Tuesday 24th March 2015

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 6:30 am

Morning!

Labour 0.5% lead on Yougov - obviously reported (quite correctly) as level pegging but wanted to cheer everyone up

No scrapping please today friends. There's a Coalition to turf out

utopiandreams · Post by **utopiandreams** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 6:45 am

Morning.

Work and Pensions - Fifth Report
Benefit sanctions policy beyond the Oakley Review: http://www.publications.parliament.uk/p ... /81402.htm

We recommend that DWP commission a broad independent review of benefit conditionality and sanctions, to investigate whether sanctions are being applied appropriately, fairly and proportionately, in accordance with the relevant Regulations and guidance, across the Jobcentre Plus network. This review should be established and report as soon as is practicable in the next Parliament.

I've only read the summary and conclusions so far and although acknowledging problems it's not as damning as it may be, but that's only to be expected by the behaviour of the Tory apologists on the committee during some of the evidence sessions. I suppose such recommendations are considered harsh in parliamentary language; they are not going to let it lay. My difficulty with what I've seen so far is that the report implies good intention with a failure of delivery in some offices, whereas the evidence plus the sheer scale of sanctions prove otherwise. My regret is that IDS, Cameron, Osborne and McVey shall not get their just desserts.

Edit: I manually emboldened 'some' with html tags.

utopiandreams · Post by **utopiandreams** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 7:33 am

RobertSnozers wrote:... It really is imperative that we don't let them back in for a second try...

Yes, Robert. I believe this is one feeling we all share, albeit as has been suggested we should welcome other views. I must confess that from time to time I'm as guilty as anyone (in the other place) for my put downs. Anyway (and here I go again, speaking of myself - I've only the cats for company at the moment) my own views have been more closely aligned to those expressed by LibDems and although living in a Lab/Tory marginal have always voted according to my beliefs. I wanted PR as much as anything else. I guess the AV debacle was due in part to a breakage of constituency representation in true PR governance, although my ideal world would have greater autonomy of regions. I bow to your knowledge though when it comes to the NHS and am reticent about full devolvement; there must be national overview.

Anyway my point is that I am for the first time voting tactically.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 8:19 am

Morning.

I'm not on Twitter but always read Peter Jukes, am hoping he is right and that the blunder grows in effect.

Peter Jukes @peterjukes · 7h 7 hours ago
For months Fleet St filled of the kind of Pro Cameron campaigning money cannot buy. All changed. Changed utterly. A terrible blunder is born.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 8:29 am

utopiandreams wrote:
RobertSnozers wrote:... It really is imperative that we don't let them back in for a second try...
Yes, Robert. I believe this is one feeling we all share, albeit as has been suggested we should welcome other views. I must confess that from time to time I'm as guilty as anyone (in the other place) for my put downs. Anyway (and here I go again, speaking of myself - I've only the cats for company at the moment) my own views have been more closely aligned to those expressed by LibDems and although living in a Lab/Tory marginal have always voted according to my beliefs. I wanted PR as much as anything else. I guess the AV debacle was due in part to a breakage of constituency representation in true PR governance, although my ideal world would have greater autonomy of regions. I bow to your knowledge though when it comes to the NHS and am reticent about full devolvement; there must be national overview.

Anyway my point is that I am for the first time voting tactically.

Hi utopiandreams. I'm wondering if many other Libdem voters are thinking of doing likewise in Lab/Tory marginals. It would certainly explain why Rees-Mogg's comfortable margin in NE Somerset has disappeared as the combined Labour and Libdem votes easily outpoll him. A large Libdem switch to Labour could easily kick him out and your comments encourage me to think it poss. As AK said the other day, if people like Rees-Mogg are in danger that's Labour majority territory. Of course if the Libdem vote collapses in Lib/Tory marginals it could go the other way. That's why I'm not as anti-Libdem as some Labour supporters as I still feel many of their MPs are preferable to the Tories who would otherwise take their seats. It may be too much to expect Labour supporters to vote tactically for the Libdems after their performance in office, however.

ErnstRemarx · Post by **ErnstRemarx** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 8:32 am

utopiandreams wrote:
RobertSnozers wrote:... It really is imperative that we don't let them back in for a second try...
Yes, Robert. I believe this is one feeling we all share, albeit as has been suggested we should welcome other views. I must confess that from time to time I'm as guilty as anyone (in the other place) for my put downs. Anyway (and here I go again, speaking of myself - I've only the cats for company at the moment) my own views have been more closely aligned to those expressed by LibDems and although living in a Lab/Tory marginal have always voted according to my beliefs. I wanted PR as much as anything else. I guess the AV debacle was due in part to a breakage of constituency representation in true PR governance, although my ideal world would have greater autonomy of regions. I bow to your knowledge though when it comes to the NHS and am reticent about full devolvement; there must be national overview.

Anyway my point is that I am for the first time voting tactically.

Interesting stuff - can you tell us which constituency you live in? I'm in Bury North - a Tory/Labour marginal - and I've seen the money pour into the place as the Tories are maxing out their efforts to retain the seat. Just wondered how it was with you.

ErnstRemarx · Post by **ErnstRemarx** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 8:37 am

Willow904 wrote:
utopiandreams wrote:
RobertSnozers wrote:... It really is imperative that we don't let them back in for a second try...
Yes, Robert. I believe this is one feeling we all share, albeit as has been suggested we should welcome other views. I must confess that from time to time I'm as guilty as anyone (in the other place) for my put downs. Anyway (and here I go again, speaking of myself - I've only the cats for company at the moment) my own views have been more closely aligned to those expressed by LibDems and although living in a Lab/Tory marginal have always voted according to my beliefs. I wanted PR as much as anything else. I guess the AV debacle was due in part to a breakage of constituency representation in true PR governance, although my ideal world would have greater autonomy of regions. I bow to your knowledge though when it comes to the NHS and am reticent about full devolvement; there must be national overview.

Anyway my point is that I am for the first time voting tactically.
Hi utopiandreams. I'm wondering if many other Libdem voters are thinking of doing likewise in Lab/Tory marginals. It would certainly explain why Rees-Mogg's comfortable margin in NE Somerset has disappeared as the combined Labour and Libdem votes easily outpoll him. A large Libdem switch to Labour could easily kick him out and your comments encourage me to think it poss. As AK said the other day, if people like Rees-Mogg are in danger that's Labour majority territory. Of course if the Libdem vote collapses in Lib/Tory marginals it could go the other way. That's why I'm not as anti-Libdem as some Labour supporters as I still feel many of their MPs are preferable to the Tories who would otherwise take their seats. It may be too much to expect Labour supporters to vote tactically for the Libdems after their performance in office, however.

Wise words, and shrewd psephology there. Much of the FibDem vote has disappeared - principally to the Greens - but a large amount has headed Labour's way, and in the cold light of day, faced with the choice of which way to vote and knowing that the FibDems barely rank as also rans now in many seats, I rather suspect that the prospect of another 5 years of Tory rule will be instrumental in guiding some voters hands towards putting an X in the box marked Labour. I hope so anyway - after all, with the Greens unlikely to do more than poll about 5%, which way does a lefty voter go?

danesclose · Post by **danesclose** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 8:58 am

yahyah wrote:Morning.

I'm not on Twitter but always read Peter Jukes, am hoping he is right and that the blunder grows in effect.

Peter Jukes @peterjukes · 7h 7 hours ago
For months Fleet St filled of the kind of Pro Cameron campaigning money cannot buy. All changed. Changed utterly. A terrible blunder is born.

Morning all.

@yahyah - looks like Peter Jukes is correct. Fraser Nelson tweeted this:

Peter Jukes retweeted
Fraser Nelson @FraserNelson · 9h 9 hours ago

Starting gun? Nothing so deliberate. It’s the sound of Cameron shooting himself in the foot:

and the ever reliable Martin Rowson posted the following tweets:

So, to sum up: a Prime Minister too feeble to win a majority against Gordon Brown, before proving whether he's so feeble he can't win a...
...majority against Ed Miliband (who is, remember, the weakest monster or most evil weakling EVER), says he won't even TRY to fail to win...
..a majority against the next punchbag put up by Labour. Because of this meaningless speculation in furious frenzy the meejah starts to...
.shit itself FOREVER speculating even further. Angels on pinheads have nothing on these clowns:this is the Kremlinology of the Kindergarten

danesclose · Post by **danesclose** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:03 am

How to win friends & influence people the UKIP way Chapter 94:
http://edlnews.co.uk/2015/03/23/ukip-de ... -meetings/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:03 am

Trust a cartoonist to be so concise:

Kremlinology of the Kindergarten

Sums it up nicely.
Trouble is it's working quite well. Loads of Tories being invited to speculate on what it all means and being given carte blanche to get plenty of digs in at Labour. 'The mess we inherited/finishing the job on the economy' etc.

I hope it turns out to be a faux pas but given our useless media I'm not so sure it will.

utopiandreams · Post by **utopiandreams** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:11 am

ErnstRemarx wrote:Interesting stuff - can you tell us which constituency you live in? I'm in Bury North - a Tory/Labour marginal - and I've seen the money pour into the place as the Tories are maxing out their efforts to retain the seat. Just wondered how it was with you.

South Derbyshire, Ernst. I do have some reticence, not for myself but have at times alluded to things about others whose privacy I do respect.

Edit: I have met my previous MPs and have to say that I was particularly taken with Mark Todd, who stood down at the last election. I spoke on the telephone with his Labour replacement and he seemed more than willing to help with an issue I raised during the conversation. Okay he may have well have been canvassing but I assured him that it was all in hand at a local level. Indeed a representative from the local council arranged a meeting with someone from Matlock as well as a ministry bod. I've only exchanged emails with Margaret Wheeler, who I am not taken with. Neither was I with Edwina although I deigned to shake her hand.

Post by **letsskiptotheleft** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:12 am

Twitter has its moments, great for links of articles that would normally pass you by, but for sheer nastiness and scraping the bottom of the barrel you could do far, far worse than read the exchange between the two uber-trolls, Danczuk and that specimen Hopkins.

On a more restrained level there's a good exchange between Jay Rayner and Sarah Vine, god her and Gove deserve each other.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:17 am

Who's that at the door ?
Cameron's nanny whispering 'can I come in now, have got to cook the children's supper' ?
Or thinking 'there he is pratting around and pretending he's at home in the kitchen again'

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:18 am

frightful_oik wrote:Trust a cartoonist to be so concise:
Kremlinology of the Kindergarten
Sums it up nicely.
Trouble is it's working quite well. Loads of Tories being invited to speculate on what it all means and being given carte blanche to get plenty of digs in at Labour. 'The mess we inherited/finishing the job on the economy' etc.

I hope it turns out to be a faux pas but given our useless media I'm not so sure it will.

Indeed, I thought Humphrys with Fallon was a disgrace.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:26 am

My turn to have trouble thanking people today.

So, thanks

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:28 am

utopiandreams wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote:Interesting stuff - can you tell us which constituency you live in? I'm in Bury North - a Tory/Labour marginal - and I've seen the money pour into the place as the Tories are maxing out their efforts to retain the seat. Just wondered how it was with you.
South Derbyshire, Ernst. I do have some reticence, not for myself but have at times alluded to things about others whose privacy I do respect.

Edit: I have met my previous MPs and have to say that I was particularly taken with Mark Todd, who stood down at the last election. I spoke on the telephone with his Labour replacement and he seemed more than willing to help with an issue I raised during the conversation. Okay he may have well have been canvassing but I assured him that it was all in hand at a local level. Indeed a representative from the local council arranged a meeting with someone from Matlock as well as a ministry bod. I've only exchanged emails with Margaret Wheeler, who I am not taken with. Neither was I with Edwina although I deigned to shake her hand.

Heather Wheeler ud. Same constituency as me. She obvs just cuts and pastes some handout from CCHQ from the correspondence I've had. Unremarkable MP on so many levels. Mark Todd always sent personal replies to me. I've met some of the current Labour bods who seem decent sorts. The only literature I've received so far is from Lab and UKIP. Maybe Tories are short of troops on the ground.

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:29 am

StephenDolan wrote:
frightful_oik wrote:Trust a cartoonist to be so concise:
Kremlinology of the Kindergarten
Sums it up nicely.
Trouble is it's working quite well. Loads of Tories being invited to speculate on what it all means and being given carte blanche to get plenty of digs in at Labour. 'The mess we inherited/finishing the job on the economy' etc.

I hope it turns out to be a faux pas but given our useless media I'm not so sure it will.
Indeed, I thought Humphrys with Fallon was a disgrace.

That was the one I had in mind.

utopiandreams · Post by **utopiandreams** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:37 am

frightful_oik wrote:... Heather Wheeler ud. Same constituency as me..

Yes I had noticed that, frightful_oik, in some of your previous posts. Quite something for me given that I often have a black hole for names and places. Perhaps you've noticed that I over-compensate for it.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:42 am

Morning all.

There's low inflation...and now...no inflation at all.

The Consumer Prices Index (CPI) was unchanged in the year to February 2015, that is, a 12-month rate of 0.0%, down from 0.3% in January.

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/cpi/consu ... index.html

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:44 am

utopiandreams wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote:Interesting stuff - can you tell us which constituency you live in? I'm in Bury North - a Tory/Labour marginal - and I've seen the money pour into the place as the Tories are maxing out their efforts to retain the seat. Just wondered how it was with you.
South Derbyshire, Ernst. I do have some reticence, not for myself but have at times alluded to things about others whose privacy I do respect.

Edit: I have met my previous MPs and have to say that I was particularly taken with Mark Todd, who stood down at the last election. I spoke on the telephone with his Labour replacement and he seemed more than willing to help with an issue I raised during the conversation. Okay he may have well have been canvassing but I assured him that it was all in hand at a local level. Indeed a representative from the local council arranged a meeting with someone from Matlock as well as a ministry bod. I've only exchanged emails with Margaret Wheeler, who I am not taken with. Neither was I with Edwina although I deigned to shake her hand.

Interesting constituency. Looks like the last boundary change removed some urban, possibly Labour, voters? Labour and Libdem could combine to overhaul the Tories but it would be tight. Doesn't look like they'll be a Green candidate though, so it could hinge on what Ukip does.

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 9:53 am

Willow904 wrote:
utopiandreams wrote:
ErnstRemarx wrote:Interesting stuff - can you tell us which constituency you live in? I'm in Bury North - a Tory/Labour marginal - and I've seen the money pour into the place as the Tories are maxing out their efforts to retain the seat. Just wondered how it was with you.
South Derbyshire, Ernst. I do have some reticence, not for myself but have at times alluded to things about others whose privacy I do respect.

Edit: I have met my previous MPs and have to say that I was particularly taken with Mark Todd, who stood down at the last election. I spoke on the telephone with his Labour replacement and he seemed more than willing to help with an issue I raised during the conversation. Okay he may have well have been canvassing but I assured him that it was all in hand at a local level. Indeed a representative from the local council arranged a meeting with someone from Matlock as well as a ministry bod. I've only exchanged emails with Margaret Wheeler, who I am not taken with. Neither was I with Edwina although I deigned to shake her hand.
Interesting constituency. Looks like the last boundary change removed some urban, possibly Labour, voters? Labour and Libdem could combine to overhaul the Tories but it would be tight. Doesn't look like they'll be a Green candidate though, so it could hinge on what Ukip does.

That's right. I can't see Labour winning quite. But it could become very marginal for the next time.

utopiandreams · Post by **utopiandreams** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:01 am

Willow904 wrote:... Doesn't look like they'll be a Green candidate though, so it could hinge on what Ukip does.

'And therein lies some of the problem, Willow904. There are traditional Labour voters in this area who have switched to UKIP against my every effort to educate them accordingly. Personally I do lean a little toward the Greens, being a bit of an old hippy, but they're too idealistic with little to no pragmatism. They remind me somewhat of a cult, besides they have no candidates here.

Lonewolfie · Post by **Lonewolfie** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:09 am

StephenDolan wrote:
frightful_oik wrote:Trust a cartoonist to be so concise:
Kremlinology of the Kindergarten
Sums it up nicely.
Trouble is it's working quite well. Loads of Tories being invited to speculate on what it all means and being given carte blanche to get plenty of digs in at Labour. 'The mess we inherited/finishing the job on the economy' etc.

I hope it turns out to be a faux pas but given our useless media I'm not so sure it will.
Indeed, I thought Humphrys with Fallon was a disgrace.

...wasn't Humphreys on Panorama last night telling us 'what Britain wants'? (Mustard mitt I didn't watch - really couldn't even imagine the slighty aloof hectoring tone to tell us how 'we've never had it so good and everything is absolutely fantabulous now we've had proper governance for a few years and what we really want is...' - without a severe rise in blood pressure - am also assuming that's how it turned out)

WRT it working, don't forget - they still have 43/44 days to go (depending on whose clock you use - I prefer the FTN timer as it marks the last day of this clusterfracking omnishambolic creche of incompetent cruelty) and there isn't a whitewash factory in the world that can produce the industrial amounts required to paper over the massive crevices opening up around them.

On the debates and the 'hosts', pretty much anyone on the 'inside' of the Westmonster Bubble (who, naturally, will be the only ones to 'qualify') is either a serving Murkycdochian (Burley/Boulton), an ex-Murkydochian (Neil) or at least part of the 'elite' (Paxman - Oxford/British-American Project) - independence left the BBC when Gilligan gave Tory Blur the necessary ammunition to remove Greg Dyke and more importantly, Richard Sambrook....playing the Murkydochian 'long game' of chipping away until it becomes a pointless sideshow (BBC News)....I live in hope that BBC News independence will return following the implementation of Leveson (and Leveson 2) (That's also the hope that's just north of Peterborough and as close as it can get to Landslide)

...and morftingtinoon all.

fedup59 · Post by **fedup59** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:25 am

Morning all - on the debates I would like to see Steve Richards chairing. I used to enjoy his early morning Sunday interviews and always thought he came out as fair, analytical and thoughtful. Probably the main reason he would never be asked.

TheGrimSqueaker · Post by **TheGrimSqueaker** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:27 am

Speaking of marginal and tactical voting ...... a little piece up on Labour List encouraging people to canvass in Thanet South which, increasingly, actually looks like it could be winnable for Will Scobie. If May 8th brings both Clegg and Farage set aside by Labour MPs that will be the icing on the cake (the main cake being, obviously, the working majority that Labour are going to achieve).

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:34 am

Labour could well get second in Thanet S - very hard not to see Farage not winning it, though.

(not least because of the almost indecent levels of money and resources UKIP are reportedly pouring in there, not terribly surprisingly)

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:40 am

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:Speaking of marginal and tactical voting ...... a little piece up on Labour List encouraging people to canvass in Thanet South which, increasingly, actually looks like it could be winnable for Will Scobie. If May 8th brings both Clegg and Farage set aside by Labour MPs that will be the icing on the cake (the main cake being, obviously, the working majority that Labour are going to achieve).

Save a slice for Salmond not getting in. Heck, I'd be happy for one of those three not to get in. The look on their faces when it's officially declared

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:45 am

Salmond is even less likely not to win than Farage - sorry to be such a wet blanket this morning

I'm not greedy, tbh - I will settle for Clegg

Lonewolfie · Post by **Lonewolfie** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:47 am

utopiandreams wrote:
Willow904 wrote:... Doesn't look like they'll be a Green candidate though, so it could hinge on what Ukip does.
'And therein lies some of the problem, Willow904. There are traditional Labour voters in this area who have switched to UKIP against my every effort to educate them accordingly. Personally I do lean a little toward the Greens, being a bit of an old hippy, but they're too idealistic with little to no pragmatism. They remind me somewhat of a cult, besides they have no candidates here.

Here in hope, we didn't have a Green candidate until a month or so ago, when one turned up - which led to some real thinking....

I (like you) am an old hippy, combined with the aggression/anger of Punk so identify strongly with the Green message (although I'm still confused about the supposed acceptance of Genetically Modified crops (reason enough on it's own (for me) not to vote for them)). This constituency is 50% Tory voting, so unless you vote Tory your vote doesn't count anywhere. In 2010 I voted for the Lost Deposits, thinking that they were to the left of Labour (although I see through the Murkydochian Mist and see the good things Gordon Brown (and to a lesser extent, Tory Blur and neo-lie-bore) did, as well as understanding how their hands were tied by the Murkydochian (and Bankster) Imperative - hence, I believe(TM), the reason for the total destruction of Browns legacy (he did indeed 'save their world') because if he'd won, they (Browns Labour) would've told the 'international markets' where to stuff their 'Austerity' lie. (They're all the same/wedded to Austerity is pure Murkydochian Mist)

However, the vote in May is more important than any other has ever been (I believe(TM)) and as such, I cannot, in all honesty, do anything that might weaken the position of Mr Ed (I know I can't do much anyway, but I have to live with myself) - there are more than enough detractors and outright liars constantly sniping at him/Labour and if, as I believe(TM), he gets the keys for No 10 following a landslide, I want to have voted for him (or rather, the Labour candidate in my constituency, even if it's in the realms of fantasy that he (our candidate) could win).

One of only 2 people can be Prime Minister on May the 8th and neither of them is Natalie Bennett...or Farridge...or Wee 'eck (or should that be Sturgeon)...or Leanne ~~Williams~~ Wood.

...and as for the Lost Deposits? Whatever hold Leon Brittans' protege Calamity Clegg has on his MPs' has seen them vote (sometimes enthusiastically) with their Tory masters over and over again - there are no words to describe or convey the utter contempt and downright disgust I have for them.

I'm hopeful this makes sense and none of it is meant in any way as a negative comment to anyone.
TTFN

Edit to correct name - je suis une idiot

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:53 am

Desperate, very desperate.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... abuse.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 10:56 am

Leanne Williams? Is that a cross between the leaders of Plaid Cymru and the Welsh LibDems??

(sorry

)

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:00 am

StephenDolan wrote:Desperate, very desperate.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... abuse.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It is rather crap, isn't it? I expect using the x-ray of someone who has "probably fallen off a ladder" would get the same treatment from the Telegraph. Or maybe that could be spun as the x-ray of someone who had possibly been involved in a "nasty physical attack".

Good morfternoon.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:15 am

Ed Balls MP, Labour’s Shadow Chancellor, in a speech and poster launch in Birmingham

"...today I can announce a clear pledge to the British people:
The next Labour government will not raise VAT.
We will not put up VAT.
And we will not extend it to food, children’s clothes, books, newspapers and public transport fares.
We will not raise VAT because it’s the tax that hits everyone. It’s the tax that hits you every day. And it hits pensioners and the poorest hardest.
I would resign rather than break this promise and hike up VAT.
And Labour can make this manifesto commitment for the next Parliament because, unlike the Tories, all of our promises are fully funded and paid for."

[further text - including historical information about Tories & taxes disproportionately affecting those with the smallest incomes]

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1144851 ... d-balls-mp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Good morning.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:15 am

Some good stuff in that. Whether it gets reported is another matter.
http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1144851 ... d-balls-mp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:16 am

StephenDolan wrote:Some good stuff in that. Whether it gets reported is another matter.
http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1144851 ... d-balls-mp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I did my best, StephenDolan

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:17 am

citizenJA wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:Some good stuff in that. Whether it gets reported is another matter.
http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1144851 ... d-balls-mp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I did my best, StephenDolan

you beat me to it. Worth reading twice I suspect.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:19 am

Lonewolfie wrote:
utopiandreams wrote:
Willow904 wrote:... Doesn't look like they'll be a Green candidate though, so it could hinge on what Ukip does.
'And therein lies some of the problem, Willow904. There are traditional Labour voters in this area who have switched to UKIP against my every effort to educate them accordingly. Personally I do lean a little toward the Greens, being a bit of an old hippy, but they're too idealistic with little to no pragmatism. They remind me somewhat of a cult, besides they have no candidates here.
Here in hope, we didn't have a Green candidate until a month or so ago, when one turned up - which led to some real thinking....

I (like you) am an old hippy, combined with the aggression/anger of Punk so identify strongly with the Green message (although I'm still confused about the supposed acceptance of Genetically Modified crops (reason enough on it's own (for me) not to vote for them)). This constituency is 50% Tory voting, so unless you vote Tory your vote doesn't count anywhere. In 2010 I voted for the Lost Deposits, thinking that they were to the left of Labour (although I see through the Murkydochian Mist and see the good things Gordon Brown (and to a lesser extent, Tory Blur and neo-lie-bore) did, as well as understanding how their hands were tied by the Murkydochian (and Bankster) Imperative - hence, I believe(TM), the reason for the total destruction of Browns legacy (he did indeed 'save their world') because if he'd won, they (Browns Labour) would've told the 'international markets' where to stuff their 'Austerity' lie. (They're all the same/wedded to Austerity is pure Murkydochian Mist)

However, the vote in May is more important than any other has ever been (I believe(TM)) and as such, I cannot, in all honesty, do anything that might weaken the position of Mr Ed (I know I can't do much anyway, but I have to live with myself) - there are more than enough detractors and outright liars constantly sniping at him/Labour and if, as I believe(TM), he gets the keys for No 10 following a landslide, I want to have voted for him (or rather, the Labour candidate in my constituency, even if it's in the realms of fantasy that he (our candidate) could win).

One of only 2 people can be Prime Minister on May the 8th and neither of them is Natalie Bennett...or Farridge...or Wee 'eck (or should that be Sturgeon)...or Leanne Williams.

...and as for the Lost Deposits? Whatever hold Leon Brittans' protege Calamity Clegg has on his MPs' has seen them vote (sometimes enthusiastically) with their Tory masters over and over again - there are no words to describe or convey the utter contempt and downright disgust I have for them.

I'm hopeful this makes sense and none of it is meant in any way as a negative comment to anyone.
TTFN

In a truly hung parliament vote share will be crucial. Your vote for Labour in a safe Tory seat may actually serve a purpose if Labour form a minority government as it will help create a mandate. I'm glad you've reassessed the New Labour years. I think it's too easy, with hindsight, to attack them for continuing with neoliberalism in 1997. They would have been a very lone voice indeed pre-crash. It's what the parties intend to do now that the limitations and dangers of our economic system has been laid bare that counts and as far as I can tell only Ed Miliband and the Greens have said anything about the need to move away from the trickle-down economics of the last 35 years. Possibly the SNP land reforms as well, but I'm more doubtful, as their approach to tax is way too right-wing for me.

Incidentally, I do think the social democrats within the Libdems were to the left of New Labour and maybe on a par with Ed Miliband, who has described himself as a social democrat. I don't think anyone could have predicted that the Liberals would stage an internal coup and chuck them all out in order to facilitate a right-wing coalition with the Tories, but then I'm afraid I didn't give it much thought when Clegg took over from Ming beyond thinking that I still preferred Charles Kennedy. Looking back, it was probably obvious then that social democratic values were in danger of being drowned out by much more right-wing liberal ones.

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:22 am

StephenDolan wrote:Desperate, very desperate.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... abuse.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Good grief !

If that x-ray is proof positive of an abused child, what on earth does the tory rebuttal x-ray where they photoshopped a whole series of breaks, say ?

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:25 am

BBC 3 has been running a series of political programmes called “I’m a …., ask me anything” & it’s where young people ask the questions that they most want to hear the answers to.

This series has been aimed at political party leaders. First up was Ed Miliband, followed last week by Nicola Sturgeon, Leanne Wood & Natalie Bennett.

This week it’s the Conservatives turn but Cameron isn’t attending ! Instead they are sending Grant Shapps & a panel of Tories in his place.

What is it with Cameron / debates and Tories / young people ?!

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:25 am

@Pk1
Regarding the announcement yesterday from Labour not raising VAT & the headline you posted along with it yesterday entitled 'Labour won't decrease VAT' I wrote, 'naturally'. My meaning was Labour have trouble getting good press headlines from mainstream media, 'naturally', Labour's announcement is reported in the worst light possible.

That's all I meant. I was agreeing with you.

http://flythenest.org/viewtopic.php?f=4 ... 150#p38225

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:30 am

citizenJA wrote:@Pk1
Regarding the announcement yesterday from Labour not raising VAT & the headline you posted along with it yesterday entitled 'Labour won't decrease VAT' I wrote, 'naturally'. My meaning was Labour have trouble getting good press headlines from mainstream media, 'naturally', Labour's announcement is reported in the worst light possible.

That's all I meant. I was agreeing with you.

http://flythenest.org/viewtopic.php?f=4 ... 150#p38225

I have no real wish to spark another debate over yesterdays nonsense but I rather think you read that headline incorrectly.

It said "Labour won't lift VAT", not that they wouldn't cut it so in my view, it did get positive coverage & from City AM at that !

mikems · Post by **mikems** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:30 am

Zero inflation. Cameron claims it is good news that debt is not being eroded and that the value of savings is.

Can someone please ask Cameron at what point, when he was drawing up his long term economic plan with his genius chancellor, he came up with the idea of deflation and a global oil price slump?

Post by **adam** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:36 am

pk1 wrote:BBC 3 has been running a series of political programmes called “I’m a …., ask me anything” & it’s where young people ask the questions that they most want to hear the answers to.

This series has been aimed at political party leaders. First up was Ed Miliband, followed last week by Nicola Sturgeon, Leanne Wood & Natalie Bennett.

This week it’s the Conservatives turn but Cameron isn’t attending ! Instead they are sending Grant Shapps & a panel of Tories in his place.

What is it with Cameron / debates and Tories / young people ?!

I'm quote hopeful that question one will be 'Why doesn't Cameron want to talk to us?'

mikems · Post by **mikems** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:40 am

Sending Grant Shapps?!? That should be an absolute bunfight with the youngsters. They will rip him to bits.

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:45 am

PorFavor wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:Desperate, very desperate.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... abuse.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It is rather crap, isn't it? I expect using the x-ray of someone who has "probably fallen off a ladder" would get the same treatment from the Telegraph. Or maybe that could be spun as the x-ray of someone who had possibly been involved in a "nasty physical attack".

Good morfternoon.

Marvo all.

Yes, it is crap. It's a stock image, as confirmed by the person who designed the poster.

It looks to me like a closed uncomplicated fracture of the tibia; as the x-ray isn't a very good one, I'm not sure I can see the epiphyses I'd expect to see at the ends of the bones if this were a very young child; plus it's a full break and usually children's fractures have a "greenstick" look. I'm no expert, mind. But I've seen a lot of x-rays in my time....
It is an unidentifiable x-ray of a tibial fracture - if the professors and whoever thinks it could be an x-ray of an abused child, they are entitled to their opinion; that fracture could also be caused by trauma like a road traffic accident. Of course, the article leaves it to the very end - having stoked up a bit of outrage - to inform us that another expert is not convinced.

We knew that whatever Labour do in this campaign they will get bad press - this is probably just the beginning. Cue OGRFG getting his chops all over the meeja intoning "as a father of young children.....etc".

mikems · Post by **mikems** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:46 am

Also, now we have zero inflation, remember that George Osborne claimed our national debts - now vastly increased - would lead to hyper-inflation, that 'bond vigilantes' would hold the UK to ransom and that we would become 'like Greece' and 'bankrupt'.

Not just wrong, hyper-wrong.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:48 am

Rachel Reeves MP, Labour’s Shadow Secretary of State for Work and Pensions, responding to the Work and Pensions select committee report on benefit sanctions

A Labour government will end Job Centre sanction targets and ensure that vulnerable people get the hardship payments they are entitled to. And we will ensure that everyone who can work, does work through a Compulsory Jobs Guarantee.”

MARCH 23, 2015 (11:28 PM)

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1144464 ... agement-of

pk1 · Post by **pk1** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:51 am

News to me:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho ... 27142.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 11:58 am

Rain just started pouring down.
Air quality cleaning mechanism.

mikems · Post by **mikems** » Tue 24 Mar, 2015 12:03 pm

How long can share prices remain so high in the face of deflation? It's only QE and the world's footloose capital (with additions of terror and drug money helpfully supplied by your local/global bank and its mates) keeping the whole thing going atm.