Saturday 28th & Sunday 29th September 2019

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:57 am

tinyclanger2 wrote:Sorry but I don’t think he does.

You are making a more general argument, not just the "temporary PM" thing?

If so, I think that is rather over-pessimistic.

Oh, and PTO.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 11:00 am

Glasgow triathlon-half staggerthon/chain-smoking/Herald crossword.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 11:09 am

Good morfternoon.

Entirely expected - but I was alarmed yesterday to hear calls for the Americanisation of the legal system.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 12:15 pm

The Conservative party is the oldest, greatest political party in the world, it’s a big, broad church and we don’t do deals with other parties. (Politics Live, Guardian - my emphasis)

Guess who told that lie. And guess which TV channel's interviewer didn't pick him up on it.

Edited to add the bolding.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 12:23 pm

Yes - I mean in general. (Sorry). I worry about a nation that STILL trusts the Tories over Labour - I don’t see any way out.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 12:30 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:Yes - I mean in general. (Sorry). I worry about a nation that STILL trusts the Tories over Labour - I don’t see any way out.

Regrettably, most people still take their cues from the mainstream media most of the time as they are not greatly interested in politics.

An election campaign is a chance to change that, however. As happened two years ago.

Nil desperandum

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 1:00 pm

re the media.

After the Supreme Court ruling, the BBC were doing a bit of vox pop and one individual came out with "They're all Remainers. I read it in the papers"

So of course it must be true...

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 1:01 pm

Interesting how Cameron came in saying Britain was broken - and now it is

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 1:26 pm

I understand that the British press plays a massive role in this, my question is about how we ever get around that (and I recall being here 9 years ago asking the same question only now it’s much much worse). Social media, Nick Griffin on Question Time, hate speech normalized by Farage with the help of the BBC have all contributed. We need a new approach to counteract it at community level.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 1:41 pm

Actually even quite a lot of low information voters know the press is biased (though that doesn't stop it from affecting them, unfortunately)

Whereas the BBC is still seen by them as trustworthy and objective. The very same Beeb that just stenographed a Tory press release about "40 new hospitals" this morning.

Though a good thing here is the recent Munchetty business is so outrageous that even some "centrist" types have had their eyes opened there - having previously stuck steadfastly to the line that media criticism is just self interested pleading from "Corbynista cultists".

Interesting times, indeed!

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 2:20 pm

Jonn Elledge
@JonnElledge
"The thing about social media is... it works very well if people *want* to spread your message."
@katyballs
murders the CCHQ social media team so delicately that it won't notice it's injured until its head drops off

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 2:21 pm

And another thing - when Labour want to invest in public services and talk about putting taxes up for the wealthy they are accused (by the non-wealthy) of magic-money tree thinking; and yet when the likes of Johnson claims he’s going to invest and at the same time cut taxes, those same people think he’s great.
WTFityF?

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 2:21 pm

(And how do I prevent my brain from exploding Scanners stylee)?

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 3:06 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:(And how do I prevent my brain from exploding Scanners stylee)?

I find a generous helping of red wine is efficacious when experiencing the symptoms of an imminent cranial detonation.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 3:12 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:And another thing - when Labour want to invest in public services and talk about putting taxes up for the wealthy they are accused (by the non-wealthy) of magic-money tree thinking; and yet when the likes of Johnson claims he’s going to invest and at the same time cut taxes, those same people think he’s great.
WTFityF?

A compromised media keeps people in the dark about money and taxes. People intentionally kept ignorant about macroeconomics and government investment see and hear a wealthy Tory say he'll spend money for hospitals and other public services. "Well, okay. He's well-off. Well-off Tories got their fortunes easily. Maybe we'll get good public services easily too.". Labour portrayed as grifters gonna take your Mama's house. It's irrational and wrong. But that's how the expensive story gets told, over and over. I'm so sick of this horseshit.

People must examine what's repeated at them from Tory media and compare that with reality.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 3:17 pm

Good afternoon, everyone.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 3:23 pm

Fear blows out creative and critical thinking function. Vision narrows. It's easier manipulating a fearful and tired population.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 3:27 pm

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

What Matthew d'Ancona seems to be missing here is that the SNP aren't the idiots he seems to think they are.

There isn't a chance in hell they would table a vote of no confidence without the support of the other opposition parties resulting in them going down in history as those who facilitated a Tory no deal brexit. It aint gonna happen.

Of all the UK parties they have been the most consistent and level headed about brexit and yet he thinks they could fall into Johnson's trap at the last hurdle?

I think not.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 5:07 pm

Another of Susan Oosthuizen's fascinating threads...I think it's still going.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **adam** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 6:32 pm

Lord Ashcroft polling...

Forced to choose between a Conservative government led by Boris Johnson and a Labour government led by Jeremy Corbyn, voters overall chose Johnson and the Tories by 56% to 44%. Lib Dem voters preferred a Corbyn government by two to one. Conservative remainers preferred Johnson and the Tories by 87% to 13%. Labour Leave voters also marginally preferred a Johnson-led Conservative government, by 52% to 48%. Euro election Brexit Party voters preferred this option by 96% to 4%

I still think what I think about polling but as a snapshot, what you get is a suggestion that the 25%ish of labour support who voted leave would split around 13/12 to a leave party (that isn't what the poll says - it's who would you prefer in government, not who would you vote for, but I'm busy extrapolating, leave me be). which would probably be quite geographically specific and isn't anything like as bad as headline stories would tell you.

And that the lib dems' supporters are more clear-headed than their leadership.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:10 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... ont-add-up" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:11 pm

You don't have to be an expert in deciding the Tory party are lying fuckwits.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:11 pm

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:12 pm

Actually remove the H.I'm neither humble nor non humble just me.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:14 pm

Barring the recorded messages,the Glasgow train announcements as indecipherable as they were fourty years ago.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:17 pm

Actually remove the IMHO in it's entirety
An easily repeatedly proved fact.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:18 pm

Actually remove the actually(ies)

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:20 pm

Tarquin has been left in charge.He has been warned about the last time and drug-fuelled orgies-he waited until I'd gone.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:25 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/stage/2019/ ... ghton-dome" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 8:36 pm

No 10 denies claims Boris Johnson squeezed journalist's thigh

Boris Johnson’s first day at Conservative party conference as prime minister was overshadowed by allegations of sexual misbehaviour, as Downing Street was forced to deny allegations that he had groped a female journalist [Charlotte Edwardes].

Matt Hancock, the health secretary, who ran against Johnson for his party’s leadership, was initially criticised for suggesting the issue related to Johnson’s private life. Johnson “never lectured people about their private lives,” he said.

However, Hancock later told Channel 4 News of Edwardes: “I know her and I know her to be trustworthy.”

Amber Rudd later tweeted: “I agree with @MattHancock”. (Guardian)

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... e-edwardes

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 9:39 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... z-victoryL" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 9:40 pm

Or even

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... rz-victory" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 9:41 pm

(Just to confuse PF)

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 9:44 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... rust-press" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(No comment)

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:01 pm

https://conservativepartyconference.com/index" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:12 pm

HindleA wrote:(Just to confuse PF)

And you did!

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:16 pm

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/brex ... s-uprating" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They don't have to "negotiate"with the EU over uprating.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:17 pm

I aim to displease.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:18 pm

HindleA wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... rust-press

(No comment)

I was very disappointed that the article didn't include an update on his piano endeavours.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:21 pm

But we can praise ourselves on our forthright negotiation we don't have to/blame them if we decide not to.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:23 pm

See previous comment.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:28 pm

Probably more like 60% to paradise but unsure if it is a location as such.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:43 pm

HindleA wrote:I aim to displease.

No you dont.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:48 pm

I can't speak for Hindle but in all my experiences with the fellow I've found him trustworthy.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:49 pm

Whereas I couldn't say the same for you lot.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:51 pm

Sky'sGoneOut wrote:
HindleA wrote:I aim to displease.
No you dont.

Do you mean that it's purely accidental?

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:53 pm

Sky'sGoneOut wrote:I can't speak for Hindle but in all my experiences with the fellow I've found him trustworthy.

Have you forgotten the lasagne incident?

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:56 pm

I would like to say apologies had been made but...we're cool.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 10:59 pm

Night night.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Sun 29 Sep, 2019 11:09 pm

No I mean Hindle is as Hindle does.

He does his own thing as we all do.

While judging nobody.