FlyTheNest

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 7:36 am**

Morning all.

The top story on both the BBC and Guardian website is the negative (and probably utterly untrue if they're true to form) campaigning by the Tories, having again misused public resources by using the Treasury as a wing of the Tory election campaign, about Labour's spending plans.

Tories attack Labour on '£20.7bn unfunded spending' commitments
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30677112" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Didn't someone on here say yesterday that the IFS had said Labour has they least unfunded commitments of the three main parties?

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 8:14 am**

Spacedone wrote:Morning all.

The top story on both the BBC and Guardian website is the negative (and probably utterly untrue if they're true to form) campaigning by the Tories, having again misused public resources by using the Treasury as a wing of the Tory election campaign, about Labour's spending plans.

Tories attack Labour on '£20.7bn unfunded spending' commitments
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30677112" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Didn't someone on here say yesterday that the IFS had said Labour has they least unfunded commitments of the three main parties?

Morning - it was Chris Leslie citing the IFS (well not on here but that's the original source I think).

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 9:10 am**

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
Spacedone wrote:Morning all.

The top story on both the BBC and Guardian website is the negative (and probably utterly untrue if they're true to form) campaigning by the Tories, having again misused public resources by using the Treasury as a wing of the Tory election campaign, about Labour's spending plans.

Tories attack Labour on '£20.7bn unfunded spending' commitments
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30677112" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Didn't someone on here say yesterday that the IFS had said Labour has they least unfunded commitments of the three main parties?

Morning - it was Chris Leslie citing the IFS (well not on here but that's the original source I think).

Two points need hammering home by Labour when asked about this. First, as quoted Shadow chancellor Ed Balls has also written to the Treasury's most senior civil servant, Sir Nicholas Macpherson, to request "urgent reform".
Mr Balls said the practice of the Treasury basing costings on "assumptions provided by special advisers, is now putting HM Treasury officials in an impossible position owing to Conservative advisers consistently providing blatantly false and politically-motivated assumptions." and secondly the push to get the OBR to formally examine each parties economic plans. Chote said it was a good idea.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 9:34 am**

StephenDolan wrote:
PaulfromYorkshire wrote:
Spacedone wrote:Morning all.

The top story on both the BBC and Guardian website is the negative (and probably utterly untrue if they're true to form) campaigning by the Tories, having again misused public resources by using the Treasury as a wing of the Tory election campaign, about Labour's spending plans.

Tories attack Labour on '£20.7bn unfunded spending' commitments
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30677112" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Didn't someone on here say yesterday that the IFS had said Labour has they least unfunded commitments of the three main parties?

Morning - it was Chris Leslie citing the IFS (well not on here but that's the original source I think).
Two points need hammering home by Labour when asked about this. First, as quoted Shadow chancellor Ed Balls has also written to the Treasury's most senior civil servant, Sir Nicholas Macpherson, to request "urgent reform".
Mr Balls said the practice of the Treasury basing costings on "assumptions provided by special advisers, is now putting HM Treasury officials in an impossible position owing to Conservative advisers consistently providing blatantly false and politically-motivated assumptions." and secondly the push to get the OBR to formally examine each parties economic plans. Chote said it was a good idea.

Completely agree.

The OBR thing was a very smart move by Balls. Whenever the "unfunded" accusation comes up the Eds can just say look this is all hearsay. We asked to have our figures analysed and the Government have refused. We'd still like it to happen. What are they scared of?

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 9:53 am**

Good morning.

Shamed MP Neil Hamilton may contest Portsmouth South for Ukip

A leaked report suggests the UK Independence Party (Ukip) is being forced to find a seat for Mr Hamilton to campaign for – and Portsmouth South is being sized up.(News)

And what an honour it will be if Portsmouth South gets everyone else's reject.

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/ ... -1-6502451

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 9:55 am**

Andy Burnham ‏@andyburnhammp 52m52 minutes ago
Labour will soon reveal detailed & costed 10-year plan for NHS & social care. Would've mentioned on BBC but struggle to get word in edgeways

Good morning all. Look forward to this from AB and Labour.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 9:58 am**

PorFavor wrote:Good morning.

Shamed MP Neil Hamilton may contest Portsmouth South for Ukip

A leaked report suggests the UK Independence Party (Ukip) is being forced to find a seat for Mr Hamilton to campaign for – and Portsmouth South is being sized up.(News)
And what an honour it will be if Portsmouth South gets everyone else's reject.

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/ ... -1-6502451

I felt for you when I read this PF - honestly I did. The ridicule has already started - before the man has even been selected. And they're only going to foist Hamilton on the electorate because one of their big wig donors is demanding it. And Farage has the nerve to criticise other parties for being gravy train ruled ....

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 11:07 am**

What a freak show that would be if Handycock also stood as an Independent (which is, it seems, distinctly possible)

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 11:18 am**

AnatolyKasparov wrote:What a freak show that would be if Handycock also stood as an Independent (which is, it seems, distinctly possible)

Morning all.
I thought it was pretty much nailed on that Hancock would stand as an Independent, because the pay off is larger for an MP defeated in an election rather than one standing down

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 11:35 am**

danesclose wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:What a freak show that would be if Handycock also stood as an Independent (which is, it seems, distinctly possible)
Morning all.
I thought it was pretty much nailed on that Hancock would stand as an Independent, because the pay off is larger for an MP defeated in an election rather than one standing down

Oh, yes - I think there's next to no chance of his not standing.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 11:35 am**

Good-morning, everyone.

Has the Portsmouth South candidate read the job description? It's a great big responsibility representing a constituency in Parliament.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 12:20 pm**

A Sparrow just shared the Tory 'analysis' on Lab spending, and the Labour rebuttal

: B6lbGdEIAAEMI5n.jpg (33.01 KiB) Viewed 15940 times

: B6laoFeIAAAwCPG.jpg (62.29 KiB) Viewed 15940 times

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 12:20 pm**

Wow, this is starting to get awfully close to Number 10...

Murder link to Margaret Thatcher aide accused of raping teenage boy

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... e-boy.html

Scotland Yard is investigating a possible link between one of Margaret Thatcher’s closest aides and the unsolved murder of an eight-year-old boy in the 1980s.

Sir Peter Morrison, the former deputy chairman of the Conservative Party who died in 1995, was a known child molester but was never charged with any crime during his lifetime.

Now police are examining whether the MP for Chester could have had any link to the unsolved murder of eight-year-old Vishal Mehrotra in 1981.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 12:56 pm**

Kevin Maguire ‏@Kevin_Maguire 14m14 minutes ago
See on Osborne's face he knows that Tory launch went badly. Report on Labour spending not worth the paper it's printed on

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:04 pm**

BBC showing favoritism again

: 10888448_325465817648155_6729976503469516479_n.jpg (67.3 KiB) Viewed 15894 times

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:14 pm**

Jeremy Cliffe ‏@JeremyCliffe 28m28 minutes ago
Osborne would be mad to let the OBR audit Labour's spending plans: they would probably get a clean bill of health.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:14 pm**

The Tory press conference seems not to have gone down to well with the journalists. Summed it like this:

"Here's some dodgy numbers based on anything any Labour MP has ever said. Aren't you impressed?"
"No"

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:15 pm**

Sudden thought:

People of all political persuasions were, a few years ago, all muttering about people out of work for whatever reason getting more than they were.

I wonder if they've realised that with wages falling they have been used, and will be again if the Tories get in, as part of the solution?

Cut their wages even more, and the Cons can carry on slashing SS to level them out.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:24 pm**

Jonathan Ashworth MP ‏@JonAshworth 2m2 minutes ago
Oh dear Sajid Javid just forced to concede Tories haven't 'spelt out' how they will fund their £7bn+ tax cuts #WATO

It was painful to listen to.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:30 pm**

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Jonathan Ashworth MP ‏@JonAshworth 2m2 minutes ago
Oh dear Sajid Javid just forced to concede Tories haven't 'spelt out' how they will fund their £7bn+ tax cuts #WATO
It was painful to listen to.

It was, I was laughing so much at how bad he was that I may have bruised a rib. This mob really are useless, roll out their big guns for a major press conference & then let the whole thing unravel just an hour later.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:31 pm**

Ed Balls did pretty well on WATO just now.

This Tory dossier on Labour spending plans ... so it's now perfectly acceptable to make up your opponent's spending plans? They must be running scared and playing very very dirty to have decided they want to spend more time on preparing an alternative Labour manifesto and budget than sorting out the detail - such as a gaping 7bn funding gap - for their own.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:35 pm**

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Jonathan Ashworth MP ‏@JonAshworth 2m2 minutes ago
Oh dear Sajid Javid just forced to concede Tories haven't 'spelt out' how they will fund their £7bn+ tax cuts #WATO
It was painful to listen to.
It was, I was laughing so much at how bad he was that I may have bruised a rib. This mob really are useless, roll out their big guns for a major press conference & then let the whole thing unravel just an hour later.

Agree. And I agree with this too:

Tony McNulty ‏@Tony_McNulty 6m6 minutes ago
@abelardinelli Hope Tories keep @sajidjavid as major spokesperson - won't last five minutes in the election campaign proper #WatoCarCrash

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:36 pm**

He (Nick Clegg - and if you read on you'll see that it really couldn't have been anyone else (apart from, perhaps, any other LibDem)) also refused to rule out going into coalition with Ukip, although he said he could not see any meeting point between them and said Nigel Farage represented everything he opposed. (Andrew Sparrow, Guardian)

Edited

Just to clarify - the bit in the (wrong sort of) brackets was my two-penn'orth and not Andrew Sparrow's (or whoever's writing the blog).

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:41 pm**

rebeccariots2 wrote:
TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote: It was painful to listen to.
It was, I was laughing so much at how bad he was that I may have bruised a rib. This mob really are useless, roll out their big guns for a major press conference & then let the whole thing unravel just an hour later.
Agree. And I agree with this too:
Tony McNulty ‏@Tony_McNulty 6m6 minutes ago
@abelardinelli Hope Tories keep @sajidjavid as major spokesperson - won't last five minutes in the election campaign proper #WatoCarCrash

Crazy thing is that was why Javid for the Culture gig; not because of his love of the Arts, but because he was supposed to be a safe pair of hands on radio & TV. Instead it is turning into a toss up as to who is the biggest liability media-wise, Javid or Gove. As I don't have the proverbial heart of stone I hope you'll forgive me a vindictive chuckle .....

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:43 pm**

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Kevin Maguire ‏@Kevin_Maguire 14m14 minutes ago
See on Osborne's face he knows that Tory launch went badly. Report on Labour spending not worth the paper it's printed on

Andrew Sparrow Tweeted that it wasn't very convincing, but Osborne didn't seem bothered. I replied he wouldn't be if he was as out of it as he was the other week.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:43 pm**

PorFavor wrote:
He (Nick Clegg - and if you read on you'll see that it really couldn't have been anyone else (apart from, perhaps, any other LibDem)) also refused to rule out going into coalition with Ukip, although he said he could not see any meeting point between them and said Nigel Farage represented everything he opposed. (Andrew Sparrow, Guardian)

He's making them into a right tarts' party ... and sorry for being offensive to tarts - who I'm sure don't want to be associated with the Lib Dems in any way whatsoever.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:48 pm**

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Jonathan Ashworth MP ‏@JonAshworth 2m2 minutes ago
Oh dear Sajid Javid just forced to concede Tories haven't 'spelt out' how they will fund their £7bn+ tax cuts #WATO
It was painful to listen to.
It was, I was laughing so much at how bad he was that I may have bruised a rib. This mob really are useless, roll out their big guns for a major press conference & then let the whole thing unravel just an hour later.

A few years ago I read that policy decisions were sort of on the hoof. They don't do much meeting around a table to thrash things out and get their stories straight.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:50 pm**

rebeccariots2 wrote:
PorFavor wrote:
He (Nick Clegg - and if you read on you'll see that it really couldn't have been anyone else (apart from, perhaps, any other LibDem)) also refused to rule out going into coalition with Ukip, although he said he could not see any meeting point between them and said Nigel Farage represented everything he opposed. (Andrew Sparrow, Guardian)
He's making them into a right tarts' party ... and sorry for being offensive to tarts - who I'm sure don't want to be associated with the Lib Dems in any way whatsoever.

I'm not well acquainted with many tarts except a few old ones like me, but I think they have more integrity in their little fingers than the whole sorry bunch of LibDems.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:51 pm**

Tories call on Cameron to gerrymander the electoral register
http://peterblack.blogspot.co.uk/2015/0 ... ander.html

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:52 pm**

ohsocynical wrote:A few years ago I read that policy decisions were sort of on the hoof. They don't do much meeting around a table to thrash things out and get their stories straight.

Judging by the body language displayed in that press conference today, you get the feeling some of them can hardly bear to be in the same room with each other, let alone round a table. I grow more convinced that the Tory Party is on the verge of splintering, terminally, and is just being held together by George & Lynton's enforcers; but how much longer can they keep things together, would be nice if they imploded before the election.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:55 pm**

rebeccariots2 wrote:Ed Balls did pretty well on WATO just now.

This Tory dossier on Labour spending plans ... so it's now perfectly acceptable to make up your opponent's spending plans? They must be running scared and playing very very dirty to have decided they want to spend more time on preparing an alternative Labour manifesto and budget than sorting out the detail - such as a gaping 7bn funding gap - for their own.

I imagine the cupboard's pretty bare for the Tory spin doctors...Almost the minute they come up with a slogan or plan it's easily discounted or so juvenile no-one takes it seriously.

They are so not up to the job. It's just a shame people are only now catching on.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:55 pm**

Paul Waugh @paulwaugh
Asked if Tory party were going to do similar costing analysis of LibDems plans, Treasury source replies, with a smile, "No:

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:56 pm**

Just come across The Times cartoonist Peter Brookes take on the Tory poster, published on Saturday - how did this get past Mudoch

: B6YFNL7IYAAsKGl.jpg (107.02 KiB) Viewed 15827 times

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 1:59 pm**

ohsocynical wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:Ed Balls did pretty well on WATO just now.

This Tory dossier on Labour spending plans ... so it's now perfectly acceptable to make up your opponent's spending plans? They must be running scared and playing very very dirty to have decided they want to spend more time on preparing an alternative Labour manifesto and budget than sorting out the detail - such as a gaping 7bn funding gap - for their own.
I imagine the cupboard's pretty bare for the Tory spin doctors...Almost the minute they come up with a slogan or plan it's easily discounted or so juvenile no-one takes it seriously.

They are so not up to the job. It's just a shame people are only now catching on.

I don't know why Ohso (but will accept it's got something to do with my smutty mind) but I keep having an image of a bloke with his flies wide open furiously pointing out a small bit of someone's vest showing as utterly disgusting ... that seems to be the Tories campaign summed up.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:00 pm**

Toby Latimer wrote:Just come across The Times cartoonist Peter Brookes take on the Tory poster, published on Saturday - how did this get past Mudoch
The attachment B6YFNL7IYAAsKGl.jpg is no longer available

Martin's is better I think.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:03 pm**

Courtesy of Laura McInerney, here's one of the policy proposals. Think how much this cost of civil service time if this was replicated for everything.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... hority.pdf

And it begins...

Policy assumptions from HM Treasury’s special advisers

There you go - government website putting out Tory Party propaganda. This should be on the Tories own website using their own people. Or get the OBR to cost them.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:07 pm**

@Toby Latimer

Thanks for the Times cartoon. It's very good. I couldn't use my gratitude-ometer as you've been spreading yourself about a bit and I can't get over you (so I'll have to get up and go round. Boo boom.)!

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:09 pm**

GENERAL ELECTION PREDICTIONS 31: LONDON CENTRAL
http://www.iaindale.com/posts/2015/01/0 ... um=twitter

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:12 pm**

PorFavor wrote:@Toby Latimer

Thanks for the Times cartoon. It's very good. I couldn't use my gratitude-ometer as you've been spreading yourself about a bit and I can't get over you (so I'll have to get up and go round. Boo boom.)!

Rather surprised to see it in a Tory supporting paper, i would expect it in the Indy perhaps, or the Mirror or Graun.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:14 pm**

Here's the bus driver's son Javid having a car crash interview on TWAO http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p02gbfmq" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:14 pm**

Toby Latimer wrote:
PorFavor wrote:@Toby Latimer

Thanks for the Times cartoon. It's very good. I couldn't use my gratitude-ometer as you've been spreading yourself about a bit and I can't get over you (so I'll have to get up and go round. Boo boom.)!

Rather surprised to see it in a Tory supporting paper, i would expect it in the Indy perhaps, or the Mirror or Graun.

Yes - so am I. A pleasant surprise, though.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:24 pm**

rebeccariots2 wrote:
GENERAL ELECTION PREDICTIONS 31: LONDON CENTRAL
http://www.iaindale.com/posts/2015/01/0 ... um=twitter

Well that was a bit dull, wasn't it?

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:28 pm**

I see Giselle97 has taken up Mark Ferguson's critical stance re Labour with him ... and sparked a bit of a discussion.

Giselle
‏@giselle97
@Markfergusonuk More unresearched anti-Labour negative comments from you Mark. Why don't you just change completely to Tory/LibDem #WeBackEd

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:30 pm**

Willow904 wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
GENERAL ELECTION PREDICTIONS 31: LONDON CENTRAL
http://www.iaindale.com/posts/2015/01/0 ... um=twitter
Well that was a bit dull, wasn't it?

Yes - except I like the bits where he says the Labour majority will increase substantially - most notably for Emily Thornberry in Islington.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:30 pm**

I remember reading something ages ago about sexual representation and allusion in imagery. It said that valleys and clefts were representative of female sexual organs and that towers and suchlike represent a phallus.

In the tory image, you have the road/penis stretching effortlessly forward into...a declevity/vagina in the hills...that is not in the original image.

Or that is one reading anyway. But they have definitely altered the image to make that declevity for the road to plunge manfully into.

I'm sorry to draw this to your attention, but this may be a nasty glance into the mental workings of Corrinne Stockheath from Surrey. Or mine. You are the judges!

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:31 pm**

RogerOThornhill wrote:Courtesy of Laura McInerney, here's one of the policy proposals. Think how much this cost of civil service time if this was replicated for everything.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... hority.pdf

And it begins...

Policy assumptions from HM Treasury’s special advisers

There you go - government website putting out Tory Party propaganda. This should be on the Tories own website using their own people. Or get the OBR to cost them.

Political Scrapbook had a similar story that the "assumptions@ for the Labour costings was from Treasury SPADs, not Treasury Officials

http://politicalscrapbook.net/2015/01/f ... officials/

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:33 pm**

RogerOThornhill wrote:Courtesy of Laura McInerney, here's one of the policy proposals. Think how much this cost of civil service time if this was replicated for everything.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... hority.pdf

And it begins...

Policy assumptions from HM Treasury’s special advisers

There you go - government website putting out Tory Party propaganda. This should be on the Tories own website using their own people. Or get the OBR to cost them.

The 'policy assumptions from HM Treasury's special advisers' is wholly inappropriate, as you say, Roger. Current government's special advisers put on this task pulling data out of context from the Opposition & making up assumptions is wrong. It's repugnant to me to see this obvious political guerilla tactics from current government using 'government stationery' as a legitimising effort.

Let the OBR do it.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:33 pm**

I think that is *slightly* unfair on Mark Ferguson tbh - though I equally understand why people get frustrated with him

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:42 pm**

mikems wrote:I remember reading something ages ago about sexual representation and allusion in imagery. It said that valleys and clefts were representative of female sexual organs and that towers and suchlike represent a phallus.

In the tory image, you have the road/penis stretching effortlessly forward into...a declevity/vagina in the hills...that is not in the original image.

Or that is one reading anyway. But they have definitely altered the image to make that declevity for the road to plunge manfully into.

I'm sorry to draw this to your attention, but this may be a nasty glance into the mental workings of Corrinne Stockheath from Surrey. Or mine. You are the judges!

Ah, well. That's the Conservatives - hoping to carry on shafting practically everyone.

Sorry. But you started it (or Corinne Stockheath from Surrey (who?) did). As you can probably tell, I'm no judge of anything . . . .

Edited for sodding brackets.

Posted: **Mon 05 Jan, 2015 2:47 pm**

AnatolyKasparov wrote:I think that is *slightly* unfair on Mark Ferguson tbh - though I equally understand why people get frustrated with him

Frustrated is an understatement. After the leadership crisis that wasn't he acknowledged his tendency to be negative, and promised to critique rather than criticise; but he has just carried on in the same vein. I'm with Giselle 100%, I think Ferguson has become part of the problem, not the solution.

FlyTheNest

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