Saturday 10th & Sunday 11th March 2018

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 9:56 pm

PF I've found the gin.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 9:59 pm

(Had my fingers crossed)

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 10:09 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... nished-mps" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Astonished’ MPs told £817m has gone unspent in housing budget
Ministers face demand for urgent answers over return of cash to Treasury

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 10:13 pm

Mark Steel (from Thursday)
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/sau ... ssion=true" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"If Theresa May says Saudi Arabia must reform, then we can rest assured it will"

This is why, when Conservatives and their supporters hear that 20 years ago Jeremy Corbyn met someone from an organisation they disagree with, they get very angry with him. They’re furious that instead of speaking in the same room as them and saying “hello”, he should have taken them to meet the Queen and Prince Charles and spend all day with the cabinet and sold them billions of pounds worth of weapons. It’s no wonder they don’t trust him.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 10:17 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... or-welfare" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Millions of families on brink face deepest benefit cuts in years
New study confirms that the poorest are being hit hardest by continuing austerity

You don't need a study,which makes,I am afraid the non clear and unequivocal commitment by Labour to end the freeze as a bare minimim so very disappointing,it is the most pernicious particularly for those with no/little options and,despite the guff,impact many of the declared exempted by the method of calculation.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 10:23 pm

Have self banned myself from "opening"I just can't be trusted/the power went to my head.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 10:28 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -austerity" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

For the Tories, eliminating the deficit was just a pretext to slash the state
Frances Ryan

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 10:28 pm

citizenJA wrote:I'm uncertain what Nick Cohen is about. Does anyone know?

He's just a bit dotty in his opposition to the FAR LEFT , much of which seems to be in his imagination . , can' tresist jibes at Corbyn !

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 10:31 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:And why are those turnouts so often tiny?

Of course, because of legislation passed by a CONSERVATIVE government.

You lmean the Tories made it illegal for union members to vote ?

I'd like to know

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 10:58 pm

[youtube]whq2XZyMT9s[/youtube]

Post by **adam** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 11:34 pm

HindleA wrote:[youtube]whq2XZyMT9s[/youtube]

That Courtney Cox has let herself go.

Post by **adam** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 11:42 pm

Tea - teriyaki salmon (ginger, garlic, soy sauce x3, maple syrupx2, rice winex1, bit of oil, mixed up and spooned over salmon while it grills, easy as anything), noodles with sesame seeds and toasted sesame oil, pak choi with oyster sauce (open bottle, tip out sauce).

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 10 Mar, 2018 11:50 pm

Goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 12:43 am

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... so-ruinous" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Why the left’s hellish vision is so ruinous
An unduly bleak view of recent British history, apt to see little but a legacy of neoliberalism, ignores the advances of social democracy and erodes faith in progressive politics, writes Andrew Hindmoor

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 12:48 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43361548" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Regulator to quiz water firms over shortages

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 12:57 am

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... s-workload" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Policy paper

Reducing teacher workload

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 6:01 am

adam wrote:Tea - teriyaki salmon (ginger, garlic, soy sauce x3, maple syrupx2, rice winex1, bit of oil, mixed up and spooned over salmon while it grills, easy as anything), noodles with sesame seeds and toasted sesame oil, pak choi with oyster sauce (open bottle, tip out sauce).

I once had an unfortunate incident with a spear (leaf?) of bok choi, somehow managing to catarpault it across a restaurant.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 7:06 am

"Any participation may be used against you"

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/g ... e-12134445" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 9:21 am

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 48621.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"Brexit: People crossing Irish border would have to register in advance under plan being studied by Theresa May"
- It's the 'Smart Border 2.0' report, again, which states that infrastructure is needed.

The package of measures has also attracted support from the Democratic Unionist Party (DUP), the Tories’ partners in government, which hailed it “as an excellent foundation to build on”.

∆Unfortunate choice of words.

The decision to consider the plan, put forward in Brussels, was strongly criticised by the Irish government, which told The Independent the proposals would break Ms May’s pledge of no “physical infrastructure and associated checks” after Brexit.
Peter Hain , the former Northern Ireland Secretary, went further, warning the proposal to pre-register travellers “would be risking immediate civil unrest”.
“If I was Northern Ireland Secretary and this report came on to my desk, its next stop would be the bin,” Mr Hain said.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 10:49 am

frog222 wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:And why are those turnouts so often tiny?

Of course, because of legislation passed by a CONSERVATIVE government.
You lmean the Tories made it illegal for union members to vote ?

I'd like to know

All postal ballots (especially with the attending restrictions) tend to mean low turnouts, this was entirely forseeable.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 1:43 pm

IMMIGRATION: THE WRONG BATTLE
Jeremy Corbyn is being criticized for claiming that immigration cuts wages. I suspect his critics are right, if not quite for the reasons some of them might think

http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad.com ... attle.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This blog sums up my thoughts on Corbyn's recent speech. His admirers point out he is always taken out of context, that the subject is nuanced etc but never really quite explain why then he keeps coming back to these topics voluntarily. As the blog points out, poor pay and conditions are mostly related to (right wing) domestic policy, so why give hard Brexiters ammunition by repeatedly and voluntarily tying low pay to freedom of movement and the single market?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 1:57 pm

Good-afternoon, everyone

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 2:18 pm

Willow904 wrote:
IMMIGRATION: THE WRONG BATTLE
Jeremy Corbyn is being criticized for claiming that immigration cuts wages. I suspect his critics are right, if not quite for the reasons some of them might think
http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad.com ... attle.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This blog sums up my thoughts on Corbyn's recent speech. His admirers point out he is always taken out of context, that the subject is nuanced etc but never really quite explain why then he keeps coming back to these topics voluntarily. As the blog points out, poor pay and conditions are mostly related to (right wing) domestic policy, so why give hard Brexiters ammunition by repeatedly and voluntarily tying low pay to freedom of movement and the single market?

Thank you for this. I need to know when and where my understanding isn't complete. I hadn't remembered this part of Corbyn's latest speech. Allowing inaccurate information living on is wrong. I've read the blog entry once and went through the speech. I've not organised my thoughts well enough to add anything more here now.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 2:39 pm

French Brexit advert banned from Tube stations
The campaign - which also appealed for "hot entrepreneurs" - has been banned by TfL but is now set to appear in national press.
https://news.sky.com/story/french-brexi ... s-11285558" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 2:42 pm

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/v ... 47bec76d41" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Vince Cable Says UK Is Locked In 'Civil War' Over Brexit
'The fool's errand has resulted in hate crime on our streets.'

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 3:05 pm

Zero mention never mind fighting in the streets,as is commonly the case doesn't bear any resemblance to my World or experience.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 3:09 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
French Brexit advert banned from Tube stations
The campaign - which also appealed for "hot entrepreneurs" - has been banned by TfL but is now set to appear in national press.
https://news.sky.com/story/french-brexi ... s-11285558" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://e3.365dm.com/18/03/1096x616/sky ... 0311104635" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Much enjoyed , here in Normandy

Post by **refitman** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 3:19 pm

Willow904 wrote:
IMMIGRATION: THE WRONG BATTLE
Jeremy Corbyn is being criticized for claiming that immigration cuts wages. I suspect his critics are right, if not quite for the reasons some of them might think
http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad.com ... attle.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This blog sums up my thoughts on Corbyn's recent speech. His admirers point out he is always taken out of context, that the subject is nuanced etc but never really quite explain why then he keeps coming back to these topics voluntarily. As the blog points out, poor pay and conditions are mostly related to (right wing) domestic policy, so why give hard Brexiters ammunition by repeatedly and voluntarily tying low pay to freedom of movement and the single market?

It does miss the part where Corbyn recognises the EU are already working on this:

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 3:41 pm

Vastly complicated when attempting to define lorry drivers as 'posted workers' --

-french-president-emmanuel-macron-posted-workers-directive-reforms
http://www.france24.com/en/20171023-eu- ... ve-reforms" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Dozens of research projects covering different periods in the last 25odd years show overall not much effect

immigration-and-jobs-labour-market-effects-immigration/
https://fullfact.org/immigration/immigr ... migration/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

BUT where they do impact is on lower-paid lower-skilled in local pockets , where the workers are not posted from overseas but recruited both by agencies and personal contact, which is very visible to the 'locals' .

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 3:41 pm

refitman wrote:
Willow904 wrote:
IMMIGRATION: THE WRONG BATTLE
Jeremy Corbyn is being criticized for claiming that immigration cuts wages. I suspect his critics are right, if not quite for the reasons some of them might think
http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad.com ... attle.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This blog sums up my thoughts on Corbyn's recent speech. His admirers point out he is always taken out of context, that the subject is nuanced etc but never really quite explain why then he keeps coming back to these topics voluntarily. As the blog points out, poor pay and conditions are mostly related to (right wing) domestic policy, so why give hard Brexiters ammunition by repeatedly and voluntarily tying low pay to freedom of movement and the single market?
It does miss the part where Corbyn recognises the EU are already working on this:

I'm not aware what changes the EU have in mind and Corbyn doesn't say but as he says this applies to Eurozone countries, I'm left unclear what relevance it will have for non-Eurozone countries.

Anyway, it still relates to my point that it links EU/single market immigration with negative impacts on pay, a concept that is being used to drive a hard Brexit, even though there are far bigger causes of low pay, not least continued austerity and lack of capital investment.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 4:04 pm

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/e ... ssion=true" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

We can't let the Tories take lessons from the US on using voter ID to distort democracy

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 4:20 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43362673" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Russian spy: Salisbury diners told to wash possessions

Corbyn maybe should have followed McDonnell's lead on a RT boycott.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 4:22 pm

When is the last time JC appeared on there?

Post by **refitman** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 4:42 pm

Willow904 wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43362673
Russian spy: Salisbury diners told to wash possessions
Corbyn maybe should have followed McDonnell's lead on a RT boycott.

Galloway seems to have lost his shit over that.

Post by **refitman** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 4:43 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:When is the last time JC appeared on there?

Weekly, the way some people talk about it.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 4:44 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:When is the last time JC appeared on there?

McDonnell was on Marr this morning and was very clear he wouldn't be appearing on RT again. I just felt an opportunity had presented itself for Corbyn to follow suit and endorse McDonnell's stance, rather than his office's wishy washy "we are keeping the situation under review" response. Opportunity missed, perhaps, though McDonnell is receiving good coverage on an individual level.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 4:49 pm

refitman wrote:
Willow904 wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43362673
Russian spy: Salisbury diners told to wash possessions
Corbyn maybe should have followed McDonnell's lead on a RT boycott.
Galloway seems to have lost his shit over that.

Yes. I'm quite liking John McDonnell today.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 4:57 pm

refitman wrote:
Willow904 wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43362673
Russian spy: Salisbury diners told to wash possessions
Corbyn maybe should have followed McDonnell's lead on a RT boycott.
Galloway seems to have lost his shit over that.

The same man who (in)famously once said "yes I did support the Soviet Union, and I think the disappearance of the Soviet Union is the biggest catastrophe of my life"

Post by **refitman** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 5:02 pm

George Galloway
✔
@georgegalloway

Instead of boycotting @RT_com Mr @johnmcdonnellMP why not boycott the pro-war Observer which yesterday hit rock bottom smearing you and your friends as “foul racists”, your candidate for GS as just “a mistress”? PS the man you delighted this morning is dripping in Iraqi blood!
10:53 AM - Mar 11, 2018
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

George Galloway
✔
@georgegalloway

I tell you I’m spitting mad about John McDonnell and @RT_com As you’ll hear at 1pm on @talkRADIO ( should I boycott Mr Murdoch’s media John?) on the Sunday Roast! #Russia #RT #Corbyn #Lansman #Momentum #Spies #War #Murder #Mayhem
10:58 AM - Mar 11, 2018
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 5:17 pm

Willow904 wrote:
IMMIGRATION: THE WRONG BATTLE
Jeremy Corbyn is being criticized for claiming that immigration cuts wages. I suspect his critics are right, if not quite for the reasons some of them might think
http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad.com ... attle.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This blog sums up my thoughts on Corbyn's recent speech. His admirers point out he is always taken out of context, that the subject is nuanced etc but never really quite explain why then he keeps coming back to these topics voluntarily. As the blog points out, poor pay and conditions are mostly related to (right wing) domestic policy, so why give hard Brexiters ammunition by repeatedly and voluntarily tying low pay to freedom of movement and the single market?

Maybe It's more to do with what people believe rather than what is true. The idea that migrants undercut native workers & depress wages is quite widely established/believed/believable and although it's risky enforcing anti migration views, it's probably not easy to dissuade people otherwise.
If a significant proportion of pro-leave votes were motivated by a worry that migration needs better control (rather than just a xenophobic,knee jerk reaction), but the same voters are still open to there being a need for migrant workers in key areas to fulfil shortages, then maybe Corbyn's approach could help swing votes to Labour & against hard Brexit (not sure of what he's suggesting suspect practical effect of any policy might be to improve min. pay & conditions for all workers in a sector, regardless of their origin)

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 5:29 pm

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 50321.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"Philip Hammond insists Tories will not pay back more than £800,000 in donations from Russian oligarchs"

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 5:48 pm

tinybgoat wrote:
Willow904 wrote:
IMMIGRATION: THE WRONG BATTLE
Jeremy Corbyn is being criticized for claiming that immigration cuts wages. I suspect his critics are right, if not quite for the reasons some of them might think
http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad.com ... attle.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This blog sums up my thoughts on Corbyn's recent speech. His admirers point out he is always taken out of context, that the subject is nuanced etc but never really quite explain why then he keeps coming back to these topics voluntarily. As the blog points out, poor pay and conditions are mostly related to (right wing) domestic policy, so why give hard Brexiters ammunition by repeatedly and voluntarily tying low pay to freedom of movement and the single market?
Maybe It's more to do with what people believe rather than what is true. The idea that migrants undercut native workers & depress wages is quite widely established/believed/believable and although it's risky enforcing anti migration views, it's probably not easy to dissuade people otherwise.
If a significant proportion of pro-leave votes were motivated by a worry that migration needs better control (rather than just a xenophobic,knee jerk reaction), but the same voters are still open to there being a need for migrant workers in key areas to fulfil shortages, then maybe Corbyn's approach could help swing votes to Labour & against hard Brexit (not sure of what he's suggesting suspect practical effect of any policy might be to improve min. pay & conditions for all workers in a sector, regardless of their origin)

That's rather what was said when Labour failed to oppose austerity cuts, though, isn't it? I don't think indulging a notion on which Labour couldn't out-Tory the Tories did therm much good then and the article I linked is warning similarly now. If people want immigration controls, it's hard to see how Labour can trump the Tories on that.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 6:11 pm

tinybgoat wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 50321.html
"Philip Hammond insists Tories will not pay back more than £800,000 in donations from Russian oligarchs"

“There are people in this country who are British citizens who are of Russian origin. I don’t think we should taint them, or should tar them with Putin’s brush,” he said.

I think I'm getting the hang of this now. Russian oligarchs who have been in this country for a couple of years and have donated thousands to the Tories are British.

West Indians who have lived here for decades paying tax and NI are foreigners.

I just got a bit confused by the whole historic Commonwealth ties versus long time national enemies thing.

Post by **refitman** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 6:17 pm

A series of Labour MPs, including deputy speaker Sir Lindsay Hoyle, Harriet Harman and Chris Bryant are known to be hoping to replace Bercow, who pledged to serve as speaker for 10 years and has completed almost nine. However, none are yet campaigning for Bercow to go immediately.

(pending the outcome of the bullying investigation) Does Harman ever get on the right side of things?

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 6:32 pm

Willow904 wrote: .…
That's rather what was said when Labour failed to oppose austerity cuts, though, isn't it? I don't think indulging a notion on which Labour couldn't out-Tory the Tories did therm much good then and the article I linked is warning similarly now. If people want immigration controls, it's hard to see how Labour can trump the Tories on that.

True, I did consider that, but I don't think it's quite the same thing, people are always going to be uneasy about immigration, but a lot aren't totally against it, just scared that there aren't controls. Labour should be able to promote the positive aspects of freedom of movement whilst demonstrating that there are safeguards in place (or available). Admittedly Tories could do the same but currently are failing to give a coherent policy on how migration will work & where the replacement workers are going to come from.
(Arrgh, struggling to edit nested quotes out on mobile)

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 7:16 pm

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PA MineWorkers support the Democrat !

HT Ms Riots

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 9:07 pm

Of course that also applies to the brits, incvluding MP's, who pretend to believe that the referendum was "THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE "!

excuse caps

Edited " pretend to" . That's FIXED !

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 10:05 pm

Goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sun 11 Mar, 2018 11:10 pm

Oops.

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