Wednesday 28th November 2018
Posted: Wed 28 Nov, 2018 7:03 am
Morning all.
GuardianChancellor admits UK will be worse off under all Brexit scenarios
Keir StarmerNot good enough. Parliament won the right to see the full legal advice and that is precisely what we expect to see. Labour will not let ministers off the hook.
" The poorest 20% of people in England lost an average of 11% of their incomes as a result of austerity, compared with zero losses for the top fifth of households.HindleA wrote:https://amp.theguardian.com/society/201 ... ssion=true
Spending cuts breach UK's human rights obligations, says report
Labour is still on another hook , because if they had responsibility for brexit their option would (saving magic!) still leave the country poorer , assuming Norway being the closest option --PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Keir StarmerNot good enough. Parliament won the right to see the full legal advice and that is precisely what we expect to see. Labour will not let ministers off the hook.
Considered by who? Theresa May? Would she have enough support to get it through among moderate Tories, presuming the SNP are on board (as they appear to have been signalling)? Or would she need Labour support? Would Labour support this? Either officially from the front bench or in sufficient numbers from the backbenches? Or is this just another ploy, a threat to the hard Brexiters that if they don't support May's deal they'll end up with an even softer Brexit?Brexit deal latest news: Norway-style deal will be considered if Theresa May’s plan is blocked by Parliament, Chancellor suggests - live updates
He said something along lines of economically being worse off, but there being other political benefits including 'being able to negotiate new trade deals',PaulfromYorkshire wrote:GuardianChancellor admits UK will be worse off under all Brexit scenarios
Only if the government is able to negotiate a Canadian style FTA and come up with a solution to the Irish border in order to avoid the backstop kicking in. At the moment the only solution available that would allow us to pursue new trade deals is a border in the Irish sea. Which is not going to be acceptable to the DUP, for obvious reasons. So this is just more going round in circles, with everyone knowing what the options and trade offs are but no one willing to articulate them because they don't want to admit that leaving the EU is stupid and pointless.tinybgoat wrote:He said something along lines of economically being worse off, but there being other political benefits including 'being able to negotiate new trade deals',PaulfromYorkshire wrote:GuardianChancellor admits UK will be worse off under all Brexit scenarios
I'm pretty sure that was meant to be an economic benefit!
Hammond speaking quite openly about the government's lies and failures that he continues to be complicit in. Damnation where it's due.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Hammond speaking quite openly there. Praise where it's due.
They should have been talking about the trade offs long ago. The public have always been capable of understanding the trade offs. Indeed, polls have been indicating for some time that pursuing the end of freedom of movement at the expense of the economy as May is doing has always had less support than vice versa and that's before open and honest debate about what leaving the single market really means and what going it alone on WTO terms would really entail.adam wrote:Hammond speaking quite openly about the government's lies and failures that he continues to be complicit in. Damnation where it's due.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Hammond speaking quite openly there. Praise where it's due.
"People didn't vote to be poorer" Hammond not long ago .adam wrote:Hammond speaking quite openly about the government's lies and failures that he continues to be complicit in. Damnation where it's due.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Hammond speaking quite openly there. Praise where it's due.
Some interesting ideas,some Frog222 might like.This is the second of two posts here looking at Brexit through a democratic, rather than a political lens. In the previous post, I argued that the ‘cliff edge’ exit that is inevitable when leaving the EU is not sustainable for the EU, and that the UK would be doing everyone a favour by challenging it.
Slugger : " Here’s what I believe Mrs May needs to do now;tinybgoat wrote:https://sluggerotoole.com/2018/11/28/wh ... ed-part-2/
"Why Brexit is going wrong and how it could be fixed (part 2)"Some interesting ideas,some Frog222 might like.This is the second of two posts here looking at Brexit through a democratic, rather than a political lens. In the previous post, I argued that the ‘cliff edge’ exit that is inevitable when leaving the EU is not sustainable for the EU, and that the UK would be doing everyone a favour by challenging it.
(including truth & conciliation type mechanism)
I completely agree that the commons have passed a binding motion requiring the government to do something which they now have to do, but I have some sympathy with this view. It doesn't mean that the commons have done the wrong thing - there is a clear argument that we are so close to a catastrophic situation that we need to know everything, and there is the possibility that the government are asserting that x is the legal position despite the fact that there own legal advice is that x is not the legal position. But there is a good general idea that advice is confidential, even if there are specific reasons why it might be forced open.frog222 wrote:"" It would be impossible for government to function if we create a precedent that the legal advice that the government receives has to be made public.
We must have, as every other citizen has, the right to take privileged legal advice which remains private between the lawyer and the client.
So the client has the ability to ask the difficult questions, to receive full and frank legal advice, and then to make a decision based on that full and frank advice. ""
State secret !
It is probably what Hammond actually wants tbh, less so May given how obsessed she is with freedom of movement. But she may yet be forced into it, or possibly her successor if she is forced from office (though given the past few years, I will believe that when I see it)Willow904 wrote:Morning.
Behind paywall but headline raises a few questions:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/20 ... d-theresa/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Considered by who? Theresa May? Would she have enough support to get it through among moderate Tories, presuming the SNP are on board (as they appear to have been signalling)? Or would she need Labour support? Would Labour support this? Either officially from the front bench or in sufficient numbers from the backbenches? Or is this just another ploy, a threat to the hard Brexiters that if they don't support May's deal they'll end up with an even softer Brexit?Brexit deal latest news: Norway-style deal will be considered if Theresa May’s plan is blocked by Parliament, Chancellor suggests - live updates
Glad your wife was seen eventually and is getting some treatment.RogerOThornhill wrote:Morning all.
Well, that was fun...wife felt ill yesterday afternoon - cold, shivering, severe back pain, short of breath - 111 took an age to get a clinician to phone back. They sent an ambulance which eventually turned up and took her off to A&E. I followed up but came home when we heard there was a 4 hour wait in Majors to get seen by a doctor. Got home at midnight and went to bed. Phone call at 7:20...she can be collected. Went straight off there and got back in time to get dressed - properly this time. Meeting in school at 8:30. Home for a second part of breakfast. Back to school for Y5 swimming. Then home.
And breathe...they think it was possibly a chest infection but we can't be too careful given what she's been through before.
Hopefully it was nothing too serious, best wishesRogerOThornhill wrote:Morning all.
Well, that was fun...wife felt ill yesterday afternoon - cold, shivering, severe back pain, short of breath - 111 took an age to get a clinician to phone back. They sent an ambulance which eventually turned up and took her off to A&E. I followed up but came home when we heard there was a 4 hour wait in Majors to get seen by a doctor. Got home at midnight and went to bed. Phone call at 7:20...she can be collected. Went straight off there and got back in time to get dressed - properly this time. Meeting in school at 8:30. Home for a second part of breakfast. Back to school for Y5 swimming. Then home.
And breathe...they think it was possibly a chest infection but we can't be too careful given what she's been through before.
One of the many reasons that I never bother with This Week was the fact that Letts was a regular.Nige Tassell
@nigetassell
34m34 minutes ago
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Quentin Letts' departure from the Mail does mean, of course, that he's now more likely to crop up on our TV screens as Pompous Arse For Hire. Admittedly, it is a much more crowded marketplace these days...
But that's not a valid comparison - it should be against other EU/non EU countries for the same periods.John Redwood, a Conservative Brexiter, asks Stride if the government will publish figures showing the UK growth rate in the 25 years before it joined the EEC, and since it joined the single market in 1992. That will show how bad the EU has been for the UK.
For someone who was in business like Davis, he seems to not have a clue as to what forecasts are for - they're not for simply waiting and measuring against the actual outcome but about taking action - "If x is showing us y, then we should do z to improve y."David Davis, the former Brexit secretary, asks Stride if he knows of any economic forecast that has got the figures right. Stride accepts such a forecast does not exist.
I don't play chess any more. I like bocce ball.AnatolyKasparov wrote:Gone a bit quiet again innit, well I'm sure the news that the world chess champion has retained their title will interest you
I sat reading the 'minute by minute' of the last game whilst waiting for my train!AnatolyKasparov wrote:Gone a bit quiet again innit, well I'm sure the news that the world chess champion has retained their title will interest you
No more waiting for trains after werk for me!adam wrote:I sat reading the 'minute by minute' of the last game whilst waiting for my train!AnatolyKasparov wrote:Gone a bit quiet again innit, well I'm sure the news that the world chess champion has retained their title will interest you
Final result of around 54-46, pretty close by recent standards.frog222 wrote:JACKSON, MISSISSIPPI (The Borowitz Report)—Celebrating her election victory on Tuesday night, U.S. Senator Cindy Hyde-Smith said that, despite predictions that her state was ready to turn the page on its shameful past, “I never lost faith in Mississippi’s racists.”
“For weeks, we’ve been hearing national pundits say that Mississippi was ready to enter the twenty-first century,” Hyde-Smith told a crowd of supporters at her victory rally. “Tonight, with your help, we proved them wrong.”
Hyde-Smith said that, despite the media’s unearthing of a cavalcade of embarrassing comments and actions from her past, “I never doubted that, at the end of the day, the people of Mississippi would listen to the racist voices in their heads.”
Choking back tears, Hyde-Smith thanked her supporters for honoring Mississippi’s storied heritage of hatred and cruelty.
“Mississippi voters do not want to tear down the relics of our Confederate past,” she said. “As such a relic, I am eternally grateful.”
Exit polls showed that Hyde-Smith performed extremely well with voters who described themselves as bigots, and dominated among those who could not correctly spell “Mississippi.”
8 points - the next closest contest in recent years was over 16 points. A win is a win and a loss a loss, but this was a decent end to the elections.AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Final result of around 54-46, pretty close by recent standards.
Could be somewhat better tho !adam wrote:8 points - the next closest contest in recent years was over 16 points. A win is a win and a loss a loss, but this was a decent end to the elections.AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Final result of around 54-46, pretty close by recent standards.
I think this is wrong - she doesn't need 218, she needs half of the votes made for any candidate plus one - in other words, half plus one of the votes ignoring abstentions.Nancy Pelosi overcame the first hurdle in her quest to become Speaker again as 203 Democrats supported her in an internal election. She still needs 218 votes on the floor in January.