Saturday 24th & Sunday 25th February 2018

[tinyclanger2]

Rather excellent to see OhSo here

[tinyclanger2]

(and Toby Latimer)

[ohsocynical]

The Conservative Party is hiring an army of paid tweeters to take on Jeremy Corbyn’s supporters on social media, the Telegraph can disclose.

The attempt to “professionalise” the Tories’ campaign operation comes amid fears among senior Tories that the party faces disastrous results in May’s local authority elections.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/201 ... ht-labour/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Margaret Dunne #PCPEU #LoveNHS‏
@MargaretDunne13

By hiring online trolls, is Party Chair, Brandon Lewis, breaching the Representation of the People Act?

It is illegal to employ someone “for payment or promise of payment as a canvasser for the purpose of promoting or procuring a candidate’s election”.

Should we mention this??

[AnatolyKasparov]

Hi there ohso

[ohsocynical]

Hi there ohso

Testing the waters

[TobyLatimer]

(and Toby Latimer)

Thanks for having me

[ohsocynical]

It's funny how some people never learn that ill thought out plots tend to come back and bite you on the arse. Hard.

"Attacks on Jeremy Corbyn by the rightwing press are leading to large spikes in his support base immediately after negative newspaper articles, according to data seen by the Guardian.

New figures from Momentum come days after Labour went on the offensive over reports in the Daily Mail, the Sun and others that Corbyn met a Czechoslovakian spy in the 1980s.

Breaking from the tradition of his predecessors, who courted the tabloids, Corbyn blamed significant parts of the national press “owned by billionaire tax exiles” for “a succession of false and absurd stories”.

Buoyed by its gains in the general election, Corbyn’s Labour has maintained it can use social media to bypass the mainstream press and any ad hominem attacks."

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[RogerOThornhill]

Dear me, that took some doing...one of our fence panels was broken so 'er indoors ordered three which arrived last week. And of course as our son was home for the weekend, what better time to replace that one and two others. Two went in fine...the other took about an hour's sawing and sanding before it eventually slid down with a bit of pushing on our part. That one certainly isn't going to come out every easily...

[HindleA]

Just a normal day at Chez O'Thornhill.

[HindleA]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... re-for-all" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Why are Democratic party thinktanks still not backing universal healthcare?

[PaulfromYorkshire]

It's funny how some people never learn that ill thought out plots tend to come back and bite you on the arse. Hard.

"Attacks on Jeremy Corbyn by the rightwing press are leading to large spikes in his support base immediately after negative newspaper articles, according to data seen by the Guardian.

New figures from Momentum come days after Labour went on the offensive over reports in the Daily Mail, the Sun and others that Corbyn met a Czechoslovakian spy in the 1980s.

Breaking from the tradition of his predecessors, who courted the tabloids, Corbyn blamed significant parts of the national press “owned by billionaire tax exiles” for “a succession of false and absurd stories”.

Buoyed by its gains in the general election, Corbyn’s Labour has maintained it can use social media to bypass the mainstream press and any ad hominem attacks."

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I've been wondering exactly what these Czech spy stories sound like to those somewhat younger than ourselves. After all it's nearly 30 years since the Berlin Wall came down. In fact I saw the other day it's now been down longer than it was up. If you are under 40, it must just seem like stuff from a movie.

[HindleA]

It does.

[HindleA]

Fair few walls in Berlin I suspect.

[HindleA]

Obviously one less.

[ohsocynical]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... re-for-all


Why are Democratic party thinktanks still not backing universal healthcare?

Because most Democratic policy ideas are on an even footing with Conservative policies here.

[Eric_WLothian]

Well, that didn't go to plan.

I made the mistake of winding up my Scottish mates

Getting it double-barrelled from all sides

I didn't think there were so many different Braveheart gifs - and the Scottish do have a way with swearing - so creative

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Not sure if that link worked. It was supposed to be Fred MacAulay on Mock the Week.

[PorFavor]

Night night.

[ohsocynical]

@HindleA

Have you seen this?

From ‘barely surviving’ to thriving: Ontario basic income recipients report less stress, better health
The three-year pilot project, which began last summer, is testing whether no-strings-attached cash support can boost health, education and housing for people living in poverty.

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2018/0 ... ealth.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[AnatolyKasparov]

Re the earlier posts, has SH been given an involuntary holiday from this site?

[refitman]

Well, that didn't go to plan.

I made the mistake of winding up my Scottish mates

Getting it double-barrelled from all sides

I didn't think there were so many different Braveheart gifs - and the Scottish do have a way with swearing - so creative

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Not sure if that link worked. It was supposed to be Fred MacAulay on Mock the Week.

The link worked, here's the embed:
[youtube]kTTfmz5TZNk[/youtube]

[Sky'sGoneOut]

Dear me, that took some doing...one of our fence panels was broken so 'er indoors ordered three which arrived last week. And of course as our son was home for the weekend, what better time to replace that one and two others. Two went in fine...the other took about an hour's sawing and sanding before it eventually slid down with a bit of pushing on our part. That one certainly isn't going to come out every easily...

An acquaintance of mine last year had three panels blown down, the concrete posts were still fine it was just the flimsy cheap panels that had blown out. I offered to buy and put new decent panels in for £150 but he decided to go with 'professionals' who charged him 'nearly a grand' to smash the panels in with a sledgehammer and not bother with any of that sawing or sanding nonsense, or indeed levelling them as they were on a slope, so now he has a three tiered garden fence with massive dents along the tops of each panel. And he's one of those dicks who never admit they could be wrong or ripped off so he now claims that's how he always wanted his fence to look.

[Sky'sGoneOut]

I guess the Winter Olympics counts as politics given the joint Korean ice hockey team and all that.

As an insomniac I probably saw more than most and here is my favourite moment...

[youtube]xga4xRhkyoI[/youtube]

I was watching it live and you can hear her wail when she thinks she's going to hit a squirrel.

Mind you I come from a part of the country that is planning a mass cull of grey squirrels eventually, thousands of the poor wee buggers, but it will have to be done if we're to keep our tufty eared reds viable as a species.

[Sky'sGoneOut]

So anyway we now have Labour backing staying in the (or 'a') customs union, which seems to me to be a small step towards sanity and while I would like them to take the next step towards staying in the single market I can see why that would appear to be electoral suicide to many northern Labour MP's because it would mean continued freedom of movement.

BUT, we were told at the last GE that Labour would lose its northern heartlands to Ukip and it not only failed to happen but Ukip lost its deposits right across the north. If you look at my area of Yorkshire Labour are within 500 votes of taking some rural Tory seats that have been conservative for nearly 100 years.

I'm not a natural Labour supporter. I'm a Scottish Liberal. But even I can see this country is there for the taking if you people are bold.

[howsillyofme1]

So anyway we now have Labour backing staying in the (or 'a') customs union, which seems to me to be a small step towards sanity and while I would like them to take the next step towards staying in the single market I can see why that would appear to be electoral suicide to many northern Labour MP's because it would mean continued freedom of movement.

BUT, we were told at the last GE that Labour would lose its northern heartlands to Ukip and it not only failed to happen but Ukip lost its deposits right across the north. If you look at my area of Yorkshire Labour are within 500 votes of taking some rural Tory seats that have been conservative for nearly 100 years.

I'm not a natural Labour supporter. I'm a Scottish Liberal. But even I can see this country is there for the taking if you people are bold.

The GE losses were not supposed to be to UKIP but to the Tories who would hoover up the Labour vote. The reasons that didn't happen were different - some being that Labour UKIP voters cannot be assumed to transfer to Tory just over Brexit, and another being that Labour was being very careful not to come down too heavily not he remain side

If Labour had opposed A50 then it may be very different

I am going to be very repetitive but I have still not had a convincing answer from anyone on the following questions, so will keep asking it of those who are so keen on the single market...

1. What is the roadmap to joining 'the single market' and 'the custom's union'?
2. What would you say to convince someone who is a 'soft leaver' and who based their vote in the referendum on sovereignty to change their minds?

Most people I know who voted leave (anecdote I know) and also who responded to this poll for Ashcroft did so because of sovereignty and immigration

http://lordashcroftpolls.com/2016/06/ho ... d-and-why/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The issue with your proposal is that it will not allow us to do anything about immigration and will actually make the sovereignty position much worse as we will have even less say

The thing is that so many people are calling for this and make it seem straightforward that the answer to it must be really simple and I am missing something......

The arguments for SM/CU are economic (unless you live in Ireland) and it suggests that this argument is still not getting through

[Sky'sGoneOut]

Am I wrong?

Well not factually. All the rest is the wonderful world of subjectivity.

And fake news. And yeah I may be stoned now.

I'll be back.

[howsillyofme1]

Am I wrong?

No - there is no right or wrong on this

It is just that there are a lot of demands for Labour to commit to being in the single market and I am asking how that is achieved (there is not membership form for the single market so it must be done via another means) and how do you explain to people who voted leave (the majority in the vote) that the future relationship will give us even less say than we had in the EU?

If the answer is we should stay in the EU then I agree with you but I have no answer to how we achieve this at the moment - and I am sure neither do Labour

The continued talking about the single market and demanding Labour do something about it now is, in my view, reducing the likelihood of it ever happening

[Sky'sGoneOut]

I agree with you, Labour have been obscuring and dicking about for months in the hope that the people who normaly vote for them will coninue doing so.

And as I pointed out above, they will.

[howsillyofme1]

I agree with you, Labour have been obscuring and dicking about for months in the hope that the people who normaly vote for them will coninue doing so.

And as I pointed out above, they will.

I think 'obscuring and dicking' is a bit unfair

Do you have any answers to the questions?

Because to come clean will require them too because they will be eviscerated by the press if they can't - and all those so keen on the single market will be conspicuous by their absence!

I must be missing something because people are so convinced - in some ways it reminds me of the conviction of the Brexiteers that everything will work out okay

[Sky'sGoneOut]

To be clear you are talking to someone who's had two bottles of wine.

[Sky'sGoneOut]

And a bit of weed.

[howsillyofme1]

Sky'sGoneOut

ahhh....you are still doing better than I would

I can give my view not he first question

We leave the EU
Join EFTA
Sign EEA
Negotiate and agree extra provisions to EEA
Negotiate a custom's agreement

The EEA deal is compatible with the principles of the EU internal market and we then will need to look at the bits it doesn't cover so well and beef it up a bit. The EEA agreement was influenced a lot by the requirements of Norway and has some exemptions. In this we are assuming we will be welcomed into EFTA seamlessly

The second question - I have no answer too and I can't think of one. This is the elephant in the room. I am waiting for someone to tell me something that is credible and concrete

Reading and listening to some commentators I have am not at all convinced many of them know what they are talking about - some of the politicians do but because they are interviewed by people who don't we go around in circles

[ohsocynical]

Impressive. I wonder if they'll achieve what they want.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Sky'sGoneOut]

The Irish border is the thing.

[Sky'sGoneOut]

The Irish border is the thing.

I see.