Friday 19th June 2015

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 4:58 am

Morning.

Doing some catching up.

Frank Field Chair DWP Select Committee.

giselle97 · Post by **giselle97** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 8:24 am

HindleA wrote:Morning.

Doing some catching up.

Frank Field Chair DWP Select Committee.

Morning AH. Nice to see you.

Logging in from Scotland today and still en route further north. What an eye opener the news programmes up here were.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 8:24 am

HindleA wrote:Morning.

Doing some catching up.

Frank Field Chair DWP Select Committee.

Perhaps he'll surprise us.

If not, current government ignores all criticism and advice anyway.

I wonder how long IDS will be able to pretend UC is deliverable?

giselle97 · Post by **giselle97** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 8:27 am

Morning Willow. I don't know how few of the millions needing support have actually been put on UC but the last comment I read from Ephemerid, either here or at the G, indicated it was a miniscule number!

giselle97 · Post by **giselle97** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 9:02 am

There is a positive of sorts in Thorning-Schmidt’s loss. We won't see any more shots of Cameron doing shameful, comedic contortions to try and get in on a selfie with her.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=camer ... gws_rd=ssl
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/peopl ... 98090.html

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 9:13 am

LadyCentauria,in t'wee small hrs wrote: The Lords might get an amendment through (on EU citizens resident here,
too) but the Govt. could drop any amendment by final reading. One of the
things that seriously pissed me orf in the debate, today, was the number
of Tory MPs who stood up and said either that they supported or had
sympathy for the argument of votes at 16 but not yet – or that it was so
important that it deserved a separate debate rather than being a one-off
for the Referendum after a rushed debate on an amendment.
Lord make me pure but not yet. Emancipation Now but not just yet...
Well, Barry Sheerman peed me orf, too, with his claim that 16/17 yr olds
shouldn't get the vote because they're vulnerable and need protection
from sexual abuse. I cannot see the connection between the two things.
All sorts of people of all ages are vulnerable to sexual abuse – having a
vote has nothing to do with it.

Our daughter will turn 16, this year,
and only reason I can think of for not letting 16 yr olds vote is protecting the status quo, they're an angry lot!
I can see there might be an abuse issue,
local polling stations here are:
Church hall, (also used for toddlers groups),
Primary School,(also contains teachers, all crb checked, but can't be too safe)
Letting Agency, (near a chip shop!)
Actually think the one near chip shop may be temporary, it was previously on the bowling green (next to playground! Arrgh!).

Hopefully Lords will give 2 fingers to the Salisbury Convention, on this one.

Eric_WLothian · Post by **Eric_WLothian** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 9:30 am

tinybgoat wrote:
LadyCentauria,in t'wee small hrs wrote: The Lords might get an amendment through (on EU citizens resident here,
too) but the Govt. could drop any amendment by final reading. One of the
things that seriously pissed me orf in the debate, today, was the number
of Tory MPs who stood up and said either that they supported or had
sympathy for the argument of votes at 16 but not yet – or that it was so
important that it deserved a separate debate rather than being a one-off
for the Referendum after a rushed debate on an amendment.
Lord make me pure but not yet. Emancipation Now but not just yet...
Well, Barry Sheerman peed me orf, too, with his claim that 16/17 yr olds
shouldn't get the vote because they're vulnerable and need protection
from sexual abuse. I cannot see the connection between the two things.
All sorts of people of all ages are vulnerable to sexual abuse – having a
vote has nothing to do with it.
Our daughter will turn 16, this year,
and only reason I can think of for not letting 16 yr olds vote is protecting the status quo, they're an angry lot!
I can see there might be an abuse issue,
local polling stations here are:
Church hall, (also used for toddlers groups),
Primary School,(also contains teachers, all crb checked, but can't be too safe)
Letting Agency, (near a chip shop!)
Actually think the one near chip shop may be temporary, it was previously on the bowling green (next to playground! Arrgh!).

Hopefully Lords will give 2 fingers to the Salisbury Convention, on this one.

The issue referred to may be the publication of 16/17 year-olds names and addresses on the voters' register.
In the EU, only Austria has a voting age of 16 (though interestingly, outside the EU, so do the Channel Islands and Isle of Man). The vast majority of countries in the world specify 18.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publication ... /2123.html
I know I wasn't in the least interested in politics at 16 - and neither was anybody I knew. Maybe that's changed. Imo if the voting age is to be altered, it should be as part of a rationalisation of age-criteria such as smoking, drinking, driving, legal issues, employment - the list is endless. (And the proposed 'state guardian' in Scotland).

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 9:33 am

giselle97 wrote:Morning Willow. I don't know how few of the millions needing support have actually been put on UC but the last comment I read from Ephemerid, either here or at the G, indicated it was a miniscule number!

According to DWP 64,000 people have clamied UC as of March of this year. Bearing in mind UC has initially rolled out to those recently unemployed, many of the 64,000 would have returned to work within a few months so how many are still on UC is impossible to extrapolate, it depends whether they still qualified for housing benefit and working tax credits while working, I suppose. What I do know is that moving in with a boyfriend/ girlfriend on UC could mean you are at risk of losing your own HB and WTC if in low paid work - an extra stress for low-paid relationships which will change social dynamics in unpredictable ways. I saw on the tv a couple from Bristol who had been affected in this way, although their main complaint was that there had been a delay in the UC payment. There's been quite a bit on sanctions of late but next to nothing about payment delays where people who qualify for benefit, have complied 100% but are still facing long periods without payments. I'd like to see more on this in the press, as this is reflective of DWP failure which IDS needs to be held accountable for and is quite separate from the moral issue of sanctions.

https://www.apm.org.uk/news/universal-c ... e-progress" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 9:46 am

giselle97 wrote:There is a positive of sorts in Thorning-Schmidt’s loss. We won't see any more shots of Cameron doing shameful, comedic contortions to try and get in on a selfie with her.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=camer ... gws_rd=ssl
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/peopl ... 98090.html

The other "positive" might be it makes more clear that simply trying to out-"b***ard" the right on stuff like immigration will always be a mug's game.

The SD's thought they were being clever when they seemed to be closing the gap with the Venstre-led bloc in the polls. But (surprise!) the baton was duly taken up by the DPP, who neither of the "main" parties would ever be able to outdo on this topic. At the end of an election campaign that had basically turned into "who can kick nasty foreigners hardest?" auction lots of Danes ultimately decided, not entirely unreasonably, why not in that case vote for the real thing?

And of course it shows what a tricky task Labour has on this stuff - they have to deal with the genuine fears and concerns of many of their core supporters (as I have said several times before, the potential UKIP threat in our English/Welsh "industrial" heartlands is very real) and just endlessly saying that "immigration is good" (as urged by the metropolitan, inner city types) won't cut it. But nor will selling their soul on this, or indeed other issues.

(on which subject, it was being tweeted last night that the previously "pro-immigration" Kendall had "lurched" into UKIP territory on the subject - any details?)

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 9:49 am

Eric_WLothian wrote:
tinybgoat wrote:
LadyCentauria,in t'wee small hrs wrote: The Lords might get an amendment through (on EU citizens resident here,
too) but the Govt. could drop any amendment by final reading. One of the
things that seriously pissed me orf in the debate, today, was the number
of Tory MPs who stood up and said either that they supported or had
sympathy for the argument of votes at 16 but not yet – or that it was so
important that it deserved a separate debate rather than being a one-off
for the Referendum after a rushed debate on an amendment.
Lord make me pure but not yet. Emancipation Now but not just yet...
Well, Barry Sheerman peed me orf, too, with his claim that 16/17 yr olds
shouldn't get the vote because they're vulnerable and need protection
from sexual abuse. I cannot see the connection between the two things.
All sorts of people of all ages are vulnerable to sexual abuse – having a
vote has nothing to do with it.
Our daughter will turn 16, this year,
and only reason I can think of for not letting 16 yr olds vote is protecting the status quo, they're an angry lot!
I can see there might be an abuse issue,
local polling stations here are:
Church hall, (also used for toddlers groups),
Primary School,(also contains teachers, all crb checked, but can't be too safe)
Letting Agency, (near a chip shop!)
Actually think the one near chip shop may be temporary, it was previously on the bowling green (next to playground! Arrgh!).

Hopefully Lords will give 2 fingers to the Salisbury Convention, on this one.
The issue referred to may be the publication of 16/17 year-olds names and addresses on the voters' register.
In the EU, only Austria has a voting age of 16 (though interestingly, outside the EU, so do the Channel Islands and Isle of Man). The vast majority of countries in the world specify 18.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publication ... /2123.html
I know I wasn't in the least interested in politics at 16 - and neither was anybody I knew. Maybe that's changed. Imo if the voting age is to be altered, it should be as part of a rationalisation of age-criteria such as smoking, drinking, driving, legal issues, employment - the list is endless. (And the proposed 'state guardian' in Scotland).

The rationalisation point is a good one. We let 17 year olds drive cars. The idea that it would be irresponsible to let them vote in the light of this is laughable. The question we should be asking is do we feel other activities such as driving, going out to work, getting married etc should be raised to 18? If no, it's hard to argue voting has to remain at 18. As for the electoral register, aren't 17 year olds already on in prep for turning 18? Is the concern that 15 year olds would be listed similarly? Would it really be impossible to exempt under-18's being listed on the public roll? Has the sky fallen in in Scotland because 16 year olds put their names on a list? I'm not actually strongly for or against, tbh. The only thing about voting at 16 that appeals would be if young people had citizenship classes at school to teach them about the importance of democracy and their responsibility to vote. Without such education, I don't see the reduction of the voting age particularly significant either way although on balance I do feel there are solid arguments for a special one off for the EU referendum and certainly should be debated as part of it rather than separately.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 9:52 am

Morning.

There's some powerful stuff circulating about the contrasting views and treatment by the establishment of 'terror' attack perpetrators.

1/2

: Shooter Definitions.jpg (41.5 KiB) Viewed 23908 times

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 9:53 am

2/2

: Which Is Being Arrested For Mass Murder.jpg (42.62 KiB) Viewed 23908 times

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 10:07 am

Eric_WLothian wrote:
tinybgoat wrote:
LadyCentauria,in t'wee small hrs wrote: The Lords might get an amendment through (on EU citizens resident here,
too) but the Govt. could drop any amendment by final reading. One of the
things that seriously pissed me orf in the debate, today, was the number
of Tory MPs who stood up and said either that they supported or had
sympathy for the argument of votes at 16 but not yet – or that it was so
important that it deserved a separate debate rather than being a one-off
for the Referendum after a rushed debate on an amendment.
Lord make me pure but not yet. Emancipation Now but not just yet...
Well, Barry Sheerman peed me orf, too, with his claim that 16/17 yr olds
shouldn't get the vote because they're vulnerable and need protection
from sexual abuse. I cannot see the connection between the two things.
All sorts of people of all ages are vulnerable to sexual abuse – having a
vote has nothing to do with it.
Our daughter will turn 16, this year,
and only reason I can think of for not letting 16 yr olds vote is protecting the status quo, they're an angry lot!
I can see there might be an abuse issue,
local polling stations here are:
Church hall, (also used for toddlers groups),
Primary School,(also contains teachers, all crb checked, but can't be too safe)
Letting Agency, (near a chip shop!)
Actually think the one near chip shop may be temporary, it was previously on the bowling green (next to playground! Arrgh!).

Hopefully Lords will give 2 fingers to the Salisbury Convention, on this one.
The issue referred to may be the publication of 16/17 year-olds names and addresses on the voters' register.
In the EU, only Austria has a voting age of 16 (though interestingly, outside the EU, so do the Channel Islands and Isle of Man). The vast majority of countries in the world specify 18.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publication ... /2123.html
I know I wasn't in the least interested in politics at 16 - and neither was anybody I knew. Maybe that's changed. Imo if the voting age is to be altered, it should be as part of a rationalisation of age-criteria such as smoking, drinking, driving, legal issues, employment - the list is endless. (And the proposed 'state guardian' in Scotland).

A lot of kids were interested in politics
(or at least, 'current affairs'), when I was 16 (early 80s), though maybe our views were nieve, and possibly still are.
Our kids schools both held pretend elections, - although oldest child, disagreed with idea.
Labour won in both

I think it's a good idea to let 16/17 year olds vote, at an age when a lot of them will still be in education,
& the principle of importance voting can be got across too them.
Suppose opposite view would be that they're too open to influence by teachers/parents at that age.
Maybe it should be part of wider rationalisation, but think that way it will never happen.

Eric_WLothian · Post by **Eric_WLothian** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 10:07 am

Willow904 wrote:The rationalisation point is a good one. We let 17 year olds drive cars. The idea that it would be irresponsible to let them vote in the light of this is laughable. The question we should be asking is do we feel other activities such as driving, going out to work, getting married etc should be raised to 18? If no, it's hard to argue voting has to remain at 18. As for the electoral register, aren't 17 year olds already on in prep for turning 18? Is the concern that 15 year olds would be listed similarly? Would it really be impossible to exempt under-18's being listed on the public roll? Has the sky fallen in in Scotland because 16 year olds put their names on a list? I'm not actually strongly for or against, tbh. The only thing about voting at 16 that appeals would be if young people had citizenship classes at school to teach them about the importance of democracy and their responsibility to vote. Without such education, I don't see the reduction of the voting age particularly significant either way although on balance I do feel there are solid arguments for a special one off for the EU referendum and certainly should be debated as part of it rather than separately.

The various age limits are only arbitrary numbers - but there has to be a cut-off point somewhere. I'm sure there are many 16 year-olds who are savvy enough to weigh up the arguments and make their own decision. Equally, there are many 18+ year-olds who blindly follow the Sun.
The trouble is, I don't recall seeing a valid argument for changing, other than "a say in their future" - which could be applied to any age.

Eric_WLothian · Post by **Eric_WLothian** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 10:14 am

tinybgoat wrote:A lot of kids were interested in politics
(or at least, 'current affairs'), when I was 16 (early 80s), though maybe our views were nieve, and possibly still are.
Our kids schools both held pretend elections, - although oldest child, disagreed with idea.
Labour won in both
I think it's a good idea to let 16/17 year olds vote, at an age when a lot of them will still be in education,
& the principle of importance voting can be got across too them.
Suppose opposite view would be that they're too open to influence by teachers/parents at that age.
Maybe it should be part of wider rationalisation, but think that way it will never happen.

Ah well, you youngsters had a different education to me. We didn't have pretend elections when I were a lad.

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 10:15 am

Eric_WLothian wrote:
Willow904 wrote:The rationalisation point is a good one. We let 17 year olds drive cars. The idea that it would be irresponsible to let them vote in the light of this is laughable. The question we should be asking is do we feel other activities such as driving, going out to work, getting married etc should be raised to 18? If no, it's hard to argue voting has to remain at 18. As for the electoral register, aren't 17 year olds already on in prep for turning 18? Is the concern that 15 year olds would be listed similarly? Would it really be impossible to exempt under-18's being listed on the public roll? Has the sky fallen in in Scotland because 16 year olds put their names on a list? I'm not actually strongly for or against, tbh. The only thing about voting at 16 that appeals would be if young people had citizenship classes at school to teach them about the importance of democracy and their responsibility to vote. Without such education, I don't see the reduction of the voting age particularly significant either way although on balance I do feel there are solid arguments for a special one off for the EU referendum and certainly should be debated as part of it rather than separately.
The various age limits are only arbitrary numbers - but there has to be a cut-off point somewhere. I'm sure there are many 16 year-olds who are savvy enough to weigh up the arguments and make their own decision. Equally, there are many 18+ year-olds who blindly follow the Sun.
The trouble is, I don't recall seeing a valid argument for changing, other than "a say in their future" - which could be applied to any age.

"Everyone else is doing it, so why can't we?"
no good then.

Eric_WLothian · Post by **Eric_WLothian** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 10:20 am

tinybgoat wrote:
Eric_WLothian wrote:
Willow904 wrote:The rationalisation point is a good one. We let 17 year olds drive cars. The idea that it would be irresponsible to let them vote in the light of this is laughable. The question we should be asking is do we feel other activities such as driving, going out to work, getting married etc should be raised to 18? If no, it's hard to argue voting has to remain at 18. As for the electoral register, aren't 17 year olds already on in prep for turning 18? Is the concern that 15 year olds would be listed similarly? Would it really be impossible to exempt under-18's being listed on the public roll? Has the sky fallen in in Scotland because 16 year olds put their names on a list? I'm not actually strongly for or against, tbh. The only thing about voting at 16 that appeals would be if young people had citizenship classes at school to teach them about the importance of democracy and their responsibility to vote. Without such education, I don't see the reduction of the voting age particularly significant either way although on balance I do feel there are solid arguments for a special one off for the EU referendum and certainly should be debated as part of it rather than separately.
The various age limits are only arbitrary numbers - but there has to be a cut-off point somewhere. I'm sure there are many 16 year-olds who are savvy enough to weigh up the arguments and make their own decision. Equally, there are many 18+ year-olds who blindly follow the Sun.
The trouble is, I don't recall seeing a valid argument for changing, other than "a say in their future" - which could be applied to any age.
"Everyone else is doing it, so why can't we?"
no good then.

My 4-year old granddaughter wants to do everything her 11-year old sister does. That doesn't mean she can, or should.

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 10:40 am

Eric_WLothian wrote:
tinybgoat wrote:
Eric_WLothian wrote: The various age limits are only arbitrary numbers - but there has to be a cut-off point somewhere. I'm sure there are many 16 year-olds who are savvy enough to weigh up the arguments and make their own decision. Equally, there are many 18+ year-olds who blindly follow the Sun.
The trouble is, I don't recall seeing a valid argument for changing, other than "a say in their future" - which could be applied to any age.
"Everyone else is doing it, so why can't we?"
no good then.
My 4-year old granddaughter wants to do everything her 11-year old sister does. That doesn't mean she can, or should.

It's no good,I'm torn between,
"I hate you",
" yeah but no but",
"whatevs"
&"It's so unfair, can't wait to leave home."
That's it for now I'm off to kick a computer

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 10:51 am

Paul WaughVerified account
‏@paulwaugh
One of Lab's real stars of 2015, @jessphillips tells @HuffPostUK why she'll "keep banging on" about women + the poor
http://huff.to/1JZ5V15" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It's very good.

This is why the 2015 new intake gives me hope ...

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 10:52 am

UK Youth Parliament is a good place to start when trying to work out age related voting I find.

http://www.ukyouthparliament.org.uk/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

For a wider view, blogs by the young such as "Whippersnapper", written by 16 and 17 years olds gives a good indication of their involvement.

http://ukwhippersnapper.blogspot.co.uk/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This referendum is voting on their future - and they have a right to have a say in it.
(I can think of many, many 30+ year olds who I would personally take the vote away from.........)

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 10:59 am

Good morfternoon.

Have we had this?

UK to reject EU plans to combat multinational tax avoidance

David Gauke, financial secretary to the Treasury, insists on tax competition as opposed to Union’s plan to introdu

Britain will reject plans announced in Brussels this week to combat industrial-scale tax avoidance by the world’s biggest multinationals, the Treasury minister responsible for tax policy has said. (Guardian)

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/j ... -avoidance

Edited to add link and remove rubbish.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:06 am

PorFavor wrote:Good morfternoon.

Have we had this?

UK to reject EU plans to combat multinational tax avoidance

David Gauke, financial secretary to the Treasury, insists on tax competition as opposed to Union’s plan to introdu

Britain will reject plans announced in Brussels this week to combat industrial-scale tax avoidance by the world’s biggest multinationals, the Treasury minister responsible for tax policy has said. (Guardian)
Britain will reject plans announced in ... has said.

Morning PF.

I think that deserves the HindleA stock answer. 'Bloody Tories'.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:17 am

Good-morning, everyone.
Wonderful posts from all.
The conversations going on here are excellent.
I'll say it again - I don't know what I'd do without you.
HindleA, it's good to read you again, I missed your voice.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:18 am

http://www.theguardian.com/housing-netw ... x#comments" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"The election has finally opened Tory eyes to the disaster of the bedroom tax"

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:25 am

It was" fascist bastards" until I matured(not a lot)

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:28 am

Three hours ago on G blog:

Osborne: Time to prepare for the worst
"We have entered the eleventh hour of this Greek crisis and we urge the Greek government to do a deal before it is too late.
We hope for the best, but we now must be prepared for the worst.
Britain has “taken measures” to increase economic security to handle risks from abroad, he adds."

A reporter asks Osborne what “the worst” is, but I don’t think he replies before vanishing into today’s meeting.

http://www.theguardian.com/business/liv ... 174bb6333d" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Three minutes ago G blog:

Bruno Waterfield
‏@BrunoBrussels
Ouch. @George_Osborne got number of eurozone countries wrong in Ecofin BSR debate. He said 18. It's 19.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.theguardian.com/business/liv ... 95c10feae1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:32 am

Apparently,"hard workers" who wish to seek medical intervention all work office hours and are desperate to access this on their weekends off.Must be true Twunt says so.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:34 am

Apparently,Russia is ready to give financial aid to Greece.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:35 am

Rowena Mason ‏@rowenamason 4m4 minutes ago
Michael Gove has put Chris Grayling's plans for a near-£100m teen super-prison under review, thinking of scrapping it http://gu.com/p/4avba/stw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

When even Gove can spot this is a disaster ... confirms how bad Grayling was / is.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:36 am

HindleA wrote:Apparently,Russia is ready to give financial aid to Greece.

Hah. That will confound those This Week know it alls who assured viewers last night that Russia / Putin was in no position to offer any support whatsoever.

I hope Greece isn't pushed to that though.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:38 am

The most recent information from Greece is that the people are calm, cheerful & wishing everyone a good weekend.
Good to read Yannis Stournaras, Governor of the Bank of Greece & former Austerity Infliction Finance Minister has chilled out after his episode of hysteria the other day.

Bank of Greece: the banking system is stable
Greece’s central bank has issued a statement this morning, in which it declares that the banking system remains stable.

This meeting appears to have been aimed at mending fences between Stournaras and the leftist-led government, says our correspondent Helena Smith. Earlier this week, the governing Syriza party accused Stournaras, a former finance minister in the previous pro-bailout conservative led government, of fear-mongering after warning in his annual report that failure to find a deal would push Greece into uncontrollable economic collapse.

http://www.theguardian.com/business/liv ... 174bb6338c" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Derek Gatopoulos ‏@dgatopoulos 1h1 hour ago
Here's Google translation of Bank of Greece statement
#Greece

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:39 am

Joe Watts ‏@JoeWatts_ 4m4 minutes ago
British voters overwhelmingly want to stay in the EU says exclusive Ipsos MORI poll http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics ... 31462.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; … by @JoeMurphyLondon

Joe Murphy ‏@JoeMurphyLondon 5m5 minutes ago
POLL: 66% would vote In and 22% for Out. Only 12% d/k @Ipsos MORI @EveningStandard http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics ... 31462.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:41 am

HindleA wrote:Apparently,Russia is ready to give financial aid to Greece.

Reminds me of the plot development for "A Very British Coup",
shortly before the coup.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:44 am

Perhaps overstated,"ready to consider the question of giving financial aid"

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:47 am

Many thanks to AngryAsWell for the link to Yanis Varoufakis' (Finance Minister of Greece) speech yesterday linked below.

Greece’s Proposals to End the Crisis: My intervention at today’s Eurogroup
Posted on June 18, 2015 by yanisv

"The only antidote to propaganda and malicious ‘leaks’ is transparency. After so much disinformation on my presentation at the Eurogroup of the Greek government’s position, the only response is to post the precise words uttered within. Read them and judge for yourselves whether the Greek government’s proposals constitute a basis for agreement."

[Varoufakis' speech follows & comments available to read as well]

http://yanisvaroufakis.eu/2015/06/18/gr ... eurogroup/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Maybe Labour party MPs & leadership can each have a blog up & running with a comment enabled feature regularly updated & used?

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:49 am

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Rowena Mason ‏@rowenamason 4m4 minutes ago
Michael Gove has put Chris Grayling's plans for a near-£100m teen super-prison under review, thinking of scrapping it http://gu.com/p/4avba/stw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
When even Gove can spot this is a disaster ... confirms how bad Grayling was / is.

A bit odd that on the one hand...

This position is a clear contrast to the government’s stance before the election. It had already appointed a contractor to start work on the 320-place jail in Leicestershire this year ahead of it opening in 2017.

and yet

It has not yet received approval at Treasury level,

How could they appoint a contractor when it didn't even have Treasury approval yet?

frightful_oik · Post by **frightful_oik** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 11:52 am

RogerOThornhill wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Rowena Mason ‏@rowenamason 4m4 minutes ago
Michael Gove has put Chris Grayling's plans for a near-£100m teen super-prison under review, thinking of scrapping it http://gu.com/p/4avba/stw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
When even Gove can spot this is a disaster ... confirms how bad Grayling was / is.
A bit odd that on the one hand...

This position is a clear contrast to the government’s stance before the election. It had already appointed a contractor to start work on the 320-place jail in Leicestershire this year ahead of it opening in 2017.
and yet

It has not yet received approval at Treasury level,
How could they appoint a contractor when it didn't even have Treasury approval yet?

Needed the donation?

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:01 pm

@frightful_oik

Now that's what I call cynicism!

(Probably right, though).

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:03 pm

Because rumours are rife - I remain calm & check sources.

ST PETERSBURG, Russia (Reuters) – Greece has not asked the Russian Finance Ministry for financial assistance and its prime minister is visiting Russia to discuss joint projects rather than to seek cash, Russian Deputy Finance Minister Sergei Storchak said on Thursday.

“There have been no requests,” Storchak told Reuters at the St Petersburg International Economic Forum.
“There are no resources (in our budget to provide money).”

Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras arrived in St Petersburg earlier on Thursday to meet, among others, President Vladimir Putin.

(Reporting by Lidia Kelly and Darya Korsunskaya, Writing by Lidia Kelly)
http://www.euronews.com/newswires/30264 ... -minister/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(my emphasis)

The Greek leaders were in Russia yesterday for the St Petersburg International Economic Forum.
Happens every year.

The St. Petersburg International Economic Forum is Russia's premier annual event for investment and interaction between business and government.
http://rbth.co.uk/petersburg_internatio ... omic_forum" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:10 pm

frightful_oik wrote:
RogerOThornhill wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote: When even Gove can spot this is a disaster ... confirms how bad Grayling was / is.
A bit odd that on the one hand...
This position is a clear contrast to the government’s stance before the election. It had already appointed a contractor to start work on the 320-place jail in Leicestershire this year ahead of it opening in 2017.
and yet
It has not yet received approval at Treasury level,
How could they appoint a contractor when it didn't even have Treasury approval yet?
Needed the donation?

It would seem UK Tory government are dodgy.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:17 pm

The Government Must Think Again and Protect Young People Put at Risk By Their Welfare Reform
Jess Phillips is the Labour MP for Birmingham Yardley
19 June 2015

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/jess-ph ... mg00000067" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Outstanding article by the new MP.
Thank you for posting the link.

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:20 pm

frightful_oik wrote:
RogerOThornhill wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote: When even Gove can spot this is a disaster ... confirms how bad Grayling was / is.
A bit odd that on the one hand...

This position is a clear contrast to the government’s stance before the election. It had already appointed a contractor to start work on the 320-place jail in Leicestershire this year ahead of it opening in 2017.
and yet

It has not yet received approval at Treasury level,
How could they appoint a contractor when it didn't even have Treasury approval yet?
Needed the donation?

Stinks, dunnit.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:20 pm

http://www.theguardian.com/business/liv ... 95c10feb27" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.theguardian.com/business/liv ... e79a3c8e03" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

shit
let's everyone have a cuppa & ring back later

gilsey · Post by **gilsey** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:21 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Joe Watts ‏@JoeWatts_ 4m4 minutes ago
British voters overwhelmingly want to stay in the EU says exclusive Ipsos MORI poll http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics ... 31462.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; … by @JoeMurphyLondon

Joe Murphy ‏@JoeMurphyLondon 5m5 minutes ago
POLL: 66% would vote In and 22% for Out. Only 12% d/k @Ipsos MORI @EveningStandard http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics ... 31462.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

So why vote for a referendum?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:30 pm

Analysts at Capital Economics explain that Greece really, really needs extra liquidity from the ECB.

http://www.theguardian.com/business/liv ... 95c10feb33" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Really?
Twice in one short sentence.
Must be true.

Capital Economics is an economic research consultancy based in London.
In 2012 it won the Wolfson Economics Prize for the best proposal on how the Eurozone could be safely dismantled.

https://www.capitaleconomics.com/wolfson-prize.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:41 pm

http://www.theguardian.com/social-care- ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Profession in shock as the College of Social Work forced to close

In a strategic review with the Department for Education (DfE) and the Department for Health, the college made the case for taking on responsibility for other key functions, such as post-qualifying training, in line with the responsibilities of other professional bodies. The government rejected these proposals, and awarded the accreditation of the new approved child and family practitioner role to KPMG and Morning Lane Associates instead.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:49 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Joe Watts ‏@JoeWatts_ 4m4 minutes ago
British voters overwhelmingly want to stay in the EU says exclusive Ipsos MORI poll http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics ... 31462.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; … by @JoeMurphyLondon

Joe Murphy ‏@JoeMurphyLondon 5m5 minutes ago
POLL: 66% would vote In and 22% for Out. Only 12% d/k @Ipsos MORI @EveningStandard http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics ... 31462.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

What does Smithson say?

seeingclearly · Post by **seeingclearly** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 12:51 pm

This made me very sad, that young lives could be played around with for such trivial reasons.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015 ... le-storage" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 1:02 pm

Two minutes ago live blog on the G:

Reuters has just snapped that the ECB has raised the emergency funding cap for Greeks banks, quoting a banking source.
But they don’t say how much by.....

http://www.theguardian.com/business/liv ... e79a3c8e30" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I get the impression Greek government's ending austerity for the Greek people by refusing to cut social security provision or raising that jackass awful regressive VAT, the ECB, IMF & assorted Greek creditors can't do shit about it but threaten, accuse, tell lies & give everyone a bad day.
Come on, let's brass tack this here.
The debt is banker's balance sheets propped up by regular people paying for inflated assets, financial instruments & a non-reality based global economy.
It's something like that, anyway.
The phone slams down & a few minutes later a sulky ECB emergency cap raise.
Because it's your game you're protecting, isn't it, ECB, IMF, Global CreditorsWeR?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Fri 19 Jun, 2015 1:06 pm

seeingclearly wrote:This made me very sad, that young lives could be played around with for such trivial reasons.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015 ... le-storage" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

christ that's awful
Some people forget human beings, life & the land are valuable, not balance sheets or targets achieved.