Monday 10th November 2014

Post by **refitman** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 7:14 am

Morning all.

Right, off to see a man about a telelphone line.

TechnicalEphemera · Post by **TechnicalEphemera** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 8:13 am

The headline in this story is excellent.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/news ... ology.html

The content largely accurate. See campaigns such as "Automate Britain" to see why.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 8:14 am

Back in the real world.

Teresa May tonight will probably have to rely on Labour votes in the EAW debate. She's having a rather easy ride on Today at the moment. What a surprise, eh?!

Lonewolfie · Post by **Lonewolfie** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 8:36 am

Morning all...and wow...a 12 page w/end?

The sort of stuff within those 12 pages is why I'm proud to be here (and grateful that you all put up with the sometimes unintelligible gruntfuttockery emanating from my position of Hope).

Mr Ed seems to have ridden the (non-existent) storm, although there is some residue of the attacks at the Beeb...this piece, under the headline...

'Newspaper headlines: Ed's new 'leadership crisis' '

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-the-papers-29974714

...obviously now, they can write it up as an actual something that is real (so many column inches dedicated to it over the w/end)...and of all the issues that they could write about WRT Dodgy Dave, Gidiot and the Coalition Scorched-earthers, at the bottom of the piece the writer reminds us that not everything is serious - Fat Pickles is a heart-throb in Novosibirsk (smirk, smirk) and Gidiots' cat has upset his dog, and Daves cat is top dog in Downing Street (smirk, titter, smirk - wink wink)

...and I'm not going to link to it, but the ever balanced Graun has...drum roll...

'Ed Milibands' backers are making matters worse, say critics'.

....and thank you for the brilliant FTN tweet (I hope no-one minds me re-posting it)...

: ftn104.PNG (18.01 KiB) Viewed 15409 times

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 8:38 am

letsskiptotheleft wrote:Back in the real world.

Teresa May tonight will probably have to rely on Labour votes in the EAW debate. She's having a rather easy ride on Today at the moment. What a surprise, eh?!

Morning. Yes - they are almost clearing the way for her every word ...

And she will have to rely on Labour votes. Interesting that Robinson actually said the Tories won't want a rebellion of their own to distract away from 'Miliband's woes'. Exactly.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 8:47 am

Are low-paid, outraged workers ready to fight back?
Wages have been falling for years and inequality is growing. But the dissatisfaction of workers may finally force a revolt
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... fight-back

One of the best things I've read in a while.

...He found that over a 10-year period, for the advanced countries, the biggest driver by far was this phenomenon dubbed “financialisation”.

It’s a complex process: first, companies become driven by the short-term demands of shareholders, or by debt-finance takeovers and their only option is to slash wage costs. Next the composition of the economy shifts – from the factories and heavy industry of the 1970s and 80s to the distribution centre and call-centre work that is common now. Trade union bargaining power is eroded – and this was the overt aim of both Margaret Thatcher and Tony Blair – and the current system of individual secret salaries and precarious jobs is imposed. Finally, to sugar the pill, you can live on the lower wages because credit is endlessly available. From mobile phones to new cars, to overdrafts, capitalism is now structured to turn every consumer into a financial income stream. Long before you bought your gym membership, the gym itself had sold the projected income into the financial markets, to be traded against other streams of interest.

When the entire system is based on credit, there is no incentive to call time on anybody...

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 8:57 am

Tim Montgomerie @montie · 18m 18 minutes ago
CBI asking for more taxpayer subsidy of its workforces today. Shld be more appreciative of what business already has http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/c ... 244797.ece" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

Right on cue - eh? (Following my above post of the Paul Mason article.)

This - subsidies to business to keep wages down ... and 'benefits' higher ... could be a major battleground.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 8:58 am

Pen ‏@westernshores 21s21 seconds ago
The stench of missed emissions targets as Coalition's green credentials are ‘torn up and thrown out’ http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 50180.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 9:10 am

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Tim Montgomerie @montie · 18m 18 minutes ago
CBI asking for more taxpayer subsidy of its workforces today. Shld be more appreciative of what business already has http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/c ... 244797.ece" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …
Right on cue - eh? (Following my above post of the Paul Mason article.)

This - subsidies to business to keep wages down ... and 'benefits' higher ... could be a major battleground.

When I heard this on the R4 News my thought was "Well, you could always redress the balance between labour and shareholder capital...nah, get the taxpayer to stump up"...

At some point it might occur to them that this is not a long-term solution to the deficit.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 9:38 am

Andy Reed retweeted
Tim Montgomerie ‏@montie 2m2 minutes ago
Important FT splash this morning: The harshest, deepest spending cuts are still to come http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/5426fc12-6346 ... z3IelgJLOQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; … #BiggestDeficitInEurope

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 9:38 am

"Miliband is certainly unpopular, and his weaknesses have contributed to his plight; but the bigger weaknesses belong to the party as a whole. Voters threw Labour out four years ago and it has given them no good reason to change their minds. The mayhem of the past few days has been a giant displacement activity of benefit only to Labour’s opponents."

YouGov email today.

The problem with this narrative being pushed is that Labour are ahead. Still. The 'benefit' to the opponents listed has increased their percentage polling, erm not at all.

EAW vote. Then we have R&S coming up, with associated UKIP love in (predictions for which commentator will be the first to mention an earthquake afterwards?). This will improve the Conservatives lot how exactly?

Morning all btw.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 9:39 am

They aren't going to let it go....

''Labour acknowledges ‘noises off’ over Ed Miliband leadership
Chuka Umunna admits there is a small minority of critical MPs but says majority are up for Miliband-led election campaign

Nicholas Watt, chief political correspondent
The Guardian, Monday 10 November 2014 09.30 GMT''

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... mentpage=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 10:14 am

letsskiptotheleft wrote:Back in the real world.

Teresa May tonight will probably have to rely on Labour votes in the EAW debate. She's having a rather easy ride on Today at the moment. What a surprise, eh?!

But there is not going to be EAW vote today.
Posted this last night
Yvette Cooper letter to Theresa May asking her to explain why there will be no vote on the European Arrest on Monday, unless things have changed over night.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1020266 ... ing-her-to" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Morning all

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 10:16 am

RobertSnozers wrote:The thing that strikes me this morning is the many stories of real government failure obscured by the made up story of a Labour leadership crisis. It's actually getting sinister now. The obviousness of the agenda is terrifying. You can have any colour government you like as long as it's blue. The audacity of Miliband for even daring to edge back the neoliberal hegemony the tiniest amount means he must be destroyed? Good grief.

What angers me even more now is that we had an opportunity in 1997 to reverse this trend and we failed to take it. Thatcher may have started us on this road but Blair took us last the point of no return.

I like to retain some hope. Blair took us almost to the point of no return?

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 10:19 am

AngryAsWell wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:Back in the real world.

Teresa May tonight will probably have to rely on Labour votes in the EAW debate. She's having a rather easy ride on Today at the moment. What a surprise, eh?!
But there is not going to be EAW vote today.
Posted this last night
Yvette Cooper letter to Theresa May asking her to explain why there will be no vote on the European Arrest on Monday, unless things have changed over night.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1020266 ... ing-her-to" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Morning all

From what I heard on Today, the vote isn't specifically about the EAW - in fact, it doesn't actually mention it by name - but on the usual "package of measures" of which the EAW is only a part.

Lonewolfie · Post by **Lonewolfie** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 10:20 am

Anyone remember the name Sir Alan Moses? He's the new scourge of the 'free' press, the Chair of IPSO - he addressed the Society Of Editors last night...text of the speech here...

http://societyofeditors.co.uk/page-view ... rintfrom=1

choice quotes would be (IMHO)....

“Ipso wants no more than the means of ensuring it can monitor and ensure compliance with the standards you have devised and set and with which you have agreed to comply.”

"Those who have in the past had their lives turned upside down by breaches of standards to which the press has publicly committed itself, the standards in the Editors’ Code, were promised the earth…not by me, not by you but by Government."

"And so with an irony that may enter your soul, we acknowledge you are often more spinned against than spinning"

Perhaps the acronym actually stands for Independent Press Sycophants Office. I only hope it doesn't last as long as the PCC (which was brought in by Thatcher, in 1991, in response to nefarious activities by 'some of the press' and some press losing confidence in the Press Council (I couldn't possibly have any idea whatsoever who that might have been)).

Out of interest, on the same subject, I've been contacted again by the above mentioned office, requesting I detail exactly which bits of the 22 (I think it was 22 pieces in 9 days IIRC) anti-Welsh NHS pieces in the Daily Heil are untrue and that I'm actually complaining about (obviously a general 'you shouldn't let a paper lie continually like that' isn't good enough) - does anyone know if there's a resource (Welsh Government/health activist blog/someone here) that would give me the info? Im going to try to find examples, but I'll only really have what the Heil has printed, but no facts or evidence by way of rebuttal/example.

...and on the subject of the Heil and the need to be truthful, responsible and accurate...I apologise for linking this...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... warns.html

...when we also have this (which I'm sure has been linked/discussed here before) - not newsworthy enough for the MSM though I'm guessing...

http://www.welfareweekly.com/part-time- ... al-credit/

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 10:22 am

Good morning - or it should be but seeing as I'm so tired I put milk in my coffee after 20 years of drinking it black, then I can't say it's got off to the best of starts

Anyhow, I was greeted with this image on my twitter feed so I decided that if I had to see it, then you lot did too !

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 10:24 am

Good morning, everyone.

@tinyclanger2

Thanks for your kind thoughts last night (I've just caught up). Not a bad night - lots of thunder but I found that quite restful. The 'phone should start ringing just about now . . . ) And we're off . . . .

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 10:26 am

Populus:

Con 34 (+1)
Lab 36 (+1)
LD 8 (-1)
UKIP 13 (-1)
Greens 4

Populus also collate a Top 10 most noticed & this weeks (ending Nov 7):

Ebola
EU bill
Death of Lynda Bellingham
Islamic State
Virgin Galactic crash
American mid-term elections
Immigration
Hong Kong murders
Football
Tower of London poppies

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 10:29 am

RogerOThornhill wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:Back in the real world.

Teresa May tonight will probably have to rely on Labour votes in the EAW debate. She's having a rather easy ride on Today at the moment. What a surprise, eh?!
But there is not going to be EAW vote today.
Posted this last night
Yvette Cooper letter to Theresa May asking her to explain why there will be no vote on the European Arrest on Monday, unless things have changed over night.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1020266 ... ing-her-to" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Morning all
From what I heard on Today, the vote isn't specifically about the EAW - in fact, it doesn't actually mention it by name - but on the usual "package of measures" of which the EAW is only a part.

From Yvette's letter

However, the motion to be voted on in Monday’s business – published today – makes no mention of the European Arrest Warrant, instead referring only to a document that includes 11 of the 35 measures requiring further transposition into domestic law in order to meet the UK’s obligations – again not including the European Arrest Warrant, or indeed the 23 other measures being opted into by the Government.

Lonewolfie · Post by **Lonewolfie** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 10:41 am

PorFavor wrote:
RobertSnozers wrote:The thing that strikes me this morning is the many stories of real government failure obscured by the made up story of a Labour leadership crisis. It's actually getting sinister now. The obviousness of the agenda is terrifying. You can have any colour government you like as long as it's blue. The audacity of Miliband for even daring to edge back the neoliberal hegemony the tiniest amount means he must be destroyed? Good grief.

What angers me even more now is that we had an opportunity in 1997 to reverse this trend and we failed to take it. Thatcher may have started us on this road but Blair took us last the point of no return.
I like to retain some hope. Blair took us almost to the point of no return?

Yup...me too (of course, I live in Hope though

)

I think it was TGS that said many people getting into the #WebackEd twitter trend appear shocked to hear that there are Labour policies and real people in Labour. I tend to see positive in most things (for most of the time - I find it draining and detrimental to be angry all the time) so when journos blithely infer that Mr Ed has basically become the target for everyones' ire against the 'Establishment', and that's why he's useless, weird-looking and in such massive trouble with....um...well, actually, no-one in particular...I see it that they are throwing everything they possibly can - which can only backfire (there is no way of spinning, for example, the record on MPs Expenses of the 3 party leaders (and Farridge the F***wit) into anything other than Mr Ed didn't claim anything).

The Establishment are s******g bricks - the CSA isn't going anywhere...there is no 'point of no return' because I believe(TM) (and have said many times before) all polls ever conducted are/were against the privatisation agenda, against the actions of the Ultra-Neo-Conmen (and women) - the 'Thatcher Landslide' of '87, when the British public apparently gave her carte blanche to rip up everything good about society, had 58% of votes cast AGAINST the Tories. There has never (in my opinion) been any mandate for what they have done - will we begin see the connections made between Government/media noise and the cover-up of paedosadism?

For me it's a bit like what was said about the NHS - "it will never die whilst there is one person left alive who cares about it" (I think - something like that)

Never give up

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:13 am

Good-morning, everyone.

DonutHingeParty · Post by **DonutHingeParty** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:13 am

pk1 wrote:Good morning - or it should be but seeing as I'm so tired I put milk in my coffee after 20 years of drinking it black, then I can't say it's got off to the best of starts

Anyhow, I was greeted with this image on my twitter feed so I decided that if I had to see it, then you lot did too !

Interestingly the Daily Mail also had that story showing how refined a diner he was, eating in small chunks, unlike Miliband.

Not since I saw a copy of Chat magazine which said "Is Kim too thin?" and a copy of OK magazine which said "Kim struggles to lose Baby weight" using two photos from THE SAME OCCASION have I been as convinced of the mendacity of tabloid photo journalism.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:15 am

Mike Smithson ‏@MSmithsonPB · 1h1 hour ago
LAB maintains its Populus lead. No EdM effect
Con 34 (+1) Lab 36 (+1) LD 8 (-1) UKIP 13 (-1) Greens 4

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:19 am

letsskiptotheleft wrote:Back in the real world.

Teresa May tonight will probably have to rely on Labour votes in the EAW debate. She's having a rather easy ride on Today at the moment. What a surprise, eh?!

"Yvette Cooper MP, Labour’s Shadow Home Secretary has tonight written to Theresa May to ask her to explain why there will be no vote on the European Arrest Warrant in the House of Commons on Monday, and ask her to amend the motion to ensure all 35 measures being opted back into are voted on in the House on Monday."
Cooper's letter to May excerpt:

"I am seriously concerned that your decision to vote on a motion which doesn’t mention the European Arrest Warrant, simply to try and avoid a Tory party rebellion, may endanger the UK’s continued use of this vital tool. You have committed to a vote on this before the opt-in in process is finalised. The deadline for that is December 1st 2014 – when the ‘opt-out’ you enacted will come into effect. If you have not opted back into the Arrest Warrant by then, it will cease to function in the UK. Surely we must be voting on Monday to authorise its continued use, as you pledged to do?

You must urgently amend the motion to ensure all 35 measures being opted back into are voted on Monday – these vital crime fighting tools, as you have said yourself, are too important to lose.

Yours sincerely,

Rt Hon Yvette Cooper MP"

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1020266 ... ing-her-to" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Letter dated
NOVEMBER 7, 2014 (7:25 PM)

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:20 am

Morning all.

Well, that was an interesting weekend. The handful of Blairites attempting a coup proved they couldn't organise the proverbial in a brewery, the Loyal Press who stood behind them whispering words of encouragement now know social media has clipped their wings and all eyes are on Ed and Labour; that last one is a Very Good Thing as this was always going to be a week where Labour set the pace, with the EAW vote (or not, as the case may be), Ed's speech at the CBI and Clive Efford's NHS private members bill. The icing on the cake would be a better than anticipated result at Rochester and Strood, but can't have everything I guess.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:26 am

Good morning all - again.

I'm popping in to greet you again because we have just had a very very positive meeting with our new local campaign organiser for Labour - he's brilliant. Local - young - experienced in working with people and campaigns - good realistic approach - picks up quickly on opportunities and ideas - listens well before responding. Mr Riots, who is not easily enthused, came away brimming with ideas and energy (didn't happen with the previous organiser or meetings).

Now we're cooking. Got some good things planned over the next couple of months and others to be getting on with meanwhile.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:32 am

StephenDolan wrote:"Miliband is certainly unpopular, and his weaknesses have contributed to his plight; but the bigger weaknesses belong to the party as a whole. Voters threw Labour out four years ago and it has given them no good reason to change their minds. The mayhem of the past few days has been a giant displacement activity of benefit only to Labour’s opponents."

YouGov email today.

The problem with this narrative being pushed is that Labour are ahead. Still. The 'benefit' to the opponents listed has increased their percentage polling, erm not at all.

(my bold)

YouGov lose credibility making such an opinionated statement above. That's what that statement is - opinion - even "voters threw Labour out four years ago" is loaded with hostility diminishing the statement. Voters didn't return a majority government in 2010. The rest of it is blatantly ugly without connection to demonstratively factual information.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:34 am

Tim Montgomerie @montie · 2h 2 hours ago
#BiggestDeficitInEurope Osborne giving up on deficit goals is biggest story of parliament. Merits much more attention http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/c ... 253113.ece" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

As we were saying ... massive stories like this being almost completely overlooked by the media lust for Ed's blood.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:38 am

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:Morning all.

Well, that was an interesting weekend. The handful of Blairites attempting a coup proved they couldn't organise the proverbial in a brewery, the Loyal Press who stood behind them whispering words of encouragement now know social media has clipped their wings and all eyes are on Ed and Labour; that last one is a Very Good Thing as this was always going to be a week where Labour set the pace, with the EAW vote (or not, as the case may be), Ed's speech at the CBI and Clive Efford's NHS private members bill. The icing on the cake would be a better than anticipated result at Rochester and Strood, but can't have everything I guess.

Rochester isn't until *next* week

Have seen a few saying it is this Thursday, actually - maybe because the anti-Ed "plotters" were bigging it up?

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:39 am

citizenJA wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:"Miliband is certainly unpopular, and his weaknesses have contributed to his plight; but the bigger weaknesses belong to the party as a whole. Voters threw Labour out four years ago and it has given them no good reason to change their minds. The mayhem of the past few days has been a giant displacement activity of benefit only to Labour’s opponents."

YouGov email today.

The problem with this narrative being pushed is that Labour are ahead. Still. The 'benefit' to the opponents listed has increased their percentage polling, erm not at all.
(my bold)

YouGov lose credibility making such an opinionated statement above. That's what that statement is - opinion - even "voters through Labour out four years ago" is loaded with hostility diminishing the statement. Voters didn't return a majority government in 2010. The rest of it is blatantly ugly without connection to demonstratively factual information.

Completely agree. It's funny that the commentators that are the worst at consistently pushing their opinion as fact are the polling company summarisers themselves.

Q. Would you like the bedroom tax to be removed?
A. By him? No, he's far too wierd looking. Let's keep it

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:43 am

Excellent example from you describing what happens when the data collection instrument is biased, Stephen!

Q. Would you like the bedroom tax to be removed?
A. By him? No, he's far too wierd looking. Let's keep it

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:48 am

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
TheGrimSqueaker wrote:Morning all.

Well, that was an interesting weekend. The handful of Blairites attempting a coup proved they couldn't organise the proverbial in a brewery, the Loyal Press who stood behind them whispering words of encouragement now know social media has clipped their wings and all eyes are on Ed and Labour; that last one is a Very Good Thing as this was always going to be a week where Labour set the pace, with the EAW vote (or not, as the case may be), Ed's speech at the CBI and Clive Efford's NHS private members bill. The icing on the cake would be a better than anticipated result at Rochester and Strood, but can't have everything I guess.
Rochester isn't until *next* week

Have seen a few saying it is this Thursday, actually - maybe because the anti-Ed "plotters" were bigging it up?

My bad.

Just seems to have been going on for ever, maybe subconsciously I want it done with .....

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:50 am

Richard Exell ‏@RichardExell 2h2 hours ago
Strong smell of burning pants: TUC complains to statistics watchdog over George Osborne's claims on women in work - http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 47695.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

stefanstern
‏@stefanstern
@RichardExell I am going to talk to my H+S rep - me - about my working conditions now you have introduced the smell of GO's burning pants.

Richard Dunstan
1:55 AM - 10 Nov 2014
Richard Exell ‏@RichardExell 2h2 hours ago
@stefanstern Slight improvement on the smell of IDS's singed underwear, which is what we're normally complaining about

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:53 am

In politics the first rule of plotting is that you have to have a candidate, someone to replace the leader you hope to get rid of. This may not be true of FTSE 100 companies or the Premier League, where there is a large international market in vaguely plausible executive talent. Politics isn’t like that: there are rarely more than two or three options.

That's what makes the past five days of bogus melodrama over the Labour leader, Ed Miliband, so ridiculous. Thank goodness the Guardian has kept its nerve. Sure, many of the shadowy wannabe-Cassius conspirators on the Labour benches do have a candidate: the former home secretary and all-purpose good guy, Alan Johnson. But as the Fleet Street commentariat has reluctantly started to acknowledge in their long weekend features, there’s a large fly in that ointment: Johnson won’t take the job even if wrapped in pink ribbon.

He has made that clear. For the avoidance of any doubt: “I have no intention of going back to frontline politics,” Johnson said at the weekend. I think that passes the General Sherman test, set when the US civil war hero was pressed to run for president in 1864: “ I will not accept if nominated and will not serve if elected.” It’s a handy formula by which to test the weasel words brigade; many fail and would this time if pressed.

They won’t be pressed this side of the May general election, of course. As old enemies as diverse as Ken Livingstone and Neil Kinnock are united in saying Miliband will be Labour leader on polling day. Whether or not he will emerge as prime minister the next day, or in the chaotic negotiations which may follow, is more problematic. I put it no stronger. Voters are in a self-harming mood and seem determined to make sure they all lose.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/blo ... tive-party" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Michael White
10 November 2014 - 10.40

(my bold)

The Labour members, supporters & elected leaders within the Labour party aren't plotting against Ed Miliband.

I'm beside myself reading this nonsense. I'm going to write a book on propaganda use during the Tory-led Coalition Dark Ages Austerity Forever period.

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:53 am

rebeccariots2 wrote:Good morning all - again.

I'm popping in to greet you again because we have just had a very very positive meeting with our new local campaign organiser for Labour - he's brilliant. Local - young - experienced in working with people and campaigns - good realistic approach - picks up quickly on opportunities and ideas - listens well before responding. Mr Riots, who is not easily enthused, came away brimming with ideas and energy (didn't happen with the previous organiser or meetings).

Now we're cooking. Got some good things planned over the next couple of months and others to be getting on with meanwhile.

Sounds great RR2. Harness the energy of the young & use it to good effect.

I've been thinking about the Labour MPs who are said to be worried about holding their seats & using that as their basis for attacking Ed from within.

Surely it is down to those MPs to work a bit harder in their constituencies, solving whatever local difficulties they can & generally attracting a local following just as - dare I say it - Douglas Carswell has in Clacton.

Lazy MPs deserve the opprobrium the electorate show them.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 11:58 am

Mark Ferguson @Markfergusonuk · 3h 3 hours ago
This morning I’m making a sandwich. Boring thing to tweet, but I just wanted the Daily Mail to know

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:03 pm

pk1 wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:Good morning all - again.

I'm popping in to greet you again because we have just had a very very positive meeting with our new local campaign organiser for Labour - he's brilliant. Local - young - experienced in working with people and campaigns - good realistic approach - picks up quickly on opportunities and ideas - listens well before responding. Mr Riots, who is not easily enthused, came away brimming with ideas and energy (didn't happen with the previous organiser or meetings).

Now we're cooking. Got some good things planned over the next couple of months and others to be getting on with meanwhile.
Sounds great RR2. Harness the energy of the young & use it to good effect.

I've been thinking about the Labour MPs who are said to be worried about holding their seats & using that as their basis for attacking Ed from within.

Surely it is down to those MPs to work a bit harder in their constituencies, solving whatever local difficulties they can & generally attracting a local following just as - dare I say it - Douglas Carswell has in Clacton.

Lazy MPs deserve the opprobrium the electorate show them.

(my bold)

I agree with you & your post wholeheartedly. But what attack of Ed from within the Labour party from which MPs? There's no evidence of any internal discord from Labour MPs about Miliband; if there is, it's not been credibly substantiated.

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:04 pm

The originator of the #WeBackEd was invited onto todays Daily Politics !

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What a bloody shame they invited her on such short notice that she can't do it but all the same, doesn't this just demonstrate how successful the campaign has been - a campaign that btw, is STILL trending at No 3 in the UK as I type ! JUST WOW !!

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:05 pm

: DailyMailSandwichGate.jpg (43.16 KiB) Viewed 15073 times

https://twitter.com/gabyhinsliff/with_replies

Gaby Hinsliff @gabyhinsliff · 2h 2 hours ago
What the Internet really needs now is a picture of Ed Miliband MAKING a bacon sandwich badly. Using two Daily Mails as bread. #sandwichgate

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:13 pm

citizenJA wrote:
pk1 wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:Good morning all - again.

I'm popping in to greet you again because we have just had a very very positive meeting with our new local campaign organiser for Labour - he's brilliant. Local - young - experienced in working with people and campaigns - good realistic approach - picks up quickly on opportunities and ideas - listens well before responding. Mr Riots, who is not easily enthused, came away brimming with ideas and energy (didn't happen with the previous organiser or meetings).

Now we're cooking. Got some good things planned over the next couple of months and others to be getting on with meanwhile.
Sounds great RR2. Harness the energy of the young & use it to good effect.

I've been thinking about the Labour MPs who are said to be worried about holding their seats & using that as their basis for attacking Ed from within.

Surely it is down to those MPs to work a bit harder in their constituencies, solving whatever local difficulties they can & generally attracting a local following just as - dare I say it - Douglas Carswell has in Clacton.

Lazy MPs deserve the opprobrium the electorate show them.
(my bold)

I agree with you & your post wholeheartedly. But what attack of Ed from within the Labour party from which MPs? There's no evidence of any internal discord from Labour MPs about Miliband; if there is, it's not been credibly substantiated.

Yes, there are Labour MPs against him - a few. And we have a good idea of their identities, mostly.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:26 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
citizenJA wrote:
pk1 wrote: Sounds great RR2. Harness the energy of the young & use it to good effect.

I've been thinking about the Labour MPs who are said to be worried about holding their seats & using that as their basis for attacking Ed from within.

Surely it is down to those MPs to work a bit harder in their constituencies, solving whatever local difficulties they can & generally attracting a local following just as - dare I say it - Douglas Carswell has in Clacton.

Lazy MPs deserve the opprobrium the electorate show them.
(my bold)

I agree with you & your post wholeheartedly. But what attack of Ed from within the Labour party from which MPs? There's no evidence of any internal discord from Labour MPs about Miliband; if there is, it's not been credibly substantiated.
Yes, there are Labour MPs against him - a few. And we have a good idea of their identities, mostly.

Thank you, AK. Yes.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:26 pm

From the Guardian:

"The strong language used by Kinnock upset critics"

Aww, diddums, if they are that upset maybe they are too sensitive and should bugger off once and for all. Kinnock had his faults, but Austin and Danzcuk ain't fit to lace his boots.

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:29 pm

Labour Whips ‏@labourwhips 4m4 minutes ago
UQ granted to @edballsmp on gov’s agreement on EU budget surcharge Wonder if @George_Osborne will come to tell us what a great deal he got?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:33 pm

letsskiptotheleft wrote:From the Guardian:

"The strong language used by Kinnock upset critics"

Aww, diddums, if they are that upset maybe they are too sensitive and should bugger off once and for all. Kinnock had his faults, but Austin and Danzcuk ain't fit to lace his boots.

He told someone to fuck off? Good on him.

I've used profanity in this post & I accept it's removal and/or disciplinary action.

Do I need to get permission to post Kinnock's strong language? Is it copyrighted? Please let me know. Thank you.

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:33 pm

I'm gathering from twitter that Andrew Neil has quoted Cons being ahead in Poll of polls for first time in many months.

Fine & dandy if it was true but this revealing exchange demonstrably shows that it isn't :

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Stephen Bush ‏@stephenkb 3h3 hours ago
@tnewtondunn No, that's my mistake. One of the YouGovs from last week counted twice. Will have a correction tomorrow. Sorry.

Never mind though - the 'error' gave the media an opportunity to lie with the truth only becoming apparent after the lie has been told.

The truth is here:

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FFS !!

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:37 pm

AngryAsWell wrote:Mike Smithson ‏@MSmithsonPB · 1h1 hour ago
LAB maintains its Populus lead. No EdM effect
Con 34 (+1) Lab 36 (+1) LD 8 (-1) UKIP 13 (-1) Greens 4

Smithson must be gutted.

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:38 pm

R5 has just mentioned (in passing) that the EAW will not be debated - but will be part of the vote (?)
what's going on here?

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:43 pm

Ben Bradshaw has just run rings around Jo Coburn on Daily Politics, it was a joy to watch. Bearing in mind (as he pointed out himself) that he voted for David, not Ed, in the leadership election it was a significant performance; no longer can the media claim, as Coburn tried to, that Labour are "wheeling out" the loyalists - as Bradshaw showed, baring the "serial malcontents" pretty much everybody in the PLP is now a loyalist!

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Mon 10 Nov, 2014 12:46 pm

yahyah wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:Mike Smithson ‏@MSmithsonPB · 1h1 hour ago
LAB maintains its Populus lead. No EdM effect
Con 34 (+1) Lab 36 (+1) LD 8 (-1) UKIP 13 (-1) Greens 4

Smithson must be gutted.

I think that is slightly harsh, tbh - he has more time for Ed than much of the MSM media (not saying much, admittedly)

And, even given the correction, where has this "poll of polls" come from? Fairly obvious it doesn't include this weekend's surveys......