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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:36 am 
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Re Crosby:

Found it!

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/nov/23/guardian-profile-lynton-crosby

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:40 am 
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Found this.
Hadn't kept the link so I hope you will forgive me for printing it in full...So much foul, polluted water under the bridge in such a short time it takes your breath away.

Campaigners in Whitehall point out that George Osborne is ignoring the 'elephant in the room' – tax havens.
The British media is now in moving-on mode on the issue of tax havens. It would do well to pause, be less excitable about the pantomime of brand shaming and actually examine the depth to which tax havenry is hardwired into our economic model and columns of state.
Among the millions of column inches generated in the past two years on this issue, three words you will not find in sequential order are "City of London". Extraordinary, when one considers the critical advantage our tax haven network offers the preponderance of offshore lawyers and accountants that cluster the Square Mile, siphoning off the rewards of capital flight. And that network that is growing, not receding.
Back in 2008, in the epicentre of the financial crisis, the City of London – mindful of impending scrutiny and possible regulation on an unprecedented scale – set up a new identity, "City UK", to promote its affairs and sanctioned an immediate £500,000 per annum grant. This body is "independent" and private and so it's exempt from freedom of information legislation, but City of London Corporation heads sit at the top of its governing bodies, beside the major players in global tax avoidance such as Ernst and Young, Deloitte and KPMG.
As established UK tax havens are politely asked to show the world some leg on transparency, "City UK", with its unparalleled expertise in the ways of the offshore world, is busily setting up a new "global financial centre" in Nairobi, Kenya. It has appealed to City financial identities to assist in "derivative securities, securities market and the regulatory and administrative environment". Author and tax haven authority Nicholas Shaxson has appraised the development very clearly. This development has not been reported by our news media.
Hence David Cameron is enjoying something of a press glow; his management of the rolling tax avoidance scandal has been first-class, for two reasons. First, he is always quickest out of the traps to condemn those exposed as "tax dodgers", often deploying language such as "repellent" or "repugnant".
The fact, his government legislated to make tax avoidance far easier for large transnationals – even exclusively consulting those holding hundreds of tax haven subsidiaries on how laws should look within that process – is again overlooked by most media. Cameron simply takes credit for deploying strong adjectives.
Second, most likely due to his twin vulnerabilities of a personal offshore inheritance and poor legislative record, he is careful to always be seen to "own" the issue; never on the back foot reacting, always proactive in hunting down the bad guys; even confronting our own union flag-flying network of tax havens with his recent "clampdown" agreement.
The premier of the Cayman Islands – the UK territory recently described by the UN adviser on economics, Professor Jeffrey Sachs, as "a mortal threat to the world economy" – made clear after the meeting just how much of a clampdown had been secured: "All of us have the ability to insert reservations in whatever agreements we reach and we get to negotiate each of the individual agreements with each country."
This view was further verified by a rare insight from a UK journalist, Channel 4 News correspondent Gary Gibbon, who managed to accost the deputy premier of the Turks and Caicos Islands, who explained that in terms of the deal: "We cannot say today we will get that because there will be a lot of push-back from companies that have beneficial ownership."
These comments, completely at odds with how the "deal" was broadly reported, are compounded by the premise – upheld by almost all British news media – that the territories are independent in the first place. Sticking with Cayman,during 2012 while I was making my documentary, its sovereign budget, drafted by a directly elected ministerial cabinet was twice rejected by the Foreign Office in London.
Furthermore, when McKeeva Bush, the incumbent premier of the island, was arrested for alleged corruption days after a meeting with Cameron in London, the Foreign Office-appointed "governor" imposed a replacement without any electoral process or consultation with the Cayman people. The move was warmly welcomed by the Cayman financial services industry and the replacement remained in post for six months.
So Whitehall can reject a sovereign budget and impose a head of state, but when it comes to global tax negotiations it is on its knees, tinkering and appealing for co-operation. This is further fudge. If the political will existed, all of the UK territories could be forced to comply with any regulations in a heartbeat. They will not be, because despite nearly half of the 73 jurisdictions listed in the global Financial Secrecy Index being directly connected to the UK, these places are too important to the City and the economic model successive UK governments have been devoted to.
That is the elephant in the room of the UK tax debate. And all the while the City enjoys an estimated £93m lobbying war chest, it is safe to assume that Cameron will remain reluctant to budge it.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:47 am 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
But.....but.......Ed once looked a bit funny eating a bacon sandwich, you know! And *that* is AMAZINGLY IMPORTANT :wall:


Really? When was that? Reports on it must have been well tucked away. I didn't hear or see anything about it . . .


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:48 am 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Where is it? North of Manchester, south of Rochdale basically.

He was in the HoC just two days ago voting against the "bedroom tax" - this has come right out of the blue despite his age :(

RIP.


RIP indeed, he was a nice bloke. H&M is right next door to Bury North, on the other side of the M66. To say that it's a bit down on its luck is no great overstatement. Middleton is where Avro used to have a plant pumping out Lancasters, and Middleton itself (as well as Heywood) is covered by Rochdale MBC. That council's now Labour but for some years was a FibDem hold, until the Rochdale Fibs imploded spectacularly. Middleton returns a mix of councillors mostly Labour (now) but a smattering of Tories. The same cannot be said under any circumstances about Heywood, where people greet you with "gimme six". It's a weird little place - you can buy Confederate regalia and flags in a shop on the high street - and the pubs are something to behold.

A few years back Ms.Remarx and her lecturer mate Sue met up in the Dunne's store in Heywood (why it's there,I'll never know; even M&S would look less out of place), and I tagged along. When they'd gutted the stock (10 mins, tops), Sue, the niave that she is, suggested we drop into one of the local pubs for a quick drink. Walking past the relative sanity of Wetherspoon's (bouncers on the door), her eye alighted on a pub further down the pavement and in she went.

Inside it was rather like of scene out of Dante's Inferno, except with grubbier decor and a disco ball on the ceiling. It was also full of extremely pissed septuagenarian and octogenarian blokes - this is about 6.30pm on a Thursday - and their dodgy looking, equally aged and equally pissed 'girls', as they referred to them. At least the beer was cheap, however even that wasn't an inducement to stay (as an anthropologist, there's always that urge), and when one particularly repulsive woman in her mid 70s (estimate) started to dance in a comically unsexy way, to a slow handclap accompaniment from the men (and I swear I could hear top and bottom sets also rattling away in the mix), I decided it was time to sup up and go.

That's Heywood.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:05 pm 
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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2746370/Revealed-New-boss-investigation-VIP-child-abuse-claims-linked-Leon-Brittan-The-Mail-On-Sunday-exposes-family-friendship-SECOND-inquiry-chief-ex-MP-accused-abuse-file-cover-up.html

YahYah, have you seen this?

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:06 pm 
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rebeccariots2 wrote:
Quote:
Nick Sutton ‏@suttonnick 11m
Here's @YouGov data suggesting LibDems most liked to have filmed or photographed themselves during sex via @hopisen pic.twitter.com/GtpckclfYK


Eh?
(Or should that be uurggh?)



Why is that not a surprise :lol:

[Thanks, that cheered me up].


Last edited by yahyah on Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:10 pm 
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@Ernst:

That's Heywood.

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Sounds like my kind of town 8-) :lol:

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:20 pm 
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ohsocynical wrote:
Found this.
Hadn't kept the link so I hope you will forgive me for printing it in full...So much foul, polluted water under the bridge in such a short time it takes your breath away.

Campaigners in Whitehall point out that George Osborne is ignoring the 'elephant in the room' – tax havens.
The British media is now in moving-on mode on the issue of tax havens. It would do well to pause, be less excitable about the pantomime of brand shaming and actually examine the depth to which tax havenry is hardwired into our economic model and columns of state.
...

Here's the original article: http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... ay-city-uk


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:26 pm 
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rebeccariots2 wrote:
@ Ephemerid

Just to clarify that I also think Carwyn Jones is a very canny politician. My post about him not needing to do much wasn't a criticism - more saying that the waters seem to be parting for Wales to benefit from what is going on re Scotland and, yes, he's not slow off the mark to point that out.

Osborne is having one of those 'give away' mornings by the sound of it. People aren't daft though. They're not going to be fooled by the promise of new powers for Scotland, or future rail price freezes either.



Apologies, rebeccar - I'm so annoyed that I have not expressed myself well.

Westminster is now in breach of the Edinburgh Agreement - the rules imposed on the Scots by that agreement are that no policy announcements etc. should be made 28 days before the referendum as it states in item 29 of that agreement; the government agreed to adhere to the restrictions as set out therein and they have now breached it more than once.

If the agreement is now null and void, in theory so is the result of the referendum - if it is not conducted as agreed, it's wrong.
Cameron and the rest of them have, by making all these promises while the voting is in progress, interfered with the conduct of the referendum and that is absolutely disgraceful.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:36 pm 
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ephemerid wrote:

Osborne has added his two-pennorth to the many and various bribes emanating from Westminster. It's reprehensible behaviour.

The UK has rules regarding "electoral purdah" which apply here - but only to the Yes campaign.
I am aware that this is a referendum and not an election, but Sturgeon has stated that the terms of the referendum include no further policy announcements - a condition not imposed on the UK government.

I was already pro-independence - now I am absolutely for it and I really hope the Scots vote Yes in large numbers.
I don't care if Westminster insists this will cause a constitutional crisis - with this mob in charge perhaps that's what we need to clean up politics in the UK and move towards a federal arrangement that involves PR and the abolition of the Lords.


The Scottish Referendum Act "...prevents Scottish Ministers and public bodies from publishing material (other than in response to specific requests for information) which deals with any issues raised by the referendum question or puts any arguments for or against any outcome, or is designed to encourage voting at the referendum."

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Resource/0045/00458330.pdf

I haven't noticed any marked absence of Scottish ministers in the media recently. While I have no wish to defend Osborne, he could argue that the 'yes' campaign have constantly asked for a positive reason for staying in the union and he's now answering the question. I know it's a flimsy excuse but the point I'm making is that neither side are sticking to the rules.

While a 'yes' vote may or may not cause a constitutional crisis in the remaining UK, it would (imo) cause chaos in Scotland.

We have a unicameral government in Scotland - effectively an elected dictatorship. While I would agree that the HoL is in dire need of reform (or replacement), it does have a place as a regulatory body (of sorts). Nobody, to my knowledge, has suggested a second house in an independent Scotland.

The 'yes' campaign has centered around an anti-Tory stance which is extremely short-sighted. The Tory government is not a permanent Westminster fixture and it is by no means certain that there wouldn't be right wing governments in the future in Scotland (look at the number of Scottish Tories in pre-Thatcher governments).

On another forum I asked two questions:
1. What problems does Scotland have, which apply to no other part of the UK?
2. What positive, achievable, benefit would independence bring?
I never did get an answer!

I agree that a federal UK is probably the best way forward, by the way.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:41 pm 
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Thoughtful post Eric. Thanks.

Must say, the idea that if Yes loses we will have months of 'it ain't fair' is quite depressing.
[But suppose same likely if No loses too].

Also, are the media getting a bit hysterical ? - one poll does not a Salmond triumph make.


Last edited by yahyah on Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:45 pm 
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Does anyone know when the actual result of the Scottish Independence Referendum is likely to be known, please? (I'm probably being bone-idle here - the information must be relatively easily available somewhere. Sorry.)


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:56 pm 
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PorFavor wrote:
Does anyone know when the actual result of the Scottish Independence Referendum is likely to be known, please? (I'm probably being bone-idle here - the information must be relatively easily available somewhere. Sorry.)

The Chief Counting Officer estimates the results will be known early morning of the 19th: http://www.electionsscotland.info/emb/d ... referendum (pdf) pp14.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 12:57 pm 
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yahyah wrote:
Thoughtful post Eric. Thanks.

Must say, the idea that if Yes loses we will have months of 'it ain't fair' is quite depressing.

Also, are the media getting a bit hysterical - one poll does not a Salmond win make.


There is already a hint of an "it ain't fair" argument brewing:

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/scottish-independence-vote-rigging-fears-1-3533762

While I suspect the specific instances of children being on the electoral register are probably clerical errors, a surge in registrations 2 weeks before the vote must put any validation process under strain.

One can only hope that the result is decisive enough (either way) do discount any allegations of malpractice.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:02 pm 
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refitman wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
Does anyone know when the actual result of the Scottish Independence Referendum is likely to be known, please? (I'm probably being bone-idle here - the information must be relatively easily available somewhere. Sorry.)

The Chief Counting Officer estimates the results will be known early morning of the 19th: http://www.electionsscotland.info/emb/d ... referendum (pdf) pp14.


Ah - thank you very much!


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:15 pm 
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PorFavor wrote:
refitman wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
Does anyone know when the actual result of the Scottish Independence Referendum is likely to be known, please? (I'm probably being bone-idle here - the information must be relatively easily available somewhere. Sorry.)

The Chief Counting Officer estimates the results will be known early morning of the 19th: http://www.electionsscotland.info/emb/d ... referendum (pdf) pp14.


Ah - thank you very much!


STV have said they will have through-the-night coverage:

http://news.stv.tv/scotland/290750-stv-announces-extensive-overnight-independence-referendum-coverage/

but the BBC may have problems:

http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/sep/03/bbc-strike-could-disrupt-scottish-independence-referendum-coverage

With only 32 regional results to cover, I don't envy the presenters who have to fill in the gaps.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:23 pm 
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@Refitman:


Thanks :)

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:32 pm 
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ErnstRemarx wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Where is it? North of Manchester, south of Rochdale basically.

He was in the HoC just two days ago voting against the "bedroom tax" - this has come right out of the blue despite his age :(

RIP.


RIP indeed, he was a nice bloke. H&M is right next door to Bury North, on the other side of the M66. To say that it's a bit down on its luck is no great overstatement. Middleton is where Avro used to have a plant pumping out Lancasters, and Middleton itself (as well as Heywood) is covered by Rochdale MBC. That council's now Labour but for some years was a FibDem hold, until the Rochdale Fibs imploded spectacularly. Middleton returns a mix of councillors mostly Labour (now) but a smattering of Tories. The same cannot be said under any circumstances about Heywood, where people greet you with "gimme six". It's a weird little place - you can buy Confederate regalia and flags in a shop on the high street - and the pubs are something to behold.

A few years back Ms.Remarx and her lecturer mate Sue met up in the Dunne's store in Heywood (why it's there,I'll never know; even M&S would look less out of place), and I tagged along. When they'd gutted the stock (10 mins, tops), Sue, the niave that she is, suggested we drop into one of the local pubs for a quick drink. Walking past the relative sanity of Wetherspoon's (bouncers on the door), her eye alighted on a pub further down the pavement and in she went.

Inside it was rather like of scene out of Dante's Inferno, except with grubbier decor and a disco ball on the ceiling. It was also full of extremely pissed septuagenarian and octogenarian blokes - this is about 6.30pm on a Thursday - and their dodgy looking, equally aged and equally pissed 'girls', as they referred to them. At least the beer was cheap, however even that wasn't an inducement to stay (as an anthropologist, there's always that urge), and when one particularly repulsive woman in her mid 70s (estimate) started to dance in a comically unsexy way, to a slow handclap accompaniment from the men (and I swear I could hear top and bottom sets also rattling away in the mix), I decided it was time to sup up and go.

That's Heywood.


Just a little bit cruel & harsh there Ernst, being in Bury South I'm just "a cross the way" (almost walking distance) from Heywood and although the town centre is a bit yucky (as is Middleton) the outer areas can be quite pleasant. Heywood was involved in the Rochdale child abuse scandal with at lease one of the take ways involved being in the town centre. It could be fertile Ukip ground.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Heywo ... 20&bih=846
People will be people, and I can take you to pubs in Bury not that different to the Heywood one you visited ;)
Lunch will not be "done" again in the pub we went to - Shoulder of Mutton - 3 times fried chips taste just as disgusting as they sound! Should have known better, but the food there (years ago) used to be 1st class :(
At the farmers market we bought lovely bread, beautiful cheeses, fresh picked veg and some potted herbs. Wished we had taken them and had a picnic instead of the pub grub.
Catching up, back laters :)
Edit to add
Heywood have a 1940's day every June where everyone dresses in 1940's style, the pubs sell beer at 1940 prices (restricted to one each!) and a jolly good time is had by all, like a giant street party that takes over the town centre, with much raised for local charities. We go every year - great fun :)
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Heywo ... +1940s+day


Last edited by AngryAsWell on Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:35 pm 
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I've just been across to the Guardian Politics page - and guess what question they answer in one of their more recent articles? Oh, well . . .


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:37 pm 
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Eric_WLothian wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
refitman wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
Does anyone know when the actual result of the Scottish Independence Referendum is likely to be known, please? (I'm probably being bone-idle here - the information must be relatively easily available somewhere. Sorry.)

The Chief Counting Officer estimates the results will be known early morning of the 19th: http://www.electionsscotland.info/emb/d ... referendum (pdf) pp14.


Ah - thank you very much!


STV have said they will have through-the-night coverage:

http://news.stv.tv/scotland/290750-stv-announces-extensive-overnight-independence-referendum-coverage/

but the BBC may have problems:

http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/sep/03/bbc-strike-could-disrupt-scottish-independence-referendum-coverage

With only 32 regional results to cover, I don't envy the presenters who have to fill in the gaps.


Oh great - does that mean that those of us in rUK who aren't able to get STV will be left waiting in a results news vacuum (like with the first TV debate ...)? If so I predict a press bods and political geeks meltdown on social media. Surely the BBC are going to guarantee proper up to the minute results coverage for the whole UK .... surely?

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:38 pm 
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Thank you to all those who have helped me to understand where Heywood and Middleton is and what makes it tick (or did).

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:39 pm 
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If Scotland vote yes I cant see Cameron holding on much longer. Two bye-elections coming up now. A strong UKIP showing in both(which is probable) will make the tories hit threat level panic.

Far from delaying the general election, Dave might find himself facing one rather sooner.

Even with a no vote, I'm not convinced the govt can make it to christmas. It really wouldn't surprise me to see it fall.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:41 pm 
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http://dbfamilylaw.wordpress.com/2014/09/07/csainquiry-open-letter-to-fiona-woolf-on-bias/

Interesting!

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:42 pm 
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@ AngryAsWell

Quote:
3 times fried chips


I'd have been worried at twice fried chips but THREE???? The mind boggles at whatever reason some chef could possibly give for this overkill method.

Yeah - next time go find a nice peaceful spot with greenery and eat the fresh cheese, bread and other goodies you've just bought. Sounds delicious.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:47 pm 
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@Ephermerid:

If the agreement is now null and void, in theory so is the result of the referendum - if it is not conducted as agreed, it's wrong.
Cameron and the rest of them have, by making all these promises while the voting is in progress, interfered with the conduct of the referendum and that is absolutely disgraceful.


If they didn't personally know the consequences, someone will have told them.

So it's either total disregard for the rules and laws of the land, pig ignorance, or on purpose.

On purpose I reckon.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:55 pm 
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rebeccariots2 wrote:
@ AngryAsWell

Quote:
3 times fried chips


I'd have been worried at twice fried chips but THREE???? The mind boggles at whatever reason some chef could possibly give for this overkill method.

Yeah - next time go find a nice peaceful spot with greenery and eat the fresh cheese, bread and other goodies you've just bought. Sounds delicious.


I think the 'chef' may have misinterpreted the procedure. I have a Tom Kerridge book which advocates three times cooked (not three times fried) chips:

1. Bring a pan of salted water to the boil and blanch the chips until soft, but still holding their shape.
2. Remove the chips with a slotted spoon and drain them on a perforated tray (alternatively use plates lined with kitchen paper).
3. Fill a deep-fat fryer with vegetable oil and preheat to 140C/284F (CAUTION: hot oil can be dangerous. Do not leave unattended.)
4. Cook the chips for approximately 8–10 minutes, or until the oil stops bubbling (which means that the moisture has been removed). You will need to do this in batches unless you have a large fryer. Remove the chips using a slotted spoon and drain the chips on a perforated tray or plates lined with kitchen paper.
5. Preheat the deep-fat fryer to 180C/350F. Deep fry the chips for a second time until crisp and golden-brown.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:59 pm 
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rebeccariots2 wrote:
@ AngryAsWell

Quote:
3 times fried chips


I'd have been worried at twice fried chips but THREE???? The mind boggles at whatever reason some chef could possibly give for this overkill method.

Yeah - next time go find a nice peaceful spot with greenery and eat the fresh cheese, bread and other goodies you've just bought. Sounds delicious.


Heston Blumenthal's tried and tested steps for perfect fluffy chips with a crisp coating

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/how- ... ips-recipe

They are really really naff :( Definitely flask of coffee and up to the hills to eat fresh bread and cheese next time :)
:lol:


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 1:59 pm 
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@ AngryAsWell

Quote:
3 times fried chips


Oooh-er. Sounds as if they were trying a bit of cordon-bleau and got it wrong.

The best chefs:
Boil the chips briefly.
Take them out, dry them.
Using a mixture of oil and beef dripping,
Fry them briefly.
Take out allow to drain. Leave for a while,
Pop them back in the frier to finish off.

It's supposed to make the most delicious crispy chips you ever tasted. Or so Tom Kerridge says :)

RebbecaRiots2: Ha. Snap! Except for the beef dripping.... :lol:

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:00 pm 
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Re: Chips...

I can't be arsed. I like them just about cooked and very soggy :)

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:01 pm 
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Bit of a palaver Eric. I'd be starving by the time they were ready. :D
Just make sure you've got loads of bread and butter ready.

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I have always been too scared to deep fry.

My mum accidentally set fire to our kitchen wall when I was a child when she served us chips and left the pan on.

My dad foolishly carried the burning pan of fat out into the garden, singeing his eye lashes and part of his cheek in the process.

Seeing the Fire Brigade tackling the fire and my dad's face afterwards put me off anything other than sauteing.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:06 pm 
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Eric_WLothian wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
@ AngryAsWell

Quote:
3 times fried chips


I'd have been worried at twice fried chips but THREE???? The mind boggles at whatever reason some chef could possibly give for this overkill method.

Yeah - next time go find a nice peaceful spot with greenery and eat the fresh cheese, bread and other goodies you've just bought. Sounds delicious.


I think the 'chef' may have misinterpreted the procedure. I have a Tom Kerridge book which advocates three times cooked (not three times fried) chips:

1. Bring a pan of salted water to the boil and blanch the chips until soft, but still holding their shape.
2. Remove the chips with a slotted spoon and drain them on a perforated tray (alternatively use plates lined with kitchen paper).
3. Fill a deep-fat fryer with vegetable oil and preheat to 140C/284F (CAUTION: hot oil can be dangerous. Do not leave unattended.)
4. Cook the chips for approximately 8–10 minutes, or until the oil stops bubbling (which means that the moisture has been removed). You will need to do this in batches unless you have a large fryer. Remove the chips using a slotted spoon and drain the chips on a perforated tray or plates lined with kitchen paper.
5. Preheat the deep-fat fryer to 180C/350F. Deep fry the chips for a second time until crisp and golden-brown.

Yes that's the one it should have been (or Heston's) but I think there must be a new fangled kitchen equipment they use, as these came served in there own little chip fryer basket, all very nice and "kitchen supper" looking, but the fat on the "chips" was hanging, you could smell the rancidness without even tasting them - lol.
Its a posh place not a cheepo hole, and really expected better. Oh well live and learn.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:07 pm 
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rebeccariots2 wrote:
Eric_WLothian wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
refitman wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
Does anyone know when the actual result of the Scottish Independence Referendum is likely to be known, please? (I'm probably being bone-idle here - the information must be relatively easily available somewhere. Sorry.)

The Chief Counting Officer estimates the results will be known early morning of the 19th: http://www.electionsscotland.info/emb/d ... referendum (pdf) pp14.


Ah - thank you very much!


STV have said they will have through-the-night coverage:

http://news.stv.tv/scotland/290750-stv-announces-extensive-overnight-independence-referendum-coverage/

but the BBC may have problems:

http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/sep/03/bbc-strike-could-disrupt-scottish-independence-referendum-coverage

With only 32 regional results to cover, I don't envy the presenters who have to fill in the gaps.


Oh great - does that mean that those of us in rUK who aren't able to get STV will be left waiting in a results news vacuum (like with the first TV debate ...)? If so I predict a press bods and political geeks meltdown on social media. Surely the BBC are going to guarantee proper up to the minute results coverage for the whole UK .... surely?

I guess the BBC will have coverage through the night on news-24, even if it's not on BBC1/2. I can't recall NUJ strikes in the past shutting down their news coverage completely. No doubt there will be an influx of urban area results in the wee small hours, then a long wait for the Highlands and Islands.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:07 pm 
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AngryAsWell wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Where is it? North of Manchester, south of Rochdale basically.

He was in the HoC just two days ago voting against the "bedroom tax" - this has come right out of the blue despite his age :(

RIP.


RIP indeed, he was a nice bloke. H&M is right next door to Bury North, on the other side of the M66. To say that it's a bit down on its luck is no great overstatement. Middleton is where Avro used to have a plant pumping out Lancasters, and Middleton itself (as well as Heywood) is covered by Rochdale MBC. That council's now Labour but for some years was a FibDem hold, until the Rochdale Fibs imploded spectacularly. Middleton returns a mix of councillors mostly Labour (now) but a smattering of Tories. The same cannot be said under any circumstances about Heywood, where people greet you with "gimme six". It's a weird little place - you can buy Confederate regalia and flags in a shop on the high street - and the pubs are something to behold.

A few years back Ms.Remarx and her lecturer mate Sue met up in the Dunne's store in Heywood (why it's there,I'll never know; even M&S would look less out of place), and I tagged along. When they'd gutted the stock (10 mins, tops), Sue, the niave that she is, suggested we drop into one of the local pubs for a quick drink. Walking past the relative sanity of Wetherspoon's (bouncers on the door), her eye alighted on a pub further down the pavement and in she went.

Inside it was rather like of scene out of Dante's Inferno, except with grubbier decor and a disco ball on the ceiling. It was also full of extremely pissed septuagenarian and octogenarian blokes - this is about 6.30pm on a Thursday - and their dodgy looking, equally aged and equally pissed 'girls', as they referred to them. At least the beer was cheap, however even that wasn't an inducement to stay (as an anthropologist, there's always that urge), and when one particularly repulsive woman in her mid 70s (estimate) started to dance in a comically unsexy way, to a slow handclap accompaniment from the men (and I swear I could hear top and bottom sets also rattling away in the mix), I decided it was time to sup up and go.

That's Heywood.


Just a little bit cruel & harsh there Ernst, being in Bury South I'm just "a cross the way" (almost walking distance) from Heywood and although the town centre is a bit yucky (as is Middleton) the outer areas can be quite pleasant. Heywood was involved in the Rochdale child abuse scandal with at lease one of the take ways involved being in the town centre. It could be fertile Ukip ground.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Heywo ... 20&bih=846
People will be people, and I can take you to pubs in Bury not that different to the Heywood one you visited ;)
Lunch will not be "done" again in the pub we went to - Shoulder of Mutton - 3 times fried chips taste just as disgusting as they sound! Should have known better, but the food there (years ago) used to be 1st class :(
At the farmers market we bought lovely bread, beautiful cheeses, fresh picked veg and some potted herbs. Wished we had taken them and had a picnic instead of the pub grub.
Catching up, back laters :)
Edit to add
Heywood have a 1940's day every June where everyone dresses in 1940's style, the pubs sell beer at 1940 prices (restricted to one each!) and a jolly good time is had by all, like a giant street party that takes over the town centre, with much raised for local charities. We go every year - great fun :)
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Heywo ... +1940s+day


Hi AAW, my Heywood story is my long lingering impression of the place. I'm aware of Bamford, Norden and other areas of the town that aren't quite so weird, but it would be a very kind soul who might be able to raise a kind comment about the centre of Heywood. And the town centre pubs are, frankly, the sort of place I'd go if I was looking for a heavy to go and beat someone up.

You're in Bury South you say? Perhaps you and I should share a beer sometime - you can meet Ms.Remarx (her identity might just surprise you!) and I can have the pleasure of meeting Mr.AAW. We're in the north of Bury North - you? I've met Paul before now, so it would be lovely to touch base with another FTNer in person.

Edit: Shoulder of Mutton? Which one? I only know one and that's in Holcombe and is a well known gastro pub (ie, it's massively over expensive) frequented by locals. Well, when I say locals, I mean solicitors, quantity surveyors and accountants who can afford the ridiculous prices and pretend that they'll all grockles. Just wait for the first mobile to go off, and see how all the horny handed sons of the soil dive towards their pockets. Rural indeed.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:14 pm 
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Quote:
Retweeted by Ian Dunt
euan mccolm ‏@euanmccolm 7m
gordon brown announces a six day, 30 stop tour of scotland to outline promised new powers for holyrood.


Is that wise Gordon?

He can't be taking orders from Cameron ... so they must all be worried in the BT camp.

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Dogs. Beach. Canine happiness.

See you later.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:19 pm 
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frightful_oik wrote:
Bit of a palaver Eric. I'd be starving by the time they were ready. :D
Just make sure you've got loads of bread and butter ready.


Well you won't like Heston Blumenthal's recipe then (AAW's link seems to be the quick version :lol: )

http://www.insearchofheston.com/2013/10/how-to-make-heston-blumenthals-triple-cooked-chips-recipe-a-definitive-step-by-step-guide/

Quote: "Time: 7 hours".


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:22 pm 
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rebeccariots2 wrote:
Quote:
Retweeted by Ian Dunt
euan mccolm ‏@euanmccolm 7m
gordon brown announces a six day, 30 stop tour of scotland to outline promised new powers for holyrood.


Is that wise Gordon?

He can't be taking orders from Cameron ... so they must all be worried in the BT camp.



I had that phone call canvassing for a Labour donation last week [provided by a company paid to do so]. The canvasser said Labour people were getting jittery about a shift to Yes among undecided Labour supporters.

Looks like they were right to be so.

YouGov result shows Labour voters now at 35% Yes, up from 18% four weeks ago.
'Working class' voters now 56% Yes up from 41% four weeks ago.

So the SNP's sneaky pretense that everyone south of the border is a Tory may have paid off, unless other polls show different results.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:28 pm 
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Eric_WLothian wrote:
frightful_oik wrote:
Bit of a palaver Eric. I'd be starving by the time they were ready. :D
Just make sure you've got loads of bread and butter ready.


Well you won't like Heston Blumenthal's recipe then (AAW's link seems to be the quick version :lol: )

http://www.insearchofheston.com/2013/10/how-to-make-heston-blumenthals-triple-cooked-chips-recipe-a-definitive-step-by-step-guide/

Quote: "Time: 7 hours".



Bit of a mission.....7 hours?

I had 3-times cooked chips done in duck fat and salt once. Smart pub somewhere...can't remember where.

They were the most fantastic thing I have ever eaten - really crispy and very fluffy inside, not greasy at all. Lush.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:32 pm 
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Maybe Ephie or any other Yes supporters know the answer to whether banks like Nat West will be affected by independence ?

RBS is 81% tax payer owned, with their headquarters in Scotland.

Will they move HQ to somewhere else in the UK ?

Will it make any difference to Nat West account holders or pose any concerns for them ?


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:35 pm 
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rebeccariots2 wrote:
Quote:
Retweeted by Ian Dunt
euan mccolm ‏@euanmccolm 7m
gordon brown announces a six day, 30 stop tour of scotland to outline promised new powers for holyrood.


Is that wise Gordon?

He can't be taking orders from Cameron ... so they must all be worried in the BT camp.


This was probably on the cards before the YouGov poll result. Here's an article published yesterday:
http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/gordon-brown-no-equals-more-powers-for-holyrood-1-3533170


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:40 pm 
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ErnstRemarx wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Where is it? North of Manchester, south of Rochdale basically.

He was in the HoC just two days ago voting against the "bedroom tax" - this has come right out of the blue despite his age :(

RIP.


RIP indeed, he was a nice bloke. H&M is right next door to Bury North, on the other side of the M66. To say that it's a bit down on its luck is no great overstatement. Middleton is where Avro used to have a plant pumping out Lancasters, and Middleton itself (as well as Heywood) is covered by Rochdale MBC. That council's now Labour but for some years was a FibDem hold, until the Rochdale Fibs imploded spectacularly. Middleton returns a mix of councillors mostly Labour (now) but a smattering of Tories. The same cannot be said under any circumstances about Heywood, where people greet you with "gimme six". It's a weird little place - you can buy Confederate regalia and flags in a shop on the high street - and the pubs are something to behold.

A few years back Ms.Remarx and her lecturer mate Sue met up in the Dunne's store in Heywood (why it's there,I'll never know; even M&S would look less out of place), and I tagged along. When they'd gutted the stock (10 mins, tops), Sue, the niave that she is, suggested we drop into one of the local pubs for a quick drink. Walking past the relative sanity of Wetherspoon's (bouncers on the door), her eye alighted on a pub further down the pavement and in she went.

Inside it was rather like of scene out of Dante's Inferno, except with grubbier decor and a disco ball on the ceiling. It was also full of extremely pissed septuagenarian and octogenarian blokes - this is about 6.30pm on a Thursday - and their dodgy looking, equally aged and equally pissed 'girls', as they referred to them. At least the beer was cheap, however even that wasn't an inducement to stay (as an anthropologist, there's always that urge), and when one particularly repulsive woman in her mid 70s (estimate) started to dance in a comically unsexy way, to a slow handclap accompaniment from the men (and I swear I could hear top and bottom sets also rattling away in the mix), I decided it was time to sup up and go.

That's Heywood.


Just a little bit cruel & harsh there Ernst, being in Bury South I'm just "a cross the way" (almost walking distance) from Heywood and although the town centre is a bit yucky (as is Middleton) the outer areas can be quite pleasant. Heywood was involved in the Rochdale child abuse scandal with at lease one of the take ways involved being in the town centre. It could be fertile Ukip ground.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Heywo ... 20&bih=846
People will be people, and I can take you to pubs in Bury not that different to the Heywood one you visited ;)
Lunch will not be "done" again in the pub we went to - Shoulder of Mutton - 3 times fried chips taste just as disgusting as they sound! Should have known better, but the food there (years ago) used to be 1st class :(
At the farmers market we bought lovely bread, beautiful cheeses, fresh picked veg and some potted herbs. Wished we had taken them and had a picnic instead of the pub grub.
Catching up, back laters :)
Edit to add
Heywood have a 1940's day every June where everyone dresses in 1940's style, the pubs sell beer at 1940 prices (restricted to one each!) and a jolly good time is had by all, like a giant street party that takes over the town centre, with much raised for local charities. We go every year - great fun :)
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Heywo ... +1940s+day


Hi AAW, my Heywood story is my long lingering impression of the place. I'm aware of Bamford, Norden and other areas of the town that aren't quite so weird, but it would be a very kind soul who might be able to raise a kind comment about the centre of Heywood. And the town centre pubs are, frankly, the sort of place I'd go if I was looking for a heavy to go and beat someone up.

You're in Bury South you say? Perhaps you and I should share a beer sometime - you can meet Ms.Remarx (her identity might just surprise you!) and I can have the pleasure of meeting Mr.AAW. We're in the north of Bury North - you? I've met Paul before now, so it would be lovely to touch base with another FTNer in person.

Edit: Shoulder of Mutton? Which one? I only know one and that's in Holcombe and is a well known gastro pub (ie, it's massively over expensive) frequented by locals. Well, when I say locals, I mean solicitors, quantity surveyors and accountants who can afford the ridiculous prices and pretend that they'll all grockles. Just wait for the first mobile to go off, and see how all the horny handed sons of the soil dive towards their pockets. Rural indeed.


Just replied and the site ate it :(
I must be very kind soul as when we go to the 1940 day the people of Heywood are welcoming and fun loving. Yes its run down, but no more than many many Town Centres these days.
Would be good to meet up, when I go to Bury I grab grub at Katsouris or the Fusiliers Museum, fancy lunch at one or the other?
Correct on the SoM, we used to go there in our younger, more affluent days and felt like a treat today, so decided (as we were up that way) to go back in time.
It was bobbins :( Thankfully, we only stretched to a butty and chips.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:45 pm 
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yahyah wrote:
Maybe Ephie or any other Yes supporters know the answer to whether banks like Nat West will be affected by independence ?

RBS is 81% tax payer owned, with their headquarters in Scotland.

Will they move HQ to somewhere else in the UK ?

Will it make any difference to Nat West account holders or pose any concerns for them ?


Couple of interesting articles:-
Robert Peston article which discusses your question
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-26455655

...and another (based on an FT article) on the finance sector:
http://bettertogether.net/blog/entry/big-pension-firms-moving-money-out-of-scotland-over-separation-risks


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:47 pm 
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rebeccariots2 wrote:
Dogs. Beach. Canine happiness.

See you later.

Dogs. Beach. Canine happiness - Just for you in case you missed it yesterday :)

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/09 ... ostpopular


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:48 pm 
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yahyah wrote:
Maybe Ephie or any other Yes supporters know the answer to whether banks like Nat West will be affected by independence ?

RBS is 81% tax payer owned, with their headquarters in Scotland.

Will they move HQ to somewhere else in the UK ?

Will it make any difference to Nat West account holders or pose any concerns for them ?


I am not a yes supporter. However.

RBS will move south. Scotland couldn't afford for them to stay as the economy isn't big enough to accept the liabilities.

Nobody knows what currency Scotland will use for the 5 years between independence and adopting the Euro. My honest advice, if you have money in a Scottish bank move it to an rUK bank just in case.

Scotland's biggest problem as an independent nation is they don't have enough people, think New Zealand (but with a less benign climate, and safer geology). I would be surprised if an Independent Scotland will be able to sustain free healthcare when the oil runs out.

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:50 pm 
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yahyah wrote:
Maybe Ephie or any other Yes supporters know the answer to whether banks like Nat West will be affected by independence ?

RBS is 81% tax payer owned, with their headquarters in Scotland.

Will they move HQ to somewhere else in the UK ?

Will it make any difference to Nat West account holders or pose any concerns for them ?


I suspect that they will weigh up the financial risks involved and then ensure that they are domiciled for all purposes in the rUK, maintain branches in Scotland and wait to see what happens.

If, as Salmond has said, Scotland refuses to take a percentage of the UK's debt with them and renege on such a debt, I can't see them then being able to turn around to the money markets and get loans (which they'll need, being unable print their own money via a Scottish bank/lender of last resort) at anything other than extortionate rates over 1-3 years (a la Euro using countries such as Portugal).

Someone, somewhere down the line is going to get a severe haircut, and I'm pretty sure that Wee Eck will blame it on anti-Scottish markets. That will avoid having to explain why using the pound, when you have no control whatsoever over it having been denied currency union by the government of rUK (for good reasons) is such a fabbo idea. Blame it on everyone else and continue to invoke the spirit that, by then, would have made Scotland free from England, if not in any way free from the financial implications of actions that Salmond has already said that an independent Scotland would take.

I simply cannot believe that Scots will look at the financial fallout from all of this and then decide that independence at such a price is worthwhile.


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 2:53 pm 
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TechnicalEphemera wrote:
yahyah wrote:
Maybe Ephie or any other Yes supporters know the answer to whether banks like Nat West will be affected by independence ?

RBS is 81% tax payer owned, with their headquarters in Scotland.

Will they move HQ to somewhere else in the UK ?

Will it make any difference to Nat West account holders or pose any concerns for them ?


I am not a yes supporter. However.

RBS will move south. Scotland couldn't afford for them to stay as the economy isn't big enough to accept the liabilities.

Nobody knows what currency Scotland will use for the 5 years between independence and adopting the Euro. My honest advice, if you have money in a Scottish bank move it to an rUK bank just in case.

Scotland's biggest problem as an independent nation is they don't have enough people, think New Zealand (but with a less benign climate, and safer geology). I would be surprised if an Independent Scotland will be able to sustain free healthcare when the oil runs out.



Maybe that's what the mooted border guards will be there for, to stop sick people piling back into the rest of the UK as NHS health tourists. ;)


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 3:00 pm 
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AngryAsWell wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Where is it? North of Manchester, south of Rochdale basically.

He was in the HoC just two days ago voting against the "bedroom tax" - this has come right out of the blue despite his age :(

RIP.


RIP indeed, he was a nice bloke. H&M is right next door to Bury North, on the other side of the M66. To say that it's a bit down on its luck is no great overstatement. Middleton is where Avro used to have a plant pumping out Lancasters, and Middleton itself (as well as Heywood) is covered by Rochdale MBC. That council's now Labour but for some years was a FibDem hold, until the Rochdale Fibs imploded spectacularly. Middleton returns a mix of councillors mostly Labour (now) but a smattering of Tories. The same cannot be said under any circumstances about Heywood, where people greet you with "gimme six". It's a weird little place - you can buy Confederate regalia and flags in a shop on the high street - and the pubs are something to behold.

A few years back Ms.Remarx and her lecturer mate Sue met up in the Dunne's store in Heywood (why it's there,I'll never know; even M&S would look less out of place), and I tagged along. When they'd gutted the stock (10 mins, tops), Sue, the niave that she is, suggested we drop into one of the local pubs for a quick drink. Walking past the relative sanity of Wetherspoon's (bouncers on the door), her eye alighted on a pub further down the pavement and in she went.

Inside it was rather like of scene out of Dante's Inferno, except with grubbier decor and a disco ball on the ceiling. It was also full of extremely pissed septuagenarian and octogenarian blokes - this is about 6.30pm on a Thursday - and their dodgy looking, equally aged and equally pissed 'girls', as they referred to them. At least the beer was cheap, however even that wasn't an inducement to stay (as an anthropologist, there's always that urge), and when one particularly repulsive woman in her mid 70s (estimate) started to dance in a comically unsexy way, to a slow handclap accompaniment from the men (and I swear I could hear top and bottom sets also rattling away in the mix), I decided it was time to sup up and go.

That's Heywood.


Just a little bit cruel & harsh there Ernst, being in Bury South I'm just "a cross the way" (almost walking distance) from Heywood and although the town centre is a bit yucky (as is Middleton) the outer areas can be quite pleasant. Heywood was involved in the Rochdale child abuse scandal with at lease one of the take ways involved being in the town centre. It could be fertile Ukip ground.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Heywo ... 20&bih=846
People will be people, and I can take you to pubs in Bury not that different to the Heywood one you visited ;)
Lunch will not be "done" again in the pub we went to - Shoulder of Mutton - 3 times fried chips taste just as disgusting as they sound! Should have known better, but the food there (years ago) used to be 1st class :(
At the farmers market we bought lovely bread, beautiful cheeses, fresh picked veg and some potted herbs. Wished we had taken them and had a picnic instead of the pub grub.
Catching up, back laters :)
Edit to add
Heywood have a 1940's day every June where everyone dresses in 1940's style, the pubs sell beer at 1940 prices (restricted to one each!) and a jolly good time is had by all, like a giant street party that takes over the town centre, with much raised for local charities. We go every year - great fun :)
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Heywo ... +1940s+day


Hi AAW, my Heywood story is my long lingering impression of the place. I'm aware of Bamford, Norden and other areas of the town that aren't quite so weird, but it would be a very kind soul who might be able to raise a kind comment about the centre of Heywood. And the town centre pubs are, frankly, the sort of place I'd go if I was looking for a heavy to go and beat someone up.

You're in Bury South you say? Perhaps you and I should share a beer sometime - you can meet Ms.Remarx (her identity might just surprise you!) and I can have the pleasure of meeting Mr.AAW. We're in the north of Bury North - you? I've met Paul before now, so it would be lovely to touch base with another FTNer in person.

Edit: Shoulder of Mutton? Which one? I only know one and that's in Holcombe and is a well known gastro pub (ie, it's massively over expensive) frequented by locals. Well, when I say locals, I mean solicitors, quantity surveyors and accountants who can afford the ridiculous prices and pretend that they'll all grockles. Just wait for the first mobile to go off, and see how all the horny handed sons of the soil dive towards their pockets. Rural indeed.


Just replied and the site ate it :(
I must be very kind soul as when we go to the 1940 day the people of Heywood are welcoming and fun loving. Yes its run down, but no more than many many Town Centres these days.
Would be good to meet up, when I go to Bury I grab grub at Katsouris or the Fusiliers Museum, fancy lunch at one or the other?
Correct on the SoM, we used to go there in our younger, more affluent days and felt like a treat today, so decided (as we were up that way) to go back in time.
It was bobbins :( Thankfully, we only stretched to a butty and chips.


I should warn you that Mr. Katsouri is a staunch Tory and contributes to their funding. Having said that, it's a bloody lovely deli (and cafe now). I'm more a Trackside/Automatic man myself, as I like decent beer and the cosmopolitan throb that Automatic provides - a unique place in many ways, and a fabbo one for cheap cocktails on a Friday aft!

I sort of gave up on the SoM when the prices headed north (same as you, I suspect), but there are so many good pubs in the north of the borough that you'd have to be in the terminal stages of existential ennui not to find a couple, at least, that aren't good eateries as well as friendly watering holes.

If you're where I think you might be, I did a Labour party hike from Unsworth Pole (Pike?) to that pub over the motorway that was briefly, and brilliantly, a Greek restaurant. And I suspect I know all your councillors quite well!


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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 3:03 pm 
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I've never been to a gastro pub. I get too het up about what they charge.

Some friends of our went to Anthony Wirral-Thompson's gastro pub last year.

£36 for a portion of fish and chips. And there was nothing outstanding about the meal. I'm sure they said it was served in plastic baskets and when they asked could they take the leftovers home in the baskets he got assy with them and said what did they expect for £36 a head? That was cheap, and he had to re-use the baskets. :shock:

Not the best way to win customers and keep them I'd say.... :lol:

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PostPosted: Sun 07 Sep, 2014 3:07 pm 
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This is good, from the BBC's Alan Little, I especially like part 2 of his narrative, the former industrial heartlands of Scotland, where the SNP had scant rewards and miners and ship builders had more in common with communities in south Wales, Yorkshire, Plymouth, Liverpool and Kent than Highland romantics.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/special/2014/ ... index.html


Last edited by letsskiptotheleft on Sun 07 Sep, 2014 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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