Monday 2nd October 2017

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 3:26 pm

gilsey wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
CBI says Hammond's speech offered 'slim pickings' and 'weak on action'

Here is Carolyn Fairbairn, the CBI director general, on Philip Hammond’s speech.

The chancellor has given a passionate defence of free markets and the importance of business and government working to tackle inequality. That is necessary, but not sufficient.

The UK is facing a generation defining-challenge. A potent cocktail of Brexit uncertainty and dogma-driven politics on both left and right threatens jobs, investment and living standards. Now is not the time for half measures.

The speech shows a government strong on diagnosis, but weak on action. Businesses looking for clear vision and urgent delivery have been left with slim pickings. Renewing the UK’s creaking infrastructure will unlock regional growth and living standards, as will improving access to housing. But they are only parts of the puzzle.

It is time for honesty about the challenges we face. Our economy is under threat – it has moved from the top of the G7 to the bottom. Faltering consumer and business confidence risks lowering living standards. Rising inflation is putting pressure on households.

The solution must be for responsible business and government to grow our way out of austerity. But this can only happen with clarity, unity and action. Today’s speech was only one step in that direction.

This must be the most negative comment the CBI has issued about a party conference speech from a Conservative chancellor for years. (Politics Live, Guardian)
'The uncertainty created by Brexit' is a 'short-term challenge' according to Hammond and 'the economy will start growing properly again' once that's addressed. From Hammond's Today interview.
Given that he's clearly the most realistic member of the govt, it just points up that the level of delusion of the rest of them is off the scale.

Politicians don't say "oh fuck, we're in the shit" because they're bullshitters. Hammond can bullshit, but in fairness to him in this case, if he didn't the pound would dive.

He had a good pop at Johnson, fair play to him. Now he needs to leave a microphone on and call Johnson and Fox "bastards".

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 3:35 pm

These are from the Economist’s Adrian Wooldridge.

adrian wooldridge
✔
@adwooldridge

I'm detecting enormous hostility to Boris Johnson at the Tory Party conference, across the political/Brexit divide
1:48 PM - Oct 2, 2017

1 1 Reply
2 2 Retweets

drian wooldridge
✔
@adwooldridge

I'm told the Tory Party is finally uniting behind a new slogan, "jihad on Johnson"
2:19 PM - Oct 2, 2017 (Politics Live, Guardian)

Jihad?

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 3:52 pm

PorFavor wrote:The audience doesn't seem in the mood to be pleased. Michael Gove keeps pausing for applause but it's a long time coming.

There *is* actually an audience today, then?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 4:31 pm

http://www.katebelgrave.com/2017/10/uni ... -no-money/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 4:57 pm

The Conservative party is in danger of seeing its supporters die off, the justice minister Phillip Lee told an SMF/Opinium fringe meeting. He said:

I do think it is hugely important, in fact I’d say this issue [appealing to younger voters], the challenge the Conservative party faces, is the challenge, actually. Nick Clegg made some headlines recently for saying that Brexit wouldn’t have happened because of natural wastage now. Rather unpalatable, but I wonder actually, in ten year’s time, because of natural wastage, whether we’re going to be in a similar losing position. (Politics Live, Gu\ardian)

Natural wastage? I don't think Conservative supporters will appreciate being spoken about as if they're raw materials on a production line - or like, well, everybody else.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 4:59 pm

I see that Paul Mason, having bullshitted about freedom of movement, and proposed that the UK should stay in the Single Market with a suspension of FoM (cake and eat it nonsense) is carrying on his Hard Brexit campaign.

Paul Mason‏Verified account
@paulmasonnews
2/ Shock among the pro-EU young at EC indifference/neutrality. Also at level/deliberateness of violence. This will rapidly change dynamics

They aren't shocked, and it won't change anything. They want independent Catalonia in the EU, as they always have done.

Paul Mason‏Verified account @paulmasonnews 55m
More
5/ Hence diplomatic efforts matter. As always European history moving too fast for EU institutions and centrist elites.

It's member government who's job it is to respond. Member states aren't going to have "EU institutions" providing running commentaries on their policing. "Centrist elites" is bollocks.

Yesterday, he retweeted a completely fake bit of the Maastricht Treaty, and accompanied a tweet about a lady whose fingers were broken with something about Juncker.

This is kipper bollocks, and he's preparing the ground for Hard Brexit. I can only hope this fool hasn't got any influence on Labour's top team.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 5:02 pm

Ha ha.

Paul Mason‏Verified account
@paulmasonnews
What I notice reporting national self determination struggles: dominant/existing nation always insists "its too complex for foreign journos"

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 5:03 pm

Crikey, I said this

Politicians don't say "oh fuck, we're in the shit" because they're bullshitters

I need to swear less! Apologies.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 5:08 pm

FWIW I always replace with bumboils in recognnition of PF.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 5:08 pm

I like asterisks
or not
what the hell

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 5:12 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:
Paul Waugh‏Verified account @paulwaugh 31m31 minutes ago
More
In all my 19 yrs of doing these gigs, that's the 1st Chancellor's party conf speech that hasn't been followed by a media briefing. Go figure
This conference really had got the "Do we really have to have a conference this year?" feel to it.

Like in the mid 90s, where Brian Mawhinney sought to lift the spirits by attacking a council grant going to an Asian hopscotch club.

Hopscotch is still going.

Hopscotch AWC offers support services for Asian women and their families on a wide range of issues including domestic violence, benefits, housing, education, immigration and health matters. We provide advocacy and support to people with learning disabilities.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 5:16 pm

Excellent.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 5:49 pm

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
#Brexit Bin‏
@BrexitBin
Follow
More
According to the BBC, this is not an anti-Brexit march

not an anti brexit march.jpg (162.43 KiB) Viewed 14868 times

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 5:54 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:I see that Paul Mason, having bullshitted about freedom of movement, and proposed that the UK should stay in the Single Market with a suspension of FoM (cake and eat it nonsense) is carrying on his Hard Brexit campaign.

Paul Mason‏Verified account
@paulmasonnews
2/ Shock among the pro-EU young at EC indifference/neutrality. Also at level/deliberateness of violence. This will rapidly change dynamics
They aren't shocked, and it won't change anything. They want independent Catalonia in the EU, as they always have done.

Paul Mason‏Verified account @paulmasonnews 55m
More
5/ Hence diplomatic efforts matter. As always European history moving too fast for EU institutions and centrist elites.
It's member government who's job it is to respond. Member states aren't going to have "EU institutions" providing running commentaries on their policing. "Centrist elites" is bollocks.

Yesterday, he retweeted a completely fake bit of the Maastricht Treaty, and accompanied a tweet about a lady whose fingers were broken with something about Juncker.

This is kipper bollocks, and he's preparing the ground for Hard Brexit. I can only hope this fool hasn't got any influence on Labour's top team.

Thanks. At one point I had quite a bit of time for Paul Mason (as a non-nationalist), so this is good to know.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 5:56 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:Crikey, I said this
Politicians don't say "oh fuck, we're in the shit" because they're bullshitters
I need to swear less! Apologies.

I have some empathy with this. The intention to improve never pans out into anything longterm.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:02 pm

At least you have room for improvement,sustaining perfection has its downside.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:03 pm

I believe.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:10 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2 ... -fee-plans" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Students on tuition fee pledge from Tories:

It’s just an attempt to win votes and I won’t be swayed
The Conservatives could not do anything that would make me vote for them
Jeremy Corbyn sounds like he is more for us
It’s one thing to promise, but she has to follow through
Who has been raising the fees in the first place?
~~It does make the Conservatives a more attractive option~~

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:15 pm

Matt Cropley‏ @MattCropley1 6h6 hours ago
More
Philip Hammond is to comedy what Henry VIII was to marriage counselling #ToryPartyConference

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:27 pm

HindleA wrote:I believe.

Well, take it as fact. From one who knows.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:28 pm

Not posting link to Hylda Baker.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:30 pm

Have you let the postman free yet,haven't seen him go?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:34 pm

Which one?.How many have you got?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:35 pm

No that's the gas man who came to read the meter in 2003

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:42 pm

(It was on a help sign he was holding up)

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:46 pm

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/nort ... government" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

News story
Northern transport gets further funding from government

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:47 pm

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/view ... containers" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Press release
Views sought on reward and return schemes for drinks containers

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:51 pm

"Environment Secretary Michael Gove has asked organisations and individuals to share their views with the government on the advantages and disadvantages of different types of reward and return schemes for plastic, metal and gin bottled drinks containers"

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 6:54 pm

Welfare state like a 'Ponzi scheme' close to collapse, says minister

[Phillip] Lee was speaking in the context of why young people might be losing faith in the system and making a point about health and social care costs and pension liabilities rising. He probably didn’t intend his words to be taken as a firm prediction that the welfare state will be abandoned at some point in the medium term, but that is unlikely to stop Labour press releasing about this soon. (Politics Live, Guardian - my emphasis)

Probably?

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 7:19 pm

HindleA wrote:https://www.gov.uk/government/news/nort ... government

News story
Northern transport gets further funding from government

£400 million, of which £300 million will help push forward plans for Northern Powerhouse rail to bolster links...
So is it really new funding or has it already been planned & is just being brought forward?

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 7:26 pm

Don't know if you know this excellent tweeter on Scottish higher education (I know!)

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

One of her things is that the Scottish system isn't as progressive as it looks- even leaving aside the "students come from rich backgrounds" argument.

Lucy HunterBlackburn‏
@LucyHunterB
Scottish system takes more in total & in short-term from lowest earners - even when they borrow *less*. SPICe comp of £16k Scot vs £36k Eng

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 7:26 pm

That's her graphic, btw.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 7:34 pm

PorFavor wrote:
The Conservative party is in danger of seeing its supporters die off, the justice minister Phillip Lee told an SMF/Opinium fringe meeting. He said:

I do think it is hugely important, in fact I’d say this issue [appealing to younger voters], the challenge the Conservative party faces, is the challenge, actually. Nick Clegg made some headlines recently for saying that Brexit wouldn’t have happened because of natural wastage now. Rather unpalatable, but I wonder actually, in ten year’s time, because of natural wastage, whether we’re going to be in a similar losing position. (Politics Live, Gu\ardian)
Natural wastage? I don't think Conservative supporters will appreciate being spoken about as if they're raw materials on a production line - or like, well, everybody else.

a good name for a grunge garage band

55DegreesNorth · Post by **55DegreesNorth** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 7:36 pm

HindleA wrote:https://www.gov.uk/government/news/nort ... government

News story
Northern transport gets further funding from government

Northern powerhouse?

Future-proofing will make it easier and less disruptive to build Northern Powerhouse Rail in the future. This will enable faster services between the Northern cities of Liverpool and Manchester, Sheffield, Leeds and York, as well as on towards the East Midlands and London. It will also enable services between Liverpool and Leeds to pass via Manchester Piccadilly station.

So not really very Northern.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 7:37 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
Tubby Isaacs wrote:I see that Paul Mason, having bullshitted about freedom of movement, and proposed that the UK should stay in the Single Market with a suspension of FoM (cake and eat it nonsense) is carrying on his Hard Brexit campaign.

Paul Mason‏Verified account
@paulmasonnews
2/ Shock among the pro-EU young at EC indifference/neutrality. Also at level/deliberateness of violence. This will rapidly change dynamics
They aren't shocked, and it won't change anything. They want independent Catalonia in the EU, as they always have done.

Paul Mason‏Verified account @paulmasonnews 55m
More
5/ Hence diplomatic efforts matter. As always European history moving too fast for EU institutions and centrist elites.
It's member government who's job it is to respond. Member states aren't going to have "EU institutions" providing running commentaries on their policing. "Centrist elites" is bollocks.

Yesterday, he retweeted a completely fake bit of the Maastricht Treaty, and accompanied a tweet about a lady whose fingers were broken with something about Juncker.

This is kipper bollocks, and he's preparing the ground for Hard Brexit. I can only hope this fool hasn't got any influence on Labour's top team.
Thanks. At one point I had quite a bit of time for Paul Mason (as a non-nationalist), so this is good to know.

Cheers. I think he lost it when he gave up the "impartiality", which can be a deadening thing for lots of news, but didn't stop him being very informative and making properly balanced judgements. He's very obviously an axe to grind here- he's not told his followers about Guy Verhofstadt's strong response. Nor the commission's blandly worded statement which nonetheless condemns violence. That's just how diplomacy works, inside or outside the EU. Countries don't go full steam into very close allies.

Corbyn's point about May needing to use influence with Rajoy was well made.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 7:45 pm

55DegreesNorth wrote:
HindleA wrote:https://www.gov.uk/government/news/nort ... government

News story
Northern transport gets further funding from government
Northern powerhouse?
Future-proofing will make it easier and less disruptive to build Northern Powerhouse Rail in the future. This will enable faster services between the Northern cities of Liverpool and Manchester, Sheffield, Leeds and York, as well as on towards the East Midlands and London. It will also enable services between Liverpool and Leeds to pass via Manchester Piccadilly station.
So not really very Northern.

The extra £300 million will go towards ensuring HS2 infrastructure can accommodate future Northern Powerhouse Rail and Midlands Connect services. Future-proofing will make it easier and less disruptive to build Northern Powerhouse Rail in the future. This will enable faster services between the Northern cities of Liverpool and Manchester, Sheffield, Leeds and York, as well as on towards the East Midlands and London.

Isn't it talking about building better links to HS2 stations in the North, which will mean they can change and go to the East Midlands and London quicker?

It's hard to tell.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 7:47 pm

Steve Peers‏Verified account
@StevePeers
He [Paul Mason] was corrected repeatedly by lawyers yesterday but has not admitted he retweeted a false statement of the law.

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 7:53 pm

This is not a 3rd world country, this is a supposed European democracy

I was in Barcelona during an anti-austerity protest - these paramilitary police are animals and were beating anything that moved, including a friend of a friend

I don't agree with Mason but the comment he made about Juncker I read as being due to the fact he was the EPP delegate for president - of which the Spanish PP is a part

I do not blame the EU - it is a weak organisation really and has very little power - the power lies with the nation states and we are seeing too many EU countries are exhibiting unpleasantly authoritarian streaks and very little sanction

Condemning every criticism of the EU as being akin to UKIP is not right - I want to be part of a Union where proto-fascists are condemned outright and are sanctioned strongly

Beating the shit out of people who are exercising a right to vote - no matter what the authorities think of the vote - is despicable and is only making secession more likely

Mason went over the top here but I do not think the EU (apart from Verhofstadt - a man who I like but who has little power) has covered itself in glory this week - we knew this was likely to happen but the Spanish police showed no constraints and them attacking Catalan firemen was revolting to see

We here a lot about venezuela over the last few weeks - let us now see the tight-wing Government in Madrid getting the same treatment

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:12 pm

55DegreesNorth wrote:
HindleA wrote:https://www.gov.uk/government/news/nort ... government

News story
Northern transport gets further funding from government
Northern powerhouse?
Future-proofing will make it easier and less disruptive to build Northern Powerhouse Rail in the future. This will enable faster services between the Northern cities of Liverpool and Manchester, Sheffield, Leeds and York, as well as on towards the East Midlands and London. It will also enable services between Liverpool and Leeds to pass via Manchester Piccadilly station.
So not really very Northern.

Steady

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:39 pm

Michael Gove blames EU for dramatic decline of wildlife as he pledges ‘green Brexit’
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 79181.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

scum

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:42 pm

Speaking at a conference fringe meeting, hosted by the Social Market Foundation (SMF) think-tank, he said: “The problem with Brexit for young people is not an economic, it's not a trade thing.

“It's about the virtual signalling of essentially being closed off to the world, because for most young people the world is just 'Amazon', it's just 'there', and it seems retrograde to being seen to be putting up barriers. It's like Trump's wall.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 79451.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:44 pm

Oh.

George Eaton‏Verified account @georgeeaton 4m4 minutes ago
More
Theresa May won't be attending Boris Johnson's Tory conference speech tomorrow.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:45 pm

Dr Lee also dismissed any shallow attempts to win back the youth vote by trying to be “cool as Tories”, admitting: “We know that's not possible.”

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:50 pm

Boris Johnson is 'fantastic', says Andrea Leadsom, amid Tory leadership unrest
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 79676.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:52 pm

RIP Tom Petty

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:53 pm

She's not wrong of course:

fantastic
fanˈtastɪk/Submit
adjective
1.
informal
extraordinarily good or attractive.
"they did a fantastic job"
synonyms: tremendous, remarkable, great, terrific, enormous, huge, striking, impressive, outstanding, phenomenal, monumental, overwhelming
2.
~~imaginative or fanciful;~~ remote from reality.
~~"fantastic hybrid creatures"~~
synonyms: ~~fanciful, extravagant, extraordinary,~~ irrational, wild, mad, absurd, far-fetched, nonsensical, incredible, unbelievable, unthinkable, implausible, improbable, unlikely, doubtful, dubious; More

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:53 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:RIP Tom Petty

buggeration

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 8:56 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:She's not wrong of course:

fantastic
fanˈtastɪk/Submit
adjective
1.
informal
extraordinarily good or attractive.
"they did a fantastic job"
synonyms: tremendous, remarkable, great, terrific, enormous, huge, striking, impressive, outstanding, phenomenal, monumental, overwhelming
2.
~~imaginative or fanciful;~~ remote from reality.
~~"fantastic hybrid creatures"~~
synonyms: ~~fanciful, extravagant, extraordinary,~~ irrational, wild, mad, absurd, far-fetched, nonsensical, incredible, unbelievable, unthinkable, implausible, improbable, unlikely, doubtful, dubious; More

good work tc2

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 9:02 pm

[youtube]-p1jtVunLE4[/youtube]

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Mon 02 Oct, 2017 9:07 pm

Tomorrow's agenda for the Conservative Conference -

10.00 - 12.30 Fighting injustices
Secretary of State for Health
Secretary of State for Justice
Home Secretary
Session to include contributions from Party Members

14.00 - 14.50 Securing the best Brexit deal for Britain
Co-Chairman of the European Conservatives and Reformists
Secretary of State for International Trade
Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union

14.50 - 16.00 Promoting Global Britain
Leader of the Conservatives in the European Parliament
Secretary of State for International Development
Secretary of State for Defence
Foreign Secretary