Monday 19th February 2018

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citizenJA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by citizenJA »

Vultures
howsillyofme1
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by howsillyofme1 »

Still not radical enough. We have far far too many MPs. The only argument in favour of their bloated number is the payroll vote. So we need to cut the payroll and cut the number of MPs (both would be a good thing). The cabinet (and its shadow) are far too big with too many non-roles created for political purposes (hello Liam Fox and Barry Gardiner). We'll have fewer disasters like O'Mara and Morris if we had around 500 MPs (as an absolute maximum, my preference would be for around 350).

It goes almost without saying that we similarly need to cut the ridiculous number of members of the House of Lords. Aim for a combined total similar to that of the US Congress, around 435
You do know that the US is a federal structure don't you and there are large number of state politicians who take on a lot of the legislative burden

If you want to argue for a federal structure in the UK with much more power divested to local areas then you may have a point

After living in another country I suggest the UK is massively underrepresented, especially at the local level, and so any changes need to made with that in mind

You make no argument for a reduction, except with a flawed comparison and the usual sneers

If you actual made an intelligent comparison then we could debate but this is totally absentr from your discussion

Just to describe my situation

I live in a commune, canton and federal structure

Conseillers communals 35 (for 1000 people)
Conseillers cantonals 150 (for 700, 000 people)
Conseillers d'Etat 246 (for 8.4 million)

by comparison in Huddersfield

Councillors 69 (for 437000 people)
MP 650 (for 65.6 million)

Our representation doesn't seem to that excessive by comparison

The problem is not our number of MPs it is the paucity of local representation and engagement
Last edited by howsillyofme1 on Mon 19 Feb, 2018 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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AngryAsWell
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by AngryAsWell »

SpinningHugo wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:Who knew the GFA was failing ?

The GFA is not failing!

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Andrew Adonis‏Verified account
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Following Following @Andrew_Adonis
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BREXIT & IRELAND: Coordinated effort by Brexiters & DUP seems to be underway to end Good Friday Agreement. See statements by Arlene, Daniel Hannan & Owen Paterson (an ex NI Secretary!). This really is playing with fire.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
All to do with the Customs Union. If you want to keep the GFA then you have to stay in the Customs Union (and not just on a transition basis).

No doubt the current Labour Labour leadership will come out in full throated support of the GFA, and accept the inevitable consequence of permanently remaining in the Customs Union. [Owen Smith will of course, but he is Core Group Hostile.]
I know and understand their reasons, the concern is not if-how-weather we stay in CU, SM or EU.
The very real concern is that these idiots are trashing/about to trash the GFA for political ends.
Not a place anyone in their right mind should aspire to go to.
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AngryAsWell
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by AngryAsWell »

Boris Johnson compares dead monkey head to Labour backbencher

http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-sto ... -1-5400342" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Boris Johnson is 53 years old.
howsillyofme1
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by howsillyofme1 »

Is it capable of exploitation? Why?

They shouldn't have sold it off because it makes no economic sense to do so. a political move to lower the headline debt figure
We do not usually know the terms of sale ('commercial confidentiality') and the ompanies who now own the debt are likely to want to maximise their return (unlike the Government who have never really cared - it is an accounting trick to pretend they are not increasing the debt). Such companies have not always been known to be particularly caring in their manner of recouping their debt, the debtor is not always clear who now owns their debt and also the scope for exploitative interest rates is not always clear
AnatolyKasparov
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

AngryAsWell wrote:Boris Johnson compares dead monkey head to Labour backbencher

http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-sto ... -1-5400342" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Boris Johnson is 53 years old.
But he's SO FUNNY!!
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
PaulfromYorkshire
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PaulfromYorkshire »

The launch of the new Renew party doesn't seem to have been a total success.

I'm not 100% sure of their slogan.
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PaulfromYorkshire
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PaulfromYorkshire »

I'm been batting it around and I'm sorry I can't deal with "fairer" in the sense I think they meant it. A situation is either fair or it isn't for me.

Which then leaves my brain automatically associating "fairer" with complexion and hair, which I'm guessing wasn't quite what they were aiming at.
SpinningHugo
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by SpinningHugo »

AngryAsWell wrote:
SpinningHugo wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:Who knew the GFA was failing ?

The GFA is not failing!

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


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BREXIT & IRELAND: Coordinated effort by Brexiters & DUP seems to be underway to end Good Friday Agreement. See statements by Arlene, Daniel Hannan & Owen Paterson (an ex NI Secretary!). This really is playing with fire.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
All to do with the Customs Union. If you want to keep the GFA then you have to stay in the Customs Union (and not just on a transition basis).

No doubt the current Labour Labour leadership will come out in full throated support of the GFA, and accept the inevitable consequence of permanently remaining in the Customs Union. [Owen Smith will of course, but he is Core Group Hostile.]
I know and understand their reasons, the concern is not if-how-weather we stay in CU, SM or EU.
The very real concern is that these idiots are trashing/about to trash the GFA for political ends.
Not a place anyone in their right mind should aspire to go to.
Plenty on the far left and far right who have never accepted Good Friday.

“an assembly is not what people have laid down their lives for over thirty years… the settlement must be for a united Ireland.”
howsillyofme1
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by howsillyofme1 »


Plenty on the far left and far right who have never accepted Good Friday.

“an assembly is not what people have laid down their lives for over thirty years… the settlement must be for a united Ireland.
I know some on the right did and there were some extremists in the IRA

Who on the left did though?

I think Sinn Felin are pretty keen on a United Ireland too but seem okay with it
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by HindleA »

You're meaning it now,stop it.
Last edited by HindleA on Mon 19 Feb, 2018 4:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
PaulfromYorkshire
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PaulfromYorkshire »

howsillyofme1 wrote:

Plenty on the far left and far right who have never accepted Good Friday.

“an assembly is not what people have laid down their lives for over thirty years… the settlement must be for a united Ireland.
I know some on the right did and there were some extremists in the IRA

Who on the left did though?

I think Sinn Felin are pretty keen on a United Ireland too but seem okay with it
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PaulfromYorkshire
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PaulfromYorkshire »

SpinningHugo wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:
SpinningHugo wrote:
All to do with the Customs Union. If you want to keep the GFA then you have to stay in the Customs Union (and not just on a transition basis).

No doubt the current Labour Labour leadership will come out in full throated support of the GFA, and accept the inevitable consequence of permanently remaining in the Customs Union. [Owen Smith will of course, but he is Core Group Hostile.]
I know and understand their reasons, the concern is not if-how-weather we stay in CU, SM or EU.
The very real concern is that these idiots are trashing/about to trash the GFA for political ends.
Not a place anyone in their right mind should aspire to go to.
Plenty on the far left and far right who have never accepted Good Friday.

“an assembly is not what people have laid down their lives for over thirty years… the settlement must be for a united Ireland.”
Thankfully, the party has not chosen a leader who said that.
HindleA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by HindleA »

"Great minds think alike/fools seldom differ"
SpinningHugo
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by SpinningHugo »

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
SpinningHugo wrote: Plenty on the far left and far right who have never accepted Good Friday.

“an assembly is not what people have laid down their lives for over thirty years… the settlement must be for a united Ireland.”
Thankfully, the party has not chosen a leader who said that.
Depends who you think the de facto leader of the Labour party is.
HindleA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by HindleA »

HR Pufnstuff
PaulfromYorkshire
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PaulfromYorkshire »

SpinningHugo wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
SpinningHugo wrote: Plenty on the far left and far right who have never accepted Good Friday.

“an assembly is not what people have laid down their lives for over thirty years… the settlement must be for a united Ireland.”
Thankfully, the party has not chosen a leader who said that.
Depends who you think the de facto leader of the Labour party is.
Oh you've made it quite clear that it's Seumas Milne. And he didn't say that either :twisted:
AnatolyKasparov
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

Do. Not. Feed.
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
PorFavor
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PorFavor »

Fracking row: Treasury 'showing shambolic conflict of interest'

Director of Third Energy, which wants to frack in North Yorkshire, is Conservative donor


Campaigners have accused the Treasury of allowing the appearance of a conflict of interest over its examination of an energy company at the forefront of fracking in the UK.

Third Energy’s financial health is being looked at by a Treasury body, the Infrastructure and Projects Authority (IPA), whose findings will inform whether the government gives the firm a green light.

But Third Energy’s newest director, Conservative party peer and donor Jitesh Gadhia, is also a non-executive director at another Treasury body, UK Government Investments. One of UKGI’s roles is to provide advice to the government on dealing with financially distressed businesses.

Rose Dickinson, a Friends of the Earth campaigner, said: “This seems a conflict of interest. Not only that, it looks fairly shambolic." (Guardian)
(I closed the Rose Dickinson quote myself - just in case the Guardian thought to sue me for misquoting their quote. If you follow . . .)

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... esh-gadhia
PaulfromYorkshire
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PaulfromYorkshire »

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Do. Not. Feed.
;-)
howsillyofme1
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by howsillyofme1 »

There is a big difference to someone opposing the GFA and seeing it as a stepping stone to a United Ireland

Northern Ireland was created out of violence and the threat of violence, unfortunately echoing much of Irish history - the GFA will hopefully lead to a future United Ireland that is agreed through peaceful means - something we would not have said a generation ago
howsillyofme1
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by howsillyofme1 »

If he is recognised as a troll by all then he should be banned - if he isn't considered to be so by the mods and members then he should be allowed to post and those of us who think he writes shite (which is most I think) should not be discouraged from engaging him

I personally think he is a malevolent little troll but I know I am in the minority

Have you noticed that he posts provocative statements which are challenged strongly and then never returns to argue his position - he just posts another provocative post?

Truly pathetic
55DegreesNorth
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by 55DegreesNorth »

howsillyofme1 wrote:If he is recognised as a troll by all then he should be banned - if he isn't considered to be so by the mods and members then he should be allowed to post and those of us who think he writes shite (which is most I think) should not be discouraged from engaging him

I personally think he is a malevolent little troll but I know I am in the minority

Have you noticed that he posts provocative statements which are challenged strongly and then never returns to argue his position - he just posts another provocative post?

Truly pathetic
He is a troll and an arse, but occasionally provokes people to articulate their position in detail. This usually makes him look a proper Rodney, but is helpful to others. I know moderation is a pain in the tits, but just pulling his needlessly sneering and provocative posts might guide him towards a more constructive approach. If it doesn’t, ban the git.
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tinyclanger2
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by tinyclanger2 »

@SGO
I leave Leeds for one day and then this happens...
great alibi!
were you with PfY?
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Willow904
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by Willow904 »

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bris ... ssion=true" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Tories slammed for 'shocking' tweet claiming poor parents can feed kids on £10 a week
"Fall seven times, get up eight" - Japanese proverb
SpinningHugo
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by SpinningHugo »

PaulfromYorkshire wrote: Oh you've made it quite clear that it's Seumas Milne. And he didn't say that either :twisted:
I think John McDonnell is de facto leader.

Milne similarly thought Good Friday "an accommodation not a settlement".

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... l-economic" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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citizenJA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by citizenJA »

HindleA wrote:HR Pufnstuff
He's your friend when things get rough
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citizenJA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by citizenJA »

Willow904 wrote:https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bris ... ssion=true
Tories slammed for 'shocking' tweet claiming poor parents can feed kids on £10 a week
I can feed kids on £10 a week
after the larder is fully stocked with a couple hundred pounds worth of provisions and all the utilities are paid
sure
howsillyofme1
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by howsillyofme1 »

SpinningHugo wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote: Oh you've made it quite clear that it's Seumas Milne. And he didn't say that either :twisted:
I think John McDonnell is de facto leader.

Milne similarly thought Good Friday "an accommodation not a settlement".

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... l-economic" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Let us look at your original comment?
Plenty on the far left and far right who have never accepted Good Friday.

“an assembly is not what people have laid down their lives for over thirty years… the settlement must be for a united Ireland.”
You quote someone from Sinn Fein insinuating it was Seumas Milne and have provided no evidence that these so-called 'left-wingers' oppose the GFA.

The GFA was put in place in order to allow the 30 years of violence to be ended and to reach an accommodation to allow power-sharing in NI, including a commitment to end violence and the armed struggle

It has been difficult but has achieved much - thanks to which go to a number of different politicians from different parties and countries - often at significant personal risk

It also set out how unification of the island of Ireland could be achieved

For those in Sinn Fein and others (including me I may add) who think that is the best solution for the future then it is indeed a stepping stone, or an accommodation. It is definitely not a settled question and there is a mechanism for unification

Your posts on this have been mendacious and pathetic
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tinyclanger2
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by tinyclanger2 »

The issue is not about whether Hugo is a troll it's about whether we ban people for potentially being one. What does a banning policy look like? It's tricky to decide and implement. And in the end it boils down to this:

Which side do you fall on? Would you rather risk banning someone (from a public forum) who was struggling to communicate because you thought them a troll? Or tolerate having the odd troll to avoid that risk? I have said it many times now in many ways - if we stop engaging with him, there's a chance he may get bored. Certainly he won't be able to dominate the board as he does now.

Personally I waver between one and the other, depending on how bored I am with it at the time. But I find it pretty easy not to respond.
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howsillyofme1
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by howsillyofme1 »

tinyclanger2 wrote:The issue is not about whether Hugo is a troll it's about whether we ban people for potentially being one. What does a banning policy look like? It's tricky to decide and implement. And in the end it boils down to this:

Which side do you fall on? Would you rather risk banning someone who was struggling to communicate because you thought them a troll? Or tolerate having the odd troll to avoid that risk? I have said it many times now in many ways - if we stop engaging with him, there's a chance he may get bored. Certainly he won't be able to dominate the board as he does now.
I think after the amount of time there is pretty much no doubt what he is

I don't do 'not engaging' unfortunately.......I can't stop myself - the only way is to stop posting myself and avoiding the board which I do not want to do
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tinyclanger2
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by tinyclanger2 »

Though, having said that, it's fair to say that underneath an exponential objects the peanut analogue.
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tinyclanger2
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by tinyclanger2 »

howsillyofme1 wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:The issue is not about whether Hugo is a troll it's about whether we ban people for potentially being one. What does a banning policy look like? It's tricky to decide and implement. And in the end it boils down to this:

Which side do you fall on? Would you rather risk banning someone who was struggling to communicate because you thought them a troll? Or tolerate having the odd troll to avoid that risk? I have said it many times now in many ways - if we stop engaging with him, there's a chance he may get bored. Certainly he won't be able to dominate the board as he does now.
I think after the amount of time there is pretty much no doubt what he is

I don't do 'not engaging' unfortunately.......I can't stop myself - the only way is to stop posting myself and avoiding the board which I do not want to do
Nor do I, but when we have a Hugoathon, I tend to do so.
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tinyclanger2
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by tinyclanger2 »

We could have a poll:

ban
ignore
carry on as normal
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tinyclanger2
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by tinyclanger2 »

I use the term normal loosely
obv
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citizenJA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by citizenJA »

tinyclanger2 wrote:I use the term normal loosely
obv
thank you for that qualifier
rhymes with ring of fire
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by frog222 »

A more interesting subject :-)

www.spectator.co.uk/2018/02/does-aid-do ... than-good/

https://www.spectator.co.uk/2018/02/doe ... than-good/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Off to read !
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citizenJA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by citizenJA »

The nose of Simon Jenkins, Guardian columnist, is nearly identical to my father's nose

off topic, I know
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citizenJA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by citizenJA »

frog222 wrote:A more interesting subject :-)

www.spectator.co.uk/2018/02/does-aid-do ... than-good/

https://www.spectator.co.uk/2018/02/doe ... than-good/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Off to read !
come back in time for your tea
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citizenJA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by citizenJA »

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... dent-loans

May skewered by even Schofield's softballs on This Morning sofa
- John Crace
Thank you for the daily Crace
frog222
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by frog222 »

citizenJA wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... dent-loans

May skewered by even Schofield's softballs on This Morning sofa
- John Crace
Thank you for the daily Crace
Whoops, forgot to post it ! Have a Paxo on Cameron --

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[youtube]ek3l9iaByro[/youtube]
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AngryAsWell
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by AngryAsWell »

Good Friday Agreement 'Not Sustainable,' Says Kate Hoey
'I think there is a need for a cold, rational look at the Belfast agreement,' says Labour MP.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/h ... c49f46c3ac" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
If I was in her constituency I'd fight to deselect her.
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AngryAsWell
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by AngryAsWell »

Catherine Bearder‏Verified account
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UKIP leader's reasoning for Brexit: "we want British fish for British fish and chips".

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citizenJA
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by citizenJA »

Goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA
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AngryAsWell
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by AngryAsWell »

Mirror Politics‏Verified account
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Tory MP deletes tweet accusing Jeremy Corbyn of 'selling British secrets to Communist spies' after Labour leader threatens legal action

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/ ... r-12053243" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …
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AngryAsWell
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by AngryAsWell »

Steve Peers‏Verified account
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Following Following @StevePeers
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Lots more people have pointed out that your account of Northern Irish political history gets many basic facts wrong. I don't see any corrections from you.

The issue for me isn't that you're a Brexiter (I like the Brexiters I know IRL). It's that you're a charlatan.

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PorFavor
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PorFavor »

@citizenJA

Night night.
PorFavor
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PorFavor »

Night night.
PorFavor
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by PorFavor »

Don't forget - PTO.
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Re: Monday 19th February 2018

Post by tinyclanger2 »

AngryAsWell wrote:Catherine Bearder‏Verified account
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Following Following @catherinemep
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UKIP leader's reasoning for Brexit: "we want British fish for British fish and chips".

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Unfortunate how quickly and completely the word "British" has become a joke.
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