Wednesday 15th January 2020

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HindleA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

Which is wasn't,the last ditch desperate massive bung re womens pensions was a sure sign they even knew they had had it,you have to more canny in your justified deception for the higher good.
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citizenJA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by citizenJA »

HindleA wrote:We are not that far apart.The Tory Party are the Tory Party,they will do what they do.
Most of us won't get anywhere near Tory leadership so complaining about their governance in person is limited. People we end up complaining at are those closest to us and not the cause of bad policy.
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Sky'sGoneOut
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by Sky'sGoneOut »

Ok so Labour leadership candidates rated out of 10 based on their appearances on Question Time.

Rebecca Long-Bailey - 0

Out of all the candidates Rebecca was by far the worst, all she ever offered were pre-prepared lines and utterly predictable dogma, I've never once seen the slightest hint that she can think for herself. She'd be a disaster for the Labour Party.

Keir Starmer - 6

He's smart and he's forensic in his arguments. But he has the personal charm of a slow, slightly sad looking Labrador that you have to keep moving along when you take it for a walk because it insists on sniffing the same lamppost for 10 minutes.

Jess Phillips - 6

Happy to be confrontational and stand up for herself. Out of all of them she comes across as the most 'genuine' (however genuine that persona may be). But sometimes speaks before engaging her brain.

Lisa Nandy - 4

Earnest and guileless, which you would have thought would be a good thing in a party leader but in the real world simply isn't. She'd make a fine minister but a terrible leader.

Emily Thornberry - 4

Confident and thick skinned, which sometimes works but oftentimes doesn't and rubs people up the wrong way because she simply won't listen to criticism. I admire her and think she could make a good leader against Johnson but as for winning an election? Nah.

So that means it's a draw between Keir Starmer and Jess Phillips from my own non Labour Party member subjective position.

And if anyone was stupid enough to take my advice it would be to vote for Starmer. He may be dull but he's smart, and has an appeal outside the party.

Just don't vote for Rebecca Long-Bailey whatever you do. That would be bad.
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citizenJA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by citizenJA »

...[Patrick Stewart] described Brexit as “the grimmest thing” to have happened to him in his political life.
https://www.theguardian.com/culture/202 ... rek-launch" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
HindleA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

All minus scores -seems a bit too strict to me.It's "Nigel " Keir Starmer(-Smith )
HindleA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

Certainly the grimiest
gilsey
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by gilsey »

Keir Starmer - 6

He's smart and he's forensic in his arguments. But he has the personal charm of a slow, slightly sad looking Labrador that you have to keep moving along when you take it for a walk because it insists on sniffing the same lamppost for 10 minutes.
I used to say he had all the charisma of a plank, but to be fair to him he has improved a little bit.
Anyway it's a long time till the next election and I'm not sure charisma's what Labour should be looking for right now. Especially if the charisma in question is that of Jess Phillips.

Glad you're ok, sky.
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Sky'sGoneOut
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by Sky'sGoneOut »

HindleA wrote:All minus scores
You know when I posted that I thought to myself "Some joker is going to come along and claim they're all minus scores despite the obvious intent that the '-' is a punctuational indicator of the score itself."

And here you are.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by gilsey »

I find this bit too depressing for words.
There are strong social justice arguments for pursuing such a right. But we also have to recognise that in the current context there is also a need to make sound economic arguments for policies to deliver this aim. These arguments fall into two categories: the waste incurred by spending public resources on services which do not deliver good outcomes and, at worst, harm people; and the benefits resulting from investing in people and services which deliver good outcomes not just for the individuals concerned but for society in general.
'Sound economic arguments'. FFS.
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HindleA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

I don't,the economic case is clear,what is depressing as I keep banging on about ,the false narrative and misportrayal of "burden/cost"
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citizenJA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by citizenJA »

Goodnight, everyone.
love,
cJA
HindleA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

IE similar to the social security nonsense,as evidence clearly shows all attempts at reduction nonjustified for economic reasons have resulted in far more expense in both direct and indirect terms concurrent with harming people.The argument being all logic dictates only a misanthrope who purposefully wants to waste money would pursue.
Last edited by HindleA on Wed 15 Jan, 2020 11:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Sky'sGoneOut
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by Sky'sGoneOut »

Thanks Gilsey and I'm inclined to agree, while from the outside I think it would be genuinely entertaining to see Jess Phillips as the Labour leader Starmer does seem the best choice and as you say he does seem to be progressing from plank to maybe a plank with a knot in it that looks like it might be a representation of someone who collects victorian door knobs.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by PorFavor »

@citizenJA

Night night.
HindleA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

I think I got away with the forgotten PTO.
PorFavor
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by PorFavor »

No you didn't - but I've been distracted, and hadn't got round to taking you to task. It's gone in the book.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

Not doing very well today with fellow posters but as you are all bastards I don't really care.
PorFavor
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by PorFavor »

That's the spirit!
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

Can't get Nigel Starmer-Smith and the Rugby Special theme tune out of my head ,I blame the "protest too much they weren't negative signs"poster)
Last edited by HindleA on Wed 15 Jan, 2020 11:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

PF's found the correct gin,by the sounds of it.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

Cliff Morgan.
PorFavor
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by PorFavor »

Sky'sGoneOut wrote:Thanks Gilsey and I'm inclined to agree, while from the outside I think it would be genuinely entertaining to see Jess Phillips as the Labour leader Starmer does seem the best choice and as you say he does seem to be progressing from plank to maybe a plank with a knot in it that looks like it might be a representation of someone who collects victorian door knobs.

Keir Starmer is bit of a stuffed shirt, but for the time being I'd have to give him 6 1\2. His score is likely to be revised, though. Something about him that makes me doubtful.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by PorFavor »

Night night.
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Sky'sGoneOut
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by Sky'sGoneOut »

HindleA wrote:Not doing very well today with fellow posters but as you are all bastards I don't really care.
Awww come on, you know we love you, as long as you dont steal our lasagnes.
gilsey
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by gilsey »

HindleA wrote:I don't,the economic case is clear,what is depressing as I keep banging on about ,the false narrative and misportrayal of "burden/cost"
The economic case is clear and should be secondary.
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HindleA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

My word,Kamikaze Labour


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... leadership" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
HindleA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

@Gilsey,the whole narrative is posited in burdensomeness/cost terms-in order to change the narrative put the reverse first IMHO.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

It doesn't mean I prioritise money over people,it reveals not only that the narrative does but that it is false.It skewers the main argument ie cost
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

Can't afford not to-unless you want to pay more for evidential harm.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

As ever I appear to view things arse about face.
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Sky'sGoneOut
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by Sky'sGoneOut »

But you have to admit Hindle that you're looking at the world with a specific bias, you've been through experiences none of the rest of us have.

I absolutely respect you for that but how far should soceity bend to take care of people who cost the state and local government a fortune?

Personally I'd light a pyre and lead my mother into it if it saved Northumbria County Council a few thousand quid.

Maybe even just kill her and leave her flesh in the trees for the birds and squirrels to eat.

Human rights are not axiomatic. They aren't set in stone. The law says my parents can't have more than £23,000 when it comes to charging for adult social care. It changes all the time depending on political whim. Who knows what this fat lying twat is going to pull out of his arse in the next few months.

My dad's plan is to buy a safe a take all their money out then put it in said safe.

It's crude but it'll work better than a trust fund.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

It is not bending to take care of (I'll ignore the infantalisation and relative power connotations of that ridiculous phrase for the moment,apart from now) but judicious cost saving/employment enhancing/ of mutual benefit between individual and the community.An opportunity warped into only cost by the framing of current laughable supposed debate.
Last edited by HindleA on Thu 16 Jan, 2020 1:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sky'sGoneOut
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by Sky'sGoneOut »

I'll ignore the infantalisation and relative power connotations of that ridiculous phrase for the moment
You're a fucking legend Hindle.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

And FWIW my views have remain unaltered no matter what circumstances,my personal experiences have done no more than irrefutable confirmed my position and provided indisputable evidence in precise,rather than in general terms as to,not least the economic case
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

The vast majority pay towards in own home social care,the law does not outline as you state.Income is only a factor.It used to be free for all here.There is guidance and discretion.
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Sky'sGoneOut
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by Sky'sGoneOut »

Don't spoil the moment, just stand there with a sword in your hand pointing it at the sky looking awesome.
HindleA
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

Shucks.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

"I have my moments"
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Sky'sGoneOut
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by Sky'sGoneOut »

Nowhere near as many moments as me.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

Me in moments but not the other way around.
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Re: Wednesday 15th January 2020

Post by HindleA »

And it hasn't changed on a "political whim",it has remained constant for yonks.
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