Thursday 29th September 2022

Post by **refitman** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 6:46 am

Morning all.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 9:24 am

Oh dear...car crash doesn't cover it.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 9:47 am

A week or so back there was a Spiked article about Gordon Brown's idea of abolishing the HoL and giving more power to local communities and elected regional assemblies - and it was strongly against the idea which I thought was a bit odd at the time given they are supposedly all for democracy.

But it makes sense if you think of having local consent for fracking - can't have stronger local government where they might vote the idea down.

https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/09/2 ... he-people/

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 9:49 am

Morning refit
I switched off Toady BEFORE the chrisphilp creature came on , and left it off . NOW to listen to Roger's from Lancashire !!!!

@gilsey -- thanks for that NLR " False Compromise " article, it's very good !
https://newleftreview.org/sidecar/posts/294
No fun reading about how many lefty Labourites honestly believed that appeasement of the AS unreason would make it go away . At the end of the second AJ video James Schneider 'explains' how impossible it was to reject the IHRA 'definition' . I wonder if Clive Lewis would have gone along with the BoD's Ten Pledges during the leadership contest ? I rather think not . Still Thornberry and RLB did , to their shame .

@AK

" I mean you do know that, as I said yesterday, the Blairite true believers are whingeing like mad that Starmer has "lurched to the left"? "

Yes. Well exposed in Monday's article at The Times showing the pressures SKS is under from the dug up Blairites and Brownites who are viscerally opposed to the the Green crap of Ed Miliband , and that nonsense about inequality

Strivers Not Skivers !

less-dissent-but-doubts-still-linger-about-direction-of-party

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/less ... -0db9dc7ql

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 9:50 am

Ouch.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 9:57 am

Did we see this...most amusing.

Post by **refitman** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 9:58 am

Oh Paul

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 10:06 am

RogerOThornhill wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 9:57 am Did we see this...most amusing.

Amusing, then tragic.
Even Cummings said she was bonkers, but did they listen?

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 10:08 am

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 10:13 am

If you look at the thread it started with telling Paul Mason where to get off.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:00 am

Teesside is where the Tories enjoyed some massive electoral successes recently. Maybe they are bored with winning now.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 12:39 pm

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 1:52 pm

Shooting fish in a barrel of course, but still.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 1:57 pm

WATO 13.08 on — had serious extracts from those ~~tame~~ brutal provincial journos

/surprise>

Balance provided by Conservative Home and the Legatum Institute

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 2:31 pm

I can confirm from watching regional telly in the NW that their journalists are often harder work for pols than the Westminster lobby lot. Most of the hard times Johnson got in the last GE campaign came from non-London hacks.

Meanwhile the likes of Pesto and Kuensservativeberg had non-existent "scoops" like MoMeNtUm ThUgZ rOuGh Up ToRy PaRtY WoRkErS.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 2:45 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 2:31 pm I can confirm from watching regional telly in the NW that their journalists are often harder work for pols than the Westminster lobby lot. Most of the hard times Johnson got in the last GE campaign came from non-London hacks.
Meanwhile the likes of Pesto and Kuensservativeberg had non-existent "scoops" like MoMeNtUm ThUgZ rOuGh Up ToRy PaRtY WoRkErS.

Like money there is plenty of talent around , but it's also in the wrong places .

I wonder how many provincials you could pay for the price of one Pesto/kuenssberg ?

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:12 pm

For the hell of it

Call an immediate general election to end the chaos of the current government

Call an immediate general election so that the people can decide who should lead us through the unprecedented crises threatening the UK.

More detailsSign this petition
<b> 96,841 signatures </b>

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/619781

PS I know times are grim for so very many, this is probably just light relief

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:16 pm

To be honest I was a bit disappointed with the Radio Leeds interview. I'm sure many of us in this city would have liked her to explain why she made going to school in a leafy middle class suburb like Roundhay sound like she was in the Bronx in the 1980's. Still I guess there's only so much of her mad ravings that you can deal with in 5 minutes.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:26 pm

We can’t afford Progress towards the FREE PORT to be halted by some nanny state health and ‘environmental’ concerns

Joe Redfern, a marine biologist and fisherman added: “The results from the investigations should change the way we think about not only the recent mass mortaliity events that have impacted our coastline but also the way we think about dredging and marine pollution all over the world.”

The fresh evidence follows an Independent investigation revealing claims from officials that they had been subjected to political pressure to push forward the algal bloom hypothesis when, in their view, further investigation was required.

One official, speaking on condition of anonymity said in July: “We were not confident that the algal bloom was the absolute cause in the manner it has been presented by politicians.”

A second said: “There was clear political pressure brought on us to just find an answer and then the least politically sensitive hypothesis was given most prominence.”

Activists and the fishing community had raised concerns that pyridine left by historical heavy industry on the Tees could have been disturbed by dredging – lifiting sediment from the seabed to deepen channels for vessels or building work– associated with the management of Teesport, run by PD Ports and ultimately backed by a financial firm with $725bn (£613bn) in assets under management. PD Ports has said it does not believe dredging is to blame.”

To hell with facts and science, it's what we believe that counts !

climate-change/crabs-die-off-tees-pyridine-algal-bloom
https://www.independent.co.uk/climate-c ... 77874.html

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:27 pm

The Telegraph Opinion section today is an absolute bin fire.

On the one hand you've got Allister Heath telling Truss to hold her nerve while still claiming the 'mini-budget' was a triumph, while on the other you've got John Curtice predicting a majority Labour government, an article calling Truss and Kwarteng idiots saying their stupidity is nothing like Thatcherism, and another predicting a massive housing price crash and doom for buy to let landlords (sob).

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:38 pm

Tom Forth @thomasforth
Another fantastic thing. The fact that thousands of clams and crabs are washing up dead on beaches around Teesside every day is huge news there. It's a national story on the environment, freeports, trust in government, and sewage. And the PM didn't know.
Quote Tweet

Kevin Marks @kevinmarks 6h
“What about the sea life deaths?”
Truss completely blanks - I'll have to look into that

On Spring tides thousands here follow the tide out to pick up or dig for clams and other food .

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:40 pm

@Sky -- that's from the Firefox paywall- penetrator ?

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:48 pm

frog222 wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:26 pm To hell with facts and science, it's what we believe that counts !

Thanks for the article Froggy. When asked about the marine die off this morning Truss took one of her long pauses before having to admit she was clueless.

Liz Truss admits she knows nothing about marine life deaths in the North East in an uncomfortable BBC interview

https://ukdaily.news/teesside/liz-truss ... 14289.html

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:58 pm

frog222 wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:40 pm @Sky -- that's from the Firefox paywall- penetrator ?

Actually the Telegraph paywall is so amateurishly flimsy you don't really need any extra software to circumvent it but this is great for genuinely effective paywalls like the FT, Economist, Spectator, etc.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-GB/firefo ... lls-clean/

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 5:36 pm

Wow.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 6:03 pm

Sky'sGoneOut wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:58 pm
frog222 wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 3:40 pm @Sky -- that's from the Firefox paywall- penetrator ?
Actually the Telegraph paywall is so amateurishly flimsy you don't really need any extra software to circumvent it but this is great for genuinely effective paywalls like the FT, Economist, Spectator, etc.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-GB/firefo ... lls-clean/

HOHO, merci Sky !

Michael Gove’s Tory conference speaking spree a headache for Liz Truss

Former levelling up minister, an arch-critic of Prime Minister’s economic policy, to speak at no fewer than eight meetings
By Dominic Penna and Nick Gutteridge 29 September 2022 • 5:08pm

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 6:07 pm

Wow indeed, I've never seen a poll like that in my life. Survation have Labour 21 ahead and Redfield & Wilton 17 (the biggest Labour lead they've ever recorded).

A lot of clenched Tory sphincters right now.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 6:29 pm

The only petitions I ever sign , for fun as much a s anything ...

111,856 signatures

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/619781

Change !

112,100 signatures

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 6:32 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 5:36 pm Wow

Recall the Crocodile Dundee scene "call that a knife"?

You think that's 20 points ahead, *I'll* show you 20 points ahead!

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 7:33 pm

Main headline article at the Telegraph as of this moment is...

Liz Truss is embarked on a course of sheer madness, taking the Bank of England with her

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/20 ... -england1/

And this is from their international business editor.

Either this is all going to calm down or Truss is going to have the shortest reign of any UK Prime Minister in history.

And it shows no sign of calming down.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 7:35 pm

Paul Scully draws a straw so short it needs an electron microscope to be seen.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 8:10 pm

Read some stuff earlier on one of the financial sites that KK is going to do an Osborne 2.0 austerity.

That's if he's still in post /unchained by Exterior Reality ...

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 10:06 pm

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:13 pm

Question Time review from Manchester where a lass in the audience said that two weeks ago she was offered a mortgage at 4.5 % interest as a first time buyer only to have that offer retracted this week and replaced with one at 10.5% as a direct result of the Truss/Kwarteng clown show last Friday meaning she could no longer afford to buy.

For the party responsible for that we had Paul Scully. Paul was extremely animated this evening, whether that was due to nerves or chemical assistance it was hard to say. Shrugging off the inevitable round of laughter that greeted him he launched into a defence of the government's economic plans which consisted entirely of saying nobody understands what the government is doing. As if that was everyone else's fault. He didn't just say this once but repeatedly as if somehow it didn't reflect badly on the imbeciles now running his party. Last time I checked it was moody teenagers who were supposed to lament that nobody understands them, not governments. He then went on to attempt the Redwood defence which is that all of this would have happened anyway, which got short shrift, before saying to the lady mentioned above that she should try again for a mortgage in a couple of weeks once everything has calmed down. I mean what the fuck? Everyone knows the Bank of England are going to raise interest rates, what difference is a couple of weeks going to make? Absolutely fucking deluded. I really hope for his sake he was high because the alternative is that this government has completely lost touch with reality.

For Labour we had Bridget Phillipson. I've been critical of Bridget's QT appearances in the past but tonight she got it spot on. Barely concealed fury. If looks could kill Paul Scully, Anne McElvoy and a couple of members of the audience would now be pushing up daisies. She radiated indignant anger and if ever there was a time for it on QT it was tonight. She didn't get to say much but she didn't need to, rarely have I seen a more effective example of seething.

For the Economist we had Anne McElvoy. We all know Anne and the Economist really don't want to be attacking free market Tories and she did her best to point out that she approved of most of the 'mini-budget'. For her it was all about the timing and the political acceptability of it all, not the substance but how it looked. Which is odd because it was entirely uncosted yet she criticised Labour (quite rightly) for some dubious claims about how they would pay for things. She certainly seemed a more reluctant critic of the government than her newspaper.

For (the CBI?) we had Karan Bilimoria. Karan wants us to borrow hundreds of billions of pounds more to prop up businesses. Like McElvoy he broadly welcomed the measures in the 'mini-budget' then went on to explain what a great bloke Keir Starmer is and how business could trust Labour again after that dreadful rotter Corbyn. It was an odd and confusing performance.

For some reason we also had Richard Bacon. Richard essentially sat and poked Paul Scully with a stick for an hour. Good lad.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:24 pm

(For anyone wondering QT is shown live on the iPlayer at 8 o'clock these days. You can pause it at the start then watch it at your leisure, hence the earlier reviews).

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:34 pm

Just looking at #bbcqt on twitter.

Who is this little weasel faced cvnt? He looks like alan sugar's left bollock.

I'll spare you the pic of Scully the tweeter was commenting on.

Post by **refitman** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:40 pm

If BBC presenters are talking back, then the Tories really are in the shit.

Post by **refitman** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:41 pm

Sky'sGoneOut wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:24 pm (For anyone wondering QT is shown live on the iPlayer at 8 o'clock these days. You can pause it at the start then watch it at your leisure, hence the earlier reviews).

Weird way to phrase "weekly torture".

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:46 pm

Sky'sGoneOut wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:13 pm Question Time review from Manchester where a lass in the audience said that two weeks ago she was offered a mortgage at 4.5 % interest as a first time buyer only to have that offer retracted this week and replaced with one at 10.5% as a direct result of the Truss/Kwarteng clown show last Friday meaning she could no longer afford to buy.

I saw that bit, there was an audible sharp intake of breath from the audience.

Tories are done, but how long do we have to live with the smouldering ruins.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:51 pm

From another Telegraph article...

Four other pollsters found big Labour leads. People Polling, for GB News, put the party 30 points ahead, with Survation recording a 21-point advantage, Deltapoll 19 points and Redfield & Wilton 17.

I can't seem to find this GB news poll, mind you I am a bit pissed.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 12:10 am

There's a meme on twitter

“what tweet can you never forget that makes you laugh every time”

I didn't have one but I do now, those seat projections

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 12:17 am

gilsey wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:46 pm I saw that bit, there was an audible sharp intake of breath from the audience.

Tories are done, but how long do we have to live with the smouldering ruins.

Indeed, a murmur of horror. We've predicted doom for the Tories so many times before but this feels different. They've really fucked up this time. The Bank of England has only protected the bond market for the next couple of weeks, interest rate rises are coming, and what options do the Tories have left? Real term wage and benefits cuts while they spunk money on millionaires? It's as if they're doing everything they possibly can to categorically disprove decades of right wing economic theory in one fell swoop.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 12:33 am

refitman wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:41 pm Weird way to phrase "weekly torture".

Sober it would be torture. An excess of alcohol magically makes it (along with many other things) a lot more fun and interesting than they actually are.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 12:34 am

Sky'sGoneOut wrote: ↑Thu 29 Sep, 2022 11:51 pm From another Telegraph article...

Four other pollsters found big Labour leads. People Polling, for GB News, put the party 30 points ahead, with Survation recording a 21-point advantage, Deltapoll 19 points and Redfield & Wilton 17.
I can't seem to find this GB news poll, mind you I am a bit pissed.

They usually actually publish on Fridays.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 1:16 am

AnatolyKasparov wrote: ↑Fri 30 Sep, 2022 12:34 am They usually actually publish on Fridays.

That should be fun.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 1:45 am

I'm beginning to feel old. I mean fucking Jeff Bridges is in a TV series called 'The old man'. Last time I checked he was The Dude or stuck in a computer game or was some alien love interest.

I don't feel like I'm getting any older, at least inside, and yet everyone around me seems to be ageing. It's weird.

Is this normal?

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 2:04 am

You are only as old as you feel. Or something.

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 3:21 am

Sky'sGoneOut · Post by **Sky'sGoneOut** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 3:27 am

Is...is that Ron Jeremy?

I do apologise.

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Fri 30 Sep, 2022 6:04 am

Sky'sGoneOut wrote: ↑Fri 30 Sep, 2022 1:45 am I'm beginning to feel old. I mean fucking Jeff Bridges is in a TV series called 'The old man'. Last time I checked he was The Dude or stuck in a computer game or was some alien love interest.
I don't feel like I'm getting any older, at least inside, and yet everyone around me seems to be ageing. It's weird.
Is this normal?

75 a week ago, most of the time I don't feel a day over 17 ... but those others keep on dropping off !