Monday 23rd March 2015

[citizenJA]

goodnight, Willow

[pk1]

Guysssss(and gals) please !

Fwiw, I took LadyC's post as a piece of humour too so I'm pleased to see her confirm it.

@AAW, don't go. You should know that bullying wouldn't ever have been acceptable on this forum & it won't start to be deemed acceptable now !

S'truth, I'm not sure what's in the water you've all been drinking today !

[LadyCentauria]

Evening Peeps.

Having left the house spitting with apoplectic rage and with steam coming out of my ears after the 11-minute Party Political Broadcast on the BBC 6 o'clock news (more of which later) I went to hear my PPC speak.

He was very good; delivered a good passionate but very locally-based talk; outlined Labour policy very clearly; and described Ed as a statesman citing his work on climate change and his stance on Syria.
There were about 25 people there (which is actually more than was expected) and we had a lot of questions which Matthew answered very well. He knows the local area very well, and I thought he did good.

Back to the Beeb - I am really angry and I intend to complain to the BBC. Not only did they lead with this bilge and keep it going for far too long, they went back to Landale in Downing St. halfway through then referred to it again in the headlines at the end.
Less than a minute on Amin. Absolutely outrageous.

LadyC - I read it as intended.

Glad your PPC did well at tonight's meeting – I wish him every success on Polling Day.

Re: the quasi-party-political broadcast. It really doesn't warrant top spot or such a large segment of the programme, does it. Unless he's a) just announced he's standing down as party-leader regardless of the result on May 7th, or b) could be construed as signalling an intent to write a new law that says no-one can serve more than two terms as PM but none of the hacks have, so far, suggested that. Oh joy, Evan Davies will have Michael Gove on Newsnight to explain David Cameron's thinking...

And, thank you

[ephemerid]

Thank you, @Hobiejoe. That was the exactly spirit in which my silly sense of humour led me to write the piece

To me it came across as someone in a room, talking in a loud voice, surrounded by friends taking the p$ss out of a person, knowing their target could hear them but would be unlikely to challenge them. In other words, bullying.
Hugo had reached out a hand with a link to a funny article, the disagreements were starting to be smoothed over. Your mocking post did nothing to help that healing. There is a place for humour. In the middle of a disagreement is not it - esp when one party has reached out to end it.
Others disagree with me on this, I wrote to a moderator and got no reply, so I am obviously in the wrong place. Leave your mocking, bullying post be, but I won't stay around to see more of it.

Been nice knowing you all and I will miss being here for the election but I cannot stay in a place where people are mocked in this way - for the crime of posting on a public forum.

I shall miss you. I'd rather you didn't go.

[pk1]

YouGov/Sun:

CON 34 (+1)
LAB 34 (-1)
LD 8 (nc)
UKIP 12 (-2)
GRN 6 (+1)

[refitman]

Janice Atkinson has been expelled from Ukip.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32028343" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[TheGrimSqueaker]

Helen Pidd ‏@helenpidd · 8h8 hours ago
Re Danczuk slagging off Ed M: I've been on the doorstep in Dewsbury this morning and a few voters, unprompted, started ranting about him.

Graun stepping up the anti-Ed attacks then.

[LadyCentauria]

Thank you, @Hobiejoe. That was the exactly spirit in which my silly sense of humour led me to write the piece

To me it came across as someone in a room, talking in a loud voice, surrounded by friends taking the p$ss out of a person, knowing their target could hear them but would be unlikely to challenge them. In other words, bullying.
Hugo had reached out a hand with a link to a funny article, the disagreements were starting to be smoothed over. Your mocking post did nothing to help that healing. There is a place for humour. In the middle of a disagreement is not it - esp when one party has reached out to end it.
Others disagree with me on this, I wrote to a moderator and got no reply, so I am obviously in the wrong place. Leave your mocking, bullying post be, but I won't stay around to see more of it.

Been nice knowing you all and I will miss being here for the election but I cannot stay in a place where people are mocked in this way - for the crime of posting on a public forum.

I don't know what to do. I'm stunned you'd think such a thing of me and I'm really sorry my post upset you so much. There was no intent whatsoever to mock or bully Hugo, who I've never had a problem with and who, I'm sure, would tell me if he had a problem with me or my attempt at humour. Perhaps the moderator you wrote to hasn't seen your letter, yet. Please don't leave.

[refitman]

@AAW - I didn't see your post and therefore PM until 10:30 (I have been busy on other sites). I replied as soon as I did see it.

[ErnstRemarx]

Just a thought, but perhaps this Cameron to step down stuff is an attempt to give the party some sort of bounce similar to that that Major got when he replaced Thatcher, but without the chaos of a defenestration.

I'm amused at the idea that Cameron discussing when he's going to step down is meant to give the Tories a leg up any time soon. He's more popular (though fuck knows why) than his loathsome party, but they seem keen to hit the eject button. Very odd behaviour. I can only assume that the pressure's getting to him.

[TechnicalEphemera]

On the Hugo stuff today.

SH is famous, at least in the world of CiF. His identity has always been a source of speculation, perhaps more what he is than who he is.

He has been welcomed here, although many disagree with his views. However FTN both demands non-conformists and then gets annoyed with them. This is worryingly similar to the Tory party view of Scotland. Probably this is something the forum needs to get over, but as this election has all the friendliness and sense of fair play of an Old Firm match I don't see that happening before May.

The debate as I saw it resolved in an agreement to respect anonymity in general, and to be mindful that Hugo should not face personal attacks just because he has a different take on stuff. The post that seems to have offended was merely riffing on the man of mystery that is Hugo, I didn't read any disrespect into it.

[StephenDolan]

Just catching up, sad to see fallings out happening. For my 2ps worth I read LC piece as rather funny, not having a go at SH (which I'd never consider that to be her style)

It's a long run up to the GE and it's getting rather twitchy and nervy, let's keep the laser focus on Cameron being booted out. all round.
Which reminds me, I must book the next day off. Staying up all night is unlikely so the challenge is working out when the optimal 3hr sleep slot is. I'd be interested to hear what other's plans and strategies are!

[TechnicalEphemera]

Just a thought, but perhaps this Cameron to step down stuff is an attempt to give the party some sort of bounce similar to that that Major got when he replaced Thatcher, but without the chaos of a defenestration.

I'm amused at the idea that Cameron discussing when he's going to step down is meant to give the Tories a leg up any time soon. He's more popular (though fuck knows why) than his loathsome party, but they seem keen to hit the eject button. Very odd behaviour. I can only assume that the pressure's getting to him.

Bonkers wasn't it.

Talking about a third term when you have never won an election outright and you are in a knife fight to even hang on to minority government is hubris.

If Cameron loses in May every hack on the planet will point to that interview as the point he lost it. That will be bollocks of course, but it makes such a great story they won't be able to resist it.

[pk1]

Helen Pidd ‏@helenpidd · 8h8 hours ago
Re Danczuk slagging off Ed M: I've been on the doorstep in Dewsbury this morning and a few voters, unprompted, started ranting about him.

Graun stepping up the anti-Ed attacks then.

I took that to mean they were ranting about Danczuk, not EM.

Reading Pidd's TL makes it clear she meant EM so I'm feeling more than a little stupid right now......

[ErnstRemarx]

I do agree with this.Why are people attacking SH so much today?Disagree with the points he makes,or if he pisses you off so much scroll past his posts.He was made welcome here,is polite and honest in his views,and I have seen nothing he has written here to warrant any of this.

I rather read it as an entertaining piece of whimsy, making light of a situation, and maybe intended to diffuse tensions.

Of course FTN is a welcoming place, this is why I enjoy it, mainly as a lurker, I'm afraid. But I can also see why the odd member may raise an online eyebrow at SH's beliefs, motivations and intentions. Sadly I'm not particularly attuned to nuance, or sometimes even clonking obviocity (not a word? I still like it), so I shall just watch with interest from here on in.

Thank you, @Hobiejoe. That was the exactly spirit in which my silly sense of humour led me to write the piece. However, if the mods/admins feel it should be expunged from the record I will, of course, delete it.

Nah, if we start taking stuff off (and we never have yet) that simply is whimsical, then we end up like the fucking Graun - not a good place to be. SH hasn't objected, if you'd like to know, and I'm glad he's here and feels able to post. I may not agree with him on various subjects, but I'm damned if differences on detail will dictate FTN's policies, and I can state without fear of contradiction that Dan and Paul will probably feel the same way.

Let's move on.

[StephenDolan]

' The shadow chancellor will say in a speech in Birmingham on Tuesday: “VAT is the tax that every Tory government in the last 40 years has raised. But no Labour government has ever hiked up the main rate of VAT.

“We will make our tax commitments in full in our manifesto. But I am clear that while millionaires have been given a huge tax cut, working people are paying more in tax after the last five years of the Tories.

“So today I can announce a clear pledge to the British people. The next Labour government will not raise VAT.”'

Great news.

[Tubby Isaacs]

EU leaders looking at Cameron and thinking "Hmm, this bozo will be gone soon anyway"

[pk1]

' The shadow chancellor will say in a speech in Birmingham on Tuesday: “VAT is the tax that every Tory government in the last 40 years has raised. But no Labour government has ever hiked up the main rate of VAT.

“We will make our tax commitments in full in our manifesto. But I am clear that while millionaires have been given a huge tax cut, working people are paying more in tax after the last five years of the Tories.

“So today I can announce a clear pledge to the British people. The next Labour government will not raise VAT.”'

Great news.

Makes the headlines on CityAM

[TheGrimSqueaker]

Helen Pidd ‏@helenpidd · 8h8 hours ago
Re Danczuk slagging off Ed M: I've been on the doorstep in Dewsbury this morning and a few voters, unprompted, started ranting about him.

Graun stepping up the anti-Ed attacks then.

I took that to mean they were ranting about Danczuk, not EM.

Reading Pidd's TL makes it clear she meant EM so I'm feeling more than a little stupid right now......

I doubt many people on the doorstep even know who Danczuk is, or care. Just Pidd indulging in a bit of cheap abuse, and of course we believe her that it was all unprompted.

[diGriz]

In response to the MSM quoting out of context, Gove just said of Cameron

What is striking is that David Cameron has been honest today...

[TheGrimSqueaker]

Any road up .....

I shall wish you all a good night. Big day tomorrow, first day back at work so better get some sleep.

[citizenJA]

' The shadow chancellor will say in a speech in Birmingham on Tuesday: “VAT is the tax that every Tory government in the last 40 years has raised. But no Labour government has ever hiked up the main rate of VAT.

“We will make our tax commitments in full in our manifesto. But I am clear that while millionaires have been given a huge tax cut, working people are paying more in tax after the last five years of the Tories.

“So today I can announce a clear pledge to the British people. The next Labour government will not raise VAT.”'

Great news.

Makes the headlines on CityAM

Oh, naturally.

[citizenJA]

Any road up .....

I shall wish you all a good night. Big day tomorrow, first day back at work so better get some sleep.

Me too.
goodnight, comrades.
love
JA

[ErnstRemarx]

Thank you, @Hobiejoe. That was the exactly spirit in which my silly sense of humour led me to write the piece

To me it came across as someone in a room, talking in a loud voice, surrounded by friends taking the p$ss out of a person, knowing their target could hear them but would be unlikely to challenge them. In other words, bullying.
Hugo had reached out a hand with a link to a funny article, the disagreements were starting to be smoothed over. Your mocking post did nothing to help that healing. There is a place for humour. In the middle of a disagreement is not it - esp when one party has reached out to end it.
Others disagree with me on this, I wrote to a moderator and got no reply, so I am obviously in the wrong place. Leave your mocking, bullying post be, but I won't stay around to see more of it.

Been nice knowing you all and I will miss being here for the election but I cannot stay in a place where people are mocked in this way - for the crime of posting on a public forum.

I don't know what to do. I'm stunned you'd think such a thing of me and I'm really sorry my post upset you so much. There was no intent whatsoever to mock or bully Hugo, who I've never had a problem with and who, I'm sure, would tell me if he had a problem with me or my attempt at humour. Perhaps the moderator you wrote to hasn't seen your letter, yet. Please don't leave.

I've received no complaint from Hugo and I've emailed AAW in an attempt to get this sorted out.

Here's the rule. Tackle the ball, not the man. That's for everyone. Engage the argument, not the person. I'm not interested in minutiae. If we cannot behave like adults on this board then we set a very poor example to others and cheapen the place - and I'm sure that no one here wants that.

Think twice before you hit 'submit' is all I ask, and I'm sure Dan and Paul will concur.

[LadyCentauria]

Any road up .....

I shall wish you all a good night. Big day tomorrow, first day back at work so better get some sleep.

Hope it goes well, Grim

[ErnstRemarx]

Any road up .....

I shall wish you all a good night. Big day tomorrow, first day back at work so better get some sleep.

Good luck, cock - sleep well.

[pk1]

Any road up .....

I shall wish you all a good night. Big day tomorrow, first day back at work so better get some sleep.

Take it easy, you've had your warning.

[pk1]

' The shadow chancellor will say in a speech in Birmingham on Tuesday: “VAT is the tax that every Tory government in the last 40 years has raised. But no Labour government has ever hiked up the main rate of VAT.

“We will make our tax commitments in full in our manifesto. But I am clear that while millionaires have been given a huge tax cut, working people are paying more in tax after the last five years of the Tories.

“So today I can announce a clear pledge to the British people. The next Labour government will not raise VAT.”'

Great news.

Makes the headlines on CityAM

Oh, naturally.

I have no idea what you're implying but the image is there & it proves what I said.

[RogerOThornhill]

Makes the headlines on CityAM

Oh, naturally.

I have no idea what you're implying but the image is there & it proves what I said.

I'm guessing that it's because City AM is run by a load of free market, small state, low tax loons who'd act like a Heath Robinson cartoon if anyone had the temerity of mentioning raising taxes. These people loathe taxation.

[RogerOThornhill]

Well that's saying what you think!

Adam Boulton
‏@adamboultonSKY
Still think all this @David_Cameron stuff is boring wank which changes nothing that matters

[utopiandreams]

Work and Pensions - Fifth Report
Benefit sanctions policy beyond the Oakley Review: http://www.publications.parliament.uk/p ... /81402.htm

We recommend that DWP commission a broad independent review of benefit conditionality and sanctions, to investigate whether sanctions are being applied appropriately, fairly and proportionately, in accordance with the relevant Regulations and guidance, across the Jobcentre Plus network. This review should be established and report as soon as is practicable in the next Parliament.

I've only read the summary so far and although acknowledging problems is not as damning as it may be, but that's only to be expected by the behaviour of the Tory apologists on the committee during some of the evidence sessions. I suppose such recommendations are considered harsh in parliamentary language; they are not going to let it lay. My regret is that IDS, Cameron, Osborne and McVey shall not get their just desserts.