Saturday 8th & Sunday 9th November 2014

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 2:33 pm

Apologies if any FTNers live in Dudley North but it looks like the sort of place I'd avoid.

General Election 2010: Dudley North
Party Candidate Votes
Labour Ian Austin 38.7%
Conservative Graeme Brown 37%
Liberal Democrat Mike Becket 10.5%
UKIP Malcolm Davies 3,267 8.5%
BNP Ken Griffiths 1,899 4.9%
National Front Kevin Inman 0.4%

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 2:38 pm

Poster on another board points out a good indication that the Johnson story is bollocks.

He's 12-1 to be the next leader.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 2:38 pm

yahyah wrote:Apologies if any FTNers live in Dudley North but it looks like the sort of place I'd avoid.

General Election 2010: Dudley North
Party Candidate Votes
Labour Ian Austin 38.7%
Conservative Graeme Brown 37%
Liberal Democrat Mike Becket 10.5%
UKIP Malcolm Davies 3,267 8.5%
BNP Ken Griffiths 1,899 4.9%
National Front Kevin Inman 0.4%

He seems to be pandering to certain elements too?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ation.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 2:38 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
refitman wrote:
.@IanAustinMP the public back your leader, why won't you? #webackEd
?
If Ed has a twitter account can we send him something about hanging on in there.?

I thought of writing him a letter - but my handwriting is crap these days and - guess what? - I don't have a printer (which isn't actually an insurmountable problem).

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 2:47 pm

RobertSnozers wrote:How about the members and registered supporters of the Labour Party email the official email and CC e.g. labourlist saying they will resign if Ed is pushed out?

LabourList have this at the moment, I duly signed this morning, think it's primarily for members?

http://labourlist.org/2014/11/anonymous ... r-shut-up/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 2:49 pm

letsskiptotheleft wrote:
RobertSnozers wrote:How about the members and registered supporters of the Labour Party email the official email and CC e.g. labourlist saying they will resign if Ed is pushed out?
LabourList have this at the moment, I duly signed this morning, think it's primarily for members?

http://labourlist.org/2014/11/anonymous ... r-shut-up/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thanks. (I signed it yesterday but the more the merrier (if merrier's the right word)).

Edited for sodding brackets.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 2:49 pm

Lynton and all better stick a few big bets on Alan Johnson.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 2:55 pm

PorFavor wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:
RobertSnozers wrote:How about the members and registered supporters of the Labour Party email the official email and CC e.g. labourlist saying they will resign if Ed is pushed out?
LabourList have this at the moment, I duly signed this morning, think it's primarily for members?

http://labourlist.org/2014/11/anonymous ... r-shut-up/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks. (I signed it yesterday but the more the merrier (if merrier's the right word).

Hah! I buried my head under a pillow yesterday, expecting a shit-storm, it arrived.

On a happier note I note Austin is taking a kicking on twitter.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 2:59 pm

Memo to Labour MP's briefing against Ed - this is a doorstep. Remember these?
#webackEd
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

...and #webackEd is still trending on twitter
Take heart all - we will overcome.

Upwards and onwards to that Landslide in 2015

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:09 pm

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/11 ... 28258.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Inevitably webackEd is "bad news for Miliband". The guy must be completely immune to bad news by now.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:12 pm

May I take this opportunity to thank my honourable friends here for entrusting me with Committee Chair duties.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:19 pm

You would think that this is an important piece, illustrates how wages are stagnant, how many are looking over the precipice, in the so called ''fastest growing'' in Europe. Yet the Guardian continues to go with a story which is basically Chinese whispers, strange that!

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2014/n ... -rate-rise" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:28 pm

letsskiptotheleft wrote:You would think that this is an important piece, illustrates how wages are stagnant, how many are looking over the precipice, in the so called ''fastest growing'' in Europe. Yet the Guardian continues to go with a story which is basically Chinese whispers, strange that!

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2014/n ... -rate-rise" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Only 14 comments below the line so far. Huh. This important information is side-lined by distracting propaganda.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:29 pm

PorFavor wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:
RobertSnozers wrote:How about the members and registered supporters of the Labour Party email the official email and CC e.g. labourlist saying they will resign if Ed is pushed out?
LabourList have this at the moment, I duly signed this morning, think it's primarily for members?

http://labourlist.org/2014/11/anonymous ... r-shut-up/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks. (I signed it yesterday but the more the merrier (if merrier's the right word)).

Edited for sodding brackets.

I signed too.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:30 pm

citizenJA wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote: LabourList have this at the moment, I duly signed this morning, think it's primarily for members?

http://labourlist.org/2014/11/anonymous ... r-shut-up/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks. (I signed it yesterday but the more the merrier (if merrier's the right word)).

Edited for sodding brackets.
I signed too.

Me too.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:32 pm

I thought of writing him a letter - but my handwriting is crap these days and - guess what? - I don't have a printer (which isn't actually an insurmountable problem)

.Wonderful idea - writing a letter - now there's truly a revolutionary idea - I'm serious. Thank you for the suggestion, sincerely. I'm doing it.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:33 pm

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-29978194" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;?

Kinnock says threat to Miliband "not substantial"

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:41 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/11 ... 28258.html

Inevitably webackEd is "bad news for Miliband". The guy must be completely immune to bad news by now.

Havisham is doing his "you are all making yourselves look very silly doing this" routine on Twitter; apparently it isn't the fault of the meeja, honest guv.

That Huff Post is a masterpiece of sneeriness, isn't it. Loved the very arch payoff about which MPs hadn't tweeted; as Caroline Flint said this morning (and I paraphrase) "So I took the night off to watch X Factor. So sue me". pk1's 'encounter' with Ms Boniface and the sneeriness of this & Hodges is very revealing; journalists, by their very natures, are creatures of ego and last night would have been very bruising for those egos, as they found out they don't have total control of the message any more. Good.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:42 pm

Incredible stuff here re Sir Peter Hayman, the paedophile diplomat.

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5401/ ... phile-ring" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Can't copy the text, but the bit that leaps out to me is the response to a question from Tory MP, Robin Maxwell-Hyslop

M-H says Hayman sent obscene material through the post, that is an offence. Why isnt he being prosecuted?

Havers says people who commit offences aren't always prosecuted! Anyway, some people who were prosecuted got a conditional discharge.

I find the Sir Peter Fahey principle (as traduced by Simon Danczuk) rather persuasive- you have serious crime and you don't think you can make it stick? Throw the book. Get them on anything. And come back at them later when you've more.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:45 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:Incredible stuff here re Sir Peter Hayman, the paedophile diplomat.

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5401/ ... phile-ring" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Can't copy the text, but the bit that leaps out to me is the response to a question from Tory MP, Robin Maxwell-Hyslop

M-H says Hayman sent obscene material through the post, that is an offence. Why isnt he being prosecuted?

Havers says people who commit offences aren't always prosecuted! Anyway, some people who were prosecuted got a conditional discharge.

I find the Sir Peter Fahey principle (as traduced by Simon Danczuk) rather persuasive- you have serious crime and you don't think you can make it stick? Throw the book. Get them on anything. And come back at them later when you've more.

Al Capone was sent up to prison as a convicted tax dodger in the US.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:56 pm

Just a thought. I've been Retweeting a few #webackEd tweets for FTN

My impression is that even those who are not Labour / Ed supporters are broadly of the opinion that the media campaign against him should be stopped. Hopefully, then, support for Miliband here and on Twitter is acceptable to the wider FTN community - it's not tribal, it's about openness and honesty in the media.

Is that OK?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 3:59 pm

Originally from RebeccaRiots2 & reposted by ErnstRemarx:
http://wwwbrokenbarnet.blogspot.co.uk/2 ... f-end.html
Democracy at work - it's hard work. I was inspired by the account from the link above. Thank you.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:07 pm

PorFavor wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:
refitman wrote: ?
If Ed has a twitter account can we send him something about hanging on in there.?

I thought of writing him a letter - but my handwriting is crap these days and - guess what? - I don't have a printer (which isn't actually an insurmountable problem).

I'm thinking of sending Ed a card, with just a couple of words of support.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:07 pm

Laying here, a thought just came to me, as they do, occasionally. Yahyah and Rebecca made a point on Thursday, or Wednesday about the number of ''aren't the LibDems wonderful'' articles that suddenly appeared in that unmentioned rag, now I am sure it is a pure coincidence then that an avalanche of pig-swill was thrown in Labour's direction?

I am aware too, that the New Statesman did no favours.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:09 pm

Will Porter ‏@GlamorousLeft 52m52 minutes ago
Ed Miliband; 2nd generation migrant, Comp School educated, Socialist and atheist. No wonder the Establishment hate him. #webackEd

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:13 pm

David Hendy ‏@davidrghendy 3h3 hours ago South East, England
Given the concerted media attack by the establishment on Ed Miliband it's rather uplifting to witness the #webacked response.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:16 pm

Why we should always be sceptical about opinion polls

http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/w ... gk81xYqvwe" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:22 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:Why we should always be sceptical about opinion polls

http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/w ... gk81xYqvwe" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Lib Dems were most likely to say they could recognise a pic of the imaginary politician in the poll !
Deluded or too arrogant to admit they may not know something ?

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:34 pm

Haha! Someone on twitter replying to a "Danzcuk is the only who sees reality" made the point that Simon has a tiny majority, is a bankrupt and owes the tax man a lot of money. Maybe that's why he is so keen on writing for the Mail?

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:37 pm

citizenJA wrote:Originally from RebeccaRiots2 & reposted by ErnstRemarx:
http://wwwbrokenbarnet.blogspot.co.uk/2 ... f-end.html
Democracy at work - it's hard work. I was inspired by the account from the link above. Thank you.

Excellent, isn't it?

The council who outsourced legal services and didn't keep on any lawyers. So didn't even know when to seek legal advice or what to make of legal advice they got back.

Thanks again to RR.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:39 pm

yahyah wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:Why we should always be sceptical about opinion polls

http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/w ... gk81xYqvwe" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Lib Dems were most likely to say they could recognise a pic of the imaginary politician in the poll !
Deluded or too arrogant to admit they may not know something ?

I laughed until I looked at the questions & how the questions were asked.

Could you recognise Andrew Farmer?

Was a picture shown to them?
Another question was this:

Have you heard of Andrew Farmer?

If that was the question asked without specifically saying Andrew Farmer was a politician, I'd have said I knew him. I went to school with one. I probably wouldn't have been able to recognise a picture though.

Ukip voters were the most likely to admit never having heard of ‘Andrew Farmer’, while almost one in five Labour supporters claimed they had heard of him.

Do UKIP voters want to know anyone?

Thanks Yahyah, good link, good information.

xx
JA

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:39 pm

Phillip Jones ‏@Phillip_D_Jones · 7 mins7 minutes ago
@bassmadman Do you stand in solidarity with #webackEd ? If so then sign and RT this to stop #bbc propaganda : https://www.change.org/p/uk-government- ... ter_mobile" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; … …

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:40 pm

citizenJA wrote:
Tubby Isaacs wrote:Incredible stuff here re Sir Peter Hayman, the paedophile diplomat.

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5401/ ... phile-ring" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Can't copy the text, but the bit that leaps out to me is the response to a question from Tory MP, Robin Maxwell-Hyslop

M-H says Hayman sent obscene material through the post, that is an offence. Why isnt he being prosecuted?

Havers says people who commit offences aren't always prosecuted! Anyway, some people who were prosecuted got a conditional discharge.

I find the Sir Peter Fahey principle (as traduced by Simon Danczuk) rather persuasive- you have serious crime and you don't think you can make it stick? Throw the book. Get them on anything. And come back at them later when you've more.
Al Capone was sent up to prison as a convicted tax dodger in the US.

Yes, indeed.

None of this of course means Hayman was pimping out young kids to the Cabinet- he had enough friends who'd want to help him anyway- but I'm starting to see a conspiracy more than I have before.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:40 pm

I also had a snort to myself earlier (no, not that kind) when Owen Jones asked Simon when was he going to join the Kippers. Slimes replied that the young lad should stop living off the back of Union dues..

Popular bloke isn't he?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:41 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
Will Porter ‏@GlamorousLeft 52m52 minutes ago
Ed Miliband; 2nd generation migrant, Comp School educated, Socialist and atheist. No wonder the Establishment hate him. #webackEd

Oh, right on! Beautiful, sincerely.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:47 pm

The U.K. will pay the whole amount without any penalties attached or interest rates

Irish Finance Minister Michael Noonan

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 4:49 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
Will Porter ‏@GlamorousLeft 52m52 minutes ago
Ed Miliband; 2nd generation migrant, Comp School educated, Socialist and atheist. No wonder the Establishment hate him. #webackEd

Worth pointing out that his father was incredibly successful, given his background.

If that was a Tory family, that would be considered praiseworthy. Blah, blah, passed on his ferocious work ethic to his two sons, blah.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:02 pm

The impact of the following information from latest Survation poll just hit me now - UKIP are that close to Tories? The Tories are in trouble. But we knew that.

Tories 29%
UKIP 23%

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:03 pm

Toynbee has a good one up, can't link as I am on my phone and I don't know how to! Few good posts btl too..

ErnstRemarx · Post by **ErnstRemarx** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:06 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
danczuk cameron.jpg
Labour backbencher Simon Danczuk told BBC One's Sunday Politics Mr Miliband would lead the party into the election, but added: "The numbers show us he's not popular. That's the reality."

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-29967737" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ality.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I know we're not supposed to say mean stuff about what people look like but Danczuk looks a lot like a Tory

Danczuk spoke at our AGM in February - I was surprised he'd been invited, as I was aware of his being on the right of the party (just didn't realise how far right) - and he made a reasonable fist of it, but I could hardly say he impressed me. Like many MPs, he won a selection (though fuck knows what it says about Rochdale Labour party, who I hope feel ashamed of his witless utterances) and is now a bit of a loose cannon. He's very much one of those who, if I run across him again, will feel the back of me 'and (metaphorically speaking). I'll ask him how trying to stab or do down his own party leader is meant to be helpful, and why the fuck should any Labour supporter in Rochdale bother to vote for a fuckwit like him?

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:14 pm

http://news.sky.com/story/1369979/milib ... eaks-cover" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;?

If a shadow minister or a senior MP goes on the record, things could move very quickly indeed, writes Sky's Darren McCaffrey.

then again with this degree of accuracy:

A particular blow would be the Observer - a Labour supporting paper -

...

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:14 pm

ErnstRemarx wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:
danczuk cameron.jpg
Labour backbencher Simon Danczuk told BBC One's Sunday Politics Mr Miliband would lead the party into the election, but added: "The numbers show us he's not popular. That's the reality."

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-29967737" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ality.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I know we're not supposed to say mean stuff about what people look like but Danczuk looks a lot like a Tory
Danczuk spoke at our AGM in February - I was surprised he'd been invited, as I was aware of his being on the right of the party (just didn't realise how far right) - and he made a reasonable fist of it, but I could hardly say he impressed me. Like many MPs, he won a selection (though fuck knows what it says about Rochdale Labour party, who I hope feel ashamed of his witless utterances) and is now a bit of a loose cannon. He's very much one of those who, if I run across him again, will feel the back of me 'and (metaphorically speaking). I'll ask him how trying to stab or do down his own party leader is meant to be helpful, and why the fuck should any Labour supporter in Rochdale bother to vote for a fuckwit like him?

If I was living in Rochdale, and a Labour member I couldn't bring myself to vote for a fucker like him, he has shown no loyalty to a decent bloke, there are ways and means of making your concerns heard, writing pieces of shit for the Daily Mail isn't one of them. Wankers like him want to realise how soul destroying it is for the likes of us who send the odd tenner, twenty quid to bolster funds for the GE, only for twats like him do undo any good work, sorry for the language but I could cheerfully ram his head down an unflushed bog.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:15 pm

ErnstRemarx wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:
danczuk cameron.jpg
Labour backbencher Simon Danczuk told BBC One's Sunday Politics Mr Miliband would lead the party into the election, but added: "The numbers show us he's not popular. That's the reality."

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-29967737" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ality.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I know we're not supposed to say mean stuff about what people look like but Danczuk looks a lot like a Tory
Danczuk spoke at our AGM in February - I was surprised he'd been invited, as I was aware of his being on the right of the party (just didn't realise how far right) - and he made a reasonable fist of it, but I could hardly say he impressed me. Like many MPs, he won a selection (though fuck knows what it says about Rochdale Labour party, who I hope feel ashamed of his witless utterances) and is now a bit of a loose cannon. He's very much one of those who, if I run across him again, will feel the back of me 'and (metaphorically speaking). I'll ask him how trying to stab or do down his own party leader is meant to be helpful, and why the fuck should any Labour supporter in Rochdale bother to vote for a fuckwit like him?

Could they deselect him, Ernst? For bringing the party into disrepute - or such like? Trouble is - that would probably be painted as trying to suppress criticism of the Labour local authority and peeps for any role played in the child abuse cases.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:17 pm

http://www.gloucestercitizen.co.uk/Glou ... story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;?

Some Labour members backing Ed (for lightish relief)

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:20 pm

Polly Toynbee retweeted
Joel Pearce @joel_pearce · 2h 2 hours ago
Okay I've joined Labour. Disagree with them on lots (& will continue to) but @Ed_Miliband's our best hope as PM in 2015. #webackEd

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:22 pm

refitman wrote:
yahyah wrote:Can we, as FTN on Twitter, ask Ian Austin what he has to say about Ed ?

Ian AustinVerified account
@IanAustinMP
How about
.@IanAustinMP the public your leader, why won't you? #webackEd
?

Can we tweet Ian Austin and ask him

When are you going to join the Tory Party.

ErnstRemarx · Post by **ErnstRemarx** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:24 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:I know we've been here before, but how the hell do we get a press that can offset the right wing dominance? We used to have a public broadcaster which was quite valuable, but that's clearly no longer (and for ages hasn't been) the case. Maybe JK's got a few quid she could spare to set one up a quality paper and pay (among others) some of our star FTNers to provide the content.

If I had more money than Brenda I'd certainly be open to an approach ....

Hi TC, much of the intelligent and thoughtful commentary and analysis has already moved away from the press (as we know it) and onto the t'interwebs, so it follows that that's where the future is likely to be.

Already, places like FTN link to useful and informative sites that are miles more useful than the 'papers' since they quote raw facts and figures and suggest interpretations that you will never, ever find on the Graun and Fail websites. That is why FTN is my goto site and why I can safely discount and ignore the Graun for good. They'll get no more clicks and visits out of me, as it's a waste of my time and energy. The truth lies elsewhere.

That is why I've asked a few times here that if you still bother with the Graun, at least post up our URL in your profile and feel very free to invite switched on posters there to come here and register (and post). We're still slowly gathering new members, but we need more and we need to attract visitors and people who've become equally disillusioned by the crap served up by the MSM.

That is why I'm (personally) very much against the sorts of spat that has - apparently - seen Temulkar stop posting here. I very much regret that. FTN is, or should be, a far wider church than being an adherent of the Labour party. All shades of left are welcome, and any reasonable (ie, not bonkers) right wing poster is welcome here too. There is much to discuss and and all intelligent input is welcome. Remember, if you disagree with a post, it makes you examine your view to be able to reply.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:26 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:http://news.sky.com/story/1369979/milib ... eaks-cover?

If a shadow minister or a senior MP goes on the record, things could move very quickly indeed, writes Sky's Darren McCaffrey.
then again with this degree of accuracy:

A particular blow would be the Observer - a Labour supporting paper -
...

okay, it's just straight out the Martians have landed flee to the hills making stuff up flat out lies at this stage.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:30 pm

ErnstRemarx wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:I know we've been here before, but how the hell do we get a press that can offset the right wing dominance? We used to have a public broadcaster which was quite valuable, but that's clearly no longer (and for ages hasn't been) the case. Maybe JK's got a few quid she could spare to set one up a quality paper and pay (among others) some of our star FTNers to provide the content.

If I had more money than Brenda I'd certainly be open to an approach ....
Hi TC, much of the intelligent and thoughtful commentary and analysis has already moved away from the press (as we know it) and onto the t'interwebs, so it follows that that's where the future is likely to be.

Already, places like FTN link to useful and informative sites that are miles more useful than the 'papers' since they quote raw facts and figures and suggest interpretations that you will never, ever find on the Graun and Fail websites. That is why FTN is my goto site and why I can safely discount and ignore the Graun for good. They'll get no more clicks and visits out of me, as it's a waste of my time and energy. The truth lies elsewhere.

That is why I've asked a few times here that if you still bother with the Graun, at least post up our URL in your profile and feel very free to invite switched on posters there to come here and register (and post). We're still slowly gathering new members, but we need more and we need to attract visitors and people who've become equally disillusioned by the crap served up by the MSM.

That is why I'm (personally) very much against the sorts of spat that has - apparently - seen Temulkar stop posting here. I very much regret that. FTN is, or should be, a far wider church than being an adherent of the Labour party. All shades of left are welcome, and any reasonable (ie, not bonkers) right wing poster is welcome here too. There is much to discuss and and all intelligent input is welcome. Remember, if you disagree with a post, it makes you examine your view to be able to reply.

I get why Temulkar doesn't post, and it is fair enough. I agreed with him on almost nothing but he fought his corner very well.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Sun 09 Nov, 2014 5:32 pm

citizenJA wrote:
tinyclanger2 wrote:http://news.sky.com/story/1369979/milib ... eaks-cover?

If a shadow minister or a senior MP goes on the record, things could move very quickly indeed, writes Sky's Darren McCaffrey.
then again with this degree of accuracy:

A particular blow would be the Observer - a Labour supporting paper -
...
okay, it's just straight out the Martians have landed flee to the hills making stuff up flat out lies at this stage.

yup