Saturday 19th and Sunday 20th September

Post by **adam** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 7:39 am

RIP RGB

Three things

God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change.... the Republicans will now do what they will and there's little that can be done about that

You never know but you would hope that there are few in the Senate who will know voting a replacement through now would be the end of their chances of being reelected so there is a chance that there could be three who won't hold the line and that's all it would take

The only reason there are nine justices is unwritten precedent and convention. If they successfully go ahead and appoint and if Biden wins and if the Democrats win the Senate it's open to Biden to just appoint more. Lots of 'if's but worth considering because if the ifs don't come off I'm not sure any of this matters anyway.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 10:26 am

First report from daughter was ten days into the school year, and she's been so busy the next one was only after three weeks, last night .

She, her husband who is also an English teacher and sons of 11 and 13 have all been masked, and seem to be managing. Her own experience is that classes seem a bit "sad" . Quite an effort speaking through a mask, specially when you want to demonstrate English pronunciation, and the youth are far more subdued than usual. She is also doing online stuff where they can talk without those bloody masks, and she comes back with corrections/suggestions, which is very popular. And of course a lot of extra work.

Luckily they are in the Orne which like my département of the Manche is pretty safe, so far ! Only one 'contact-case' quarantined in her lycée, same as the other one in town.

I found out a couple of days ago that Dr Fauci is himself taking Vitamin D supplement .

There is a relationship between that and less , or milder, covid , which was (conservatively) considered to be only a 'correlation' , but now increasingly likely to be causal as research results come in ....

I suggested she and the family take it , I think it was in March, but it was already part of their breakfast routine !

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 10:27 am

@adam -- fascinating on those nine Justices .

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 10:53 am

From JA last night --

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/heal ... 85589.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

NHS hospitals have been banned from launching their own coronavirus testing for staff and patients who have symptoms – despite a nationwide shortage in tests.

Leaked NHS documents, passed to The Independent, show the Department of Health and Social Care (DHSC) has now capped funding for Covid-19 testing in the health service, even though the lack of tests has left hospital doctors, nurses, teachers and other key workers forced to stay at home.

It appears that Typhoid Dido is instead going to use the £££'s to employ hundreds of 'consultants' to shore up her ramshackle 'system'.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 11:10 am

Its going to be very difficult for the Republicans to lever in a replacement for RBG *before the election* even using their full arsenal of dirty tricks.

It is feasible if you include the "lame duck" period that extends into January, but that raises a whole new set of questions.

She might just have held on long enough to make a real difference.......

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 11:43 am

Riding roughshod over precedent to rig the supreme court for years to come is the kind of parting shot you'd expect from someone expecting to lose the coming election. Does Trump want to come across as a loser?

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 11:47 am

His words this morning were surprisingly emollient, though I wouldn't read too much into that unfortunately.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 12:03 pm

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Marc Thiessen@marcthiessen
Level 1:
Ted Cruz with an excellent point. If election is litigated can't risk having just 8 justices and the possibility of a deadlocked court. Could cause a constitutional crisis.
2:39 AM · Sep 19, 2020

Rather revealing of Republican's thinking from right wing journalist Thiessen. Clearly losing the election is on their minds and how they can steal it anyway, but does this kind of talk risk painting Trump as a "loser" in the minds of voters? It's a gamble, I think, to be this blatant about potentially using the supreme court to overturn a democratic vote. Although it's part of US elections, it's not appealing, surely, to go into an election basically saying we can get the court to give it to us even if we fall short.

Post by **adam** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 12:32 pm

Willow904 wrote:

Marc Thiessen@marcthiessen
Level 1:
Ted Cruz with an excellent point. If election is litigated can't risk having just 8 justices and the possibility of a deadlocked court. Could cause a constitutional crisis.
2:39 AM · Sep 19, 2020
Rather revealing of Republican's thinking from right wing journalist Thiessen. Clearly losing the election is on their minds and how they can steal it anyway, but does this kind of talk risk painting Trump as a "loser" in the minds of voters? It's a gamble, I think, to be this blatant about potentially using the supreme court to overturn a democratic vote. Although it's part of US elections, it's not appealing, surely, to go into an election basically saying we can get the court to give it to us even if we fall short.

I suspect Roberts as Chief Justice would take his responsibility and break or avoid any deadlock. Which might not be a good thing on a court which is 4-3 to the right plus him - but you never know - Gorsuch has voted with the liberal bank on surprising issues this year.

Post by **adam** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 12:33 pm

frog222 wrote:First report from daughter was ten days into the school year, and she's been so busy the next one was only after three weeks, last night .

She, her husband who is also an English teacher and sons of 11 and 13 have all been masked, and seem to be managing. Her own experience is that classes seem a bit "sad" . Quite an effort speaking through a mask, specially when you want to demonstrate English pronunciation, and the youth are far more subdued than usual. She is also doing online stuff where they can talk without those bloody masks, and she comes back with corrections/suggestions, which is very popular. And of course a lot of extra work.

Luckily they are in the Orne which like my département of the Manche is pretty safe, so far ! Only one 'contact-case' quarantined in her lycée, same as the other one in town.

I found out a couple of days ago that Dr Fauci is himself taking Vitamin D supplement .

There is a relationship between that and less , or milder, covid , which was (conservatively) considered to be only a 'correlation' , but now increasingly likely to be causal as research results come in ....

I suggested she and the family take it , I think it was in March, but it was already part of their breakfast routine !

We are moving to compulsory masks out of classrooms for everyone without medical exemption all of the time from Monday. Ideally I won't be there after this week...

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 1:23 pm

adam wrote:
Willow904 wrote:

Marc Thiessen@marcthiessen
Level 1:
Ted Cruz with an excellent point. If election is litigated can't risk having just 8 justices and the possibility of a deadlocked court. Could cause a constitutional crisis.
2:39 AM · Sep 19, 2020
Rather revealing of Republican's thinking from right wing journalist Thiessen. Clearly losing the election is on their minds and how they can steal it anyway, but does this kind of talk risk painting Trump as a "loser" in the minds of voters? It's a gamble, I think, to be this blatant about potentially using the supreme court to overturn a democratic vote. Although it's part of US elections, it's not appealing, surely, to go into an election basically saying we can get the court to give it to us even if we fall short.
I suspect Roberts as Chief Justice would take his responsibility and break or avoid any deadlock. Which might not be a good thing on a court which is 4-3 to the right plus him - but you never know - Gorsuch has voted with the liberal bank on surprising issues this year.

I think there's a very strong argument that if it wasn't a concern in 2016 it can't be considered a genuine concern now.

How this plays out with the "pox on both their houses" voters will be interesting. It's a reminder that there's more at stake than the next four years. Those who aren't keen on Biden and are willing to chance 4 more years of Trump by voting for an alsoran are getting a timely reminder of the risks of not getting behind the Democrat candidate.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 1:31 pm

@ adam " We are moving to compulsory masks out of classrooms for everyone without medical exemption all of the time from Monday. Ideally I won't be there after this week... "

We have compulsory masks all the time, except when actually eating in the canteen !

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 1:55 pm

With the exception of the organisations listed in this guidance on closing businesses and venues, the government has not required any other businesses to close to the public – it is important for business to carry on.

It is at the discretion of employers as to how staff can continue working safely. Working from home is one way to do this, but workplaces can also be made safe by following COVID-19 Secure guidelines. Your employer should consult with you on how you can work safely, and must ensure workplaces are safe if they are asking you to return, as above.

If you are clinically extremely vulnerable, you can go to work as long as the workplace is Covid-19 Secure but should carry on working from home wherever possible.

Guidance
Coronavirus outbreak FAQs: what you can and can't do
Updated 14 September 2020

Some employers are requiring their employees to come into an office. Workplaces get to decide what 'Covid-19 Secure' means. One-room workplaces without open window capacity or other effective ventilation filtering virus-sized particles are common. Working in such a workplace meant I often came home smelling faintly of others' tobacco, perfume or laundry detergent. Employees spending hours in air space with co-workers not in shared 'safety bubbles' and with nothing more than some tape on the ground marking one person's area and no mask requirement means anyone shedding the virus in that room fills the room with CV19. The hours spent in the room with others shedding CV19 means everyone breathes in the virus. A sizeable number of people will die or have long-term health problems if infected with the virus.

These new restrictions take effect from 14 September. They are set out in the law, and the police and other enforcement officers are able to issue penalties to those that don’t comply.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 1:58 pm

Government call this legislation
The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (No. 2) (England) Regulations 2020
I think the only thing government are protecting is money.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 2:07 pm

Willow904 wrote:---
I think there's a very strong argument that if it wasn't a concern in 2016 it can't be considered a genuine concern now.

How this plays out with the "pox on both their houses" voters will be interesting. It's a reminder that there's more at stake than the next four years. Those who aren't keen on Biden and are willing to chance 4 more years of Trump by voting for an alsoran are getting a timely reminder of the risks of not getting behind the Democrat candidate.

(cJA edit)
Dangerous choices made by people I've not convinced to choose a safer option makes me feel as though I'm living in a horror film

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 2:14 pm

It's my understanding face masks are effective but when other safety precautions aren't used at the same time, everyone wearing a face mask in a poorly ventilated room for hours may not be enough protection.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 2:17 pm

citizenJA wrote:
Willow904 wrote:---
I think there's a very strong argument that if it wasn't a concern in 2016 it can't be considered a genuine concern now.

How this plays out with the "pox on both their houses" voters will be interesting. It's a reminder that there's more at stake than the next four years. Those who aren't keen on Biden and are willing to chance 4 more years of Trump by voting for an alsoran are getting a timely reminder of the risks of not getting behind the Democrat candidate.
(cJA edit)
Dangerous choices made by people I've not convinced to choose a safer option makes me feel as though I'm living in a horror film

is this grammatically correct?
Have I made any sense at all?
I'm tired and I can't tell if I've made sense.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 3:00 pm

citizenJA wrote:It's my understanding face masks are effective but when other safety precautions aren't used at the same time, everyone wearing a face mask in a poorly ventilated room for hours may not be enough protection.

I'd wear a face mask. I'd take care to safely use a clean one at all times.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 3:00 pm

citizenJA wrote:It's my understanding face masks are effective but when other safety precautions aren't used at the same time, everyone wearing a face mask in a poorly ventilated room for hours may not be enough protection.

All depends what you mean by effective

There's for a start a huge difference in emissions if someone is just breathing quietly, talking the same, or singing /shouting as loudly as they can . I just go on the principle that they do catch at least some of the nasties, and therefore reduce the viral load to some extent . Also of course a constant reminder to be careful ...
My eldest works in an office with a couple of others who are also vulnerable (she has MS ), but one colleague insists on coming to see them with her mask around the neck . Grrrr!

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 3:27 pm

frog222 wrote:
citizenJA wrote:It's my understanding face masks are effective but when other safety precautions aren't used at the same time, everyone wearing a face mask in a poorly ventilated room for hours may not be enough protection.
All depends what you mean by effective There's for a start a huge difference in emissions if someone is just breathing quietly, talking the same, or singing /shouting as loudly as they can . I just go on the principle that they do catch at least some of the nasties, and therefore reduce the viral load to some extent . Also of course a constant reminder to be careful ...
My eldest works in an office with a couple of others who are also vulnerable (she has MS ), but one colleague insists on coming to see them with her mask around the neck . Grrrr!

: ventilation.jpg (96.54 KiB) Viewed 13802 times

https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3223" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Trish Greenhalgh
Professor of Primary Care Health Sciences

https://www.phc.ox.ac.uk/team/trish-greenhalgh" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 4:29 pm

Isn't the bottom right box basically the average UK school right now?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 4:47 pm

Willow904 wrote:Isn't the bottom right box basically the average UK school right now?

yes, that's my understanding
I'm more frightened now than I was earlier in the year

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 4:49 pm

Willow904 wrote:
adam wrote:
Willow904 wrote:
Rather revealing of Republican's thinking from right wing journalist Thiessen. Clearly losing the election is on their minds and how they can steal it anyway, but does this kind of talk risk painting Trump as a "loser" in the minds of voters? It's a gamble, I think, to be this blatant about potentially using the supreme court to overturn a democratic vote. Although it's part of US elections, it's not appealing, surely, to go into an election basically saying we can get the court to give it to us even if we fall short.
I suspect Roberts as Chief Justice would take his responsibility and break or avoid any deadlock. Which might not be a good thing on a court which is 4-3 to the right plus him - but you never know - Gorsuch has voted with the liberal bank on surprising issues this year.
I think there's a very strong argument that if it wasn't a concern in 2016 it can't be considered a genuine concern now.

How this plays out with the "pox on both their houses" voters will be interesting. It's a reminder that there's more at stake than the next four years. Those who aren't keen on Biden and are willing to chance 4 more years of Trump by voting for an alsoran are getting a timely reminder of the risks of not getting behind the Democrat candidate.

Even with the polls favouring Biden, one thing Trump still has going for him is the "enthusiasm gap" - his people remain the likelier to turn out. A crude attempt to rig the Ginsburg succession could well make his opponents more determined to vote against him in November.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 5:08 pm

Talking of polls...

Britain Elects
@britainelects
Westminster voting intention:

CON: 40% (-2)
LAB: 40% (+3)
LDEM: 6% (-)

via
@YouGov

https://thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/ove ... -r9jl63m2q" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Problem for the Tories is that the alternatives are toxic apart from Sunak. And he's got a financial headache of his own right now.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 6:46 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:Talking of polls...
Britain Elects @britainelects
Westminster voting intention:
CON: 40% (-2)
LAB: 40% (+3)
LDEM: 6% (-)
via @YouGov
https://thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/ove ... -r9jl63m2q" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Problem for the Tories is that the alternatives are toxic apart from Sunak. And he's got a financial headache of his own right now.

Also,

, ....
Sunak bribed people to go out and socialise, now they're locked down again !

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 6:54 pm

Oh dear...

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Mike Smithson
@MSmithsonPB
Johnson drops to THIRD (behind don't knows) in latest "Best PM" ratings from YouGov

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 7:27 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:Oh dear...

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
Johnson drops to THIRD (behind don't knows) in latest "Best PM" ratings from YouGov

Delightful !

Johnson is reported to be in a foul mood because he can barely afford a nanny and doesn't have a housekeeper. Only a cleaner. To make matters worse he has to pay for food sent up to him from the Downing Street kitchen. But it gets worse.
READ MORE: Boris Johnson 'worried his £150,000 salary isn't enough'His flat above Number 11 is taxed as a benefit in kind and if he wants to entertain mates at the country retreat of Chequers he has to pay for their food and drinks. The PM ....

https://www.thenational.scot/news/18733 ... al-advice/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Charles de Gaulle INSISTED on paying for the nosh, but then , comparing him with that Johnson is a non-starter ?
What is rather funny is why he's making a noise about it instead of just touching up Lebedov for a brown envelope of used £'s . Is it method, or just the madness of a flailing total incompetent ?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 19 Sep, 2020 9:08 pm

Goodnight, everyone.
love,
cJA

Post by **adam** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 12:25 am

frog222 wrote:@ adam " We are moving to compulsory masks out of classrooms for everyone without medical exemption all of the time from Monday. Ideally I won't be there after this week... "

We have compulsory masks all the time, except when actually eating in the canteen !

We had a 'guide' given to us the other day that has gone out to parents, with extra information for staff. What we're being told is that if a child tests positive then the school will seek advice from PHE about what to do and that advice might be for the 'bubble' to go into quarantine but might be just for an identified part of that bubble to do so - interestingly it says that as staff are being professional and responsible and are distancing as they are told to, if someone in one of my classes tests positive I don't need to isolate as I've been keeping my distance from them. Whilst spending two and a half hours at a time with them without masks in a passably (just about) ventilated room. Also if the sibling of one of 'my' kids has to quarantine because of a positive test in his/her bubble, 'my' kid doesn't need to quarantine at all.

It appears to be a recipe for superspreading. Except of course we've been told children don't spread this. So all of these stories must be wrong.

Post by **adam** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 8:39 am

frog222 wrote:@adam -- fascinating on those nine Justices .

Follow up to this - apparently Congress decide how many SC Justices there need to be, and the chance of the Democrats losing Congress are effectively nil (usual warnings apply).

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 10:32 am

Ridge and Marr asking Starmer about Scottish independence this am. I thought this thread was very good on the subject, would love to hear KS talking about the constitution but suppose it's not realistic during a pandemic.

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Pascal
@PascalLTH
Since its introduction and growth under New Labour, successive governments have failed to describe devolution as a normal part of our constitutional order, as something intrinsically desirable for the integrity of our country

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 10:55 am

The expression on the face of Number 10 is that of a man who never looks where he is going and is then constantly surprised to find that he has stepped in dog excrement.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ment-fails" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 11:37 am

Rawnsley was one of his enablers, I'm afraid.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 1:41 pm

There's a lot of them about.

Some have moved on from pretending not to see the problem to trying to justify it with 'Corbyn would have been worse'. Or even, Corbyn might have been better because of COVID but otherwise....

I say that if we'd been fortunate enough to have JC in charge and the death toll from the virus had been even a third as big, he'd have been hounded out of office by now, if he hadn't resigned first.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 1:45 pm

Anyway, on a happier note.......Angela Rayner.

Good, isn't she?

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 6:03 pm

Quiet 'ere , needing some stimulation . ??????????????

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 6:20 pm

Sample extract:

“At his best [Jeremy Corbyn] was Delphic; at his worst he was gnomic. It fell instead to his team to decode and debate what little he did say, in the hope they might claim it as a victory for their own competing agendas.

One one occasion [Seumas] Milne, [Karie] Murphy and [Andrew] Fisher were forced to do just that, arguing over the meaning of what Corbyn had said as he sat in silence. Another aide recalled: ‘Jeremy sat there, and didn’t speak to offer any clarity whatsoever on what he’d meant. So he was just there, and I remember thinking, “this is mental”. They were interpreting his words in front of him, while he wasn’t saying anything … It was like he didn’t feel the need to clarify of take control of the situation.’
From Left Out, the Inside Story of Labour under Corbyn, by Gabriel Pogrund and Patrick Maguire

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2020/ ... ent-review" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://www.ft.com/content/dae3b268-8a4 ... 18d4317eea" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It could be argued, AK, that the VERY Biggest Enabler for the Johnson was Jeremy Corbyn .

Myself, I'd have naturally voted Labour (in spite of their having a justifiably hopeless un-prime ministerial leader ) , but I can understand people distrusting a wanker who proposed sending the Salisbury Novichok poison samples to be analysed in ..... MOSCOW !

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 7:11 pm

That wasn't his finest moment (though I rather suspect Milne was the ventriloquist there) granted - but still, when comparing it to all Johnson's crimes........

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 7:54 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:That wasn't his finest moment (though I rather suspect Milne was the ventriloquist there) granted - but still, when comparing it to all Johnson's crimes........

Young Jeremy's fondness for the IRA did not pass completely unnoticed by the voting public , either !

Adding it all up , the numbers of 'Anything But Corbyn' going to the Tories narrowly beat voters for Labour 'In spite of Corbyn'. ( Which I would have been part of if not disenfranchised)

Post by **adam** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 10:12 pm

frog222 wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:That wasn't his finest moment (though I rather suspect Milne was the ventriloquist there) granted - but still, when comparing it to all Johnson's crimes........
Young Jeremy's fondness for the IRA did not pass completely unnoticed by the voting public , either !

Adding it all up , the numbers of 'Anything But Corbyn' going to the Tories narrowly beat voters for Labour 'In spite of Corbyn'. ( Which I would have been part of if not disenfranchised)

Claire Fox is passing completely unnoticed by the voting public. People have to be carefully told what to care about, again and again.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 10:34 pm

adam wrote:
frog222 wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:That wasn't his finest moment (though I rather suspect Milne was the ventriloquist there) granted - but still, when comparing it to all Johnson's crimes........
Young Jeremy's fondness for the IRA did not pass completely unnoticed by the voting public , either !
Adding it all up , the numbers of 'Anything But Corbyn' going to the Tories narrowly beat voters for Labour 'In spite of Corbyn'. ( Which I would have been part of if not disenfranchised)
Claire Fox is passing completely unnoticed by the voting public. People have to be carefully told what to care about, again and again.

Ha hmm ! Everybody has heard of JC and his 'fondness' supposedly, for the IRA .

Approximately 0.00000357 of the electorate have the slightest clue who Claire Fox is .

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 10:58 pm

Back to Basics !

Was Andrew Rawnsley ( AK argument) more influential in the downfall of Corbyn, than Corbyn himself ?

One of these was a deferential view of Vladimir Putin, partly traceable to Milne and the close Corbyn aide Andrew Murray’s backgrounds in British communism, and their affinity with the old Soviet Union. In March 2018, when news broke of the poisoning of a former KGB agent and his daughter in Salisbury and blame fell on the Russian state, Corbyn made the risible suggestion that the toxic substance in question be sent to Moscow for testing. Soon after, Milne re-emphasised that proposal, and drew comparisons with the build-up to the invasion of Iraq. In the office of John McDonnell, the shadow chancellor, an adviser was seemingly so enraged that he kicked a waste bin, and then let rip: “That’s fucking going to cost us the election! That’s fucking stupid. Who the fuck does stuff like that?”

As with Biden in the USA I'd still have voted for a less evil or incompetent idiot than the alternative ...

and Corbyn came under the heading of an incompetent idiot , totally unfitted for managing anything bigger than a vegetable stall , but of course even he was preferable to a complete ... unhinged and lazy maniac !

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Sun 20 Sep, 2020 11:28 pm

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Dr Fauci , have you heard of him ?

He takes VitC , and VitD . Nothing else .