Friday 23rd November 2018

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:40 am

Morning

It is Friday isn't it?

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 7:02 am

Government minister nearly barked in a mess (5,7).

Hint - see SGO's excellent BBCQT review from last night.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 8:13 am

BTW this is a day or so old, but have we shared this marvelous clip? Yvette Cooper at her best.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 8:39 am

PFY -- Friday is for SGO and the evening's attempts at R4 humour at 1830

Thanks so much for the Yvette, re-shared!

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 8:52 am

” zitan 11m ago If I sign up to support the Guardian, will the tiresome exhortations to do so disappear from my screen?

Just got around to the Crace

MPs pile on from all sides to trash May's Brexit non-deal deal

PM promises some things will happen if other unspecified things also happen, and no one agrees

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -deal-deal" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 9:29 am

Revealed: the millionaires hoarding UK fishing rights
A painstaking five-month long investigation shows that a small group of wealthy families control huge swathes of the country’s fishing quota

https://unearthed.greenpeace.org/2018/1 ... hael-gove/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

from this twitting: " onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 10:17 am

https://www.parliament.uk/business/comm ... hed-17-19/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 10:39 am

Have to sat that Sky's review of QT last night was even better than usual.

Agree on how good Lewis is, and also suspect that Hartley-Spewer is an act to a significant degree.

(she used to be a Graun journalist and regularly express liberal sentiments, don't forget)

Post by **adam** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 10:49 am

Even Gerard Batten agrees that Farage was, like him, an awful racist shit.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 11:01 am

One wonders what Alan Sked thinks about the party he founded...not a lot I would imagine.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 12:47 pm

frog222 wrote:” zitan 11m ago If I sign up to support the Guardian, will the tiresome exhortations to do so disappear from my screen?

Just got around to the Crace

MPs pile on from all sides to trash May's Brexit non-deal deal

PM promises some things will happen if other unspecified things also happen, and no one agrees

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -deal-deal" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It seems some of her supporters have gone beyond "May's deal or no deal" and are tentatively floating the nuclear option - "May's deal or an election".

Of course the sensible answer to deadlock would be an A50 extension - but our PM has said that will never happen, so........

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 1:02 pm

Good-afternoon, everyone

Post by **refitman** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 1:26 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Have to sat that Sky's review of QT last night was even better than usual.

Agree on how good Lewis is, and also suspect that Hartley-Spewer is an act to a significant degree.

(she used to be a Graun journalist and regularly express liberal sentiments, don't forget)

Yes, but so was Melanie Phillips!

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 1:28 pm

Her move towards the barking mad right appears totally genuine, though. Not sure if that is better or worse really

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 1:49 pm

I'll be back after 'while

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 2:54 pm

Good morfternoon.

Whoops!

The CBI has inadvertently sent ITV News internal emails which highlight a difference between the confederation’s public views about the Brexit political declaration and those held inside the organisation.

The CBI’s Head of EU Negotiations, Nicole Sykes, argued there was “no need to give credit to negotiators I think, because it’s not a good deal.” (Politics Live, Guardian)

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 3:43 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
It seems some of her supporters have gone beyond "May's deal or no deal" and are tentatively floating the nuclear option - "May's deal or an election".

Of course the sensible answer to deadlock would be an A50 extension - but our PM has said that will never happen, so........

Is that a leadership or General Election? ( Been away, actually sleeping, I may have a bug !)

Some of the parameters on all that here

" In 1993, when John Major was defeated on a provision ratifying the Maastricht treaty, he returned to the Commons the next day, declaring it a matter of confidence and threatening to dissolve parliament. The rebels, fearful of an election, duly came to heel.

That procedure, however, is not open to May. Under the Fixed Term Parliaments Act, passed in 2011, a substantive motion cannot have a confidence vote attached to it. Parliament can only be dissolved if a specific vote of no confidence is carried against the government, and if no alternative government can be formed within 14 days. It would be a bold Conservative or Democratic Unionist MP who would be prepared to oppose the government in a confidence vote.

Alternatively, an early election could occur if two-thirds of MPs voted for it. Given what happened last year, it is highly unlikely, however, that many Conservatives would be prepared to take this risk. Turkeys do not normally vote for Christmas.

If defeated on the approval vote or the legislation, May, therefore, would have little option but to resign. There would then be an election for a new Conservative leader. No one other than a Conservative would be able to command a majority in the Commons. "(Number-crunching needed there !)

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... referendum" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 3:53 pm

Of course its a GE they are trying to scare people with, lots of Tories (not just those who have signed letters!) wouldn't mind a leadership election

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 4:53 pm

So out of the blue, John Hayes gets a knighthood...
and most people are reasonably certain it's connected with him backing May even though he's a long-standing Eurosceptic.

But hold on what does that well-known ex-Labour MP think?

Tom Harris
‏
Verified account

@MrTCHarris
Follow Follow @MrTCHarris
More
I don’t give a stuff for the conspiracy theories - Sir John Hayes is one of the nicest and most considerate MPs in the House. Well deserved K.

8:39 AM - 23 Nov 2018

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 4:56 pm

Can't remember whether we saw this - if so, it's worth repeating.

My world – this week “Chloe Westley” on pencils, personal abuse and who funds the Taxpayers Alliance

https://thepinprick.com/2018/10/31/my-w ... -alliance/

When I was growing up in Australia I had a book that had belonged to my Great Aunt. It was literally full of facts about Britain the greatest country on Earth. There were facts about the Empire – facts about King George the Vth who ruled over it all – really funny jokes about Irish people – pictures of Bobbies on bicycles and children with golden hair buying apples from cheerful men with straw in their mouths. You can imagine my disappointment when I arrived at Heathrow and didn’t see any of this. The King was now a woman – probably to placate feminists. The Sun wasn’t shining. And to this day I have not seen a Bobby on a bicycle or a girl with blonde hair buying apples from a man with straw in his mouth. When I told an Irish person how funny he was because Irish people are always doing stupid things he accused me of telling offensive jokes. That is typical of the kind of abuse I get for believing in a Better Britain.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 5:15 pm

I'm back

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 5:29 pm

"...if any amendments were to be carried against the government, the prime minister would have lost her authority. She could hardly return to Brussels to say: “Parliament will not back me – will you please give me something better?” The EU would reply: “We only deal with those enjoying democratic legitimacy.” The truth is, if the bill is not passed in an unamended form, the government will not be able to ratify the agreement."

- Vernon Bogdanor
We’re heading for a second referendum – and maybe a third

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 5:48 pm

https://amp.theguardian.com/society/201 ... ssion=true" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 5:53 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:So out of the blue, John Hayes gets a knighthood...
and most people are reasonably certain it's connected with him backing May even though he's a long-standing Eurosceptic.

But hold on what does that well-known ex-Labour MP think?

Tom Harris
‏
Verified account

@MrTCHarris
Follow Follow @MrTCHarris
More
I don’t give a stuff for the conspiracy theories - Sir John Hayes is one of the nicest and most considerate MPs in the House. Well deserved K.

8:39 AM - 23 Nov 2018

An utterly terrible person in every way

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:00 pm

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:05 pm

Of course the EU can give a Better Deal .

" Come back, stop being silly ."

thaumaturge · Post by **thaumaturge** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:23 pm

Hello everyone - I see some familiar names here! Have been meaning to visit for ages, and had no idea that Refitman was behind this.

Thanks to frog222 for alerting me to this, and SkysGoneOut's excellent synopses of QT.

thaumaturge · Post by **thaumaturge** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:30 pm

What, backbencher? The horror! I want to be Norn Irish Secretary. I'm pretty sure I'd be a lot better than the current incumbent. That would, of course, not be difficult.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:37 pm

Shhh ! I'm listening to the Now Show

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000183j" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PS EDIT the first ten minutes are very good .

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:41 pm

Constance has acquired a new hat.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:48 pm

https://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/m ... ignorance/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Ministers’ ‘shocking’ failure to consult DPOs on bill shows UN convention ignorance

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:54 pm

thaumaturge wrote:Hello everyone - I see some familiar names here! Have been meaning to visit for ages, and had no idea that Refitman was behind this.

Thanks to frog222 for alerting me to this, and SkysGoneOut's excellent synopses of QT.

Woo-hoo!
Welcome

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 6:57 pm

HindleA wrote:-

Where's the asterisk footnote in the social care image you've posted, please?

Post by **refitman** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 7:33 pm

thaumaturge wrote:Hello everyone - I see some familiar names here! Have been meaning to visit for ages, and had no idea that Refitman was behind this.

Thanks to frog222 for alerting me to this, and SkysGoneOut's excellent synopses of QT.

Wotcha Thaum! Nice to see you over here.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 7:47 pm

Crace's Week -- https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... ested-week" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thursday " But Nokes now has a late challenger in the form of the work and pensions minister, Justin Tomlinson, who has told a select committee that families affected by the benefit cap could take in a lodger to help make ends meet. Tomlinson appeared to believe he had solved poverty at a stroke. Among the many details he had failed to grasp – poorer people not having several spare bedrooms to rent out on Airbnb being one of them – was that he was inciting people to break the law. Any extra income earned by someone on benefits has to be declared to the council, which will reduce their payments accordingly. Failure to do so results in a prosecution for fraud. A charge someone could make against Tomlinson for impersonating intelligent life "

Two new stars are born !

thaumaturge · Post by **thaumaturge** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 8:27 pm

refitman wrote:
thaumaturge wrote:Hello everyone - I see some familiar names here! Have been meaning to visit for ages, and had no idea that Refitman was behind this.

Thanks to frog222 for alerting me to this, and SkysGoneOut's excellent synopses of QT.
Wotcha Thaum! Nice to see you over here.

You're not telling me that you can watch several rugby matches at the same time, provide excellent commentary on them all, *and* monitor this site as well?

I'm convinced you have either several brains or several helpers. Probably the former.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 8:49 pm

Goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 8:52 pm

thaumaturge wrote: You're not telling me that you can watch several rugby matches at the same time, provide excellent commentary on them all, *and* monitor this site as well?

I'm convinced you have either several brains or several helpers. Probably the former.

Which is precisely the hypothesising we had at WADDYA over MAM ( Moveanymountains -- wasn't it?)

I thought there were several MAM's , unless of course there was just ONE , financed by Guardian Central to work (almost) around the clock ...

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 9:18 pm

Four local council byelections yesterday:

Enfield - Tory hold with over half the vote and a double figure increase and swing from Labour since this May. This is something of a return to the safe Tory status this ward enjoyed for some years, reliably returning three councillors for them from 2002 onwards until 2010 (and staying quite safe in a previous 2011 byelection) before Labour unexpectedly took a seat in 2014, and though the Tories won it back earlier this year things were if anything slightly closer overall. So this result was perhaps slightly unexpected, and Labour's poor showing seems to be down to controversies affecting both the council and the local (Edmonton) MP. LibDems held onto their share and thus overtook the Greens who more than halved to 4%, followed by a Womens Equality candidate on 3% and an Independent on less than 2%.

Wirral - Labour hold with over 60 per cent, a modest increase since May in a result that showed strikingly little change from then overall. This is a ward that returned 3 Labour councillors in the 2004 all-outs but with the Tories competitive, and that remained the case for the next few elections (Tories won it by just 4 votes at their 2008 high point) before Labour pulled away after 2010. There was a small swing to the Tories here in May, but it was pretty much reversed now as the blue team was almost unchanged. Greens next on 6% then the LibDems on 3%, both down just a touch on earlier this year.

Westminster - Tory hold with 47 per cent, a tiny drop since May. This ward has traditionally been very safe for them, returning 3 councillors on one of their traditional "flagship councils" very easily since 2002 - the main interest in the next few elections was the LibDems beating Labour to secure a distant second, before Labour took back that position in 2014. There was little indication there of what was to come earlier this year, though, when a significant Labour advance and a swing of around 9% moved this ward to semi-marginal status - and while Labour may be disappointed to achieve almost no further swing now, it suggests that result was no fluke and future contests here (and indeed this borough more generally) could be more interesting than in the past. LibDems on 14% - little changed on six months ago - and lastly Greens on 3%, they say this year's elections out but that is some way down on their previous showing in 2014.

Windsor and Maidenhead - Tory hold with 54% of the vote, a drop of 5 points since the most recent 2015 elections here. This ward has been one of the most reliable for the Tories since the present authority (though then a district council rather than unitary) was set up in 1973 - two Tories were often returned unopposed in the "old days" and though the LibDems once ran this borough their sole success here remains taking one of the two seats back in 1997. As in the rest of this council, however, they have fallen away significantly in recent years and Independents duly took second place in 2011 followed by Labour three years ago, but in both cases distantly so. This time round a localist Flood Prevention Party took that spot with 23% followed by Labour who were 6% down since 2015, but that was a better showing than the LibDems who lost nearly three quarters of their vote to end up on just 5%. Greens had to be content with just 2% in their first ever outing here.

A busier week coming up - seven contests - to end the month.

thaumaturge · Post by **thaumaturge** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 9:26 pm

frog222 wrote:
thaumaturge wrote: You're not telling me that you can watch several rugby matches at the same time, provide excellent commentary on them all, *and* monitor this site as well?

I'm convinced you have either several brains or several helpers. Probably the former.
Which is precisely the hypothesising we had at WADDYA over MAM ( Moveanymountains -- wasn't it?)

I thought there were several MAM's , unless of course there was just ONE , financed by Guardian Central to work (almost) around the clock ...

Oh yes, I'd nearly forgotten about MAM.

But Refit is the real thing, and he's not a twat. To say the least.

NN from me.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 10:48 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... 13m-profit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Companies running 'inadequate' UK care homes make £113m profit

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 11:32 pm

We managed to pay staff well above minimum wage and the budget was always at a surplus(contingency was sensible),it really is the way to go if possible IMHO in terms of control and economics.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 11:32 pm

I think they call this blackmail...

Brexit: DUP may revisit confidence and supply deal, says Foster

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-46321606

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 11:38 pm

Marina Hyde
https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... with-spain" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"Get ready for Brexit advent, where a new political hellscape opens every day"

The only momentary bright spot seems to be the (temporary) humiliation of pretend aristocrat Jacob Rees-Mogg , a sort of Talentless Mr Ripley whose ERG coup against May has failed to ignite. When Michael Corleone is to attempt an assassination in The Godfather, his elder brother Sonny is all over the arrangements. “I want somebody good – and I mean good – to plant that gun,” he declares. “I don’t want my brother coming out of that toilet with just his dick in his hands.”
Well. I’m sorry for the image, but it does currently look as though Rees-Mogg has come out of the water closet with just his proverbial in his hands. That said, he could easily be back on top of the underworld in a fortnight. Such are our cuckoo times.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 11:53 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... off-colour" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

France’s ‘gilets jaunes’ leave Macron feeling decidedly off-colour

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 23 Nov, 2018 11:58 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2 ... dge-moodys" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Government 'could bail out top universities if in financial danger'
Cambridge and Oxford have high likelihood of support if problems arise, says Moody’s

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 24 Nov, 2018 12:01 am

Doting hog

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 24 Nov, 2018 12:02 am

"anagram wars"