Monday 13th November 2017

[AnatolyKasparov]

A new page!

[PaulfromYorkshire]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new- ... -agreement


Press release
New Bill to implement Withdrawal Agreement

Why is it when you need a great legal brain there;s never one around?

Seriously the usual suspects of all colours are arguing the toss on Twitter about the final vote.

One line seems to be that the deal or no deal vote is worthless because nobody except John Redwood and a couple of his mates want No Deal.

The contrary is that Davis is talking BS to spin the fact that he's had to conceded a final vote. This would mean the final vote is[/] meaningful.

[citizenJA]

A new page!

I wondered where everyone went

[citizenJA]

I don't think Dave Davis is speaking coherently in the House, no joke. His statements don't make sense.

[PorFavor]

A new page!

Or - A New Leaf (great film)!

[HindleA]

[youtube]-1ejyl-8zKw[/youtube]

[citizenJA]

I've hot water again
hot water heater was broken

[tinyclanger2]

Pro-Brexit British billionaire buys Swiss football club Lausanne
Jim Ratcliffe, founder of chemicals and fracking giant Ineos, recently tried to get government subsidies to build successor to Land Rover Defender
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... iffe-ineos" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I know I shouldn't be surprised (and am not really) but words still fail me when it comes to ****ers who don't want governments to help feed and house people, but do want government to help them add to their billions

[tinyclanger2]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 52671.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
EU bans sale of arms to Venezuela after Britain sells riot gear to regime
President Nicolas Maduro has been accused of crimes against humanity by the UN

putting the 'Great' back in Britain

[Willow904]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new- ... -agreement


Press release
New Bill to implement Withdrawal Agreement

Why is it when you need a great legal brain there;s never one around?

Seriously the usual suspects of all colours are arguing the toss on Twitter about the final vote.

One line seems to be that the deal or no deal vote is worthless because nobody except John Redwood and a couple of his mates want No Deal.

The contrary is that Davis is talking BS to spin the fact that he's had to conceded a final vote. This would mean the final vote is[/] meaningful.

If there is a Brexit agreement, it will be presented to parliament for approval as an Act of Parliament, so it can be amended, in theory, but of course it's an agreement and can't easily be changed because the EU also needs to agree, so I'm not sure this makes it especially more meaningful unless parliament also has the power to delay "exit day", which also needs to be amended if there is to be a truly meaningful vote.

If there is no agreement, parliament won't have any say at all, as far as I can tell, under Davies' concession.

[55DegreesNorth]

Evening folks,
Got snowed on today, on Long Crag, above Thrunton Wood (about 10 miles north of Rothbury).
Thanks to whoever linked the housing/land value taxation article. A good read.

[PorFavor]

Evening folks,
Got snowed on today, on Long Crag, above Thrunton Wood (about 10 miles north of Rothbury).
Thanks to whoever linked the housing/land value taxation article. A good read.

Don't encourage him.

Rather nippy here in the sunny south, too - but I can't lay claim to any snow.

[citizenJA]

"Its ironic, Redwood was forced to give this advise to his paid clients because not to do so would be to mislead them which has legal penalties.
He is under no such constraint when advising the electorate."

https://discussion.theguardian.com/comm ... /108176338" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I'm just re-posting this because I'm trying to get my head around it. I understand the conflict of interest part of this story but I'm not focusing on that. This particular MP's second job has regularly enforced legal obligations binding him or he'd not bother obeying them. Capital, money, has more value in our current society, that's what this example demonstrates to me. Do you understand what I mean?

[Willow904]

Ah, here, from the G live blog:

In private government sources are even blunter, suggesting that there is very little chance of amendments to the bill passed by the Commons leading to the EU agreeing to change the terms of a Brexit deal already negotiated by the government.

So it is kind of accept it as it is or reject it and we leave with no deal. The key is making exit day, and thus the implementation of the withdrawal bill, only possible by a parliamentary vote. The bit which gives a government minister the power to set exit day is the bit of the Withdrawal bill that really needs to be amended to give Parliament any real control over the process, IMO. Though the Henry VIII clauses could do with watering down as well.

[citizenJA]

Pro-Brexit British billionaire buys Swiss football club Lausanne
Jim Ratcliffe, founder of chemicals and fracking giant Ineos, recently tried to get government subsidies to build successor to Land Rover Defender
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... iffe-ineos" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I know I shouldn't be surprised (and am not really) but words still fail me when it comes to ****ers who don't want governments to help feed and house people, but do want government to help them add to their billions

A warped sense of priorities
a billionaire demanding government subsidies for his pollution while UK citizens are homeless or facing homelessness
Has he no niggling voice inside himself urging him to reconsider what he does with his resources and life? Does anyone other than tinyclanger2 take him aside and question him?

[PaulfromYorkshire]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ssion-mean" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;?

what-does-the-latest-brexit-concession-mean?

[PaulfromYorkshire]

I'm fascinated, utterly confused, slightly comforted and rather panicky all at the same time about the Brexit vote announcement.

I suppose it could lead to another incredibly high stakes day where MPs have to decide whether to vote for, because no deal is so disastrous, or against, because the deal is so disastrous.

For me, this means the soft Brexit, soft Remain and Hard Remain camps all need to cooperate and despatch Hard Brexit where it belongs, roundly vote down Davis's deal even if that appears to be voting for no deal, provoke a vote of No Confidence and thus a General Election.

[HindleA]

"I'm fascinated, utterly confused, slightly comforted and rather panicky all at the same time"


Welcome to my World!!!!

[AnatolyKasparov]

I'm fascinated, utterly confused, slightly comforted and rather panicky all at the same time about the Brexit vote announcement.

I suppose it could lead to another incredibly high stakes day where MPs have to decide whether to vote for, because no deal is so disastrous, or against, because the deal is so disastrous.

For me, this means the soft Brexit, soft Remain and Hard Remain camps all need to cooperate and despatch Hard Brexit where it belongs, roundly vote down Davis's deal even if that appears to be voting for no deal, provoke a vote of No Confidence and thus a General Election.

What heartens me is that we've still got another 18 months to extract more concessions.

[PorFavor]

I misread that as "extract more confessions".

[AnatolyKasparov]

Well, that might apply in some cases too

[citizenJA]

I misread that as "extract more confessions".

perfect, I did too

[HindleA]

"interesting"

[PaulfromYorkshire]

I'm fascinated, utterly confused, slightly comforted and rather panicky all at the same time about the Brexit vote announcement.

I suppose it could lead to another incredibly high stakes day where MPs have to decide whether to vote for, because no deal is so disastrous, or against, because the deal is so disastrous.

For me, this means the soft Brexit, soft Remain and Hard Remain camps all need to cooperate and despatch Hard Brexit where it belongs, roundly vote down Davis's deal even if that appears to be voting for no deal, provoke a vote of No Confidence and thus a General Election.

What heartens me is that we've still got another 18 months to extract more concessions.

And 18 months to find a vision of a relationship between the UK and the EU that all the categories I mention can unite behind. Challenging not impossible.

[PorFavor]

Night night.

[HindleA]

Bloody 'ell Italy not in the World Cup

[AngryAsWell]

Workload increasing for independent school staff – NEU poll

https://schoolsimprovement.net/workload ... -neu-poll/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[citizenJA]

Night night.

Goodnight, PorFavor

[AngryAsWell]

Theresa May: Treat Grenfell like the national tragedy it is. Make homes safe.

https://action.labour.org.uk/page/s/Tor ... fellsurvey" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[RogerOThornhill]

Bloody 'ell Italy not in the World Cup

Well that's one less/fewer team that we can't lose to on penalties on the QF out then. We need a few more though I think...

[AngryAsWell]

Boundary Commission‏
@BCE2018
Follow Follow @BCE2018
More
Will proposed boundary changes affect your constituency? Check the maps here

https://www.bce2018.org.uk/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[RogerOThornhill]

Shocked etc.

The Secret Correspondence Between Donald Trump Jr. and WikiLeaks

https://www.theatlantic.com/amp/article/545738/

The transparency organization asked the president’s son for his cooperation—in sharing its work, in contesting the results of the election, and in arranging for Julian Assange to be Australia’s ambassador to the United States.

Wonder how many organisations that got into bed with Wikileaks now regret it?

[SpinningHugo]

The Withdrawal Bill is just a sideshow really. The decision was already taken back in March. Art 50 is automatic. We now leave n March 2019.

Parliament could pass an amendment saying "if the deal presented is rejected, the government is required to give notice withdrawing art 50". No amendment in the 186 pages of them says that.

If we did give such notice there is a question mark over whether it can unilaterally be given, and if not whether all of the EU27 would agree, as would be required.

Davies conceded nothing at all.

The Hard Brexit agenda now is to talk down the clock.

At the moment, I see nothing that will stop a Hard Brexit. 47 Labour MPs can hold their heads up. The likes of Starmer, Umunna etc cannot.

[tinybgoat]

[youtube]FKPWzLgvgW4[/youtube]
(mute button optional)

[tinybgoat]

The Withdrawal Bill is just a sideshow really. The decision was already taken back in March. Art 50 is automatic. We now leave n March 2019.

Parliament could pass an amendment saying "if the deal presented is rejected, the government is required to give notice withdrawing art 50". No amendment in the 186 pages of them says that.

If we did give such notice there is a question mark over whether it can unilaterally be given, and if not whether all of the EU27 would agree, as would be required.

Davies conceded nothing at all.

The Hard Brexit agenda now is to talk down the clock.

At the moment, I see nothing that will stop a Hard Brexit. 47 Labour MPs can hold their heads up. The likes of Starmer, Umunna etc cannot.

An amendment worded like that would possibly lead to EU 27 just offering an unacceptable bill, too try and get article 50 revoked (I think gvt. has argued this case previously as reason to not allow parliament a vote on accepting a deal).

[SpinningHugo]

The Withdrawal Bill is just a sideshow really. The decision was already taken back in March. Art 50 is automatic. We now leave n March 2019.

Parliament could pass an amendment saying "if the deal presented is rejected, the government is required to give notice withdrawing art 50". No amendment in the 186 pages of them says that.

If we did give such notice there is a question mark over whether it can unilaterally be given, and if not whether all of the EU27 would agree, as would be required.

Davies conceded nothing at all.

The Hard Brexit agenda now is to talk down the clock.

At the moment, I see nothing that will stop a Hard Brexit. 47 Labour MPs can hold their heads up. The likes of Starmer, Umunna etc cannot.

An amendment worded like that would possibly lead to EU 27 just offering an unacceptable bill, too try and get article 50 revoked (I think gvt. has argued this case previously as reason to not allow parliament a vote on accepting a deal).

That is, of course, the Tory/Brexiteer argument.

It completely misunderstands the position.

There isn't anything to negotiate. We either take what we're offered, or there is a Hard Brexit. Those are the choices.