I have been reading UKPR a lot recently as it is full of Brexiteers and there are no Corbyn fans...all are from the right of Labour. The site is pretty right wing but the posts can be interesting, informative and sometimes downright barmy!
I will though share two posts I read today from Labour supporters - but definitely no fans of Corbyn......if they see this I hope they are okay with me using their words
I find their thoughts interesting and demonstrate how Labour's position can be explained
They are both fairly long
Quote:
I have to admit that stating the obvious is now seen as clear political strategy is something that I fear is going to be a let off for our politicians. May has never been great at policy or had any instincts beyond that of inforcement of government policy. Her famed view of the Tories seen as the nasty party is to my mind the same lip service that we seem to get: All in this together, the JAMs and the like spring to mind. If you look at policy itself it appears very much exclusive and not inclusive of the message that is given
it is as if they spend their time working out what emotional buttons to push without given then away anything of substance.
As a lets say a ‘hardened’ remainer, I personally believe that you have constantly answered why Corbyn will stay on the fence for Brexit since he knows in order to win enough seats he need to hold all his voters and they are more likely to either not vote or if they voted leave to vote Tory as to provide surety of leaving the EU. He has been clear in how he would vote personally, something that seems to be ignored and something that May could not bring herself to answer as an example of what he thinks personally and yet I feel what his detractors want him to do is damage the party he represents. If I was leader of the Labour party he is following the approach I would take since being in the EU is less important that sorting out the problems that the UK faces. For if you accept that the EU is not the cause of our problems then it has to be a move away from the current policies which have been under our control.
My feeling is that for the Labour leadership the EU is an irrelevance, in that it divides the country in a manner that is unhelpful to their agenda and therefore it is better that the Tories deal with it.
I understand Tory exasperations in that they would want to share the blame especially if you take the view that only a minority of Tory MP on both side genuinely wanted a referendum and more to the point that the referendum itself was only forced on Cameron for fear of losing his job and being a tactical plan because he did not think he would get a majority in GE2015
My view of the GE2017 was that there was two winners in the election. Jeremy and Ruth.
Corbyn because he basically dodged the bullet of having to deal with the brexit and the fact that having to deliver it for his own voters whom have diametrically opposite views on the EU but more importantly are essentially representing two different types of voter with little really in common.
Ruth because the 12 seats that the Tories won in Scotland give her a platform as a more liberal tory in terms of leadership opportunity
The advantage May has is of course she is in power and she can command the spotlight no matter what happens and what she does. it means that any ‘success’ is seen as hers but it also means any failure is seen as hers too. Corbyn cannot create successes only failures and in truth the only time when he would be considered interesting is when his party is in turmoil or when there is an election and he could be considered a potential PM
Corbyn is not of interest of the BBC’s LK for example because not only is he safe in his position but he is boring, there is no new policies, not much that the Anyone But Corbyn crowd can do and even of the labour party were seen as torn asunder with regards brexit they are as far away from being able to influence it as Nigel Farage is. The real story is May and what the government is doing. Tactically the problem that May has is that abandoning austerity reinforces Corbyn’s policy thrust and that is an association Tories do not want the electorate to have.
Now if you ask me as a remainer as to whether I think that what Corbyn is doing is acceptable? I agree for a principled position I would say no, but I would argue that Brexit is not the be all and end all of our politics since for example the problems that we have in the NHS as nothing to do with the EU and indeed if it were not for the EU may even be considerably worse.
Now I know people whom voted tory despite the striver versus scrounger narrative so I think it is because people tend to vote for what they consider the least worst option that can get into power.
and
Quote:
Let me try to enunciate labour policy on Brexit to those who have problem understanding nuance and emphasis.
The Referendum result will be honoured.
This means leaving THE CU and SM as they are the EUs but could mean joining a New (Bespoke) CU/SM attached to the EUs SM and CU.
There should be an interim period of at least 2 years (3 perhaps) where we either stay as full members of the current CU/SM or abide by all the rules agreed up to March 29th 2019 through some other mechanism.
(No position on new rules in that period yet but neither has HMG)
The hope of many MPs is that the EU may give some ground on free movement (Labour MPs believe Lab leave voters care little about the ECJ) so that the party may be able to move to a position of advocating staying in THE SM/CU.
They could do this with intellectual cover (whether tenuous or not would be for discussion I guess) as the CU/SM would have moved from the one in place at the time of the Referendum sufficiently to no longer be the CU/SM we voted to leave.
Being too clear about this now is unnecessary and invited questions about how much amendment required to free movement etc.
The Ian Murray and Umunna amendments required an answer to a binary question before the details of the basis on which people would make that binary choice are known and was at best naïve and at worst disloyal.
Ignore the other shadow cabinet members who make statements based on hypothetical scenarios only Corbyn and Starmer have authority in the area. Most sensible remain labour Party members and MPs trust Starmer and if he is OK with what Corbyn is saying and emphasising they can accept it also.
Finally, I am not denying that differing views exist within the front bench let alone the PLP but the unity on th e anti–austerity platform means more, at least for now.
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