FlyTheNest

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:16 pm**

TechnicalEphemera wrote:
yahyah wrote:Maybe Ephie or any other Yes supporters know the answer to whether banks like Nat West will be affected by independence ?

RBS is 81% tax payer owned, with their headquarters in Scotland.

Will they move HQ to somewhere else in the UK ?

Will it make any difference to Nat West account holders or pose any concerns for them ?
I am not a yes supporter. However.

RBS will move south. Scotland couldn't afford for them to stay as the economy isn't big enough to accept the liabilities.

Nobody knows what currency Scotland will use for the 5 years between independence and adopting the Euro. My honest advice, if you have money in a Scottish bank move it to an rUK bank just in case.

Scotland's biggest problem as an independent nation is they don't have enough people, think New Zealand (but with a less benign climate, and safer geology). I would be surprised if an Independent Scotland will be able to sustain free healthcare when the oil runs out.

The oil companies would have massive leverage in the short term. They have fields all over the world. A few mutterings about uncompetitive tax, blah, blah, prioritize other areas, would really focus Scotland's mind. As would finance too. As Simon Wren-Lewis, it's one thing to moan about how the UK is captured by interests, but nobody seems to have shown that Scotland would resist them any better.

Nicola Sturgeon has been assuring everyone there won't be passport checks. She needs to realise she has no control over what a foreign, and much powerful, neighbour will do. It's the currency union nonsense again.

A few people on the left have talked some rubbish about how much more positive the Yes campaign is. But it can't answer basic questions and can promise anything.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:24 pm**

Tubby Isaacs wrote:
TechnicalEphemera wrote:
yahyah wrote:Maybe Ephie or any other Yes supporters know the answer to whether banks like Nat West will be affected by independence ?

RBS is 81% tax payer owned, with their headquarters in Scotland.

Will they move HQ to somewhere else in the UK ?

Will it make any difference to Nat West account holders or pose any concerns for them ?
I am not a yes supporter. However.

RBS will move south. Scotland couldn't afford for them to stay as the economy isn't big enough to accept the liabilities.

Nobody knows what currency Scotland will use for the 5 years between independence and adopting the Euro. My honest advice, if you have money in a Scottish bank move it to an rUK bank just in case.

Scotland's biggest problem as an independent nation is they don't have enough people, think New Zealand (but with a less benign climate, and safer geology). I would be surprised if an Independent Scotland will be able to sustain free healthcare when the oil runs out.
The oil companies would have massive leverage in the short term. They have fields all over the world. A few mutterings about uncompetitive tax, blah, blah, prioritize other areas, would really focus Scotland's mind. As would finance too. As Simon Wren-Lewis, it's one thing to moan about how the UK is captured by interests, but nobody seems to have shown that Scotland would resist them any better.

Nicola Sturgeon has been assuring everyone there won't be passport checks. She needs to realise she has no control over what a foreign, and much powerful, neighbour will do. It's the currency union nonsense again.

A few people on the left have talked some rubbish about how much more positive the Yes campaign is. But it can't answer basic questions and can promise anything.

It is telling, as pointed out by Smithson that in the Quebec independence vote the yes camp were 7% ahead in the polls and lost.

Shy noes will carry it, I think by a surprisingly large margin. No rational person can vote for independence. The irrational nationalist vote won't be enough.

If Salmond had been competent and actually addressed the fundamentals things would be different.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:30 pm**

http://www.economicsuk.com/blog/002045.html#more" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Depressing analysis here.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:33 pm**

The oil companies would have massive leverage in the short term. They have fields all over the world. A few mutterings about uncompetitive tax, blah, blah, prioritize other areas, would really focus Scotland's mind. As would finance too. As Simon Wren-Lewis, it's one thing to moan about how the UK is captured by interests, but nobody seems to have shown that Scotland would resist them any better.

I thought the same. We've seen photos of Salmond with Murdoch and that American twit with the funny hair. Murdoch in particular is getting his feet well and truly under the table so he has first picks of the carcass.
What do the yes voters think is going to happen? It's all about leverage and financial gains and sod the people.

I don't have an opinion either way. It's up to the Scots. If I were Scottish I'd be tempted to vote yes because of the heritage. Its a lovely country and they have every right to be proud of it, but a little less romanticism would be good.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:41 pm**

Tubby Isaacs wrote:
TechnicalEphemera wrote:
yahyah wrote:Maybe Ephie or any other Yes supporters know the answer to whether banks like Nat West will be affected by independence ?

RBS is 81% tax payer owned, with their headquarters in Scotland.

Will they move HQ to somewhere else in the UK ?

Will it make any difference to Nat West account holders or pose any concerns for them ?
I am not a yes supporter. However.

RBS will move south. Scotland couldn't afford for them to stay as the economy isn't big enough to accept the liabilities.

Nobody knows what currency Scotland will use for the 5 years between independence and adopting the Euro. My honest advice, if you have money in a Scottish bank move it to an rUK bank just in case.

Scotland's biggest problem as an independent nation is they don't have enough people, think New Zealand (but with a less benign climate, and safer geology). I would be surprised if an Independent Scotland will be able to sustain free healthcare when the oil runs out.
The oil companies would have massive leverage in the short term. They have fields all over the world. A few mutterings about uncompetitive tax, blah, blah, prioritize other areas, would really focus Scotland's mind. As would finance too. As Simon Wren-Lewis, it's one thing to moan about how the UK is captured by interests, but nobody seems to have shown that Scotland would resist them any better.

Nicola Sturgeon has been assuring everyone there won't be passport checks. She needs to realise she has no control over what a foreign, and much powerful, neighbour will do. It's the currency union nonsense again.

A few people on the left have talked some rubbish about how much more positive the Yes campaign is. But it can't answer basic questions and can promise anything.

The problem is, that outside of Scotland declaring an independent Scottish pound - or zloty or whatever - backed up by a bank of last resort, they don't have any handles upon their currency, and that will cause major problems.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:44 pm**

Evening All!

As usual haven't been on one much over the weekend but have enjoyed skimming through a lot of great posts so thank you

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:45 pm**

Not being that well up on the debate why haven't companies like RBS sorted out what they will do if there's a yes vote.
Their board and ministers must have discussed it and have contingency plans. It's not like they're a little penny ante bank.
There's so much up in the air. It seems very badly organised. With such a short time to go, I'd still be quite bewildered on what option to choose if I were a Scot.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:47 pm**

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Evening All!

As usual haven't been on one much over the weekend but have enjoyed skimming through a lot of great posts so thank you

Good innit!

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:49 pm**

One piece of news that may have passed us by is that Charlotte Leslie's Mum Jane is now world champion for her age group at triathlon!

http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/Jane-Lesli ... story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:50 pm**

ohsocynical wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Evening All!

As usual haven't been on one much over the weekend but have enjoyed skimming through a lot of great posts so thank you

Good innit!

Indeed

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:50 pm**

The first and only rule.

There's no freedom without financial independence. He who pays the piper calls the tune.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:52 pm**

ohsocynical wrote:Not being that well up on the debate why haven't companies like RBS sorted out what they will do if there's a yes vote.
Their board and ministers must have discussed it and have contingency plans. It's not like they're a little penny ante bank.
There's so much up in the air. It seems very badly organised. With such a short time to go, I'd still be quite bewildered on what option to choose if I were a Scot.

Lloyds have done their planning, RBS are being a bit more coy.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/09/0 ... 0920140902

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:53 pm**

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:One piece of news that may have passed us by is that Charlotte Leslie's Mum Jane is now world champion for her age group at triathlon!

http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/Jane-Lesli ... story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Blimey! That's one fit lady...

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 9:59 pm**

Eric_WLothian wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:Not being that well up on the debate why haven't companies like RBS sorted out what they will do if there's a yes vote.
Their board and ministers must have discussed it and have contingency plans. It's not like they're a little penny ante bank.
There's so much up in the air. It seems very badly organised. With such a short time to go, I'd still be quite bewildered on what option to choose if I were a Scot.
Lloyds have done their planning, RBS are being a bit more coy.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/09/0 ... 0920140902

You don't announce this sort of thing until the very last second. Then you announce it after the fact.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:03 pm**

Eric_WLothian wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:Not being that well up on the debate why haven't companies like RBS sorted out what they will do if there's a yes vote.
Their board and ministers must have discussed it and have contingency plans. It's not like they're a little penny ante bank.
There's so much up in the air. It seems very badly organised. With such a short time to go, I'd still be quite bewildered on what option to choose if I were a Scot.
Lloyds have done their planning, RBS are being a bit more coy.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/09/0 ... 0920140902

Thanks for link

Some executives want the Bank of England to reiterate that it will continue to act as lender of last resort during the transition period and calm any fears among investors and depositors

..Err no. If there is a run on the £ (or the economy falls down round everyone's head) after a yes vote, I don't fancy picking up any of Scotland's problems.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:05 pm**

I think the apparent panic to offer more powers is very silly.

Keep your nerve.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:12 pm**

Mike Smithson
‏@MSmithsonPB Before weightings in the YouGov IndyRef YES lead poll NO was ahead by comfortable margin.

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Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:17 pm**

Labour targets Crosby over lobbying

https://www.publicaffairsnews.com/artic ... Vo.twitter" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(Golf's still on...)

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:23 pm**

AngryAsWell wrote:
Eric_WLothian wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:Not being that well up on the debate why haven't companies like RBS sorted out what they will do if there's a yes vote.
Their board and ministers must have discussed it and have contingency plans. It's not like they're a little penny ante bank.
There's so much up in the air. It seems very badly organised. With such a short time to go, I'd still be quite bewildered on what option to choose if I were a Scot.
Lloyds have done their planning, RBS are being a bit more coy.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/09/0 ... 0920140902
Thanks for link
Some executives want the Bank of England to reiterate that it will continue to act as lender of last resort during the transition period and calm any fears among investors and depositors
..Err no. If there is a run on the £ (or the economy falls down round everyone's head) after a yes vote, I don't fancy picking up any of Scotland's problems.

I guess the BoE won't have any choice but to be LoLR as long as Scotland is part of the UK, irrespective of the vote. However, I wouldn't be surprised at some sort of emergency legislation to stop cash flowing out of Scotland in the event of a 'yes' vote.

After I read the Reuters article, I began to wonder why RBS weren't being as open as Lloyds. I found the following on the Scottish Government website:

All bodies to which the SPFM [Scottish Public Finance Manual] is directly applicable, including bodies sponsored by the SG, are required to have their core bank accounts with the Government Banking Service (GBS)...
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/Gover ... 20Contract

and on the HMRC website:

The Government Banking Service provides cost-effective banking transaction services to its customers through contracts with Citigroup and Royal Bank of Scotland Group
Our customers make payments and collect receipts through their respective Citigroup and RBSG accounts.
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/gbs/about.htm

So RBS have a vested interest in not upsetting the Scottish Government if they want to keep the business post-independence.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:24 pm**

Anyone know why Guido Fawkes has a Yes badge on Twitter profile ? Just wondering if he's shit stirring for uncle M? Thinks Labour will never win without Scotland (therefore want to get rid of Scottish vote) or papping his own view for the sake of controversy...(shrugs)

https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:26 pm**

Eric_WLothian wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:Not being that well up on the debate why haven't companies like RBS sorted out what they will do if there's a yes vote.
Their board and ministers must have discussed it and have contingency plans. It's not like they're a little penny ante bank.
There's so much up in the air. It seems very badly organised. With such a short time to go, I'd still be quite bewildered on what option to choose if I were a Scot.
Lloyds have done their planning, RBS are being a bit more coy.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/09/0 ... 0920140902

Thanks for the link.

If I had to decide I still wouldn't be able to on that article

Too many coulds and not enough woulds for me.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:26 pm**

Eric_WLothian wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:
Eric_WLothian wrote: Lloyds have done their planning, RBS are being a bit more coy.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/09/0 ... 0920140902
Thanks for link
Some executives want the Bank of England to reiterate that it will continue to act as lender of last resort during the transition period and calm any fears among investors and depositors
..Err no. If there is a run on the £ (or the economy falls down round everyone's head) after a yes vote, I don't fancy picking up any of Scotland's problems.
I guess the BoE won't have any choice but to be LoLR as long as Scotland is part of the UK, irrespective of the vote. However, I wouldn't be surprised at some sort of emergency legislation to stop cash flowing out of Scotland in the event of a 'yes' vote.

After I read the Reuters article, I began to wonder why RBS weren't being as open as Lloyds. I found the following on the Scottish Government website:

All bodies to which the SPFM [Scottish Public Finance Manual] is directly applicable, including bodies sponsored by the SG, are required to have their core bank accounts with the Government Banking Service (GBS)...
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/Gover ... 20Contract
and on the HMRC website:
The Government Banking Service provides cost-effective banking transaction services to its customers through contracts with Citigroup and Royal Bank of Scotland Group
Our customers make payments and collect receipts through their respective Citigroup and RBSG accounts.
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/gbs/about.htm
So RBS have a vested interest in not upsetting the Scottish Government if they want to keep the business post-independence.

Thanks for that, explains a bit.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:31 pm**

Duncan Stephen ‏@DuncanBSS · 5h
Easy to see why Rupert Murdoch is a yes man. Alex Salmond's white paper promises the break up of the BBC. Murdoch's dream. #nothanks

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Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:41 pm**

AngryAsWell wrote:Duncan Stephen ‏@DuncanBSS · 5h
Easy to see why Rupert Murdoch is a yes man. Alex Salmond's white paper promises the break up of the BBC. Murdoch's dream. #nothanks

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Think more generally that smaller nations are easier to boss about.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:43 pm**

Retweeted by Tony Hughes (CP)
Lee Martin ‏@LeeMartin4947 · 1h
"The people of Wales are all-too familiar with the broken promises of the unionist parties." @LeanneWood #indyref

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Are the Welsh backing Scotland independence now? Is this poster her own view or the official Plaid Cymru ones? What is the Silk Commission? When was it started?
Sigh...

So much to learn, so little time...

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 10:58 pm**

AngryAsWell wrote:
Retweeted by Tony Hughes (CP)
Lee Martin ‏@LeeMartin4947 · 1h
"The people of Wales are all-too familiar with the broken promises of the unionist parties." @LeanneWood #indyref
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Are the Welsh backing Scotland independence now? Is this poster her own view or the official Plaid Cymru ones? What is the Silk Commission? When was it started?
Sigh...
So much to learn, so little time...

Official or not seems a good few in Wales are supporting Yes.
Carrie
‏@CarrieAHarper Wales supporting Yes rally, 2pm, Saturday 13th Sept, Senedd building, Cardiff #goforitScotland #indyref

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:13 pm**

Is this the future?

Alex Andreou @sturdyAlex · 23m

I love this 10'x10' self-assembly micro home. Solar energy, rain collection, self sufficient. £20k shipped. WOWSERS!

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:19 pm**

(Golf's still on - sorry)

Don't let me be last Queen of Scotland: Monarch in talks with PM over UK break up

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/do ... ch-4181230" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Best thing they can do is send Him, Her and The Baby George up there on walk abouts..

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:24 pm**

AngryAsWell wrote:(Golf's still on - sorry)
Don't let me be last Queen of Scotland: Monarch in talks with PM over UK break up
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/do ... ch-4181230" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Best thing they can do is send Him, Her and The Baby George up there on walk abouts..

One better..
Send Him, Her and The Baby George up there on walk abouts AND announce in Edinburgh (or Glasgow, not fussy) that She's having another baby AND that it will be called James (even if it a girl)

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:28 pm**

There's not too much pro-independence sympathies in Wales AAW, at least not around here, think it's more of a few PC trying to bask in any SNP glory.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:34 pm**

letsskiptotheleft wrote:There's not too much pro-independence sympathies in Wales AAW, at least not around here, think it's more of a few PC trying to bask in any SNP glory.

She's going up to Scotland this week for a pro YES visit apparently - Leanne that is.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:35 pm**

letsskiptotheleft wrote:There's not too much pro-independence sympathies in Wales AAW, at least not around here, think it's more of a few PC trying to bask in any SNP glory.

Thanks - I'm getting really quite despondent, what with Scotland, seemingly the Welsh, not to mention the never ending golf, bad chips and the tories in general....
I just can't wait for 7th May 2015

LANDSLIDE! ) Joy - Oh yes

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:36 pm**

AngryAsWell wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:There's not too much pro-independence sympathies in Wales AAW, at least not around here, think it's more of a few PC trying to bask in any SNP glory.
Thanks - I'm getting really quite despondent, what with Scotland, seemingly the Welsh, not to mention the never ending golf, bad chips and the tories in general....
I just can't wait for 7th May 2015
LANDSLIDE! ) Joy - Oh yes

While we are at it, this can't be said enough too.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:37 pm**

AngryAsWell wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:(Golf's still on - sorry)
Don't let me be last Queen of Scotland: Monarch in talks with PM over UK break up
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/do ... ch-4181230" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Best thing they can do is send Him, Her and The Baby George up there on walk abouts..
One better..
Send Him, Her and The Baby George up there on walk abouts AND announce in Edinburgh (or Glasgow, not fussy) that She's having another baby AND that it will be called James (even if it a girl)

And they could even stay up there perhaps? They've got links - from their old university days ... He could be their new monarchy and double up as air defence.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:38 pm**

letsskiptotheleft wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:There's not too much pro-independence sympathies in Wales AAW, at least not around here, think it's more of a few PC trying to bask in any SNP glory.
Thanks - I'm getting really quite despondent, what with Scotland, seemingly the Welsh, not to mention the never ending golf, bad chips and the tories in general....
I just can't wait for 7th May 2015
LANDSLIDE! ) Joy - Oh yes
While we are at it, this can't be said enough too.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Sick and tired of being told that England is Westminster and England is Tory. A shameful, rotten, knowing lie.

How very true !

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:39 pm**

rebeccariots2 wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:
AngryAsWell wrote:(Golf's still on - sorry) http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/do ... ch-4181230" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Best thing they can do is send Him, Her and The Baby George up there on walk abouts..
One better..
Send Him, Her and The Baby George up there on walk abouts AND announce in Edinburgh (or Glasgow, not fussy) that She's having another baby AND that it will be called James (even if it a girl)
And they could even stay up there perhaps? They've got links - from their old university days ... He could be their new monarchy and double up as air defence.

.....and double up as air defence

:lol!:

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:41 pm**

rebeccariots2 wrote:
letsskiptotheleft wrote:There's not too much pro-independence sympathies in Wales AAW, at least not around here, think it's more of a few PC trying to bask in any SNP glory.
She's going up to Scotland this week for a pro YES visit apparently - Leanne that is.

Hah! Leanne hasn't got an original bone in her body, at least, and it pains me to say it that Scotland has a stronger case for independence, if Wales had an economic miracle then maybe yes, but we are as a nation too poor, and that won't change anytime soon, yes the system is rotten, power, influence and economic might is focused on too small an area, but areas of England have been shafted too.

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:44 pm**

Nite all

Posted: **Sun 07 Sep, 2014 11:47 pm**

The bastards are still dreaming up and bringing in even more evil practices. Looks like they will keep on getting nastier and nastier right up until election day.

Coming Soon: The privatised sick note service that will email you back to work
http://davidhencke.wordpress.com/2014/0 ... k-to-work/

... In two months time the traditional doctor’s note excusing you from work will start to cease being valid if you are still sick after four weeks.

Just before Parliament went into the summer recess welfare reform minister, Lord Freud, announced that a US multinational company,Maximus, which also operates in Canada and Saudi Arabia will take over running the new Health and Work Service for England and Wales... The Scottish government has declined to contract out the work to the private firm and will keep the assessment programme as part of the public service.
... More worryingly it appears that the private company which will make the decision will not see anyone – and create a Return to Work programme via a call centre telephone interview and a decision by email.

The package is supposed to be agreed between the sick person and the private company and sent to both the individual and their employer. Failure to co-operate with the service will mean the individual will lose their sick pay.

Lord Freud is quoted in a DWP press release emphasising how the scheme will improve economic productivity and get people back to work faster.

Read the full piece to be truly depressed. Expect the Lib Dems to wake up to this being nasty and unfair in about 10 years time going by their record to date.

FlyTheNest

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