Friday 22nd May 2015

A home from home
Forum rules
Welcome to FTN. New posters are welcome to join the conversation. You can follow us on Twitter @FlythenestHaven You are responsible for the content you post. This is a public forum. Treat it as if you are speaking in a crowded room. Site admin and Moderators are volunteers who will respond as quickly as they are able to when made aware of any complaints. Please do not post copyrighted material without the original authors permission.
Temulkar
Secretary of State
Posts: 1343
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:24 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by Temulkar »

AnatolyKasparov wrote:
Temulkar wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote: There's been such a plethora of articles picking over the issues and problems for both Labour and the Lib Dems - and Conservatives actually - following the election but this is about the only thing I've seen on the Greens. It's a bit of a one-sided tack to say the least. Has anyone seen any other coverage / analysis re the Greens and their election?
Lib Dem supporter has tantrum. I think we underachieved in Bristol, but thats more to do with the candidate imo. Elsewhere were in a good position to build for the next GE.
Shurely your big underperformance was in Norwich S (one of a literal handful of seats where the Green share was down on 2010)?

If you mean Bristol W, then I certainly wasn't expecting the sitting LibDem MP to come a poor third (not that far ahead of the Tories, even)
Adrian Ramsey not standing in Norwich (for what reasons I dont know) cost us there. He had a good local profile and lots of support. I was never convinced by it, but Bristol west should have been won, we had every advantage and blew it.
Temulkar
Secretary of State
Posts: 1343
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:24 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by Temulkar »

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
Temulkar wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote: There's been such a plethora of articles picking over the issues and problems for both Labour and the Lib Dems - and Conservatives actually - following the election but this is about the only thing I've seen on the Greens. It's a bit of a one-sided tack to say the least. Has anyone seen any other coverage / analysis re the Greens and their election?
Lib Dem supporter has tantrum. I think we underachieved in Bristol, but thats more to do with the candidate imo. Elsewhere were in a good position to build for the next GE.
"Environmentalist has tantrum" would be more apt. Lean was writing about 'green' issues when Lucas was still at Malvern Girls' College, so I suspect you may have missed his point; he seems to be suggesting that the Green Party has abandoned its environmental roots in an attempt to assume the mantle of the Real Left, and there is some truth in that - not that they are "the Real Left" (much of the manifesto was indistinguishable from Labour, largely because the two parties have been 'borrowing' each others polices for years), but more that environmental issues seemed to be way down on Natalie's list of priorities. Still, as with a lot of his pieces, there is a lot more heat than light (somewhat ironically).
True but he is also a very well known lib dem supporter, and close to Norman Lamb. If you think the green manifesto was the same as labour you didnt read it.
User avatar
TheGrimSqueaker
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2192
Joined: Thu 28 Aug, 2014 12:23 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by TheGrimSqueaker »

Temulkar wrote:
TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
Temulkar wrote: Lib Dem supporter has tantrum. I think we underachieved in Bristol, but thats more to do with the candidate imo. Elsewhere were in a good position to build for the next GE.
"Environmentalist has tantrum" would be more apt. Lean was writing about 'green' issues when Lucas was still at Malvern Girls' College, so I suspect you may have missed his point; he seems to be suggesting that the Green Party has abandoned its environmental roots in an attempt to assume the mantle of the Real Left, and there is some truth in that - not that they are "the Real Left" (much of the manifesto was indistinguishable from Labour, largely because the two parties have been 'borrowing' each others polices for years), but more that environmental issues seemed to be way down on Natalie's list of priorities. Still, as with a lot of his pieces, there is a lot more heat than light (somewhat ironically).
True but he is also a very well known lib dem supporter, and close to Norman Lamb. If you think the green manifesto was the same as labour you didnt read it.
I didn't say it was the same, I said much of it was indistinguishable; Bennett's "Big Announcement" about bus re-regulation was a direct copy of a policy Michael Dugher had revealed months before, Labour's "Living Wage" policy owed much to the Greens. Tem, if you are going to start banging on about tribalism again you really need to address your own tendencies first.

For example continuing to focus on Lean's political affiliations, rather than acknowledging my point about his long history of writing on the environmental issues, suggests that you consider the Green Party 'owns' those issues and only they have the right to speak about them. Lean's point stands, there are some who wonder whether the Greens have lost their way; it is not a matter of insignificance that Adrian Ramsay didn't stand in Norwich, given that he stood down as Deputy Leader when Bennett was elected and has largely walked away from active politics to concentrate on being Green for real at the Centre for Alternative Technology - it may be a fairly insubstantial piece in the Torygraph but it contains an kernel of truth, and you ignore that at your peril.
COWER BRIEF MORTALS. HO. HO. HO.
Temulkar
Secretary of State
Posts: 1343
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:24 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by Temulkar »

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
Temulkar wrote:
TheGrimSqueaker wrote: "Environmentalist has tantrum" would be more apt. Lean was writing about 'green' issues when Lucas was still at Malvern Girls' College, so I suspect you may have missed his point; he seems to be suggesting that the Green Party has abandoned its environmental roots in an attempt to assume the mantle of the Real Left, and there is some truth in that - not that they are "the Real Left" (much of the manifesto was indistinguishable from Labour, largely because the two parties have been 'borrowing' each others polices for years), but more that environmental issues seemed to be way down on Natalie's list of priorities. Still, as with a lot of his pieces, there is a lot more heat than light (somewhat ironically).
True but he is also a very well known lib dem supporter, and close to Norman Lamb. If you think the green manifesto was the same as labour you didnt read it.
I didn't say it was the same, I said much of it was indistinguishable; Bennett's "Big Announcement" about bus re-regulation was a direct copy of a policy Michael Dugher had revealed months before, Labour's "Living Wage" policy owed much to the Greens. Tem, if you are going to start banging on about tribalism again you really need to address your own tendencies first.

For example continuing to focus on Lean's political affiliations, rather than acknowledging my point about his long history of writing on the environmental issues, suggests that you consider the Green Party 'owns' those issues and only they have the right to speak about them. Lean's point stands, there are some who wonder whether the Greens have lost their way; it is not a matter of insignificance that Adrian Ramsay didn't stand in Norwich, given that he stood down as Deputy Leader when Bennett was elected and has largely walked away from active politics to concentrate on being Green for real at the Centre for Alternative Technology - it may be a fairly insubstantial piece in the Torygraph but it contains an kernel of truth, and you ignore that at your peril.

So you still insist on focussing on his party affiliations, rather than his track record on environmental issues? Interesting.
My first word was 'True' and certainly threre are older members and ex members from the ecology party who would rather we were a pressure group soley for the environment; the party has long moved on from that. Adrian is still active in the party, probably sharpening up his bid for the leadership in England next year, but there is more to him not standing than meets the eye apparently, which I am not privy to.
Temulkar
Secretary of State
Posts: 1343
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:24 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by Temulkar »

Some good news from france though

http://www.thejournal.ie/french-superma ... 9-May2015/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
thatchersorphan
Committee Chair
Posts: 240
Joined: Thu 09 Oct, 2014 3:09 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by thatchersorphan »

http://www.clydebankpost.co.uk/news/loc ... nctioning/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; DWP order woman with 45 years experience to do unpaid work to learn 'vital skills' - or face sanctioning
User avatar
Willow904
Prime Minister
Posts: 7220
Joined: Thu 18 Sep, 2014 2:40 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by Willow904 »

Sorry for the Liz Kendall outburst earlier. I can't believe she's as bad as she's coming across. But she is coming across rather badly. I do think there's a danger that when we try to say things we think people want to hear, it doesn't come across half as well as when we say things more instinctively. She's clearly trying to build bridges she thinks are broken (with the press, business?). I'm sure her heart's in the right place. I can't see her selling the government's stake in our uranium enrichment plants or anything really bonkers like Cameron and co. I do agree with whoever it was yesterday who said she's not a Tory. I just feel that what Labour has at the moment is a core of voters who voted for Gordon Brown and voted for Ed Miliband and Liz Kendall doesn't look capable of holding onto those voters, let alone getting some of the SNP and Ukip ones back. And she should be wary of applying the word "reform" to public services. The Tories use the phrase to mean outsourcing and privatisation leading to a reduction in service alongside reduction in pay and conditions for those who deliver it. If she means "improve" she should just say so, it would go down a lot better with Labour voters.
"Fall seven times, get up eight" - Japanese proverb
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

Temulkar wrote:As an aside now Hunt is not standing for the leadership he should have more time to read my book :) ON pre-order now, featuring Cameron's 9 x great grandfather, and the real milady d'winter.
I'm delighted to read you here, Temuklar. I hope Hunty reads your book. May I know what it is? Good to hear from you.
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by PorFavor »

RobertSnozers wrote:
Willow904 wrote:Sorry for the Liz Kendall outburst earlier. I can't believe she's as bad as she's coming across. But she is coming across rather badly. I do think there's a danger that when we try to say things we think people want to hear, it doesn't come across half as well as when we say things more instinctively. She's clearly trying to build bridges she thinks are broken (with the press, business?). I'm sure her heart's in the right place. I can't see her selling the government's stake in our uranium enrichment plants or anything really bonkers like Cameron and co. I do agree with whoever it was yesterday who said she's not a Tory. I just feel that what Labour has at the moment is a core of voters who voted for Gordon Brown and voted for Ed Miliband and Liz Kendall doesn't look capable of holding onto those voters, let alone getting some of the SNP and Ukip ones back. And she should be wary of applying the word "reform" to public services. The Tories use the phrase to mean outsourcing and privatisation leading to a reduction in service alongside reduction in pay and conditions for those who deliver it. If she means "improve" she should just say so, it would go down a lot better with Labour voters.
Personally I think we should reclaim the use of the word reform, not abandon it. The BBC initially refused to refer to the last government's health reorganisation as 'reforms' but I dare say they were bullied into it later by Oliver and co.
"Improve" is a much more meaningful term. "Reform", for me, falls into the same category of meaningless waffle as "making a difference".
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

Willow904 wrote:Sorry for the Liz Kendall outburst earlier. I can't believe she's as bad as she's coming across. But she is coming across rather badly. I do think there's a danger that when we try to say things we think people want to hear, it doesn't come across half as well as when we say things more instinctively. She's clearly trying to build bridges she thinks are broken (with the press, business?). I'm sure her heart's in the right place. I can't see her selling the government's stake in our uranium enrichment plants or anything really bonkers like Cameron and co. I do agree with whoever it was yesterday who said she's not a Tory. I just feel that what Labour has at the moment is a core of voters who voted for Gordon Brown and voted for Ed Miliband and Liz Kendall doesn't look capable of holding onto those voters, let alone getting some of the SNP and Ukip ones back. And she should be wary of applying the word "reform" to public services. The Tories use the phrase to mean outsourcing and privatisation leading to a reduction in service alongside reduction in pay and conditions for those who deliver it. If she means "improve" she should just say so, it would go down a lot better with Labour voters.
I love your outbursts, seriously, no need to apologise to me.
After re-reading some of Kendall's direct quotes in context I'm disappointed with some of her allusions - 'reform' public services - what do you mean, Kendall? Don't drop that without giving further direction of your vision for Labour. She said, 'public services are supposed to serve the public - the clue is in the name'. Well, okay. Nye Bevan & Mag Thatcher could have said those same words. Each thought the public best served using different policies.
The fact Tristram Hunt is supporting her leadership bid confuses me.
Again, I don't know these people well enough to understand what their words & actions mean exactly at this time.
But then, most of the electorate don't either.
You're right, I don't think Kendall communicates positively now.

The media distort through carelessness &/or deliberate manipulation, omission.
We read & hear distorted messages from mainstream media, particularly about the Labour party.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

BBC Newsnight to host first official Labour leadership hustings

Harriet Harman MP, Labour’s Acting Leader, has today welcomed the announcement that BBC Newsnight will broadcast Labour’s first official hustings for candidates in its leadership election.

The Newsnight Labour Leadership Debate will be presented by Laura Kuenssberg and will be broadcast live from Nuneaton in front of an audience at 7pm on BBC Two and the BBC News Channel on Wednesday June 17.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1195941 ... ial-labour" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
StephenDolan
First Secretary of State
Posts: 3725
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 10:15 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by StephenDolan »

citizenJA wrote:
BBC Newsnight to host first official Labour leadership hustings

Harriet Harman MP, Labour’s Acting Leader, has today welcomed the announcement that BBC Newsnight will broadcast Labour’s first official hustings for candidates in its leadership election.

The Newsnight Labour Leadership Debate will be presented by Laura Kuenssberg and will be broadcast live from Nuneaton in front of an audience at 7pm on BBC Two and the BBC News Channel on Wednesday June 17.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1195941 ... ial-labour" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
BBC to select the audience and the questions. Be interesting to see what methodology they apply for the former.
User avatar
TheGrimSqueaker
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2192
Joined: Thu 28 Aug, 2014 12:23 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by TheGrimSqueaker »

RobertSnozers wrote:I think it's fair enough to point out his political allegiance as he bemoans the loss of professional nutjob Norman Baker. Moreover, the article seems to be attacking the party's left-leaning nature rather than any real loss of environmental credentials, and it doesn't surprise me that some of the more old-school Greens who were of a more centrist or small-c conservative outlook (wasn't one of the founders a Tory councillor?) don't like the direction the party has taken politically.

There's a problem that all small parties, especially those focussing on a small area of issues, face when they try to break into the mainstream. They have to be taken seriously across the full range of issues. I can see that this was what Bennett was trying to do, and also the fact that she was focussing on anti-austerity was part of the conversation about post-hung parliament discussions rather than where the party would necessarily focus were all things equal. If the true state of the polls was apparent, maybe things would have been different. The author seems to be essentially arguing for the party to remain as a small, single-issue pressure group, which probably not many supporters would agree with.

I think he's misdiagnosing, personally, and a lot of the slump the party seemed to suffer was down to Bennett's underwhelming performance as leader rather than any particular political tack the party was taking. I also agree that there was a lot more common ground between the Labour and Green manifestos than points of difference, though I suppose those differences could be argued to be significant.
It is fair enough to point out the allegiance, but surely not so fair to dismiss his concerns based solely on that allegiance? Tem, despite his barely visible nod toward my point, relied on nobody knowing Lean's background and reading it purely as a partisan hack job; when you understand that background it gives a slightly different perspective.

Does the article discuss loss of environmental credentials? Well, it makes it clear how low they were on Bennett's list of priorities and the mention of Brighton Council's woeful record on recycling is noteworthy; you are right, it is difficult when previously niche parties begin to make the move toward a more mainstream position, there is inevitably a certain loss of identity - the irony is that was their main criticism of Labour, the loss of traditional identity, with Bennett attempting to claim the old mantle for her won.

I also agree that Lean is, in the main, talking a load of old tosh. Natalie Bennett veered between underwhelming and woefully bad throughout the campaign; Lucas knew that was likely to be the case, hence her attempts to get herself on the TV debates. And the less said about Bennett's focus on anti-austerity the better, given that I am not alone in considering both she and Lucas lied through their teeth about Labour's true position on that.
COWER BRIEF MORTALS. HO. HO. HO.
SpinningHugo
Prime Minister
Posts: 4211
Joined: Mon 16 Feb, 2015 1:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by SpinningHugo »

This is interesting on why the current leadership election is so dire

http://ericjoyce.co.uk/2015/05/the-red- ... rtherners/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

StephenDolan wrote:
citizenJA wrote:
BBC Newsnight to host first official Labour leadership hustings

Harriet Harman MP, Labour’s Acting Leader, has today welcomed the announcement that BBC Newsnight will broadcast Labour’s first official hustings for candidates in its leadership election.

The Newsnight Labour Leadership Debate will be presented by Laura Kuenssberg and will be broadcast live from Nuneaton in front of an audience at 7pm on BBC Two and the BBC News Channel on Wednesday June 17.

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1195941 ... ial-labour" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
BBC to select the audience and the questions. Be interesting to see what methodology they apply for the former.
I think it's a smart move to involve the wider public ... as long as the audience really are the wider public. As someone with a vote I don't want one of the most important opportunities to see the candidates answer to the public to be skewed in any way. I want to use my vote as wisely as I can.
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

SpinningHugo wrote:This is interesting on why the current leadership election is so dire

http://ericjoyce.co.uk/2015/05/the-red- ... rtherners/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thank you Hugo - worth it for this paragraph alone which gave me a damn good chuckle.
... So, Gordon’s special adviser has just lost an election and because another of his special advisers has lost his seat the party’s being asked to have another of the former’s special advisers (and the latter’s wife) as leader. Only that’s not going happen because David Blunkett’s special adviser is the one who ‘most impresses’ Len McLuskey. Ach, say some, if only Tony Blair’s special adviser wasn’t in New York being spiteful about his brother still, we wouldn’t have to rely on Harriet Harman’s special adviser getting on the ballot paper, because Peter Mandleson’s special adviser’s has ruled himself out now that he can’t get the numbers. Oh, but wait, Glenys Kinnock’s special adviser is having a go – no, false alarm, she’s just trying to get her face on telly. And we’ve gone full circle and disappeared up our own bottoms…
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

Press Association ‏@pressassoc 7m7 minutes ago
#Breaking Former Scottish Secretary Alistair Carmichael has admitted leaking a diplomatic memo about Nicola Sturgeon’s view of Ed Miliband
So it was him.
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

Chris Leslie MP, Labour’s Shadow Chancellor, informs us today Tory Chancellor Jeff officially failed achieving another deadline Jeff set for himself. The deficit is still there. It was supposed to be eliminated now, according to Tory government. It's not eliminated.

I don't think Tories are good in government.
But Tories are perceived as good on the economy.
We're told over & over again how good Tories with the economy.
Tories are so great, they're the party of the working class!

As a defence mechanism, sometimes people side with hostage takers threatening to shoot them rather than law enforcement negotiating for their release.

Therapy.
Psychological counselling.
To remember what we knew as small children but sometimes got terrorised out of knowing.
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

Andrew Gwynne MP retweeted
James Worron ‏@JamesWorron 12m12 minutes ago
A mere 8 Lib Dem MPs and they still manage to have a scandal.
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 3m3 minutes ago
Paul Waugh retweeted Ross Colquhoun
Given @acarmichaelmp now says he *was* aware of memo content, this video cd force him to quit as MP.
Paul Flynn MP is calling for him to stand down re lack of truth.

Others questioning whether the result of this investigation was held back until after the election as ... with the content of the memo not dismissed as inaccurate ... Nicola Sturgeon having a preference for David Cameron as prime minister might just have influenced people's decisions one way or another.
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

Patronage has always been a large part of politics, of course, but for the UK Labour Party at the moment, past and present patronage is everything.
Except it's probably not though. However, it's essential for people to believe the Labour party is all about something called patronage because diversion is created - and diversion at the moment, past and present is how bad guys win what they can't through fair means.

Diversion from this...

Quintessential aristocratic Tory government deliberating fostering fear, division & bamboozling people who aren't interested in politics into paying for services & infrastructure owned by the nation, not the government. People get conned into paying for what they own again with additional charges added for those public services forever.

Tories take money out of the economy regular people use along with making public services benefit a small group of Tory friends & family owning the businesses now paying slave-wages, if any, to people doing the work but not owning the businesses. We're continually told Tories are good with the economy. It's not demonstrably true but...
...'for the UK Labour Party at the moment, past and present patronage is everything'
...is a useful diversion from the fact a group of aristocrats making up the Tory party & their donors continue robbing the UK blind while the people are diverted.
Temulkar
Secretary of State
Posts: 1343
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:24 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by Temulkar »

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
RobertSnozers wrote:I think it's fair enough to point out his political allegiance as he bemoans the loss of professional nutjob Norman Baker. Moreover, the article seems to be attacking the party's left-leaning nature rather than any real loss of environmental credentials, and it doesn't surprise me that some of the more old-school Greens who were of a more centrist or small-c conservative outlook (wasn't one of the founders a Tory councillor?) don't like the direction the party has taken politically.

There's a problem that all small parties, especially those focussing on a small area of issues, face when they try to break into the mainstream. They have to be taken seriously across the full range of issues. I can see that this was what Bennett was trying to do, and also the fact that she was focussing on anti-austerity was part of the conversation about post-hung parliament discussions rather than where the party would necessarily focus were all things equal. If the true state of the polls was apparent, maybe things would have been different. The author seems to be essentially arguing for the party to remain as a small, single-issue pressure group, which probably not many supporters would agree with.

I think he's misdiagnosing, personally, and a lot of the slump the party seemed to suffer was down to Bennett's underwhelming performance as leader rather than any particular political tack the party was taking. I also agree that there was a lot more common ground between the Labour and Green manifestos than points of difference, though I suppose those differences could be argued to be significant.
It is fair enough to point out the allegiance, but surely not so fair to dismiss his concerns based solely on that allegiance? Tem, despite his barely visible nod toward my point, relied on nobody knowing Lean's background and reading it purely as a partisan hack job; when you understand that background it gives a slightly different perspective.

Does the article discuss loss of environmental credentials? Well, it makes it clear how low they were on Bennett's list of priorities and the mention of Brighton Council's woeful record on recycling is noteworthy; you are right, it is difficult when previously niche parties begin to make the move toward a more mainstream position, there is inevitably a certain loss of identity - the irony is that was their main criticism of Labour, the loss of traditional identity, with Bennett attempting to claim the old mantle for her won.

I also agree that Lean is, in the main, talking a load of old tosh. Natalie Bennett veered between underwhelming and woefully bad throughout the campaign; Lucas knew that was likely to be the case, hence her attempts to get herself on the TV debates. And the less said about Bennett's focus on anti-austerity the better, given that I am not alone in considering both she and Lucas lied through their teeth about Labour's true position on that.
I didnt dississ anything thats tripe. I agreed with you on his credentials, Ive pointed that out. I openly stated where the greens have gone wrong in Bristol and Norwich, hardly being tribal am I. As for our identity and politics its summed up in three words, enviromentalsm, localism and socialism. What is it Labour stand for again? do any of you know? Judging by your leaders debate its how to ape the tory party, something that has cost you millions of votes and the whole of Scotland.

Our manifesto was markedly different, not indistinguishable. Trident, fracking, TTIP, HS2, Nationalisation of Rail and Energy to name a few of the main ones. You keep going on about Brighton, where the greens did not have a majority and Labour voted with the Tories to block any progressive measure. Yeah voted with the tories, how to cut off your nose to spite your face.

I came on here today happy and decided to respond to a point about the greens that was mentioned, not triball. Given leans long standing friendship with Lamb, and his long standing criticism that we are too political its no shock he wrote the article, nor does it contain anything he hasn't said before. Instead straight away Im accused of tribalism, missing the point, etc etc ad nauseum. Its boring.

I see some on this place have learned nothing in the last two weeks, so I will leave you to your echo chamber.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh 3m3 minutes ago
Paul Waugh retweeted Ross Colquhoun
Given @acarmichaelmp now says he *was* aware of memo content, this video cd force him to quit as MP.
Paul Flynn MP is calling for him to stand down re lack of truth.

Others questioning whether the result of this investigation was held back until after the election as ... with the content of the memo not dismissed as inaccurate ... Nicola Sturgeon having a preference for David Cameron as prime minister might just have influenced people's decisions one way or another.
Okay, this dude is currently a UK Parliamentary MP for the constituency posted below.
Rt Hon Alistair Carmichael MP
Constituency
Orkney and Shetland

Party
Liberal Democrat

Address as
Mr Carmichael

http://www.parliament.uk/biographies/co ... chael/1442" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
In his letter to the Scottish First Minister, Mr Carmichael said: “I wish to inform you that I am taking full responsibility for the publication of that document when I was Secretary of State.

“I accept that its publication was a serious breach of protocol and that the details of that account are not correct.”

He added: “I am clear that this was an error of judgment on my part and wish to offer you my sincere apologies for the embarrassment caused to you and the French ambassador.”

http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/ele ... -1-7274989" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Okay, what now, my man? Embarrassment? Sincere apologies? Not good enough.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

Andy Burnham MP, Labour’s Shadow Health Secretary, responding to figures showing NHS Trusts in England have reported a total deficit of £822 million, said:

“This report confirms a growing crisis in the NHS on David Cameron’s watch.

“People will wonder how the Prime Minister can possibly pay for his new round of NHS promises when hospitals are sinking into ever-deeper debt now.

“Without more money this year and next, the NHS will have to brace itself for a round of severe cuts to staffing, beds and services.

“David Cameron was not straight with people at the election on the scale of the problems facing the NHS. With services going backwards and hospitals in financial crisis, it is patients who will pay the price. Rather than empty promises, the Prime Minister must urgently produce a plan to sort out the problems he has caused.”

http://press.labour.org.uk/post/1196061 ... cit-of-822" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
ohsocynical
Prime Minister
Posts: 10937
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:10 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by ohsocynical »

citizenJA wrote:Hunty sent me a copy of his speech given at Demos (Wednesday 20 May 2015).
Extract below.
"It was not until I went to study at the University of Chicago in the mid-1990s that I 'got' politics.
Whilst Milton Friedman, George Stigler and Gary Becker preached the virtues of monetarism, trickle-down and public choice theory, outside of the Ivory Tower stretched a waste-land of crack-houses, boarded-up projects, shoot outs, and deep, deep poverty.
I felt then and I feel now a sense of outrage about allowing this staggering inequity.

...the blindingly obvious fact that without shelter, food, warmth, people are not free; that in the so-called land of freedom and opportunity the rights that I had taken for granted when growing up were being denied to people on an epic scale.

I do not regard a stronger commitment to tackling inequality as a component in Labour's recent electoral failure."

- Tristram Hunt MP for Stoke-on-Trent Central
The entire speech is a good surprise.
I don't know Labour party leadership personally & so can't definitively say their integrity is rock solid.
I will say, when I read, listen & a few times meet with Labour party leaders, I'm impressed by their goodness.
There are a lot of good Labour MPs in the party now.
Some are disconcerting, yes.
Labour needs the help of us all if we'd like Labour to represent us in Parliament.
My daughter used to live in Illinois. When my son visited her, they detoured into some of Chicago's 'poor' areas.
My son said it made him shake...

And here we are staring down the same barrel...
We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office. – Aesop
User avatar
TheGrimSqueaker
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2192
Joined: Thu 28 Aug, 2014 12:23 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by TheGrimSqueaker »

Temulkar wrote:I see some on this place have learned nothing in the last two weeks, so I will leave you to your echo chamber.
What haven't I learned Tem? Sorry if you expected me to be humbly grateful for your pearls of wisdom, but if I think somebody is speaking garbage I'll let them know. And please don't give us that guff about you only coming on here to respond to a post; you are probably the most tribal poster on here, and I say that as somebody who acknowledges that I am happy to be a Labour tribalist - nice to see you take the gloves off at the end there, was getting fed up with the sly insinuations you'd been treating us to since May 8th.

To everybody else I make no apology for this post; I've been biting my lip since the 8th and I still think I am being relatively restrained. If the admins want to remove this post then feel free. For myself, I'm taking a little break from here, until a few things in my own life are a little clearer and until we have a better idea of where Labour stands; so Tem, feel free to carry on sniping, safe in the knowledge that I can't be arsed to respond to you any longer and that you've sucked the joy out of being here.
COWER BRIEF MORTALS. HO. HO. HO.
55DegreesNorth
Minister of State
Posts: 419
Joined: Wed 27 Aug, 2014 6:13 am

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by 55DegreesNorth »

Afternoon folks,
Absolutely irrelevant, but I've been repairing my back yard wall all day, and my iPad fingerprint recognition no longer works as my fingers are so worn. #21stCenturyProblems.
Temulkar
Secretary of State
Posts: 1343
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:24 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by Temulkar »

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
Temulkar wrote:I see some on this place have learned nothing in the last two weeks, so I will leave you to your echo chamber.
What haven't I learned Tem? Sorry if you expected me to be humbly grateful for your pearls of wisdom, but if I think somebody is speaking garbage I'll let them know. And please don't give us that guff about you only coming on here to respond to a post; you are probably the most tribal poster on here, and I say that as somebody who acknowledges that I am happy to be a Labour tribalist - nice to see you take the gloves off at the end there, was getting fed up with the sly insinuations you'd been treating us to since May 8th.

To everybody else I make no apology for this post; I've been biting my lip since the 8th and I still think I am being relatively restrained. If the admins want to remove this post then feel free. For myself, I'm taking a little break from here, until a few things in my own life are a little clearer and until we have a better idea of where Labour stands; so Tem, feel free to carry on sniping, safe in the knowledge that I can't be arsed to respond to you any longer and that you've sucked the joy out of being here.
I haven't posted anything here since the 11th May. Your delusional. Point me to a single one of these posts where I have been making sly digs. In fact point me to any post made since the election where I have been anything other than constructive and trying to add to the debate. The last time I came on I had to ask the mods to step in, after getting attacked because I had the gall to post a kippers reasons for not voting labour. Is that a sly dig? Are my posts on Labour needing to be a grass roots movement a sly dig? Don't be such a fucking cretin.

And that is what you havent learned, different voices will add to this place and you may actually learn the big question you have all been asking, which is why did people not vote for labour. I told you before the election that your bitterness and bile was costing you supporters to the greens, I was proven right, you lost at least 12 seats because of us. If you don't learn from that and change you will lose more in 2020.

So whats more important to you, making labour electable again, or venting your bile. If this is just a place for labour supporters make it that place, otherwise suck up the fact other people support other parties and can add to the conversation. And should be able to without being constantly attacked. Basically you need to grow the fuck up.
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

Mike Gapes retweeted
Jane Merrick ‏@janemerrick23 3h3 hours ago
Important part of leak inquiry is Cabinet Secretary found civil servant who spoke to French Consul Gen "accurately" reported conversation
I've just heard Nicola Sturgeon saying exactly the opposite - that the content of the memo was found to be not an accurate report of her conversation.

Aaaagh. Which is it? What does the report conclude?
Working on the wild side.
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by PorFavor »

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Mike Gapes retweeted
Jane Merrick ‏@janemerrick23 3h3 hours ago
Important part of leak inquiry is Cabinet Secretary found civil servant who spoke to French Consul Gen "accurately" reported conversation
I've just heard Nicola Sturgeon saying exactly the opposite - that the content of the memo was found to be not an accurate report of her conversation.

Aaaagh. Which is it? What does the report conclude?

Yes - I was listening to that same (I assume) interview. According to Nicola Sturgeon, the minute taker apparently acknowledged, in the minutes, that the section in question may have lost something in the translation (or words to that effect).
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

Christopher Hope @christopherhope · 3h 3 hours ago
My summary of PM David Cameron's Riga press conference, which finished moments ago: "The more he spoke the less he said".
:lol:

The bits I heard I tried to tune out as he had what I call his Famous Five voice on in full swing ... that forced 'buck up everyone we're all jolly good chums really' tone drives me round the bend.
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
TheGrimSqueaker
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2192
Joined: Thu 28 Aug, 2014 12:23 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by TheGrimSqueaker »

Temulkar wrote:I haven't posted anything here since the 11th May. Your delusional. Point me to a single one of these posts where I have been making sly digs. In fact point me to any post made since the election where I have been anything other than constructive and trying to add to the debate. The last time I came on I had to ask the mods to step in, after getting attacked because I had the gall to post a kippers reasons for not voting labour. Is that a sly dig? Are my posts on Labour needing to be a grass roots movement a sly dig? Don't be such a fucking cretin.
From the 8th to the 11th you were sniping away, your posts on the 8th upset a lot of people, they were just too polite to tell you; I've long since given up being polite with you, as far as I'm concerned you only ever come on here to cause trouble.
Temulkar wrote:And that is what you havent learned, different voices will add to this place and you may actually learn the big question you have all been asking, which is why did people not vote for labour. I told you before the election that your bitterness and bile was costing you supporters to the greens, I was proven right, you lost at least 12 seats because of us. If you don't learn from that and change you will lose more in 2020.
Ah bless, Tem the prophet was proven right; actually Tem, a fair few of us predicted that the deliberately mendacious campaigning by a fair chunk of the Green Party would cost votes, "Vote Green and get the Tories" we said and, hey, we were right too.

And I'm all for different voices Tem if they engage constructively, but that isn't your way of doing things; you like to undermine, point out how the Green way is the only way to do things right, to tell others to "grow the fuck up" ..... Well, I've always maintained if you have to resort to profanity you've lost the argument but you never present an argument, just a serious of unsubstantiated reasons why you are right and we are wrong; I've got some respect for Tiz, I can tell she is speaking from convictions and makes a good fist of putting her point across, but you ..... not a scintilla.
Temulkar wrote:So whats more important to you, making labour electable again, or venting your bile. If this is just a place for labour supporters make it that place, otherwise suck up the fact other people support other parties and can add to the conversation. And should be able to without being constantly attacked. Basically you need to grow the fuck up.
Did I not make myself clear enough? You were talking garbage, I pointed that fact out; that isn't venting bile, that is freedom of speech, something you seem very keen on unless that speech is addressed to you.

Enough. I've got better things to do than waste my time with somebody who only ever comes on here to provoke an argument. When one of the admin staff is next about can you please delete my account; this board will be so much more harmonious without my contributions.
COWER BRIEF MORTALS. HO. HO. HO.
seeingclearly
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2023
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:24 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by seeingclearly »

There's a heartbreaking post on the same difference site, a photo of a voucher issued on Wednesday to someone who hadnt eaten since the previous Friday. There are also indications that more people are losing their ESA and being shifted to JSA with delays in processing that mean people are going without payments for indefinite periods of time. Other recent incidents like this include someone whose condition has not changed who has failed to make the move from DLA to PIP successfully, this person only recently had HB restored after ESA assessment and as PIP is the gateway benefit and not available knows it will triggers other HB stoppage. This person feels their home will definite be lost, had been given no advice on how to navigate through this at all.

There are places that can help people fight back, and eventually win their benefits cases, but the real world ones are not always accessible, and the online ones sometimes need a subscription, that can be hard to find if you find yourself penniless.

It is my perception that I'm seeing more of these cases. And I think there will be more, and worse as UC gets rolled out to various regions. I didn't mention above but some of these cases that I'm seeing are of people with a child or children. it's hard to express exactly what I feel about this and every evidence that people are disgusted and very angry.

And the life seems to be sucked out of our opposition.

In the meantime as TCC ramps things up there's a kipper hate fest trolling around the net.and its sometimes not easy to tell where the messages of anger are coming from. My impression is that they are actively trying to recruit. Nicola doesn't really give a monkeys unless it suits her cause, and the person who could have made a difference has been totally neutralised.

I'll be watching tonight as they show the events of Feb 2003 on Ch4 and wondering what happened in such a short time. I know the answers, and it'll be interesting, but I can't help thinking it will deepen disaffection with Labour.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
Temulkar wrote:I haven't posted anything here since the 11th May. Your delusional. Point me to a single one of these posts where I have been making sly digs. In fact point me to any post made since the election where I have been anything other than constructive and trying to add to the debate. The last time I came on I had to ask the mods to step in, after getting attacked because I had the gall to post a kippers reasons for not voting labour. Is that a sly dig? Are my posts on Labour needing to be a grass roots movement a sly dig? Don't be such a fucking cretin.
From the 8th to the 11th you were sniping away, your posts on the 8th upset a lot of people, they were just too polite to tell you; I've long since given up being polite with you, as far as I'm concerned you only ever come on here to cause trouble.
Temulkar wrote:And that is what you havent learned, different voices will add to this place and you may actually learn the big question you have all been asking, which is why did people not vote for labour. I told you before the election that your bitterness and bile was costing you supporters to the greens, I was proven right, you lost at least 12 seats because of us. If you don't learn from that and change you will lose more in 2020.
Ah bless, Tem the prophet was proven right; actually Tem, a fair few of us predicted that the deliberately mendacious campaigning by a fair chunk of the Green Party would cost votes, "Vote Green and get the Tories" we said and, hey, we were right too.

And I'm all for different voices Tem if they engage constructively, but that isn't your way of doing things; you like to undermine, point out how the Green way is the only way to do things right, to tell others to "grow the fuck up" ..... Well, I've always maintained if you have to resort to profanity you've lost the argument but you never present an argument, just a serious of unsubstantiated reasons why you are right and we are wrong; I've got some respect for Tiz, I can tell she is speaking from convictions and makes a good fist of putting her point across, but you ..... not a scintilla.
Temulkar wrote:So whats more important to you, making labour electable again, or venEnough. I've got better things to do than waste my time with somebody who only ever comes on here to provoke an argument. When one of the admin staff is next about can you please delete my account; this board will be so much more harmonious without my contributions.

_________________
NO MORE MR NICE GUYting your bile. If this is just a place for labour supporters make it that place, otherwise suck up the fact other people support other parties and can add to the conversation. And should be able to without being constantly attacked. Basically you need to grow the fuck up.
Did I not make myself clear enough? You were talking garbage, I pointed that fact out; that isn't venting bile, that is freedom of speech, something you seem very keen on unless that speech is addressed to you.

Enough. I've got better things to do than waste my time with somebody who only ever comes on here to provoke an argument. When one of the admin staff is next about can you please delete my account; this board will be so much more harmonious without my contributions.
Don't go.
For goodness sake, don't go.
Just ignore from now on.
Please, don't go.
User avatar
tinyclanger2
Prime Minister
Posts: 9711
Joined: Thu 18 Sep, 2014 9:18 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by tinyclanger2 »

On my Oxbridge thing, apologies for causing irritation, but my point is that wherever you come from, if you go there you end up taking on some of the Oxbridge view. Why have we decided that such a tiny fraction of our population are best suited to serve our diverse collective needs? It doesn't make any sense. At all. All those publicly funded buildings with "keep out plebs" signs. It doesn't lend itself to a full view of the world.

And of course we need people representing us who have not been to university. What we need is proper representation. And smart people come from all routes through life.

As do not so smart people.
LET'S FACE IT I'M JUST 'KIN' SEETHIN'
ohsocynical
Prime Minister
Posts: 10937
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:10 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by ohsocynical »

Temulkar wrote:Some good news from france though

http://www.thejournal.ie/french-superma ... 9-May2015/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
A supremely sensible idea...Good practice for the future, because there will come a time no doubt when food shortages are a reality.

I remember after the war when every street still had a big galvanised bin for scrap food. The housewives used to put all the vegetable trimmings and food waste in it although we were still rationed on a lot of items and there was rarely any leftovers. Mr Martin the pig man, who owned a pig sties at the local allotments used to come around with his pony and trap every day to empty it.
A lovely bloke, he was suntanned, with black brylcreamed hair and always wore a spotless white shirt, but his grey flannel trousers were held up with a bit of rope, and were tucked into his wellies...We never saw him in a pair of shoes.
He and his cart didn't half stink so he never got much conversation from the locals unless it was at arms length. :D
Last edited by ohsocynical on Fri 22 May, 2015 6:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office. – Aesop
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

Just to echo citizen in asking people not to leave. Take a break if necessary but please come back.

I apologise for posting what I thought was a straightforward query relating to coverage re the Greens' election. It wasn't meant to have sparked a row - but it has and I really regret that.
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

tinyclanger2 wrote:On my Oxbridge thing, apologies for causing irritation, but my point is that wherever you come from, if you go there you end up taking on some of the Oxbridge view. Why have we decided that such a tiny fraction of our population are best suited to serve our diverse collective needs? It doesn't make any sense. At all. All those publicly funded buildings with "keep out plebs" signs. It doesn't lend itself to a full view of the world.

And of course we need people representing us who have not been to university. What we need is proper representation. And smart people come from all routes through life.

As do not so smart people.
The conversation we were having last night about Cambridge & Oxford was valuable to have.
Gracious, everything you've mentioned on the subject is reasonable, interesting, informative.
No apologies needed from you to me, no.
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

BBC Question Time ‏@bbcquestiontime 19h19 hours ago
.@OwenJones84 "You keep taking credit for GPs but it takes about 7 years to train a GP - the Tories have only been in power for 5." #bbcqt

RCGP
‏@rcgp
.@bbcquestiontime @OwenJones84 it actually takes 10 years to become a GP - 5 yrs med school, 2 yrs foundation & 3 yrs GP specialty training
So where are these 5,000 extra GPs going to come from? (It's actually 10,000 needed as 5,000 are due to quit.) The question that Nicky Morgan simply had no answer for on QT.
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

Pete WishartVerified account
‏@PeteWishart
The Libs were amongst the stoutest supporters of recall for political misdoing. We now expect them to practice what they preach. #carmichael

David Maddox ‏@DavidPBMaddox 3m3 minutes ago
David Maddox retweeted Pete Wishart
Good point well made
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
tinyclanger2
Prime Minister
Posts: 9711
Joined: Thu 18 Sep, 2014 9:18 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by tinyclanger2 »

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Pete WishartVerified account
‏@PeteWishart
The Libs were amongst the stoutest supporters of recall for political misdoing. We now expect them to practice what they preach. #carmichael

David Maddox ‏@DavidPBMaddox 3m3 minutes ago
David Maddox retweeted Pete Wishart
Good point well made
So what was Pickles' position?

My coat you say?
LET'S FACE IT I'M JUST 'KIN' SEETHIN'
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

We're each creative, intelligent people here, I value your posts.
It's not okay to swear at people on the thread, okay, it's over the top.
I've no problem with some tasteful profanity. Never pointed at someone in anger, no.
Please excuse the liberty I take. I'm just a person posting here.
I am what I say I am.
The pointed profanity isn't okay.
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

Nick Clegg's strategist evaluates Lib Dem defeat: 'we got routed by The Fear'
Ryan Coetzee says fear of Labour-SNP government and failure to win credit for coalition policies were at heart of Lib Dems’ catastrophic result

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... ion-defeat" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
No comments facility.
Working on the wild side.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

ohsocynical wrote:
Temulkar wrote:Some good news from france though

http://www.thejournal.ie/french-superma ... 9-May2015/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
A supremely sensible idea...Good practice for the future, because there will come a time no doubt when food shortages are a reality.

I remember after the war when every street still had a big galvanised bin for scrap food. The housewives used to put all the vegetable trimmings and food waste in it although we were still rationed on a lot of items and there was rarely any leftovers. Mr Martin the pig man, who owned a pig sties at the local allotments used to come around with his pony and trap every day to empty it.
A lovely bloke, he was suntanned, with black brylcreamed hair and always wore a spotless white shirt, but his grey flannel trousers were held up with a bit of rope, and were tucked into his wellies...We never saw him in a pair of shoes.
He and his cart didn't half stink so he never got much conversation from the locals unless it was at arms length. :D
Your descriptions are priceless, you know?
You're a talented writer.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by citizenJA »

Lib Dem Alistair Carmichael admits responsibility for anti-Sturgeon leak
Calls for MP to resign after admission about memo of private conversation in which SNP leader purportedly said she wanted David Cameron to remain PM


http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... id-cameron" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Comments open on this one.
User avatar
rebeccariots2
Prime Minister
Posts: 14038
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by rebeccariots2 »

Michael Crick @MichaelLCrick · 3h 3 hours ago
Of 8 Lib Dems to serve in last Cabinet, two resigned in disgrace - Laws & Huhne - & a third says he would have done so if still there.
They were the party who insisted it would all be different with them in government ... they would bring fairness and accountability ... and la,la,la,la, la la lalalalalala ...
Working on the wild side.
Temulkar
Secretary of State
Posts: 1343
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:24 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by Temulkar »

TheGrimSqueaker wrote:
Temulkar wrote:I haven't posted anything here since the 11th May. Your delusional. Point me to a single one of these posts where I have been making sly digs. In fact point me to any post made since the election where I have been anything other than constructive and trying to add to the debate. The last time I came on I had to ask the mods to step in, after getting attacked because I had the gall to post a kippers reasons for not voting labour. Is that a sly dig? Are my posts on Labour needing to be a grass roots movement a sly dig? Don't be such a fucking cretin.
From the 8th to the 11th you were sniping away, your posts on the 8th upset a lot of people, they were just too polite to tell you; I've long since given up being polite with you, as far as I'm concerned you only ever come on here to cause trouble.
Temulkar wrote:And that is what you havent learned, different voices will add to this place and you may actually learn the big question you have all been asking, which is why did people not vote for labour. I told you before the election that your bitterness and bile was costing you supporters to the greens, I was proven right, you lost at least 12 seats because of us. If you don't learn from that and change you will lose more in 2020.
Ah bless, Tem the prophet was proven right; actually Tem, a fair few of us predicted that the deliberately mendacious campaigning by a fair chunk of the Green Party would cost votes, "Vote Green and get the Tories" we said and, hey, we were right too.

And I'm all for different voices Tem if they engage constructively, but that isn't your way of doing things; you like to undermine, point out how the Green way is the only way to do things right, to tell others to "grow the fuck up" ..... Well, I've always maintained if you have to resort to profanity you've lost the argument but you never present an argument, just a serious of unsubstantiated reasons why you are right and we are wrong; I've got some respect for Tiz, I can tell she is speaking from convictions and makes a good fist of putting her point across, but you ..... not a scintilla.
Temulkar wrote:So whats more important to you, making labour electable again, or venting your bile. If this is just a place for labour supporters make it that place, otherwise suck up the fact other people support other parties and can add to the conversation. And should be able to without being constantly attacked. Basically you need to grow the fuck up.
Did I not make myself clear enough? You were talking garbage, I pointed that fact out; that isn't venting bile, that is freedom of speech, something you seem very keen on unless that speech is addressed to you.

Enough. I've got better things to do than waste my time with somebody who only ever comes on here to provoke an argument. When one of the admin staff is next about can you please delete my account; this board will be so much more harmonious without my contributions.
Point me to the posts where I have been making sly digs. Go on. The search function is there. I have tried to be constructive and add to the debate, just like I did today. When yahyah got upset I apologised even though she misread my post, and Ive also recieved a number of emails asking me to keep posting here, and indeed posts welcoming me back whenever I try to post.

How is is garbage to point out a long standing critic of the greens, and suppporter of Lamb is a long standing critic of the greens and supporter of Lamb? and where is the sly dig at labour? HOw on earth s that coming on here to cause trouble? When you made your point back the first word of my reply was TRUE, wheres the dig at labour?

Your unhinged.
seeingclearly
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2023
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:24 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by seeingclearly »

And here's the confirmation. ESA sanctions up in one month.

http://benefitsandwork.co.uk/news/3095- ... -one-month" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
ohsocynical
Prime Minister
Posts: 10937
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:10 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by ohsocynical »

rebeccariots2 wrote:
BBC Question Time ‏@bbcquestiontime 19h19 hours ago
.@OwenJones84 "You keep taking credit for GPs but it takes about 7 years to train a GP - the Tories have only been in power for 5." #bbcqt

RCGP
‏@rcgp
.@bbcquestiontime @OwenJones84 it actually takes 10 years to become a GP - 5 yrs med school, 2 yrs foundation & 3 yrs GP specialty training
So where are these 5,000 extra GPs going to come from? (It's actually 10,000 needed as 5,000 are due to quit.) The question that Nicky Morgan simply had no answer for on QT.
Mr Ohso had to see the doctor again this morning. I wait with baited breath to see what's happened each time he has to go there. Today though he struck it lucky. He actually managed to see the GP that has owned the practice ever since it opened...He questioned some of Mr Ohso's recent treatment, so hubby was obliged to tell him about the rude locums and inadequate treatment.

The doc said, to quote: "Cameron is wrecking things. We're having a job to stay open with the hours we already do. I can't get enough doctors to cover. I was going to retire two years ago, but can't. God knows how it'll end up."

Thankfully he's going to give Mr Ohso a complete MOT. His heart was checked via clever computer this morning, and was given the all clear...So that's one worry less.
We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office. – Aesop
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Friday 22nd May 2015

Post by PorFavor »

@Ernst Remarx

Hello!
Locked