools.
ironic,

also China Ummana, calls ' for a “period of silence” from the foreign secretary.'

Chukka's attempt to brand himself as the champion of Remain is ridiculous.

He voted for art 50 without conditions. He is one of the guilty.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 11:06 am
by AnatolyKasparov
As with so many "militant remainers", you sound ever more like a hard leftist two decades ago.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 11:19 am
by citizenJA
Good-morning, everyone

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 11:23 am
by PorFavor
Good morfternoon.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 11:23 am
by citizenJA
tinybgoat wrote:---
[Chuka Umunna] calls ' for a “period of silence” from the foreign secretary.'
(cJA edit)
:lol:

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 11:29 am
by citizenJA
There's something you all should know
I like Chuka Umunna
It's a personal liking, he reminds me of a friend I knew a long time ago

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 11:35 am
by PorFavor
tinybgoat wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -after-all
Boris Johnson has insisted that Britain will still claw back £350m a week after leaving the EU, with much of that money preferably being spent on the NHS, as he warned critics of Brexit against treating 17.4 million voters as fools.
ironic,

also China Ummana, calls ' for a “period of silence” from the foreign secretary.'
From the linked article -
He [Boris Johnson] said Britain would “keep environmental and social protections that are fair and wise”, but get rid of other EU regulations that, he claimed, cost between 4% and 7% of GDP.
Those words ("fair and wise") are not ones which come readily to mind when thinking of Boris Johnson. However, Theresa May might pinch this latest word-coupling to use on her Italian visit . . .

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 11:36 am
by citizenJA
PorFavor wrote:Good morfternoon.
Mr citizen was good enough to make your tea
he's handed me coffee with cream/milk

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 12:23 pm
by PorFavor
Willow904 wrote:https://inews.co.uk/opinion/i-worked-do ... young/amp/
I worked in Downing Street and this is how the Tories can help the young
I found this interesting. Did Theresa May really believe that spreading austerity to the older generation would win younger voters? Like, "I'm in huge student debt and will never be able to afford a house and the Tories aren't going to change this, but they're going to take my gran's bus pass away so it feels much fairer now so I'll vote for them after all." :roll:
I was perplexed by this bit from your linked article -
Universities are better funded and more accountable than ever before. (my emphasis)

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 12:27 pm
by adam
PorFavor wrote:I was perplexed by this bit from your linked article -
Universities are better funded and more accountable than ever before. (my emphasis)
Because they've turned students into customers who demand value for money? (I haven't read the article yet).

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 12:31 pm
by PorFavor
@adam

Well, I can only assume that that's what's implied (although I don't believe it to be so) - no explanation is put forward.


Edited to add -

That is to say, I don't believe that universities are more accountable.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 12:34 pm
by Willow904
adam wrote:
PorFavor wrote:I was perplexed by this bit from your linked article -
Universities are better funded and more accountable than ever before. (my emphasis)
Because they've turned students into customers who demand value for money? (I haven't read the article yet).
Yeah, I think that's their argument. But before the introduction of fees unis were mostly dependent on central government for their money who have a lot more clout to demand changes if they didn't feel they are getting value for money than individual "consumers"/ students do, so that's really not the case, is it.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 12:50 pm
by AnatolyKasparov
BBC referring to Johnson's "£350 million" claim as "controversial". Of course its nothing of the sort, it is and always was an outright fib.

When did they and other media outlets become infected with the idea that their obligation to provide "balanced" coverage meant being "balanced" between truth and falsehood?

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 1:08 pm
by citizenJA
T May attempted some justification for choosing Florence for her 22 September speech.
Asked why the venue had been picked, May’s spokesman said the prime minister...“The UK has had deep cultural
and economic ties spanning centuries with Florence, a city known for its historical trading power.


- Theresa May to deliver Brexit speech in Florence - Peter Walker, Guardian
For centuries, Britain's historical continental alliances don't typically include Florence but with other nations/regions in economic competition and military conflict against Italian regions.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 1:10 pm
by citizenJA
AnatolyKasparov wrote:BBC referring to Johnson's "£350 million" claim as "controversial". Of course its nothing of the sort, it is and always was an outright fib.

When did they and other media outlets become infected with the idea that their obligation to provide "balanced" coverage meant being "balanced" between truth and falsehood?
'Let's just say it's a little bit your fault and a little bit my fault' and therefore no one is held accountable for egregious wrongdoing.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 1:13 pm
by citizenJA
Individual students as education consumers don't have the power to force change

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 1:19 pm
by citizenJA
It's like expecting individuals to choose sustainable transportation, energy and food choice infrastructure through economic means
What we can't do on our own is a lot
If government declines to represent for the good of people and country, they need to go away and let someone else do it

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 2:39 pm
by AnatolyKasparov
Hodgson off to a good start at Palace, I see......

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 2:42 pm
by adam
Willow904 wrote:Yeah, I think that's their argument. But before the introduction of fees unis were mostly dependent on central government for their money who have a lot more clout to demand changes if they didn't feel they are getting value for money than individual "consumers"/ students do, so that's really not the case, is it.
& @ PF - I agree, it does nothing of the sort but I can only imagine that's the argument. Willow your point is very good and thoroughly sensible but it goes against the religion of the market and the power of consumer choice so I doubt the government will be very interested.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 3:40 pm
by AnatolyKasparov
JeSuisJuggalo?

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 3:43 pm
by PorFavor
AnatolyKasparov wrote:JeSuisJuggalo?
Stop clowning around.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 5:05 pm
by citizenJA
AnatolyKasparov wrote:JeSuisJuggalo?
Apologies, AnatolyKasparov, please let me know what you're specifically referring to posting this if you've time
It's my ignorance, not your fault
PorFavor responded with something funnier than hell, I know that for certain

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 5:13 pm
by AnatolyKasparov
Its an (anti-Trump and alt-right) clown march on today.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 5:13 pm
by PorFavor
citizenJA wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:JeSuisJuggalo?
Apologies, AnatolyKasparov, please let me know what you're specifically referring to posting this if you've time
It's my ignorance, not your fault
PorFavor responded with something funnier than hell, I know that for certain
I assumed (rightly or wrongly) that AnatolyKasparov was referring to this -
No laughing matter: clowns brace for impact of Stephen King's It (Guardian)
https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/s ... lown-craze

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 5:20 pm
by refitman
AnatolyKasparov wrote:Its an (anti-Trump and alt-right) clown march on today
I feel sorry for the couple getting married in the middle of it all.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... washington" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 5:43 pm
by citizenJA
Ah...thank you, everyone, I understand now
I decline to know Trump

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 5:44 pm
by citizenJA
refitman wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:Its an (anti-Trump and alt-right) clown march on today
I feel sorry for the couple getting married in the middle of it all.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... washington" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
'ignore him, Honey...'

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 5:47 pm
by citizenJA
@PorFavor
Scary image
Read the book years ago
it's just about right

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 6:16 pm
by PorFavor
From yesterday -
Head of scandal-hit G4S detention centres is put on administrative leave

The head of two G4S-run detention centres has been placed on administrative leave after a series of scandals, the Guardian has learned.

The news is another unfortunate milestone in a difficult period for G4S, which has faced severe criticism over its management of the two IRCs in the UK. (Guardian - my emphasis)
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... tive-leave

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 6:33 pm
by RogerOThornhill
PorFavor wrote:From yesterday -
Head of scandal-hit G4S detention centres is put on administrative leave

The head of two G4S-run detention centres has been placed on administrative leave after a series of scandals, the Guardian has learned.

The news is another unfortunate milestone in a difficult period for G4S, which has faced severe criticism over its management of the two IRCs in the UK. (Guardian - my emphasis)
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... tive-leave
Administrative leave?

Too wet for gardening I guess...

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 8:37 pm
by AnatolyKasparov
Pity the poor Brum fan who actually got a Harry Redknapp tattoo :lol:

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 10:06 pm
by citizenJA
goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 10:13 pm
by PorFavor
citizenJA wrote:goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA
Night night, citizenJA.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 10:22 pm
by PorFavor
Night night.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sat 16 Sep, 2017 10:38 pm
by refitman
Yay! Civil war!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ous-tories" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 12:15 am
by refitman
I see someone let Nick Cohen out again.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 12:16 am
by AnatolyKasparov
refitman wrote:I see someone let Nick Cohen out again.
To recycle almost the exact same column for the 137th time.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 9:45 am
by tinybgoat
https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... rears-soar" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"Revealed: universal credit sends rent arrears soaring"
Ministers are coming under intense pressure to put the brakes on the government’s flagship welfare reform programme, following damning new evidence that it is leaving thousands of low-paid workers unable to pay their rent and at risk of homelessness.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 9:51 am
by tinybgoat
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... -on-thames" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
‘You have one minute to get out’ police tell Sunbury residents
Actually about police raid for bombing suspect,
but read it after universal credit article & (in my mind, at least) headlines linked.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 10:20 am
by AnatolyKasparov
LibDem conference begins today - just how excited are we all??

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 10:34 am
by HindleA
https://www.libdems.org.uk/autumn_conference_17" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://www.libdems.org.uk/autumn_conference_17_agenda" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 10:39 am
by PorFavor
refitman wrote:Yay! Civil war!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ous-tories" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
If Boris Johnson is "tempting" Theresa May to sack him, could that not indicate that he feels that being sacked would work to his advantage? Or is his main aim simply to highlight her weakness?

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 10:39 am
by PorFavor
Good morfternoon.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 10:48 am
by gilsey
tinybgoat wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... rears-soar
"Revealed: universal credit sends rent arrears soaring"
Ministers are coming under intense pressure to put the brakes on the government’s flagship welfare reform programme, following damning new evidence that it is leaving thousands of low-paid workers unable to pay their rent and at risk of homelessness.
I think I got this from twitter, but if it was here, apologies.
http://data.parliament.uk/writteneviden ... 48055.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Written evidence from Professor John Seddon
There were and are two hurdles to success via the current design. Of these, the first is difficult, the second is insurmountable.

The first: UC relies on a large-scale computer system. 90% of large-scale computer systems fail, 30% fail completely, 60% run wildly over budget, don’t work as anticipated, requiring work-arounds or limiting functionality (Gauld and Goldfinch 2006). If UC ever gets over this hurdle – successive reports have shown significant problems with the IT – it will not get over the second.

The second: computer systems cannot deal with high-variety demand. This is because computer systems rely on rules. The consequence is always more demand (what I call ‘failure demand’) into call centres or face-to-face services. UC claimants epitomise high variety. Private-sector organisations whose leaders have been persuaded that digital will be cheaper quickly rein back from the strategy when they see the way costs rise. They, unlike the public sector, have the rudder of profit.

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Posted: Sun 17 Sep, 2017 11:27 am
by PorFavor
Where's everyone gone? All rushed off to the LibDem Conference?