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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 8:48 am 
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Morning all.


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 11:23 am 
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Good morning, everyone.


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 12:53 pm 
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home-made gingerbread with cream cheese icing
please help yourselves


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 2:17 pm 
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Good afternoon.

It's worth looking at the tweet to see the photo...

https://twitter.com/TonaldDrump45an/sta ... 2992508928

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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 3:16 pm 
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Witness insane former Trump spokeswoman's fake bookcase.

https://twitter.com/BCredibility/status/1347873657348100097

See it in action here.

https://twitter.com/LiamThorpECHO/status/1347593039238344706


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 3:41 pm 
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Not the only thing that is fake about them, almost certainly.


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 9:13 pm 
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As some light relief from the depressing/terrifying/insane news of late I thought I'd share something delightful.

While thoroughly bored during the Arsenal v Newcastle match I began wondering about the history of the pitch markings and came across this...

https://robeastaway.com/blog/six-yard-box

Which explains that the six yard 'box' was originaly two semicircles around each of the goalposts (radius 6 yards) which join in front of the goal to form the shape of a giant arse (or pair of boobs depending on your preference).

Image

It is, of course, a tragedy that this was ever changed.


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 10:53 pm 
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Majority think Boris Johnson should resign as prime minister – poll

More people think Boris Johnson should resign as prime minister than think he should continue in office, according to the latest Opinium poll for the Observer.

The first poll of 2021 found that 43% thought he should resign, while 40% said that he should remain as leader. However, most Conservative voters (87%) think Johnson should stay on as leader, with just 7% thinking he should resign. Just 20% believed Keir Starmer should resign as Labour leader, with 52% saying he should remain as leader.(Observer)


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/09/most-think-boris-johnson-should-resign-poll


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 11:29 pm 
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What are the scores for Labour voters on Starmer quitting?


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 11:38 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
What are the scores for Labour voters on Starmer quitting?


They don't give a figure for Labour voters' rating of Keir Starmer.


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Jan, 2021 11:58 pm 
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This is how you get vaccinated in Florida, according to my brother.


Quote:
This week they had 5000 doses, and they opened the phone lines at noon on Monday. They peaked at 84,000 calls/minute, their press release says "captured more than 10,000 phone calls in 11 minutes ". The phone line is now closed.
One guy commented that he and his wife were running an app that called every second, and he had a bunch of browsers (6) running a VOIP app trying to get to the center.
Given that they only had 5,000 doses, they are using next week's doses for the extra number of people who got through.

There are about 250,000 people in Lee County over the age of 65. At 5,000/week that's 50 weeks.

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 12:18 am 
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That sounds like trying to get through to Swap Shop when I was a kid not a vaccination programme.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 12:21 am 
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Biden has promised to make swift vaccination a priority once he is POTUS, which is nice.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 9:36 am 
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Baffling Brexit rules threaten export chaos, Gove is warned

Business groups tell ministers to sort out bureaucratic mess caused by EU trade deal

Amid mounting anger among UK firms at cross-border friction they were told would not exist, British manufacturing and trade organisations met Cabinet Office minister Michael Gove in an emergency session on Thursday to discuss problems resulting from the deal struck by Boris Johnson with the EU before Christmas.

One leading figure involved in the talks with Gove described the new rule book as a “complete shitshow”. (Observer)


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/10/baffling-brexit-rules-threaten-export-chaos-gove-is-warned


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:19 am 
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Hancock asked this morning what the criteria are for reopening schools.
Listed four, none of which related to transmission in schools or safety of children and teachers.

This thread from yesterday

https://twitter.com/Dr_D_Robertson/stat ... 6750487552

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:20 am 
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"unexpected"

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:21 am 
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(as in Brexit is an "unexpected" "****show")

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:22 am 
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PorFavor wrote:
Quote:
Baffling Brexit rules threaten export chaos, Gove is warned

Business groups tell ministers to sort out bureaucratic mess caused by EU trade deal

Amid mounting anger among UK firms at cross-border friction they were told would not exist, British manufacturing and trade organisations met Cabinet Office minister Michael Gove in an emergency session on Thursday to discuss problems resulting from the deal struck by Boris Johnson with the EU before Christmas.

One leading figure involved in the talks with Gove described the new rule book as a “complete shitshow”. (Observer)


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/10/baffling-brexit-rules-threaten-export-chaos-gove-is-warned

Business groups are going to be disappointed.
The only time Johnson spoke without lying was when he said 'F*** business'.

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:24 am 
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I do feel slightly cheered by the vision of Gove being made extremely uncomfortable by business leaders.

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:32 am 
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Some of the Telegraph's 'baffling brexit rules' piece is attached to this tweet.

https://twitter.com/paullewismoney/stat ... 1193886722

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:36 am 
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Quote:
David Henig
@DavidHenigUK
Replying to
@DavidHenigUK
Question, what could government do to facilitate the transition in UK-EU trade? Appoint a dedicated Minister, be honest about the changes, listen to business, invest in extra resources in Brussels, and seek to negotiate some of the worst problems away.

https://twitter.com/DavidHenigUK/status ... 4401134593

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 11:14 am 
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PorFavor wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
What are the scores for Labour voters on Starmer quitting?


They don't give a figure for Labour voters' rating of Keir Starmer.


They are apparently 55% stay, 20% quit.

Though 17% of Labour supporters think he should go, compared to 15% of Tories who say that about the PM.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 11:16 am 
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gilsey wrote:
Hancock asked this morning what the criteria are for reopening schools.
Listed four, none of which related to transmission in schools or safety of children and teachers.


Here they are

Quote:
Laura McInerney
@miss_mcinerney
Matt Hancock on Marr says schools will reopen when 4 conditions are met:
1. No new (more dangerous) virus mutations
2. Vaccines are proceeding effectively
3. Deaths start falling
4. NHS isn’t in danger of overwhelm.

Fair enough. Let’s see if they stick to that.

Ftaod, I don't think it's 'fair enough'.

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 2:04 pm 
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They haven't even closed schools properly to begin with, so none of this is real policy, based on facts on the ground, it's just about the show of looking like they're doing something and the illusion of lifting minimal restrictions as if they did something when the virus naturally slows down going into spring. Of course, if it doesn't naturally slow down and if the vaccines aren't effective enough we are in very serious trouble indeed as we haven't locked down to anywhere near the degree necessary to get the R rate below 1.
I saw a recent poll that said more people were more scared of the virus now than at any time. I think people are right. During the first lockdown the public and businesses went earlier and further than the government ever really wanted or requested in terms of shutting down and socially distancing. It just about worked. This time, not only is the government requiring less, people are complying less. It's looking really rather bad.

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 3:50 pm 
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Though rather depressingly I think the death figures now reaching new records might bring about a bit more compliance.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 4:35 pm 
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Starmer accepts end of EU free movement in Brexit reversal

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/10/keir-starmer-accepts-end-of-eu-free-movement-in-brexit-reversal

Quote:
Keir Starmer has abandoned the commitment to free movement of people in the European Union he made to Labour members during the party’s leadership contest.

The Labour leader said his party had to be honest with the public, and that if it won the next general election a major renegotiation of the Brexit treaty would not be possible.



Knobsack.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 4:47 pm 
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gilsey wrote:
1. No new (more dangerous) virus mutations
2. Vaccines are proceeding effectively
3. Deaths start falling
4. NHS isn’t in danger of overwhelm.

I don't think it's 'fair enough'.


No neither do I, why isn't 'teachers have been vaccinated' on that list?


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 5:27 pm 
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Sky'sGoneOut wrote:
Starmer accepts end of EU free movement in Brexit reversal

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/10/keir-starmer-accepts-end-of-eu-free-movement-in-brexit-reversal

Quote:
Keir Starmer has abandoned the commitment to free movement of people in the European Union he made to Labour members during the party’s leadership contest.

The Labour leader said his party had to be honest with the public, and that if it won the next general election a major renegotiation of the Brexit treaty would not be possible.



Knobsack.


The 2017 Labour manifesto - "free movement will end when we exit the EU".

Finding it hard to be bothered about the above for that and other reasons. It suits Labour for Brexit not to be an issue at the next GE.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 5:28 pm 
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labour never cease to disappoint me

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 5:29 pm 
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And the voters rarely fail to disappoint them, maybe there is a connection.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 5:35 pm 
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there is seemingly no party that seeks to represent me in the UK - maybe time for labour to at least embrace an agenda of meaningful political reform so we end up with a political system that actually represents the heterogeneity of british society

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 5:36 pm 
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voters are what they are - it is the role of the political community to properly represent them and improve their lot

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 5:59 pm 
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The left in the US has largely managed to unite behind Biden, who is hardly a raging radical. Maybe there are some lessons for us there?

Just a thought.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 6:09 pm 
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tinyclanger2 wrote:
there is seemingly no party that seeks to represent me in the UK - maybe time for labour to at least embrace an agenda of meaningful political reform so we end up with a political system that actually represents the heterogeneity of british society


Yes, constitutional reform and properly implementing Leveson will need to be priorities. In terms of actions, at least. I'm not sure they're topics that will enthuse voters so much. The green and climate change offer needs to be strong. Money and competent leadership for education could also prove attractive. Shouldn't be hard to beat the Tories' record on schools, surely.

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 6:19 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
The left in the US has largely managed to unite behind Biden, who is hardly a raging radical. Maybe there are some lessons for us there?

Just a thought.

if only. let's see (aoc?)

i think the point is that political leaders need to have a real vision for a future that works for more people. a visionary political leader now would be looking beyond the contribution of thieir party within the status quo to fundamental change. ie the goal is improving the quality of life of most people on the planet as opposed to ensuring their own party,s continued existence

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 6:42 pm 
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AOC is terrific, I agree - but the day when she is a plausible Democratic candidate for POTUS is still some way off.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 6:50 pm 
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meanwhile am dydreaming about the hitherto unknown (to me) normandy coastal path - any tips?

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 7:01 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
The left in the US has largely managed to unite behind Biden, who is hardly a raging radical.


The left in the U.S have no choice and getting rid of Trump was a huge incentive to unite, don't let Biden's victory fool you that they aren't in reality deeply divided, which is going to cause him huge problems in the years to come, especially in Congress.

Similarly Labour in England find themselves in a position where they're increasingly seen as the only viable alternative to the Tories and as a result now represent a wider range of voters of differing left wing opinions than they have in decades. If they don't recognise that and begin to demonstrate at least some consideration for those of us voting for them who feel completely voiceless then we'll eventually drift away. There's only so long you can take people for granted and all it takes is another viable alternative to come along for it all to fall apart. Just look what happened to them in Scotland. They need to understand that they're heading a coalition of the English left, liberals, greens and begin acting like it or things could come unstuck for them with surprising rapidity.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 7:18 pm 
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quite

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 7:29 pm 
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Sure, its not all sweetness and light under the surface - it rarely has been - but we have our own mini-me Trump in this country.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 7:36 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
The 2017 Labour manifesto - "free movement will end when we exit the EU".

Finding it hard to be bothered about the above for that and other reasons. It suits Labour for Brexit not to be an issue at the next GE.


https://keirstarmer.com/plans/10-pledges/

Quote:
Defend free movement as we leave the EU.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 7:41 pm 
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tinyclanger2 wrote:
there is seemingly no party that seeks to represent me in the UK - maybe time for labour to at least embrace an agenda of meaningful political reform so we end up with a political system that actually represents the heterogeneity of british society


Absolutely, unfortunately Labour have repeatedly demonstrated they will never vote for or introduce voting reform until it is in their own interest to do so.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 8:04 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Sure, its not all sweetness and light under the surface - it rarely has been - but we have our own mini-me Trump in this country.


Not for long, I doubt he'll last another 6 months. And you're right, it rarely is sweetness and light when a political party has to try to represent a multiplicity of views, the problem here is though that the Labour party is completely ignoring the wishes of many of those who actually voted for them in an attempt to appease those who didn't, so a vast swathe of their voters don't feel represented at all. I can see why they're doing it, and why they think it a gamble worth taking, but that doesn't make it feel any less cynical.

Also I apologise if I'm coming over grumpy and argumentative, being sober on a Sunday at this time doesn't agree with me, I'll do something about it immediately :) .


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:02 pm 
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Re Keir Starmer's latest on the EU -

He's getting worse instead of getting better - or even staying the same. If this is what he's like when he's, theoretically, in the ascendancy I despair. I can't be arsed to resign my membership but, if he continues in this vein, I certainly shan't be renewing it.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:03 pm 
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tinyclanger2 wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
The left in the US has largely managed to unite behind Biden, who is hardly a raging radical. Maybe there are some lessons for us there?

Just a thought.

if only. let's see (aoc?)

i think the point is that political leaders need to have a real vision for a future that works for more people. a visionary political leader now would be looking beyond the contribution of thieir party within the status quo to fundamental change. ie the goal is improving the quality of life of most people on the planet as opposed to ensuring their own party,s continued existence
(cJA size emphasis)
Is it wise or realistic wanting this from one person?


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:13 pm 
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The demands made on individuals attempting to provide effective opposition right now are too much
Christ, if I were subjected to the amount of daily shit Labour MPs are subjected to, I'd tell the biggest loud mouth to take my place and get it done
Let me tell you where this ends up
The aristocrats win
everything
What we want from our political system we'll have to be, we'll have to identify with one another, cooperation and compromise are grinding processes that don't happen with a flip of a switch, they take persistent effort.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:17 pm 
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Fox News watch.

They began with genuine shock and horror at what was happening on Wednesday, Republicans don't riot you see and most certainly don't desecrate the historic houses of freedom and democracy while chanting they want to lynch a Republican vice president after constructing a gallows outside.

It was fascinating to watch Fox News hosts and talking heads witness the culmination of their 20 year project and be horrified by it. On Thursday they were still obviously all over the place desperately grasping for some narrative that could save them. So on the one hand you had a few attempting to demonstrate some journalistic integrity blaming Trump and his acolytes in the Republican party, while on the other you had those desperately trying to claim it was all a false flag operation instigated by 'Antifa' and those good people with overt neo nazi slogans on their clothes and banners had been led astray by the left.

By Friday the false flag evil lefties narrative was waning because for the most part Trump's fuckwits had made no effort to conceal their identities, then in the evening Trump got banned from Twitter. And with that they found a new unifying enemy and a cause to rally around in free speech. This hasn't gone entirely well for them. They've stuck to the subject all weekend and it's been highly amusing having guest after guest from constitutional experts to professors of history to people who work in the tech industry all trying to explain to them that first amendment rights don't apply to private companies, yet regardless they've ploughed on never deviating from the one path they have left that allows them to appear righteously indignant.

They've tied themselves to the mast and not only plugged their ears but put on a blindfold and no amount of humiliation is going to make them change course or acknowledge the monsters they're trying to avoid are of their own creation.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:36 pm 
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citizenJA wrote:
The demands made on individuals attempting to provide effective opposition right now are too much.


I remember Mythbusters proving that shooting fish in a barrel is indeed extemely easy*.

And those are fat Tory fish in a very small barrel.

*The shock wave alone destroys their gill bladders so you don't need to actually hit them.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:36 pm 
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I've tried and failed to work up a pun constructed around law enforcement vehicles. So count yourself lucky.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2021 10:59 pm 
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Sky'sGoneOut wrote:
citizenJA wrote:
The demands made on individuals attempting to provide effective opposition right now are too much.


I remember Mythbusters proving that shooting fish in a barrel is indeed extemely easy*.

And those are fat Tory fish in a very small barrel.

*The shock wave alone destroys their gill bladders so you don't need to actually hit them.
fat Tory fish getting shot in a small barrel won't be televised
try convincing people it happened


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