Thursday 2nd April 2015

daydreamer · Post by **daydreamer** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:15 pm

refitman wrote:On Farage and "HIV furriners shouldn't come here":
Gary Lineker ✔ @GaryLineker
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Always reluctant to offer a political view, but Farage is a dick!

Gary Lineker

Post by **refitman** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:18 pm

Is it me, or has Clegg been largely absent for most of this?

daydreamer · Post by **daydreamer** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:19 pm

StephenDolan wrote:Miliband improving, Sturgeon has been very impressive.

Glad to hear Ed's improving. From what you're all posting it seems Sturgeon is having the best of it

(Still don't care how tribal I appear).

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:20 pm

refitman wrote:Is it me, or has Clegg been largely absent for most of this?

He's been shocking after he was nailed by Sturgeon over the 49% privatisation limit of the NHS.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:20 pm

Ed. Expoitation. Prosecute employers. Short and sweet.

Plaid. Not to blame immigrants for austerity, blame bankers.

Sturgeon. Some strain on services but provide more homes accommodate them. Immigrants net contributors. and all the Brits living abroad.

Cameron reduced immigration from abroad. From EU no unemployment six months no job off you go. Four years before they get benefits.

Farage. It's not about benefits its about numbers. Come out of EU adopt Australian points system.

Clegg wouldn't ever spread fear about it. Boasting about what he's done. No answer. Open for business not open for abuse.

Bennett. Non EU immigration not fair. mentions refugee status. Shortages not immigrants fault.

Cameron again. They are giving him more time.

Farage said Merkel the boss in Europe. Says Dave won't be successful in negotiation.

Said Farage is just a back door to a Labour government.

Miliband says Cam has lost any authority in Europe.

Clegg boasting about those fucking apprenticeships...

Cam again

Wood. For the EU. But talking about voting seperately if there is a vote.

Bennett says it's about human lives. On about spousal regulations being unfair. Syrian refugees.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:21 pm

StephenDolan wrote:Miliband improving, Sturgeon has been very impressive.

Yeah, his opening statement was a bit formulaic (though there was nothing actually wrong with it) but he is getting more into his stride now.

I liked him getting a dig in at Dave for the MidStaffs smear

Some trolls trying to claim Ed is a racist for his immigration comments, though

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:23 pm

daydreamer wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:Miliband improving, Sturgeon has been very impressive.
Glad to hear Ed's improving. From what you're all posting it seems Sturgeon is having the best of it (Still don't care how tribal I appear).

My (partisan) order so far.

Sturgeon 9
Miliband 7
Wood, Bennett 5
Clegg, Cameron 3
Farage 2 (that HIV spiel was awful).

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:25 pm

Sturgeon want a promise that if there is a referendum it's a separate vote so a country isn't dragged out if they don't want.
Miliband says he doesn't want to come out.

Green party wants a referendum on Europe. Or reorganised.

Wood Says we should treat immigrants better because of all the brits abroad.

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:26 pm

moderator cutting ed off again.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:26 pm

Cameron "there are three sides to this coin"

Bennett "I partly agree with Nicola" = I agree with Nick?

daydreamer · Post by **daydreamer** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:26 pm

StephenDolan wrote:
daydreamer wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:Miliband improving, Sturgeon has been very impressive.
Glad to hear Ed's improving. From what you're all posting it seems Sturgeon is having the best of it (Still don't care how tribal I appear).
My (partisan) order so far.

Sturgeon 9
Miliband 7
Wood, Bennett 5
Clegg, Cameron 3
Farage 2 (that HIV spiel was awful).

Thanks, appreciated. Though I'm sure the MSM will rate Ed much lower. I'll go with your judgement.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:27 pm

Is anyone going to argue about the age of many apprentices?

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:27 pm

StephenDolan wrote:
daydreamer wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:Miliband improving, Sturgeon has been very impressive.
Glad to hear Ed's improving. From what you're all posting it seems Sturgeon is having the best of it (Still don't care how tribal I appear).
My (partisan) order so far.

Sturgeon 9
Miliband 7
Wood, Bennett 5
Clegg, Cameron 3
Farage 2 (that HIV spiel was awful).

That's roughly my impression, though 5 is maybe a bit generous for Bennett - you always get the impression meltdown is just around the corner.

In contrast tbf, Wood has somewhat exceeded (admittedly low) expectations.

Sturgeon *is* good, no getting away from that. But we need to remember her/the SNPs ratings are sky high already - whereas if Ed makes a good impression with Scottish voters it could yet make a real difference. Ever the optimist

daydreamer · Post by **daydreamer** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:28 pm

PaulfromYorkshire wrote:Cameron "there are three sides to this coin"

Bennett "I partly agree with Nicola" = I agree with Nick?

'Three sides to this coin' What a dick!

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:29 pm

I'd still give it to Sturgeon then Bennett, Ed is a bit too polite.

onebuttonmonkey · Post by **onebuttonmonkey** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:30 pm

Hello lovely ftners. It's been a while. And I don't want to distract from the leaders debate, but I could do with your communal assistance.

So ITV Daytime are resurrecting the Kilroy format only adding more squabbling and getting it hosted by James O'Brien. I've been invited to be the voice of the people role on a panel discussing legal highs and immigration. What this means is that I'll be on a panel with (deep breath) Christine Hamilton and Jim Davidson arguing about whether immigration is good for Britain. (Grim Squeaker's favourite) Owen Jones will be in the audience for the show. And it's going to be a right grumble off. KIt's filming on Easter Sunday and, as long as a few technicalities are sorted, I'll be on it - screening daytime next week.

So the reason I'm posting this isn't to go, "oh, look, silly onebuttonmonkey's on telly, get him". It's because you're some of the most well-informed and coherent bunch of lefties I've had the privilege to know, and you all help to make me a better informed, better arguing type, even when we disagree. So what I'd like is for your help and ideas in points you would like to see made by a shouty, hairy socialist at UKIPers and Jim Davidson on telly about immigration. Any facts, figures, key points and ideas, anything you have to help me get ready for the show would be gratefully received - even if I end up too intimidated to get them out of my silly face.

Certainly, all the older members of here know me from over at the G. Feel free to send me a message or - preferably, so I can hear all your voices together - reply on this board. You can also message me on twitter. I'll be around over the next couple of days, and even if I don't reply, I'll be checking up and reading. Erm. Yeah. Please help me to savage idiotic rightwing myths espoused by idiots. I'd be very grateful...

I'll let you get back to the debate (I've just got off the phone with the producers so am a bit distracted - also, I'mstill hellish jetlagged from getting back from California two days ago). Feel free to ignore me, but you are the first people I thought of going to for help in trying to make sure the right arguments are heard above the froth, noise and prejudice...

daydreamer · Post by **daydreamer** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:30 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:
daydreamer wrote: Glad to hear Ed's improving. From what you're all posting it seems Sturgeon is having the best of it (Still don't care how tribal I appear).
My (partisan) order so far.

Sturgeon 9
Miliband 7
Wood, Bennett 5
Clegg, Cameron 3
Farage 2 (that HIV spiel was awful).
That's roughly my impression, though 5 is maybe a bit generous for Bennett - you always get the impression meltdown is just around the corner.

In contrast tbf, Wood has somewhat exceeded (admittedly low) expectations.

Sturgeon *is* good, no getting away from that. But we need to remember her/the SNPs ratings are sky high already - whereas if Ed makes a good impression with Scottish voters it could yet make a real difference. Ever the optimist

AK, You'll have to be optimistic for both of us then.

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:30 pm

I liked this from the graun comments:

Nigel is sweating more than a light entertainment presenter from the 1970's who's just been told to pop into the local station on Monday morning "for a chat"...

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:31 pm

Bennett isn't fluent, she obviously has problems speaking in situations like this. But what she says is coming across very well...

daydreamer · Post by **daydreamer** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:31 pm

ohsocynical wrote:I'd still give it to Sturgeon then Bennett, Ed is a bit too polite.

You think Bennett did better?

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:32 pm

Cams said about pensions although it's supposed to be about education.

Bennett. Pay off the students debt, then free education.

Clegg said he couldn't put his ideas for education in place. it was Labours fault. Not enough money left.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:33 pm

ohsocynical wrote:I'd still give it to Sturgeon then Bennett, Ed is a bit too polite.

Some people (myself included) like it that he remains calm and unflustered. Just the occasional bit of passion is nice to see, though

onebuttonmonkey · Post by **onebuttonmonkey** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:33 pm

Additional - here's a link to an article about the show:

http://www.theguardian.com/media/mediam ... gel-farage

Reet. A drink and then a shout at the telly.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:33 pm

Sturgeon excellent on education I have to say.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:34 pm

daydreamer wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:I'd still give it to Sturgeon then Bennett, Ed is a bit too polite.
You think Bennett did better?

Yes. It's a woman thing. Even though she's a bit abrupt. The women are giving far more in depth answers.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:34 pm

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
StephenDolan wrote:
daydreamer wrote: Glad to hear Ed's improving. From what you're all posting it seems Sturgeon is having the best of it (Still don't care how tribal I appear).
My (partisan) order so far.

Sturgeon 9
Miliband 7
Wood, Bennett 5
Clegg, Cameron 3
Farage 2 (that HIV spiel was awful).
That's roughly my impression, though 5 is maybe a bit generous for Bennett - you always get the impression meltdown is just around the corner.

In contrast tbf, Wood has somewhat exceeded (admittedly low) expectations.

Sturgeon *is* good, no getting away from that. But we need to remember her/the SNPs ratings are sky high already - whereas if Ed makes a good impression with Scottish voters it could yet make a real difference. Ever the optimist

Wood has gone wooden.

It's how Miliband has come across to the Labour to SNP switchers (30% last poll?).

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:34 pm

I'm calling this one for Sturgeon unless she fouls up in the last few minutes.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:36 pm

Excellent Coalition squabbling

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:37 pm

Miliband on Cameron and Clegg. "they're both blaming each other and they're both right".

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:39 pm

StephenDolan wrote:Miliband on Cameron and Clegg. "they're both blaming each other and they're both right".

I did have to think about that one for a moment

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:39 pm

Can says there are a million more children it good schools.
Boasting about Free schools and academies.

Clegg says tories going to cut funding for schools.

Cam saying about sitting around cabinet table agreeing about education.

Clegg says he didn't.

Clegg says Miliband is being pious because Miliband said about breaking his promise.

Clegg pissed.

Clegg blaming Labour for Banks crash.

Cameron butting in.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:39 pm

Chair is losing control, letting Cameron bully his way through. Cmon, you're not Montague!

Post by **refitman** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:41 pm

There's a magnificent 'tache behind the lady who asked about education.

Spacedone · Post by **Spacedone** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:42 pm

Com-Res poll from half-time.

Farage is being universally slated online so not really sure what this poll is worth.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:42 pm

refitman wrote:There's a magnificent 'tache behind the lady who asked about education.

Hopefully on somebody else?

Post by **refitman** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:42 pm

According to Farage, every immigrant to this country is an individual person (no family units) and needs an entire house to themselves.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:43 pm

Bennett says brings academies and Free schools back under the same umbrella.

Wood saying Labour will cut the block? grant to Wales. Plaid saying about hung parliament but not who she'll back.

Sturgeon. Nick Clegg shameful breaking his promises. Bringing up Blair. Says SNP will make sure Ed keeps his promises about education.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:44 pm

Spacedone wrote:Com-Res poll from half-time.

Farage is being universally slated online so not really sure what this poll is worth.

Farage both best AND worst according to that

Sturgeon has the best *net* score, Miliband not far behind. Not how ComRes spun it, of course

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:45 pm

Who's that woman who just started shouting at Empty?

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:46 pm

Dave being heckled. They're saying not from the audience madam. Wonder if they've chucked her out?

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:46 pm

frightful_oik wrote:Who's that woman who just started shouting at Empty?

Not sure, was she asking about fracking?

Spacedone · Post by **Spacedone** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:46 pm

Cameron being heckled from audience by someone talking about ex-soldiers sleeping rough on the streets.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:46 pm

The lady in the audience is heckling about fracking.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:48 pm

ohsocynical wrote:Dave being heckled. They're saying not from the audience madam. Wonder if they've chucked her out?

Sounded like someone was.

Miliband hitting Cameron hard on ZHCs.

Spacedone · Post by **Spacedone** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:49 pm

ohsocynical wrote:The lady in the audience is heckling about fracking.

Odd. All the journos on Twitter say it was about homeless soldiers.

StephenDolan · Post by **StephenDolan** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:50 pm

Spacedone wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:The lady in the audience is heckling about fracking.
Odd. All the journos on Twitter say it was about homeless soldiers.

I think she called out twice.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:50 pm

That was very strong from Ed

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:50 pm

Cam breaking in again. Boasting about so much debt, said think how many houses that would build.

Miliband saying about zero hours

Cam breaking in again.

Ed managed to get the last word in.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:52 pm

Vote Clegg for a lurch free world.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Thu 02 Apr, 2015 9:52 pm

Not a word about hungry children. Not a word about the homeless. No question about the disabled. Not a word about IDSs reforms.