Tuesday 30th September 2014

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:02 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
RobertSnozers wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:Whooo...Mr Ohso and I have just had a nasty shock.

Had the car MoTd and front brakes replaced towards the end of July. Haven't been out and about in it much but have been on the mootorway a few times.
Yesterday we were on our way to do some shopping. Funny flapping thumping noise from front of car, but nothing obvious, and Mr Ohso can't get down to check the lower regions. Drove carefully home, called in a local mobile mechanic and all the wheel nuts were loose. He unscrewed the locking nut on the left front wheel with his fingers! The wheel was about to fall off. The other three wheels were loose as well.
That made our tickers thump for a minute.
So, we've just been on to Trading Standards...
Crikey! I'm amazed how relatively often that sort of thing happens. On the one hand a lucky escape. On the other, something that you should never have needed to escape from.
We were on a fast stretch of open road. If we hadn't stopped when we did, chances are we'd have ended up down a steep embankment and straight into thick pine forest.

Evidently not our time to go....

Ouch! so glad you are both all ok but ...yikes that garage need a rocket!

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:05 pm

letsskiptotheleft wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote:
Temulkar wrote: Churchill's opposition voted 21 times against the NHS Bill including second and third readings. Thats not just revisionism thats outright blatant falsehood. The media need to call him up on it.

Im starting to hope UKIP do pull another tory out of the hat just to wipe the smug grins off their faces.
Sat here nodding vigorously. What's the better that no-one in any media organisation takes the twat to task for his lies? And, yes, I do hope there's another high vis defection to UKIP from the Tories first thing tomorrow just to fuck their day up.
Can we also make the case that Churchill was a shit peace time PM, glossed over by history?

He was responsible I think for the old age pension and fought for sick pay but that seemed to be the extent of his philanthropy. I imagine the thought was if it went too far we'd all forget our place, and he desperately wanted the status quo to return to how it was between the wars...Cap doffing servants, weekend house parties, huntin', shootin', fishin'. England's green and pleasant land, blah, blah, blah.

I bet they hanker after those days still. It must piss them off dreadfully when we won't bow and scrape.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:14 pm

BBCSunPolMidlands ‏@sunpoliticsmids 2h2 hours ago
William Cash Jr son of Stone MP @BillCashMP has joined UKIP as their heritage spokesman.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:16 pm

ohsocynical wrote:BBCSunPolMidlands ‏@sunpoliticsmids 2h2 hours ago
William Cash Jr son of Stone MP @BillCashMP has joined UKIP as their heritage spokesman.

Might have waiting till Cameron's speech - unless Dad's following?

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:17 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote: Sat here nodding vigorously. What's the better that no-one in any media organisation takes the twat to task for his lies? And, yes, I do hope there's another high vis defection to UKIP from the Tories first thing tomorrow just to fuck their day up.
Can we also make the case that Churchill was a shit peace time PM, glossed over by history?
He was responsible I think for the old age pension and fought for sick pay but that seemed to be the extent of his philanthropy. I imagine the thought was if it went too far we'd all forget our place, and he desperately wanted the status quo to return to how it was between the wars...Cap doffing servants, weekend house parties, huntin', shootin', fishin'. England's green and pleasant land, blah, blah, blah.

I bet they hanker after those days still. It must piss them off dreadfully when we won't bow and scrape.

I thought he campaigned against 'sweatshops' and had summat to do with wage councils?

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:19 pm

ohsocynical wrote:BBCSunPolMidlands ‏@sunpoliticsmids 2h2 hours ago
William Cash Jr son of Stone MP @BillCashMP has joined UKIP as their heritage spokesman.

Philip Hollobone is now 2/1 to defect to UKIP before Cameron's speech.

And, to prove they really are losing the plot a Conservative activist/member was filmed burning an EU flag outside their conference building.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:20 pm

Here's a link for the Cash jr defection to UKIP

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2014-09- ... oins-ukip/

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:22 pm

Goodnight, everyone.

Post by **refitman** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:28 pm

PorFavor wrote:Goodnight, everyone.

Night PF

And Hello DHP.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:29 pm

refitman wrote:
PorFavor wrote:Goodnight, everyone.
Night PF

And Hello DHP.

Night PF and Hello to DHP from me as well

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:31 pm

Mike Smithson ‏@MSmithsonPB 9m9 minutes ago
Whoops. Got my Philips mixed up. The 2/1 favourite for next CON MP defection to UKIP is Philip Hollobone

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:32 pm

PorFavor wrote:Goodnight, everyone.

Night PF

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:36 pm

I missed the Morgan speech as the preamble of guests took so long and I wasn't going to miss my swimming...

But here's an odd thing - the academy in Birmingham that had one of the teachers and two pupils speak was a Labour academy from 2009...and also an E Act school.

that's the same E Act that's in a whole mess and having to give back 10 schools to go to other sponsors, and also has financial issues too.

I might see if I can work out where they went wrong...over expansion too quickly maybe? Wouldn't surprise me.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:40 pm

Frightful_Oik

I thought he campaigned against 'sweatshops' and had summat to do with wage councils?

Yes he did, although I don't think the whole country benefited at the time. I have another biography about him by Roy Jenkins, and there is mention that he went down a coal mine and was deeply affected by the miners working conditions. There is no doubt he'd be far to the left of the Conservative party today. And probably think Cameron and Co, are crass upstarts.

Temulkar · Post by **Temulkar** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:41 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote: Sat here nodding vigorously. What's the better that no-one in any media organisation takes the twat to task for his lies? And, yes, I do hope there's another high vis defection to UKIP from the Tories first thing tomorrow just to fuck their day up.
Can we also make the case that Churchill was a shit peace time PM, glossed over by history?
He was responsible I think for the old age pension and fought for sick pay but that seemed to be the extent of his philanthropy. I imagine the thought was if it went too far we'd all forget our place, and he desperately wanted the status quo to return to how it was between the wars...Cap doffing servants, weekend house parties, huntin', shootin', fishin'. England's green and pleasant land, blah, blah, blah.

I bet they hanker after those days still. It must piss them off dreadfully when we won't bow and scrape.

He was president of the Board of Trade when Lloyd George brought pensions, sick pay, labour exchanges, free school meals, National Insurance, Sick pay and the dole (dependent upon contribution), school medical inspections. Once upon a time the Liberals cared about the poor, the shades of Asquith and the Goat must be weeping at Clegg today.

Churchill was an awful peacetime PM/Chancellor/Opposition leader. DLG won the first world war and subsequent election and achieved all of the above as chancellor. Yet we have that degenerate scion of a degenerate house lauded as our greatest PM.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 6:59 pm

Mmn, interesting, Hollobone is one of four Conservative MP's who had informal pacts with UKIP at the 2010 election, the others being Carswell, Reckless and ranty Philip Davies.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:14 pm

DFH reckons Cameron must confront elements in his party tomorrow the same way Neil Kinnock did in 1985, I remember that speech, I was 17 at the time, even now it is electrifying to watch, Kinnock had guts, Cameron doesn't, he will cede more and more to people who will never be happy.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:32 pm

What's the betting DFH will decide it is a brilliant speech, almost regardless of the actual content?

And then, maybe, use that as an excuse for finally "crossing the floor"??

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:35 pm

letsskiptotheleft wrote:Mmn, interesting, Hollobone is one of four Conservative MP's who had informal pacts with UKIP at the 2010 election, the others being Carswell, Reckless and ranty Philip Davies.

As did an unsucessful candidate, Alex Story, who I knew from studying. He wasn't popular.

He failed to get elected in the European Elections this year too. Should have joined UKIP.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:36 pm

23rdturnoff wrote:If UKIP needs Labour votes, then I suggest they stop recruiting Tory MPs. Many more and they start to simply look like a disaffected Tory splinter group rather than the new grassroots movement they like to project.
imageark wrote:Spot the fuck on.

Style of thing

hadn't realised that I missed Imageark, but there you go.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... nts-farage" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:37 pm

Night PF.

So, 'media' news .......

After trying to pretend "it wasn't us guv, honest" for the past couple of days, Rusty's bezzie mate Paul Staines has now decided to accept full responsibility for the Brooks Nomark story; the line is it wasn't a fishing expedition but a "narrowly targeted effort" designed to exactly what it did ....force the resignation of a Minister. Leaving aside the improbability of Staines, Wickham and his crew doing anything out of moral duty, this defiant post on their tawdry little blog (with the final lines about attempts of censorship) rather suggests that Paul has had his ear bent by Lynton and didn't like the experience.

http://order-order.com/2014/09/30/not-so-pronto-ipso/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But he'd better not upset too many people as one of his sometime paymasters, the Daily Mail, have made an appointment that means they will probably no longer need his services; in a match made truly in heaven the Daily Mail has appointed Piers Morgan as "Editor-at-Large", with a remit to fill their pages full of sleaze from across the other side of the Atlantic. One more reason (as if any more were needed) to never read that nasty fascist rag.

http://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/2014/ ... organ.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A smiley I never thought I'd use, but which seems so appropriate in this case ........

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:39 pm

letsskiptotheleft wrote:DFH reckons Cameron must confront elements in his party tomorrow the same way Neil Kinnock did in 1985, I remember that speech, I was 17 at the time, even now it is electrifying to watch, Kinnock had guts, Cameron doesn't, he will cede more and more to people who will never be happy.

Cameron hasn't got the guts, and anyway it is too late. Kinnocks speech was the point at which Labour launched a purge on militant at every level of the party. It was destroyed as a movement before it could infiltrate the party.

The time for the Tories to do that was arguably 1992, but they were too weak. Given that the absolute last chance was 1997 and Hague blew it. There are now over 100 Tea Party Tory MPs, they are embedded at all levels in the party. In fact there are more hard line right wingers than moderate Tory MPs.

Game over Dave, they have won.

Why not tweet DFH with something like.

Too late Dan - the Tory extremists have taken over, 100 MPs ain't as easy as Derek Hatton

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:42 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:What's the betting DFH will decide it is a brilliant speech, almost regardless of the actual content?

And then, maybe, use that as an excuse for finally "crossing the floor"??

I think his mother would (as the Americans say) rip him a new one if he did that. Dan just wants the return of New Labour, and to be restored to his rightful place as prophet and chief scribe until he is given a safe seat; that is all the support of Cameron amounts to, a way to continue undermining Ed, guarantee defeat next year and precipitate a counter-revolution in the party which will see the Blairites back in control. Frankly he is delusional, and I think Glenda should rip him a new one anyway.

Mind you, I could be wrong about all of that.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:44 pm

letsskiptotheleft wrote:DFH reckons Cameron must confront elements in his party tomorrow the same way Neil Kinnock did in 1985, I remember that speech, I was 17 at the time, even now it is electrifying to watch, Kinnock had guts, Cameron doesn't, he will cede more and more to people who will never be happy.

Reckless the MP who went over to UKIP, said Cameron does the same with his MPs as he does with us. Will promise anything, then forget about it. He can't be trusted to stick to his word.

I'll bet he thought he could take office. Delegate responsibility to his cabinet and it would be easy peasy. You can almost hear him saying, 'It's only a question of man management and putting the right man in the job'. Which unfortunately meant only close friends and cronies.

Politics is one of the most back stabbing cut throat careers there is. Every one wants the top job or high position.

A phone call from mummy won't help his career now. He's over reached. The man is an idiot.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:45 pm

About Us
The Sutton Trust was founded in 1997 by Sir Peter Lampl to improve social mobility through education. As well as being a think-tank, the Sutton Trust is a ‘do-tank,’ having funded over 200 programmes, commissioned over 140 research studies and influenced Government education policy by pushing social mobility to the top of the political agenda.

http://www.suttontrust.com/about-us/us/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

cf: primary sources: Education

Spacedone · Post by **Spacedone** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 7:56 pm

I do believe I've slipped into The Twilight Zone.

George Eaton ‏@georgeeaton
Rare fringe appearance by Lynton Crosby on winning the Muslim vote.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:01 pm

Most of us are avoiding Sparrow's beta blog, it hasn't gone unnoticed, his final comment today

That’s all from me for today.

Thanks for the comments (those of you who are left!)

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:13 pm

http://www.hannahmitchell.org.uk/category/publications/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Hannah Mitchell Foundation works for a fair and prosperous North of England within a federal Britain. The foundation was formed in March 2012 and is steadily building up its membership (why not join us?)

Another one for the primary sources. (?)

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:15 pm

gilsey wrote:Most of us are avoiding Sparrow's beta blog, it hasn't gone unnoticed, his final comment today

That’s all from me for today.

Thanks for the comments (those of you who are left!)

468 comments for the day tells its own story - at times there was nobody posting for 10 minutes or so - it's never been like that before.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:19 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:
gilsey wrote:Most of us are avoiding Sparrow's beta blog, it hasn't gone unnoticed, his final comment today

That’s all from me for today.

Thanks for the comments (those of you who are left!)

468 comments for the day tells its own story - at times there was nobody posting for 10 minutes or so - it's never been like that before.

There was a big slump in posts after nesting was introduced, but it had recovered within a few months.

I wonder if that will be the case this time, I doubt it tbh. Even people like me who stayed loyal then are on the brink of sacking this new abomination off

Feel for AS here, tbh - he clearly has no say in what is going on

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:21 pm

Oh look Beta has its own twitter feed.

https://mobile.twitter.com/GuardianBeta

Maybe we should tweet them.

Congrats on murdering Sparrows blog with your hopeless interface

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:22 pm

Nigel Farage beats David Cameron to the top of the 2014 Right-Wing Power List

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/peopl ... 65484.html

Hours are spent answering the question: 'Just how will this policy announcement play with the Kippers?'

So in effect Farage is leading the Tories and the country?

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:24 pm

ohso wrote:So in effect Farage is leading the Tories and the country?

What in god's name are we on (as a nation)?

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:25 pm

Evening All

And thanks for the primary sources links. If nobody beats me too it I'll open a thread on that soon.

But in the mean time I'm on a mission

Spacedone · Post by **Spacedone** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:29 pm

George Eaton ‏@georgeeaton

Crosby: "Most important influence on voters is the values they think you have."

My emphasis.

Hobiejoe · Post by **Hobiejoe** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:34 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:
gilsey wrote:Most of us are avoiding Sparrow's beta blog, it hasn't gone unnoticed, his final comment today

That’s all from me for today.

Thanks for the comments (those of you who are left!)

468 comments for the day tells its own story - at times there was nobody posting for 10 minutes or so - it's never been like that before.

A certain proportion will reflect the absence of both paid and voluntary Tory trolls - perhaps enjoying the transcendental joy of walking past conference security with an OFFICIAL pass. They're probably just the types for whom status is everything.

And of course, as trolls their job is to provoke and displace reactions, and a "good" troll can provoke dozens of enfuriated replies to a single post. So a lack of trolls means that the blog may be back to a more natural level.

So I guess that's why the Graun tolerate, condone or indeed encourage those that troll what used to be their natural readerships. Wringing every last click out of us before we leave them, and they continue their voyage away from us.

Harrumph.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:44 pm

OOh-er. What's that above me?

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:48 pm

ohsocynical wrote:OOh-er. What's that above me?

Looks like someone who needs to be zapped...

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:50 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:OOh-er. What's that above me?
Looks like someone who needs to be zapped...

Duly zapped, annoying little bastards.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 8:56 pm

letsskiptotheleft wrote:
RogerOThornhill wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:OOh-er. What's that above me?
Looks like someone who needs to be zapped...
Duly zapped, annoying little bastards.

A good 25 more on the members list and the one you just zpped is back

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:05 pm

be sure to enclose photographs of your bits and bobs to confirm identity

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:06 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:
RogerOThornhill wrote: Looks like someone who needs to be zapped...
Duly zapped, annoying little bastards.
A good 25 more on the members list and the one you just zpped is back

An awful lot of them begin with 'k'...

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:08 pm

I was going to try the embed thing but this is a bit big and I'd be bound to mess it up, so will just give the link

Tory's visit the hospital
And are disappointed

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:12 pm

Andrew Graystone ‏@AndrewGraystone · 11h11 hours ago
Pre-paid benefit cards are already used for asylum seekers. Hugely oppressive (unless you're Tesco or Asda.) Our church swaps them for cash.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:13 pm

A small bit of cheer.

http://www.theguardian.com/stage/live/2 ... ke-webchat" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ErnstRemarx · Post by **ErnstRemarx** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:15 pm

gilsey wrote:Most of us are avoiding Sparrow's beta blog, it hasn't gone unnoticed, his final comment today

That’s all from me for today.

Thanks for the comments (those of you who are left!)

That's a very interesting way to sign off your blog, but possibly the most prescient comment he could make. I wonder if we should offer him membership of FTN?

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:17 pm

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/fra ... ns-7860132" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:19 pm

Disabled Tory Party member pens furious letter to Cameron and Co

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/di ... ns-4354236

I feel desperately sorry for this lady's plight and can understand her being taken in by Dave using his little boy Ivan as bait in 2010, but I have this niggling feeling she'll still vote Tory in 2015.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:21 pm

ErnstRemarx wrote:
gilsey wrote:Most of us are avoiding Sparrow's beta blog, it hasn't gone unnoticed, his final comment today

That’s all from me for today.

Thanks for the comments (those of you who are left!)

That's a very interesting way to sign off your blog, but possibly the most prescient comment he could make. I wonder if we should offer him membership of FTN?

It would be a nice gesture. It's thanks to his blog we ended up here.

ErnstRemarx · Post by **ErnstRemarx** » Tue 30 Sep, 2014 9:22 pm

I was just about to get stuck in on the 20 new 'k' class members and get rid of them and ban their IPs, but they've miraculously vanished.

I suspect the Hand of Dan...