Thursday 18th July 2019

Post by **refitman** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 7:08 am

Morning all.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 8:45 am

Morning all. I saw this last might but thought it could wait.

Conservative Party allowing 15-year-olds to vote for PM despite opposing 16-year-olds voting in general election

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/p ... k-vy0EPUcw

And Layla Moran, the Lib Dems' spokeswoman for young people, said: “The Tories will allow under-18s to choose the next prime minister, but they won’t allow them to choose their government or their own MP or whether or not they wanted to remain or leave the EU.”

Quite.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 8:49 am

I don't know why HindleA deleted his post, it made a good point.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/incr ... stic-abuse" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Increased jobcentre support for women experiencing domestic abuse

The problem of putting all household benefits into one single benefit paid to just one person has particular impact on women experiencing domestic violence but it creates wider issues that weren't previously there that can impact on pretty much anyone. Simplicity is very complicated, it seems. Young couples moving in together have seen one partner suddenly lose all their money and independence, for instance. This isn't how people normally live their lives. Decisions by couples on whether and how much to pool money is an individual one, a decision now being removed from couples by the state if they happen to receive benefits. Although the impact on women experiencing domestic violence is of especial concern, I think it's important to also consider these wider impacts as the flaw of arbitrarily giving one member of a household benefits that may include money that is supposed to provide the means to live for another adult individual within that household is a fundamental one.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 9:33 am

The real case for simplification is completely the other way around.Situational first,rather than the default set which is the rarity.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 9:38 am

That way around,not least would alert to such obvious malicious fuckwittery

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 9:39 am

Is your panic,room, space for hospital bed etc,already adapted home really necessary etc

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 9:40 am

Oops we forgot about supported housing

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 9:46 am

They are making the necessary simple complicated and necessary complex "simple" by removal ,reduction pretending it doesn't exist They want plaudits in some "returning".Piss off.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 9:49 am

Before you get to the related potential shit storm and deeply damaging musings re.the charging basis of social care.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 9:50 am

Which the opposition combatted on exactly the wrong basi IMHO.We're doomed.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 9:52 am

I always look on the bright side.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 9:56 am

Good morning, everyone.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 10:09 am

HindleA wrote:I always look on the bright side.

We know

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 10:18 am

It was only four nil and a friendly.It doesn't count.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 10:24 am

From Roger's link:

"And Mr Hunt's campaign meanwhile published a video featuring a 17-year-old Conservative member who had cast his vote in the leadership race to “battle that stereotype that our age group are uninformed"

Some would say a necessary condition of membership is that you are uninformed.I couldn't possibly comment.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 10:32 am

Sorry for deletion.A third of domestic violence victims are men.Similar to the false portrayal of family carers,receivers of social care my point is not to be contentious but to combat the easy fit(or simplification) gender/age etc based categorisations.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 10:42 am

I've had enough of Tory party machinations

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 11:47 am

I know everyone will find this really difficult to believe but Boris Johnson's smoked fish stunt was utter bollocks.

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AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 12:20 pm

citizenJA wrote:I've had enough of Tory party machinations

And so say all of us!

(including, by now, some of the Tory party I strongly suspect)

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 12:54 pm

Well, this is unexpected...

Nick
@nicktolhurst
++BREAKING++

Daniel Moylan - the "hardline arch eurosceptic" advisor to Boris Johnson on Brexit - has now obtained an Irish passport to ensure his own freedom of movement & EU citizen rights post Brexit.
7:37 AM · Jul 18, 2019 · Twitter Web App

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:00 pm

One rule for them, as ever.

GetYou · Post by **GetYou** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:05 pm

Interesting lunchtime read:

https://novaramedia.com/2019/07/18/the- ... lace-them/

It must be a new low for the Guardian when, in a manner resembling that of the Evening Standard, its commercial arm is indistinguishable from its editorial line. Rather than irritation or anger, the advert left me with a sense of befuddlement: why did Labour Lords pay £18K for negative coverage in a paper so willing to perform the service for free? Unelected legislators paying for newspaper inches in a ‘progressive’ outlet to attack a socialist leader of the opposition – just when you thought you’d seen it all, something else comes along.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:09 pm

HindleA wrote:Sorry for deletion.A third of domestic violence victims are men.Similar to the false portrayal of family carers,receivers of social care my point is not to be contentious but to combat the easy fit(or simplification) gender/age etc based categorisations.

Sadly I fear sometimes that a perception that something only or predominantly affects women can undermine attempts to get something done about it.

That we could all find ourselves on the receiving end of poor policy, rather than just "other people", is a message that needs to be communicated successfully if voters are to resist the divide and rule of Tory rhetoric and start embracing policies that benefit every single one of us, rather than just the "already haves".

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:14 pm

I'm doing well with the shocked etc posts today...

No deal cause £30bn economic hit, watchdog says

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49027889

In this scenario, the OBR said that "heightened uncertainty and declining confidence" would deter investment, while higher trade barriers with the EU would "weigh on exports".

"Together, these push the economy into recession, with asset prices and the pound falling sharply," it said.

It said this could push up public sector borrowing, leaving debt 12% higher by 2024.

The OBR added this was "not necessarily the most likely outcome" but also "by no means the worst case scenario".

Bunch of elite metropolitan Remoaners etc etc...

Post by **adam** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:41 pm

Big win for Benn amendment

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:44 pm

BBC Politics
‏@BBCPolitics
4 seconds ago

MPs vote to block the next UK PM shutting down Parliament in order to push through a no-deal #Brexit, by 315 votes to 274

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:44 pm

@Adam snap but with more detail

Post by **adam** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:48 pm

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:@Adam snap but with more detail

But less pith.

Post by **adam** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:53 pm

No names yet but tweet from guardian Daily Pol says 17 tories voted for the amendment plus a good number of abstentions.

Post by **adam** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 1:57 pm

+1 on the majority for the next vote - keeping the Lord's amendment from last night - 42 majority

Post by **adam** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 2:05 pm

Ian Austin and Kate Hoey voted against the Benn amendment.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 2:34 pm

adam wrote:Ian Austin and Kate Hoey voted against the Benn amendment.

One of Brown's failings was surrounding himself with worthless thugs like this dickhead.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 2:37 pm

Good morfternoon.

Downing Street has put out this statement about the vote. A spokesman said:

The prime minister is obviously disappointed that a number of ministers failed to vote in this afternoon’s division. No doubt her successor will take this into account when forming their government.
(Politics Live, Guardian)

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 2:43 pm

Jim Pickard
@PickardJE
·
30m
The cabinet abstentions appear to include:

chancellor Philip Hammond
business secretary Greg Clark
aid secretary Rory Stewart
justice secretary David Gauke

but not Amber Rudd....

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 3:20 pm

GetYou wrote:Interesting lunchtime read:

https://novaramedia.com/2019/07/18/the- ... lace-them/
It must be a new low for the Guardian when, in a manner resembling that of the Evening Standard, its commercial arm is indistinguishable from its editorial line. Rather than irritation or anger, the advert left me with a sense of befuddlement: why did Labour Lords pay £18K for negative coverage in a paper so willing to perform the service for free? Unelected legislators paying for newspaper inches in a ‘progressive’ outlet to attack a socialist leader of the opposition – just when you thought you’d seen it all, something else comes along.

Thanks for this. Are they afraid of the abolition of the House of Lords being replaced by an elected body?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 3:40 pm

@Willow,I agree ,the mutual reinforcement of things being a "women's/elderly /etc issue I believe is pernicious in a variety of ways and divisive and can get surreal,apparently I was a woman for s substantial amount of my working life because it/I didn't,literal deleting out of history.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 3:43 pm

Generational fairness along the same lines,ie the same generation being misrepresented as unfair to another.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 4:13 pm

"Some 50,000 of the 600,000 cases that are being checked involve someone who has since died"

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/ ... ssion=true" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 4:17 pm

https://www.habinteg.org.uk/latest-news ... aylor-1304" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 4:21 pm

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/ ... ssion=true" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 7:32 pm

Good that #kippergate is trending on Twitter

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Thu 18 Jul, 2019 10:06 pm

Goodnight, everyone.
love,
cJA

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Fri 19 Jul, 2019 12:09 am

Andrew Bridgen was on Newsnight. I don't think it's particularly useful to mention anything he said. It never is. Well apart from that time he said we were all entitled to Irish passports. I was listening to that live at the time while making a late night snack...spaghetti di mezzanotte if I recall correctly, and couldn't stop laughing at the interviewer's incredulous tone. Especially as he was from Northern Ireland so not only knew Bridgen was talking out of his arse but seemed quite angry that anyone could be so pig ignorant. In fact I think that might have been my own first exposure to the diseased Mr Potato Head's moronic utterances, I do remember I had to google him to put a face to the nonsense, which was of course a mistake.

He was on presumably as a counterbalance to Dominic Grieve, which struck me as being akin to taking a leftover limp cabbage leaf to a knife fight, and Grieve wisely just ignored him while confidently claiming that any attempt by Johnson to force through no deal would bring down his government. And it's here I think the 'Bad Boys of Brexit' have made a bit of a tactical boo boo. When asked if he could stand again as a Conservative candidate under Johnson at a general election he looked less than enamoured of the idea and said "That depends on the manifesto". And I'm beginning to suspect that with all the brexiteer entryism and votes of no confidence quite a few remainer Tory Mps feel now that they have absolutely nothing to lose as their careers in the Tory party are effectively over. This of course makes a vote of no confidence in Johnson's government all the more likely to succeed. And it's not like it would take a lot of them to bring him down.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Fri 19 Jul, 2019 12:44 am

Oh and I found out the reason for my profusion of little brown moths.

I'd somehow shoved a big bag of wholegrain flour right to the back of the cupboard and this cupboard is built into the wall and huge, I had to use a torch which prompted a load of the little moths to fly out like tiny bats from a cave. Then upon retrieving said errant flower (I had wondered where it had gone) I found it was crawling with...things.

They weren't like mini caterpillars, more like skinny maggots, and quite frankly it was absolutely gross. A proper 'eeewww' moment. But they've as much right to live as the rest of us, just not in my abode, so I put the bag of flour with its inhabitants in an old bin out the back with its lid propped open so hopefully they'll all merrily pupate into adults and fly off and mate before finding an open window and infesting somebody else's kitchen. Such is the wonder of life.