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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 8:09 am 
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Frog222 wrote:
My impression from a quick read is that gains from brexit might lower the broader cost of living by a teeny amount but certain sectors such as parts of agriculture would be hard hit .

The EU compares very well with the rest of the world, so if it ain't broke why fix it ? ( Barriers to trade from Africa are shown to be false, which was new to me ! )


I would even have to wonder if the real cost of living would be lower. Given the higher taxation in (some of) EU allows for less inequity and thereafter less spend on crime and the causes and consequences of crime.
Just of the top of head thinking, nothing to link to at this stage.

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 Post subject: Re: Sat 2 and Sun 3 June
PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 8:10 am 
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Hello!

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 Post subject: Re: Sat 2 and Sun 3 June
PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 8:14 am 
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Compare and contrast:

Express wrote:
‘YOU ONLY FUND 3%!’ EU’s Brexit blackmail MOCKED as UK scientists say Britain will THRIVE
won't trouble you with the link


The Royal Society wrote:
The UK is one of the largest recipients of research funding in the EU. Over the period 2007 – 2013 the UK received €8.8 billion out of a total of €107 billion expenditure on research, development and innovation in EU Member States, associated and third countries. This represents the fourth largest share in the EU.
https://royalsociety.org/topics-policy/ ... gIeSfD_BwE

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 Post subject: Re: Sat 2 and Sun 3 June
PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 9:13 am 
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Thread on Northern Rail, snafu.

https://twitter.com/garius/status/1002527558599168000

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 Post subject: Re: Sat 2 and Sun 3 June
PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 10:38 am 
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https://amp.theguardian.com/society/201 ... ssion=true

Quote:
Labour consults on plan for major NHS restructuring
Shadow health secretary says party will examine how to banish privatisation and restore universal public NHS


Some structural reform is probably necessary, but in terms of public facing policy more money will likely have more appeal. Labour also need to be wary of overemphasising the impact of structures against the impact of intent. The Tories have an intent that private outsourcing will provide lucrative revenue streams for shareholders. If you outsource with this aim in mind, it's not surprising that profit comes before service. Other countries use private providers with an aim to provide good healthcare - Canada or Germany e.g. - and regulate private health providers with this intention as their main aim, not to save money. The problem with the Tories and the NHS is not structures, but their basic lack of commitment to universal healthcare of any kind. Their latest proposals will create ACOs based on the US model. Their direction of travel is clear. So although Labour will want to make some structural changes to try to ensure the NHS has some protection under future governments, I suspect just having a government in charge that puts patients interests first will have the greatest impact on outcomes. When every small decision is made for the right reasons instead of the wrong ones the positive benefits will quickly add up (I hope :)).

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 Post subject: Re: Sat 2 and Sun 3 June
PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 10:42 am 
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gilsey wrote:


Their brilliant "solution" is to scrap large numbers of the "new" services. We are told this is just a temporary measure, let's see :twisted:


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 Post subject: Re: Sat 2 and Sun 3 June
PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 11:03 am 
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If a large part of the work necessary to accommodate the timetable changes hadn't been done, why did the national timetable change go ahead? Who made that decision? It could have been delayed, one presumes, until the next timetable change. Who decided to go ahead before everyone was ready? I assume Network Rail work out the details but does a major change come from government instructions? Is this Grayling directly? The fact that we don't seem to have had this level of timetabling failure before does make you wonder what on earth has been going on. Did the private companies fail to advise Network Rail of their inability to train drivers on time and how the infrastructure would not be ready? Or were concerns ignored?
Something like this would have had the papers screaming for blood under a Labour government. As it is, will any of them even suggest Grayling should go?

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 Post subject: Re: Sat 2 and Sun 3 June
PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 4:17 pm 
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Anybody there??


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 5:16 pm 
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Gardening and mechanical repairs to rotoscythe here :-)


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 Post subject: Re: Sat 2 and Sun 3 June
PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 6:58 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Anybody there??

There's nothing to say.

No new policies to debate, apart from the Duffer Zone as reported in the Sun :roll:

Everyone on Twitter blaming Corbyn for Brexit.

Just another day....


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 7:21 pm 
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I would have to echo the whole not much politics going on take.

My Twitter feed is "where is Melania"; Graham Linehan being called a TERF; Michael Rosen taking on all comers on what does "race" mean and a very peculiar row about a Lush campaign over spycops.

Somewhere in amongst all the weirdness, I believe Spain swore in a new PM.

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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 7:31 pm 
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Willow904 wrote:
I would have to echo the whole not much politics going on take.

My Twitter feed is "where is Melania"; Graham Linehan being called a TERF; Michael Rosen taking on all comers on what does "race" mean and a very peculiar row about a Lush campaign over spycops.

Somewhere in amongst all the weirdness, I believe Spain swore in a new PM.

Thanks that made me :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 8:03 pm 
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This made me laugh (on Twitter)
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I ordered a nigh phone. It should arrive in a day or two


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 8:06 pm 
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Nick Dearden
@nickdearden75

Hearing Vauxhall Labour has just voted for mandatory reselection. About time. Bye bye Kate Hoey. #Brexit


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 8:08 pm 
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PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
Nick Dearden
@nickdearden75

Hearing Vauxhall Labour has just voted for mandatory reselection. About time. Bye bye Kate Hoey. #Brexit


To avoid confusion, this appears to mean they voted for a trigger ballot.

Hoey is over 70 and before last year's snap poll stated she wouldn't fight a 2020 GE, so it might not actually alter that much in practice.


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 8:12 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
Nick Dearden
@nickdearden75

Hearing Vauxhall Labour has just voted for mandatory reselection. About time. Bye bye Kate Hoey. #Brexit


To avoid confusion, this appears to mean they voted for a trigger ballot.

Hoey is over 70 and before last year's snap poll stated she wouldn't fight a 2020 GE, so it might not actually alter that much in practice.

Yes someone BTL on the Tweet has made the same point.

Well you did encourage us to post more!


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 8:23 pm 
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Oh sure, if nothing else its still of interest that the CLP nonetheless wants a ballot just to make certain :twisted:


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 8:24 pm 
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Fair dos to Northern on this

https://www.northernrailway.co.uk/temporary-timetables

Read to the end - they are not pulling any punches!


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 9:15 pm 
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https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/06/02/u ... poena.html
"Trump’s Lawyers, in Confidential Memo, Argue to Head Off a Historic Subpoena"


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 10:02 pm 
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Willow904 wrote:
I would have to echo the whole not much politics going on take.

My Twitter feed is "where is Melania"; Graham Linehan being called a TERF; Michael Rosen taking on all comers on what does "race" mean and a very peculiar row about a Lush campaign over spycops.

Somewhere in amongst all the weirdness, I believe Spain swore in a new PM.


The Lush thing - this was a front page outrage story for some of the tabs today. But the fact is that undercover police officers spent years deeply embedding themselves in the lives of people who had no idea they were being lied to and, on more than one occasion, had children with their 'ignorant' partners. To say that it is a shocking, shaming, off the scale disgrace is something of an understatement.

Lush put together a good, effective visual campaign about this because it's disappeared from public view and the response is 'how dare you say this about the police' Say what? Say exactly what they did? Fuck sake.

Also that is clearly not the important Graham Linehan story of the day.

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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 10:38 pm 
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The Queen wore a lovely frock though


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun, 2018 11:17 pm 
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PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
The Queen wore a lovely frock though


That was my frock, Paul.

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:43 am 
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https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/ec ... ship-model
"Brexit customs row: Liam Fox reveals group on Theresa May's partnership model has met just once"
Quote:
Mr Fox said: "Our group’s met once so far… We’ve been waiting for a report coming from experts and officials, which we have just received. We meet again, parliament’s not of course been sitting in the past week, we’re back now this week."

Busy chewing his Murray Mints (as my dad used to say)


Last edited by tinybgoat on Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:48 am 
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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 5:57 am 
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https://www.wemove.eu/
One for you Paul?

(also currently looking for a new Exec Director)

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 7:15 am 
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Morning all.

This is really interesting about Trump's approach to deal-making.

https://twitter.com/fawfulfan/status/10 ... 9367837702

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 8:54 am 
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tinyclanger2 wrote:
https://www.wemove.eu/
One for you Paul?

(also currently looking for a new Exec Director)

Yes well spotted
Quote:
Our campaigns are not about saying 'Yes' or 'No' to Europe. They are about working towards our vision for the future. We push for the Europe we want and challenge unacceptable European policy decisions, thereby strengthening European democracy.

We really need more of this.


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 9:42 am 
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RogerOThornhill wrote:
Morning all.

This is really interesting about Trump's approach to deal-making.

https://twitter.com/fawfulfan/status/10 ... 9367837702

I hesitate between Mad and Bad when thinking of Trump !

First larf of the day was hearing R4 report of PPatel spouting on about meritocracy .

As if she knew what it meant — clue aristo-cracy, pluto-cracy , klepto-cracy … all opposed to demo-cracy perhaps ?


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 10:08 am 
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https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/05/l ... c-britain/
"The lies of meritocratic Britain" Nick Cohen, 2016
(I thought this was quite good, but admittedly was googling smugocracy )


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 10:19 am 
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(Saw Isle of Dogs yesterday - bit late I know. Seemed very Brexit/Trump. Was excellent IMPIIV*)

*In my possibly irrelevant and ill-informed view

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 10:23 am 
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tinyclanger2 wrote:
(Saw Isle of Dogs yesterday - bit late I know. Seemed very Brexit/Trump. Was excellent IMPIIV*)

*In my possibly irrelevant and ill-informed view

*Phew I thought you'd come over all FBPE :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 10:30 am 
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https://twitter.com/jillongovt/status/1 ... 4021719040

Quote:
Jill Rutter

@jillongovt
Follow
Follow @jillongovt

More
shocking admissions by Liam Fox on @BBCR4today that govt is only now assembling evidence for its two customs options. Remember it put out its future partnership paper on customs in August last year



:roll:

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 10:50 am 
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https://www.theguardian.com/books/2018/ ... nner-level

Quote:
Is rising inequality responsible for greater stress, anxiety and mental illness?


Yet another very good article on the abundant evidence of the negative impacts of high inequality on society.
The negatives don't just fall on the poorest, either, that's the thing. Highly unequal societies are less positive for everyone.
The difficulty in achieving this optimum, low inequality society, it seems, despite its obvious desirability, is convincing people to voluntarily support it.
How do we get away from this mindset of needing to constantly bolster ourselves by looking down on others, whether it's the poor, disabled or foreigners?
Or, conversely, is it really that hard? Is the huge quantity of Benefits Street type programmes evidence of the constant propaganda needed to maintain such a mindset against the reality that most people tend to be quite accepting of differences when they get to know someone in real life?

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 11:32 am 
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Latest border wheeze appears to be no border control at all:

https://mobile.twitter.com/faisalislam/ ... 9911756800
Quote:
Exclusive: Secret Brexit agreements cover No Deal “open border” plan to not enforce customs checks at UK border


Taking back control of no control, or something.

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 11:42 am 
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tinybgoat wrote:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/05/lies-meritocratic-britain/
"The lies of meritocratic Britain" Nick Cohen, 2016
(I thought this was quite good, but admittedly was googling smugocracy )


As with some others, Cohen only went totally mad after 23 June 2016 (and in his case, specifically after the attempt to oust Corbyn on the back of it failed)


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 11:57 am 
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https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... it-uk-news

Quote:
Replace May with Gove to sort out Brexit, Tory donor urges


Clearly, however negative Brexit has been for our economy, there simply hasn't been the kind of outright chaos the hedge fund managers were looking for to make their fortunes. "Break a few rules" says Odey, "reach out to Italy" because the pound is just too stable and hedge funds aren't making the killing they were expecting off the back of other people's misery. Not to mention the rest of Europe hasn't been hot on our heels in running for the door. The opportunities for the UK as the EU collapsed simply haven't materialised in the way the leave instigators expected. If the EU holds firm, as it ultimately must, Brexit might not even be good for the vultures.

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 12:45 pm 
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Willow904 wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jun/02/replace-theresa-may-with-michael-gove-tory-donor-says-brexit-uk-news

Quote:
Replace May with Gove to sort out Brexit, Tory donor urges


Clearly, however negative Brexit has been for our economy, there simply hasn't been the kind of outright chaos the hedge fund managers were looking for to make their fortunes. "Break a few rules" says Odey, "reach out to Italy" because the pound is just too stable and hedge funds aren't making the killing they were expecting off the back of other people's misery. Not to mention the rest of Europe hasn't been hot on our heels in running for the door. The opportunities for the UK as the EU collapsed simply haven't materialised in the way the leave instigators expected. If the EU holds firm, as it ultimately must, Brexit might not even be good for the vultures.

Yes that's very insightful.

Just a gentle slide into obscurity for all of us....


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 12:52 pm 
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tinybgoat wrote:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/05/lies-meritocratic-britain/
"The lies of meritocratic Britain" Nick Cohen, 2016
(I thought this was quite good, but admittedly was googling smugocracy )

I thought it was good, full stop :-)

"" That we are not a meritocracy ought to be obvious. A true meritocracy would resemble a type of communism. To ensure no child had an unfair advantage and only innate talent flourished, the state would ban parental bequests, and remove all children from their parents to communal hostels, as in Plato’s Republic. ""

I googled 'meritocracy as an ideology' the other day after hearing the expression on FranceCulture radio, and a VERY convenient one it is too !


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 1:24 pm 
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I note with approval that Abi Wilkinson is back on Twitter 8-)


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:15 pm 
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https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... are_btn_tw

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:20 pm 
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https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... SApp_Other


https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... SApp_Other

(A third sc not elderly,half spend,an independent living issue fundamentally)

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Last edited by HindleA on Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:21 pm 
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Plenty continuing to happen,I humbly suggest.

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:45 pm 
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https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/news/d ... ts-1635543


It was ####ing hot,is my expert opinion,noticed a couple of collapses.220th# in my class,steadily on course be the first in the over 90's (subject to the obvious)

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:49 pm 
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# or not quite last.Open to interpretation.

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 2:54 pm 
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HindleA wrote:
Plenty continuing to happen,I humbly suggest.

For sure.

But no way to engage with it and change it at a national level.

The government is just avoiding anything at all troublesome in Parliament.

Well just avoiding everything really.


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 3:07 pm 
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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 3:34 pm 
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https://news.sky.com/story/government-u ... t-11393448
"Government under pressure to publish warnings of 'Doomsday Brexit'"
Quote:
The government is under pressure to release papers outlining a "Doomsday Brexit" scenario in which the UK would run short of medicines, food and fuel within two weeks of leaving the EU.


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 3:39 pm 
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Project Fear mk II?

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 4:56 pm 
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Hindle presence = hurrah!

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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jun, 2018 4:56 pm 
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Joined: Thu 18 Sep, 2014 8:18 pm
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... PTO

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