Thursday 9th October 2014 - Dave's bumper birthday

Post by **refitman** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 7:28 am

Morning all. Labour lead at 1 point on Youogv:

Latest YouGov / The Sun results 8th Oct -

Con 33%, (+1)
Lab 34%, (no change)
LD 7%, (-1)
UKIP 14%; (-1)

APP -23 (+3)

Post by **adam** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 8:03 am

Don't we need some kind of glorious title for this? "Today, we celebrate our independence / Shot heard around the world / etc etc". The telegraph commentariat would not be pleased.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 8:26 am

This post comes with a 'no sniggering' warning.

Health watchdog contradicts claims Devon beavers pose human health risk
Emails show Public Health England does not believe beavers on river Otter would increase risk to human health from disease
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/ ... ealth-risk

Friends of the Earth need to judicially challenge Defra's warped decision to trap and confine this wildlife. Defra is beyond redemption IMO - it needs to be abolished and something else put in its place. It's not fit for purpose - has gone the twisted way of its predecessor MAFF.

Oh and morning all. I'm absolutely knackered after two further massive thunder and lightening storms last night. Having received a phone call from a scared and frantic elderly neighbour to tell me her dog hadn't come back in after going out for a late night wee - I found myself wandering around in the catastrophic elements for about an hour and a half looking for said dog for her. To no avail. There were several occasions when I wished I had picked up the rubber cased torch rather than the metal one.

Had another phone call this morning to tell me the dog had turned up at her son's house - some 4 miles away - scared and filthy. That's some going.

Lonewolfie · Post by **Lonewolfie** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 8:29 am

Has anyone asked Carswell whether he'll have the same attitude to Westminster that his colleagues have for Yurrrrp?

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/uk ... ty-1936913

https://factcheckeu.org/de/factchecks/s ... ris-davies

...and I really, really wish someone would etch the text of the responsibilities of a politician (to represent ALL constituents - not just the ones that voted for them) on a large stick and use it to cause them pain until they understand

..and Morning all...

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 8:53 am

Tim Farron's sick joke about dealing with molesters/sex offenders on his watch looks even more off colour this morning, particularly as the person accused of cover up wants his job.

''Senior Lib Dem ‘ordered destruction of document on Cyril Smith abuse claims’
Liz Lynne, candidate to become party president, denies telling former PA to get rid of notes about abuse at Knowl View school''
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... use-claims" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ErnstRemarx · Post by **ErnstRemarx** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 9:12 am

Morning all. Just a quick one, before I have to disappear into Manchester.

How did/do you peeps out the with kids handle school holidays, if all the adults in the house work full time? We've coped thus far because I worked from home whilst MsRemarx is full time. I can foresee a big problem trundling down the tracks in terms of half terms and the three big school hols of the year, starting with Xmas.

Any ideas/experiences you can share?

Lonewolfie · Post by **Lonewolfie** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 9:19 am

yahyah wrote:Tim Farron's sick joke about dealing with molesters/sex offenders on his watch looks even more off colour this morning, particularly as the person accused of cover up wants his job.

''Senior Lib Dem ‘ordered destruction of document on Cyril Smith abuse claims’
Liz Lynne, candidate to become party president, denies telling former PA to get rid of notes about abuse at Knowl View school''
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... use-claims" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Morning Yah Yah...the circles are ever-decreasing...not sure if these have been linked before, but are ongoing...

http://www.newsnorthwales.co.uk/news/13 ... hears.aspx

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/fo ... er-4402264

...and no further news about this yet...

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014 ... use-images

Now - if only we could have a Public Inquiry...or perhaps the Police could investigate...oh...perhaps not...

https://davidhencke.wordpress.com/tag/fiona-woolf/

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5381/ ... nts-on-met

which contains this little gem...

: exa0910x.JPG (33.72 KiB) Viewed 27363 times

It's that nice Mr Yates again...

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/s ... -westfield

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 9:19 am

Ian Birrell ‏@ianbirrell 1m1 minute ago
Interesting from @YouGov polling: Labour supporters are the least likely to see the much-criticised mansion tax as a winning policy

Have to say I agree with that ... never seen the mansion tax as being very workable or effective.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 9:32 am

Morning all. Congrats to the new jobbers!

I'm not sure which of these annoys me the most.

Frank Field http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 83280.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Lord Hill http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-29518722" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

George Eaton
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/20 ... serves-win" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 9:32 am

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Ian Birrell ‏@ianbirrell 1m1 minute ago
Interesting from @YouGov polling: Labour supporters are the least likely to see the much-criticised mansion tax as a winning policy
Have to say I agree with that ... never seen the mansion tax as being very workable or effective.

What's really needed is a land value tax. But that would possibly be a step too far.

The advantage of taxing property and even better land is that it's hard to avoid for the very wealthy.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 9:35 am

StephenDolan wrote: Lord Hill http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-29518722" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Some MEPs at the hearing also voiced concern about new EU efforts to boost the market in securitised debt.

Securitisation - the packaging of debt in complex instruments - was at the root of the 2008 financial crisis, as serious risks were hidden from investors.

Lord Hill said he favoured creating a bigger European market in securitised debt, provided it was based on "simplicity and transparency". There must also be "incentives to keep products safe" for investors, he said.

Yeah because it worked so well in the US...

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 9:55 am

StephenDolan wrote:Morning all. Congrats to the new jobbers!

I'm not sure which of these annoys me the most.

Frank Field http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 83280.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Lord Hill http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-29518722" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

George Eaton
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/20 ... serves-win" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The George Eaton piece would probably be my choice ... it's only made possible by far too many mutterings and asides from people who should know better. I hope the final part is correct and there will now be a concerted effort to pull together.

The Frank Field piece - well, I find this very horrible to say, I sort of agree with him. I don't think the mansion tax is a credible way to provide the extra funding that the NHS needs - far too many uncertainties in its implementation, perverse consequences etc to unpick. Even as someone on a very low income I would prefer to pay a little more NI - it feels a more assured and longer term method. Those that shout about it - would be shouting about any extra money for the NHS wherever it comes from.

Lord Hill - well it's Cameron's lousy judgement again. Big big sigh as it's confirmed once more.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:11 am

Some of what Eaton writes is true - there is a lot of resentment at the seemingly wholehearted Balls embrace of austerity and the fact the "shrink the offer" faction (of which he and his wife are leading members, along with "Dougal" Alexander) seem to have triumphed for now.

It isn't enough for Labour to win next year by default because the Tory problems are bigger - they need to find some way to inspire!

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:12 am

Apologies for the size but take a look at the UKIP leaflet for Heywood.

Never mind that Labour aren't in power, Rochdale A&E was closed in April 2011...

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/ ... ary-873514

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:20 am

So - Ebola.

There is an article on the G's front page about Jim Kim (President of the World Bank) saying that he wants a fund of $20BN to deal with serious outbreaks of disease so that "western governments" can react more quickly. He's quite right to say that help for the affected countries didn't materialise quickly enough - but I wonder why he's saying this now?
Quote from the article - "Kim's warning that the global community was still "not moving fast enough" came as the Ebola virus claimed its first victim in the US and news of a case in Spain sent shares in travel and airline companies tumbling on stock exchanges".

I have some questions.
Why is it the job of "western" governments to deal with this? What about the very rich Middle Eastern governments?
What about countries like China, India, Russia? Surely a global issue isn't just the responsibility of the west?
So far, it's the UK, France, and the US who have joined Medecins Sans Frontieres on the ground - where is everyone else?
Is it a co-incidence that we're getting calls for more money now that Ebola has arrived in the US and Europe?
Is Ebola a priority now that a few companies have seen their share value fall?

I am not very worried about the virus spreading here, and I think we are well-equipped to deal with sporadic cases, as is most of Europe; but I do think we have not done much to help the countries affected, and that's why we're facing the possibility of further spread across Africa which could lead to a very serious situation worldwide.
Jim Kim is OK, and a lot of what he says makes sense - but had the countries involved been equipped to isolate their Ebola patients, the virus would not have spread so widely and what is turning into a pandemic could have been contained. It worked in Nigeria; but the affected countries now are very poor and have no resources to deal with this, so it's not a surprise that the infection has spread.

Of course, I am now expecting panicky calls from the usual quarters to ban all people from entering the UK or whatever.......and I also take a very dim view of OGRFG and his COBRA meetings, because the preparations the military have been making have been going on for some time (you don't send a hospital ship and troops out overnight) and I can't help wondering what he's up to.....he has a habit of using "emergencies" to cover up some other thing he'd rather we didn't know about......

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:22 am

RogerOThornhill wrote:Apologies for the size but take a look at the UKIP leaflet for Heywood.

Never mind that Labour aren't in power, Rochdale A&E was closed in April 2011...

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/ ... ary-873514

Wow. How flexible are you allowed to be with the truth on official election material?

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:30 am

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Some of what Eaton writes is true - there is a lot of resentment at the seemingly wholehearted Balls embrace of austerity and the fact the "shrink the offer" faction (of which he and his wife are leading members, along with "Dougal" Alexander) seem to have triumphed for now.

It isn't enough for Labour to win next year by default because the Tory problems are bigger - they need to find some way to inspire!

If you're referring to this ...

some shadow cabinet ministers feel as if they have been left with the worst of both worlds: an undiminished reputation for profligacy, combined with an unremittingly austere programme. One suggests that the Tories’ embrace of Lafferian tax cuts, alongside the Lib Dems’ Keynesian enthusiasm for deficit-funded infrastructure, has “opened up new territory for us”. But it is not space that anyone expects Labour to occupy. Others question the electoral logic of a hair-shirt contest with the Conservatives. “Where is this great cadre of voters who are going to come over to us because we’ve pledged to cut child benefit?” one shadow cabinet minister despairingly asks.

then, yes I agree, there's quite a bit of truth in that - it seems to reflect the frustration many of us here feel. Let's hope the rumoured reshuffle next week might bring a bit of bravery in to play to counteract the hair shirt mentality which seems too fixed and timid to produce the right kind of policies and 'narrative' (sorry Roger O'T).

Editing to put the r in bravery.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:45 am

ephemerid wrote:So - Ebola.

There is an article on the G's front page about Jim Kim (President of the World Bank) saying that he wants a fund of $20BN to deal with serious outbreaks of disease so that "western governments" can react more quickly. He's quite right to say that help for the affected countries didn't materialise quickly enough - but I wonder why he's saying this now?
Quote from the article - "Kim's warning that the global community was still "not moving fast enough" came as the Ebola virus claimed its first victim in the US and news of a case in Spain sent shares in travel and airline companies tumbling on stock exchanges".

I have some questions.
Why is it the job of "western" governments to deal with this? What about the very rich Middle Eastern governments?
What about countries like China, India, Russia? Surely a global issue isn't just the responsibility of the west?
So far, it's the UK, France, and the US who have joined Medecins Sans Frontieres on the ground - where is everyone else?
Is it a co-incidence that we're getting calls for more money now that Ebola has arrived in the US and Europe?
Is Ebola a priority now that a few companies have seen their share value fall?

I am not very worried about the virus spreading here, and I think we are well-equipped to deal with sporadic cases, as is most of Europe; but I do think we have not done much to help the countries affected, and that's why we're facing the possibility of further spread across Africa which could lead to a very serious situation worldwide.
Jim Kim is OK, and a lot of what he says makes sense - but had the countries involved been equipped to isolate their Ebola patients, the virus would not have spread so widely and what is turning into a pandemic could have been contained. It worked in Nigeria; but the affected countries now are very poor and have no resources to deal with this, so it's not a surprise that the infection has spread.

Of course, I am now expecting panicky calls from the usual quarters to ban all people from entering the UK or whatever.......and I also take a very dim view of OGRFG and his COBRA meetings, because the preparations the military have been making have been going on for some time (you don't send a hospital ship and troops out overnight) and I can't help wondering what he's up to.....he has a habit of using "emergencies" to cover up some other thing he'd rather we didn't know about......

This week's Time magazine had a couple of excellent articles on Ebola, the first concentrating on the concerns of big US outbreak (highly unlikely), the second regarding the mammoth task containing the spread in Sierra Leone etc.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:47 am

Political Scrapbook ‏@PSbook 4m4 minutes ago
NEW → Disabled woman forced to wet herself in Jobcentre after staff deny toilet access http://politicalscrapbook.net/2014/10/d ... et-access/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:51 am

PoliticsHome ‏@politicshome 4m4 minutes ago
Lobbying news: Lib Dem MP says reviewing Lobbying Act would be his "first priority" in a new govt http://polho.me/1pTVrBQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; via @PubAffairsNews

Great - they want to get back into government so they can review the evils they introduced when in government .... what a twisted reason to give the public for voting for you again .... you need me back in government so I can undo the crap I did last time .... only from the Lib Dems.

mikems · Post by **mikems** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:52 am

Cuba has already sent hundreds of doctors and medical professionals to fight ebola. I read that they have been collaborating with UK who are supplying the tents/hospitals etc that they are working in.

China too : http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/sta ... bution/en/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 10:58 am

mikems wrote:Cuba has already sent hundreds of doctors and medical professionals to fight ebola. I read that they have been collaborating with UK who are supplying the tents/hospitals etc that they are working in.

China too : http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/sta ... bution/en/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thank you for that - I knew we'd been sending kit, but I didn't know about the Cubans and the Chinese. That's good, very good.

Post by **refitman** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:11 am

For those planning to wait up for results:

Ian Jones @ian_a_jones
Follow

If you're staying up for tonight's by-election results, Clacton is tipped to declare around 2.30am, followed by Heywood at roughly 3am.
9:37 AM - 9 Oct 2014

Post by **refitman** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:12 am

adam wrote:Don't we need some kind of glorious title for this? "Today, we celebrate our independence / Shot heard around the world / etc etc". The telegraph commentariat would not be pleased.

You're right, very slack of my. Tweaked. it

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:18 am

refitman wrote:For those planning to wait up for results:
Ian Jones @ian_a_jones
Follow

If you're staying up for tonight's by-election results, Clacton is tipped to declare around 2.30am, followed by Heywood at roughly 3am.
9:37 AM - 9 Oct 2014

Thanks for that I'm not sure I'm going to stay up as such, but knowing me will wake up check the results at some outlandish time!

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:23 am

Reasoning being the bookies' odds have Labour even more likely to win in Heywood than yesterday, with nobody offering less than 50/1 ON Labour winning.

Actually the same is the case for UKIP in Clacton.

I know anything can happen, but they look like reasonably certain outcomes don't they?

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:30 am

Morning.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/9953321 ... erspend-on" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Labour's plan to turn around 8 Billion overspend on disability benefits"

Post by **adam** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:31 am

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Reasoning being the bookies' odds have Labour even more likely to win in Heywood than yesterday, with nobody offering less than 50/1 ON Labour winning.

Actually the same is the case for UKIP in Clacton.

I know anything can happen, but they look like reasonably certain outcomes don't they?

Can you get odds on the tories coming third in both seats?

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:46 am

LBC Breaking ‏@lbcbreaking 5m5 minutes ago
The IPCC is to investigate whether Kent Police and Crime Commissioner Ann Barnes was insured to drive when she was involved in an accident

I'm sorry - I know I shouldn't laugh - it's a serious matter - but Theresa May's PCCs have been an unmitigated disaster, haven't they? How the Tories get away with claiming they are the party that isn't profligate with our money - let alone the best at dealing with crime and disorder - is beyond belief.

PCCs - the laughing stock nobody wanted - elected on the lowest of low turnouts.

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:47 am

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Political Scrapbook ‏@PSbook 4m4 minutes ago
NEW → Disabled woman forced to wet herself in Jobcentre after staff deny toilet access http://politicalscrapbook.net/2014/10/d ... et-access/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

Appalling, what a bunch of jobsworths. BTW the "café down the road" offered as an alternative is roughly 100 yards away and a fairly busy access road has to be negotiated too, not a walk in the park for somebody with cerebral palsy. * I realize it is not the done thing to wish bad things on people, but I'm wishing it on the Job Centre wonk who was throwing their weight around.

Brought up around the corner from that office, and actually signed on there (once) many years ago.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:51 am

adam wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Reasoning being the bookies' odds have Labour even more likely to win in Heywood than yesterday, with nobody offering less than 50/1 ON Labour winning.

Actually the same is the case for UKIP in Clacton.

I know anything can happen, but they look like reasonably certain outcomes don't they?
Can you get odds on the tories coming third in both seats?

I'm sure you can if you ask!

BTW the Rochester by-election is looking more worthy of a late night, with the Tories much closer to UKIP judging by the odds.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 11:54 am

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Political Scrapbook ‏@PSbook 4m4 minutes ago
NEW → Disabled woman forced to wet herself in Jobcentre after staff deny toilet access http://politicalscrapbook.net/2014/10/d ... et-access/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …
Appalling, what a bunch of jobsworths. BTW the "café down the road" offered as an alternative is roughly 100 yards away and a fairly busy access road has to be negotiated too, not a walk in the park for somebody with cerebral palsy. * I realize it is not the done thing to wish bad things on people, but I'm wishing it on the Job Centre wonk who was throwing their weight around.

Brought up around the corner from that office, and actually signed on there (once) many years ago.

I restrained myself from commenting because I really couldn't have done anything other than shout and swear - and really really hope that I could never imagine myself losing so much of my ability to be human and think and act outside the prevailing system (no matter how repressive) to behave like that if I was in a similar job ...

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:00 pm

Labour continues to set the agenda then.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/econ ... burst.html

It seems Miliband has somehow stopped the stupid inflation of London house prices from opposition. Imagine what he could do in government.

Oddly the Telegraph sees this as a bad thing.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:13 pm

HindleA wrote:Morning.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/9953321 ... erspend-on" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Labour's plan to turn around 8 Billion overspend on disability benefits"

Kate Green MP, Labour’s shadow minister for Disabled People, said:

“Thousands of disabled people who want to work are being failed by the Tories. The Work Programme isn’t working for disabled people, with just one in 20 finding jobs, while this Tory-led Government slashes specialist support in job centres.

"The Tories’ failure to help disabled people into work comes at a huge cost to disabled people in every corner of the country who are being let down and to taxpayers who are facing an £8 billion bill.

"We must bring down social security spending and doing that requires a new approach to tackle the root causes of these costs directly. That’s why Labour will give disabled people the support they need to find a job. Our Work Support programme will bring hope to thousands of disabled people who have been let down by David Cameron’s government.”

I just wish really wish whoever does these press things would concentrate on the human rather than the bloody money side of policy announcements.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:16 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:
HindleA wrote:Morning.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/9953321 ... erspend-on" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Labour's plan to turn around 8 Billion overspend on disability benefits"

Kate Green MP, Labour’s shadow minister for Disabled People, said:

“Thousands of disabled people who want to work are being failed by the Tories. The Work Programme isn’t working for disabled people, with just one in 20 finding jobs, while this Tory-led Government slashes specialist support in job centres.

"The Tories’ failure to help disabled people into work comes at a huge cost to disabled people in every corner of the country who are being let down and to taxpayers who are facing an £8 billion bill.

"We must bring down social security spending and doing that requires a new approach to tackle the root causes of these costs directly. That’s why Labour will give disabled people the support they need to find a job. Our Work Support programme will bring hope to thousands of disabled people who have been let down by David Cameron’s government.”
I just wish really wish whoever does these press things would concentrate on the human rather than the bloody money side of policy announcements.

Some basic thought about marketing and message would also be good.

Explain - Why this will work and why it is good for those with disabilities.

If you can't do that don't issue a press release.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:17 pm

Good afternoon.

Thanks to tinyclanger2 and others for the mention!

Congratulations to the newly "jobbed".

Energy levels are running at a low ebb at the moment - but I'm still here and still reading all your posts avidly.

I hope everyone is well.

(Have had a quick read-through of my post and can't see anything that needs editing; although I probably will once I've submitted it . . . )

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:24 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Appalling, what a bunch of jobsworths. BTW the "café down the road" offered as an alternative is roughly 100 yards away and a fairly busy access road has to be negotiated too, not a walk in the park for somebody with cerebral palsy. * I realize it is not the done thing to wish bad things on people, but I'm wishing it on the Job Centre wonk who was throwing their weight around.

Brought up around the corner from that office, and actually signed on there (once) many years ago.
I restrained myself from commenting because I really couldn't have done anything other than shout and swear - and really really hope that I could never imagine myself losing so much of my ability to be human and think and act outside the prevailing system (no matter how repressive) to behave like that if I was in a similar job ...

Swear away, I did. I know not all JCP staff are inhumane bastards, but it does seem to attract some who like nothing better than humiliating claimants; there is a comedy series called "The Job Lot" (actually quite decent considering it is on ITV) which, because the real thing is becoming so farcical, almost seems like a documentary now. Things need to change, but they won't under the current regime, where DWP mandarins have become so politicized and are now complicit in the deliberate policy of inhumanity emanating from Smith's office.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:26 pm

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/econ ... risis.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

George-Osborne-Britains-economic-recovery-at-critical-juncture-as-eurozone-risks-slipping-back-into-crisis

Yep it's all the fault of the EU George. Again. Never your fault. Whereas Labour managed to wreck the economy all on its own. Oh and the economy of half the world.

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:26 pm

Something a little lighter, and one I have been watching develop on Twitter; CCHQ have been caught out lying (again) compounding their original stupidity by forgetting that t'internet means that it is harder to hide your tracks these days.

http://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/2014/ ... -fire.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:29 pm

This is a critical moment for the British economy. The euro zone risks slipping back into crisis, […]
Britain cannot be immune from that – indeed it's already having an impact on our manufacturing and our exports, and we need to send a clear message out around the world that we have a stable economy (and) our economic plan is working.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:30 pm

I know I'm a bit doom ad gloom about H&M result but Labour do need to b prepared for a bit of a shock
Just checked last election vote distribution :
BNP 3,239
Ukip 1,215
tory's 12,528
LibDems 10,474
Labour 18,499
The Labour majority is only 5,971. They need that to go up - not down - for it to be a "good" result.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:32 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:I know I'm a bit doom ad gloom about H&M result but Labour do need to b prepared for a bit of a shock
Just checked last election vote distribution :
BNP 3,239
Ukip 1,215
tory's 12,528
LibDems 10,474
Labour 18,499
The Labour majority is only 5,971. They need that to go up - not down - for it to be a "good" result.

One thing we can be pretty certain of - the Lib Dems won't get 10,000 votes

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:33 pm

PorFavor wrote:Good afternoon.

Thanks to tinyclanger2 and others for the mention!

Congratulations to the newly "jobbed".

Energy levels are running at a low ebb at the moment - but I'm still here and still reading all your posts avidly.

I hope everyone is well.

(Have had a quick read-through of my post and can't see anything that needs editing; although I probably will once I've submitted it . . . )

Hi PF
Great to see you posting, hope the energy levels pick up for you

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:36 pm

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
This is a critical moment for the British economy. The euro zone risks slipping back into crisis, […]
Britain cannot be immune from that – indeed it's already having an impact on our manufacturing and our exports, and we need to send a clear message out around the world that we have a stable economy (and) our economic plan is working.

Is this a new "economic plan"? Or is it still the "long-term economic plan" which we all know and love?

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:42 pm

RobertSnozers wrote:
TheGrimSqueaker wrote:Something a little lighter, and one I have been watching develop on Twitter; CCHQ have been caught out lying (again) compounding their original stupidity by forgetting that t'internet means that it is harder to hide your tracks these days.

http://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/2014/ ... -fire.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Still, a lie has got halfway round the world before the truth has got its trousers on, or whatever the quote is. Classic Tory/Crosby tactics: chuck enough mud and some will stick.

True, but if we keep brushing hard enough (as Jack of Kent does often) we can clear some of that mud away and make things clearer.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:57 pm

RobertSnozers wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:I know I'm a bit doom ad gloom about H&M result but Labour do need to b prepared for a bit of a shock
Just checked last election vote distribution :
BNP 3,239
Ukip 1,215
tory's 12,528
LibDems 10,474
Labour 18,499
The Labour majority is only 5,971. They need that to go up - not down - for it to be a "good" result.
One thing we can be pretty certain of - the Lib Dems won't get 10,000 votes
I think it's also fair to say that the BNP won't get 3,000 votes - though a fair number of both former BNP and LibDem are going to vote for Ukip.

I suspect what will happen is that the Labour share will go up a bit on a rather lower turnout - leading the jeremiahs in the media to crow about Labour's falling vote.

Though if the result in Clacton is as almost everybody expects, not many will notice.

Labour *were* genuinely worried about H&M a week ago, but seem confident they have turned things around. Fingers crossed.......

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 12:59 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:
HindleA wrote:Morning.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/9953321 ... erspend-on" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Labour's plan to turn around 8 Billion overspend on disability benefits"

Kate Green MP, Labour’s shadow minister for Disabled People, said:

“Thousands of disabled people who want to work are being failed by the Tories. The Work Programme isn’t working for disabled people, with just one in 20 finding jobs, while this Tory-led Government slashes specialist support in job centres.

"The Tories’ failure to help disabled people into work comes at a huge cost to disabled people in every corner of the country who are being let down and to taxpayers who are facing an £8 billion bill.

"We must bring down social security spending and doing that requires a new approach to tackle the root causes of these costs directly. That’s why Labour will give disabled people the support they need to find a job. Our Work Support programme will bring hope to thousands of disabled people who have been let down by David Cameron’s government.”
I just wish really wish whoever does these press things would concentrate on the human rather than the bloody money side of policy announcements.

Totally understand where you're coming from but we know what Labour are up against when it comes to getting any kind of hearing - it always boils down to the money.

It does say:

A Labour government will improve employment support for sick and disabled people. Labour would introduce a new specialist Work Support programme for sick and disabled people who are furthest from the labour market. The programme will bring together existing resources from badly targeted and failing government schemes, including Work Choice and the Work Programme. The new Work Support programme will build on reforms to improve the flawed Work Capability Assessment to ensure that it provides a gateway to back-to-work support.

so this press release is regarding ESA claimants & any improvement on ESA, the Work programme & WCA has to be better than the current situation.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 1:18 pm

Does anyone here know if there is any post poll-closure coverage (radio, TV) of the by-election(s), please?

Yes, I know, bone idle, me . . . .

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 1:23 pm

PorFavor wrote:Does anyone here know if there is any post poll-closure coverage (radio, TV) of the by-election(s), please?

Yes, I know, bone idle, me . . . .

Two and a half hours of Andrew Neil apparently!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04lbpp6" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Thu 09 Oct, 2014 1:26 pm

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
PorFavor wrote:Does anyone here know if there is any post poll-closure coverage (radio, TV) of the by-election(s), please?

Yes, I know, bone idle, me . . . .
Two and a half hours of Andrew Neil apparently!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04lbpp6" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Oh - thank you. My cup runneth over!